My Unpopular Opinion
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"westboro church isn't christian"
Okay, but then you're naming yourself the judge of who is "christian enough" for you to consider a christian. Isn't the bible pretty clear about who is the only one who can know what is in a person's heart? The bible is also very clear that christians aren't identified by what they DO but what beliefs they hold in their heart. Who are you to say what is in people's heart? They may not act in a way that YOU think a christian should act (or that a normal person thinks ANYONE should ask) but isn't it a little prideful to think that you know a person's heart better than they do? And isn't pride one of the 7 deadlies?
(Sorry--long, thorough religious education over here).
First of all I am not Catholic and I do not subscribe to the "7 deadly sins". Sin is sin.
Second, Who am I to say what is in the hear of the Westboro Baptist people? I am a Christian, that's who I am! I can judge their "fruit of the spirit" which is non existent. I can judge them by the horrible signs they hold up that scream out obscenities and hate towards gays, soliders and others their PASTOR deems unworthy. I am a Christian who knows my Bible and I know what I'm talking about. I don't judge them as unredeemable in any way. I judge them as fruitless. And Jesus Himself said that a barren, fruitless tree should be thrown into the fire.
So please, don't come at me because you are thoroughly religiously educated. Book knowledge means nothing with a heart centered on Christ - in regards to quoting the Bible and issues of Christian faith.
So book knowledge means nothing...but I thought christians were supposed to be all about The Book?
Meh, nevermind. We're actually very much alike. I just believe in one less god than you do.0 -
Woah....let's not go there at all. Hitler was NOT a Christian. I dont care if he used the name of God or not.........Hitler was also very curious about the occult, should we call him a Wiccan? Heck no because then the Wiccan's would freak out. Hitler was a monster.....not a Christian.
I meant that I'm pretty sure he identified himself as Christian... I thought this was widely known? I'm not using this to rag on religion, coz by that logic all Germans are horrible coz Hitler was German, which obviously isn't true... the poster just said all those men weren't religious, and I'm just clarifying by pointing out that Hitler was in fact religious...
I know what you mean. Sorry if I seemed confrontational, really not trying to be that struck a chord in me. Hitler claimed to be Christian, wanting to purify it by removing the Jewish influence. That in itself dismisses his claim of Christianity considering he would have to purify Christianity of it's core which is Jesus Christ. Therefore, he was not Christian.
Sorry, but that is the No True Scotsman fallacy. Hitler was a Catholic. He was raised a Catholic and never disavowed his belief in Jesus Christ. You may not like what he did (who does?) but he was a Christian.
He could claim all he wanted. But the moment he wanted to purify, or white wash, Christianity by removing Jewish influence is the moment he showed that he was not a Christian.
You cannot have Christianity without Jesus Christ, a Jew.0 -
See my previous posts about his writing.The Koran and most other "holy books" also instruct their followers to go out an proselytize. That isn't unique to the Bible. I respect others' right to believe in and preach about what they want. Likewise, you should respect my right to not believe in god(s). It doesn't take faith to hold no belief. I don't believe in unicorns, faeries, or elves either. Does that take faith? No. Atheists aren't forcing you not to believe in gods. There's a reason, however, why atheists and other non-believers (theological noncognivitists, agnostics, ignosticts, etc.) engage with believers. Most of the atheists I know know more about religion and theology than most believers. We've studied and through logic and reason have come to the conclusion that there is no credible evidence for belief in gods. We also are acutely aware of the harm that organized religion and faith have caused in the world. Other posters have detailed those harms (Inquisition, Pogroms, anti-gay laws, wars, discrimination, etc.) on this thread so I don't need to provide the specifics. Ultimately, everyone has to decide for themselves what they believe or don't believe. I just think it's important that people are informed. I sent my kids to parochial schools but I also told them that when they were old enough they were free to make their own decisions about god. My son turned 19 last week. He is a self-professed atheist. My daughter is 14 and she is a believer, like my wife, but I don't worry because she has an open mind and questions everything.
Cheers!
Quoted from part 1
Death tolls
Pol Pot >2 million
Hitler > 6 million
Stalin at least 20 million (some sources say 50 million)
None of these men believed in God
Not an argument for the presence of God, but irritates me when people blame all major genocides etc on religion.
Not meaning to carry on this discussion about religion, but just to clarify a mistake in fact - I'm pretty sure Hitler was a Christian :ohwell:
Though he wasn't massacring Jews in the name of God, so I guess that's something.
Woah....let's not go there at all. Hitler was NOT a Christian. I dont care if he used the name of God or not.........Hitler was also very curious about the occult, should we call him a Wiccan? Heck no because then the Wiccan's would freak out. Hitler was a monster.....not a Christian.
Hitler was raised by a skeptic Catholic father and a devout Catholic mother, Adolf Hitler ceased to participate in the sacraments after childhood. In his book Mein Kampf and in public speeches he often made statements that affirmed a belief in Christianity. Prior to World War II Hitler had promoted "positive Christianity", a movement which purged Christianity of its Jewish elements and instilled it with Nazi philosophy.
Here's an excerpt from a speech he gave to a crowd in Munich just prior to his ascension to power:
"My feeling as a Christian points me to my Lord and Savior as a fighter. It points me to the man who once in loneliness, surrounded only by a few followers, recognized these Jews for what they were and summoned men to fight against them and who, God's truth! was greatest not as a sufferer but as a fighter. In boundless love as a Christian and as a man I read through the passage which tells us how the Lord at last rose in His might and seized the scourge to drive out of the Temple the brood of vipers and adders. How terrific was his fight against the Jewish poison. Today, after two thousand years, with deepest emotion I recognize more profoundly than ever before the fact that it was for this that He had to shed his blood upon the Cross. As a Christian I have no duty to allow myself to be cheated, but I have the duty to be a fighter for truth and justice."
He may not be the kind of Xtian you are or the kind of person you associate with Xtianity, but he never disavowed his Xtian faith.
He used the church to gain power.
That is true, but that doesn't obviate the fact that he believed that Jesus Christ was his Lord and Savior and he never disavowed that belief.0 -
As to the atheist/christian discrimination thing- I was speaking more from personal experience than anything. I've never made fun of or belittled any of my atheist family/friends yet I was seeing my facebook newsfeed bombarded by posts about people who believe in God or are religious are brainwashed, dumb, and the root of all problems, ect... and basically saying that we're old fashioned idiots. It was kinda hurtful! I base my belief in God on the fact that I've had a very personal experience and I am without a shadow of a doubt in my mind that God is real and not a fairytale. So you can see why my faith is something extremely precious and important to me. Still, I've never gone up to an atheist and told them they were dumb and a bad person. Everyone has to make the decision whether or not they believe in God for themselves0
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Go make a Was Hitler A Christian Or Just An *kitten* board. Please. Dragging us all down, guys. T_T
You're not obligated to read this thread. Just sayin'. : )
And that's why this is the unpopular opinion board!0 -
Sorry, but that is the No True Scotsman fallacy. Hitler was a Catholic. He was raised a Catholic and never disavowed his belief in Jesus Christ. You may not like what he did (who does?) but he was a Christian.
Although raised a Christian he did disavow his belief.
http://answers.org/apologetics/hitquote.html0 -
forgot Mao 100 million plus0
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"westboro church isn't christian"
Okay, but then you're naming yourself the judge of who is "christian enough" for you to consider a christian. Isn't the bible pretty clear about who is the only one who can know what is in a person's heart? The bible is also very clear that christians aren't identified by what they DO but what beliefs they hold in their heart. Who are you to say what is in people's heart? They may not act in a way that YOU think a christian should act (or that a normal person thinks ANYONE should ask) but isn't it a little prideful to think that you know a person's heart better than they do? And isn't pride one of the 7 deadlies?
(Sorry--long, thorough religious education over here).
First of all I am not Catholic and I do not subscribe to the "7 deadly sins". Sin is sin.
Second, Who am I to say what is in the hear of the Westboro Baptist people? I am a Christian, that's who I am! I can judge their "fruit of the spirit" which is non existent. I can judge them by the horrible signs they hold up that scream out obscenities and hate towards gays, soliders and others their PASTOR deems unworthy. I am a Christian who knows my Bible and I know what I'm talking about. I don't judge them as unredeemable in any way. I judge them as fruitless. And Jesus Himself said that a barren, fruitless tree should be thrown into the fire.
So please, don't come at me because you are thoroughly religiously educated. Book knowledge means nothing with a heart centered on Christ - in regards to quoting the Bible and issues of Christian faith.
So book knowledge means nothing...but I thought christians were supposed to be all about The Book?
Meh, nevermind. We're actually very much alike. I just believe in one less god than you do.
C'mon! You didn't quote my entire sentence. You took me out of context. Ehhh, it's ok. I'm cool with you. I got riled up for a second but I'm ok now.
It's a never ending circular trip we can take but I think we should just let it lie. How's that? 0 -
Go make a Was Hitler A Christian Or Just An *kitten* board. Please. Dragging us all down, guys. T_T
lol Ok I'll stop. Bu can't we post our unpopular opinions?0 -
I enjoy going to the dentist. I could sleep getting my teeth cleaned.
Oh, me too.. Only, I wouldn't sleep.. I'd rather daydream into my dentist's eyes.
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Right, knew there were moreforgot Mao 100 million plus0 -
Kittens are overrated.
Blasphemy.
Sharp claws? Pooping on the floor? No thanks.0 -
"westboro church isn't christian"
Okay, but then you're naming yourself the judge of who is "christian enough" for you to consider a christian. Isn't the bible pretty clear about who is the only one who can know what is in a person's heart? The bible is also very clear that christians aren't identified by what they DO but what beliefs they hold in their heart. Who are you to say what is in people's heart? They may not act in a way that YOU think a christian should act (or that a normal person thinks ANYONE should ask) but isn't it a little prideful to think that you know a person's heart better than they do? And isn't pride one of the 7 deadlies?
(Sorry--long, thorough religious education over here).
First of all I am not Catholic and I do not subscribe to the "7 deadly sins". Sin is sin.
Second, Who am I to say what is in the hear of the Westboro Baptist people? I am a Christian, that's who I am! I can judge their "fruit of the spirit" which is non existent. I can judge them by the horrible signs they hold up that scream out obscenities and hate towards gays, soliders and others their PASTOR deems unworthy. I am a Christian who knows my Bible and I know what I'm talking about. I don't judge them as unredeemable in any way. I judge them as fruitless. And Jesus Himself said that a barren, fruitless tree should be thrown into the fire.
So please, don't come at me because you are thoroughly religiously educated. Book knowledge means nothing with a heart centered on Christ - in regards to quoting the Bible and issues of Christian faith.
So book knowledge means nothing...but I thought christians were supposed to be all about The Book?
Meh, nevermind. We're actually very much alike. I just believe in one less god than you do.
lol...true but just as james says faith without works is dead...u can read alllllll of the bible many many times but if you dont let it get to your heart it means nothing...and if you dont allow those things you read to make you become a different person...then it was just reading and nothing more...kinda like that old adage of if you have knowledge something is poisonous but u drink it anyway- the knowledge didnt do ya no good did it lol0 -
Woah....let's not go there at all. Hitler was NOT a Christian. I dont care if he used the name of God or not.........Hitler was also very curious about the occult, should we call him a Wiccan? Heck no because then the Wiccan's would freak out. Hitler was a monster.....not a Christian.
I meant that I'm pretty sure he identified himself as Christian... I thought this was widely known? I'm not using this to rag on religion, coz by that logic all Germans are horrible coz Hitler was German, which obviously isn't true... the poster just said all those men weren't religious, and I'm just clarifying by pointing out that Hitler was in fact religious...
I know what you mean. Sorry if I seemed confrontational, really not trying to be that struck a chord in me. Hitler claimed to be Christian, wanting to purify it by removing the Jewish influence. That in itself dismisses his claim of Christianity considering he would have to purify Christianity of it's core which is Jesus Christ. Therefore, he was not Christian.
Sorry, but that is the No True Scotsman fallacy. Hitler was a Catholic. He was raised a Catholic and never disavowed his belief in Jesus Christ. You may not like what he did (who does?) but he was a Christian.
He could claim all he wanted. But the moment he wanted to purify, or white wash, Christianity by removing Jewish influence is the moment he showed that he was not a Christian.
You cannot have Christianity without Jesus Christ, a Jew.
YOU cannot have Christianity like that. Many, however, do. And that is my point. That's a logical fallacy called the No True Scotsman Fallacy. What it proves is that christianity isn't a monolith. There is no ONE Christianity. There are many, many Christianities. Hundreds of protestant denominations, dozens of catholic sects, and hundreds more non-denominational christian churches with a myriad of contradictory substantive doctrines.0 -
to the disabled vet... I am PROUD of our soldiers and our vets. I feel that our "freedoms" are being slowly stripped away by both the right and left wing. I am not proud to be an american. I am proud of my family, I am proud when I see someone do what is right. England, Canada, Switzerland, Sweden, these countries are doing a better job than we are at the moment.0
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Going to get killed for this but they are just my unpopular opinions...
Religion is for idiots.
All drugs should be legalized.
Capitalism is over rated.0 -
"westboro church isn't christian"
Okay, but then you're naming yourself the judge of who is "christian enough" for you to consider a christian. Isn't the bible pretty clear about who is the only one who can know what is in a person's heart? The bible is also very clear that christians aren't identified by what they DO but what beliefs they hold in their heart. Who are you to say what is in people's heart? They may not act in a way that YOU think a christian should act (or that a normal person thinks ANYONE should ask) but isn't it a little prideful to think that you know a person's heart better than they do? And isn't pride one of the 7 deadlies?
(Sorry--long, thorough religious education over here).
First of all I am not Catholic and I do not subscribe to the "7 deadly sins". Sin is sin.
Second, Who am I to say what is in the hear of the Westboro Baptist people? I am a Christian, that's who I am! I can judge their "fruit of the spirit" which is non existent. I can judge them by the horrible signs they hold up that scream out obscenities and hate towards gays, soliders and others their PASTOR deems unworthy. I am a Christian who knows my Bible and I know what I'm talking about. I don't judge them as unredeemable in any way. I judge them as fruitless. And Jesus Himself said that a barren, fruitless tree should be thrown into the fire.
So please, don't come at me because you are thoroughly religiously educated. Book knowledge means nothing with a heart centered on Christ - in regards to quoting the Bible and issues of Christian faith.
So book knowledge means nothing...but I thought christians were supposed to be all about The Book?
Meh, nevermind. We're actually very much alike. I just believe in one less god than you do.
C'mon! You didn't quote my entire sentence. You took me out of context. Ehhh, it's ok. I'm cool with you. I got riled up for a second but I'm ok now. It's a never ending circular trip we can take but I think we should just let it lie. How's that?
Bygones. But I also hate pie and don't care for Adele. I mean, I liked her the first 500 times they played her music on the radio, but I'm kind of over it. But I really, do hate pie. Hot fruit? WTAF is that?0 -
See my previous posts about his writing.The Koran and most other "holy books" also instruct their followers to go out an proselytize. That isn't unique to the Bible. I respect others' right to believe in and preach about what they want. Likewise, you should respect my right to not believe in god(s). It doesn't take faith to hold no belief. I don't believe in unicorns, faeries, or elves either. Does that take faith? No. Atheists aren't forcing you not to believe in gods. There's a reason, however, why atheists and other non-believers (theological noncognivitists, agnostics, ignosticts, etc.) engage with believers. Most of the atheists I know know more about religion and theology than most believers. We've studied and through logic and reason have come to the conclusion that there is no credible evidence for belief in gods. We also are acutely aware of the harm that organized religion and faith have caused in the world. Other posters have detailed those harms (Inquisition, Pogroms, anti-gay laws, wars, discrimination, etc.) on this thread so I don't need to provide the specifics. Ultimately, everyone has to decide for themselves what they believe or don't believe. I just think it's important that people are informed. I sent my kids to parochial schools but I also told them that when they were old enough they were free to make their own decisions about god. My son turned 19 last week. He is a self-professed atheist. My daughter is 14 and she is a believer, like my wife, but I don't worry because she has an open mind and questions everything.
Cheers!
Quoted from part 1
Death tolls
Pol Pot >2 million
Hitler > 6 million
Stalin at least 20 million (some sources say 50 million)
None of these men believed in God
Not an argument for the presence of God, but irritates me when people blame all major genocides etc on religion.
Not meaning to carry on this discussion about religion, but just to clarify a mistake in fact - I'm pretty sure Hitler was a Christian :ohwell:
Though he wasn't massacring Jews in the name of God, so I guess that's something.
Woah....let's not go there at all. Hitler was NOT a Christian. I dont care if he used the name of God or not.........Hitler was also very curious about the occult, should we call him a Wiccan? Heck no because then the Wiccan's would freak out. Hitler was a monster.....not a Christian.
Hitler was raised by a skeptic Catholic father and a devout Catholic mother, Adolf Hitler ceased to participate in the sacraments after childhood. In his book Mein Kampf and in public speeches he often made statements that affirmed a belief in Christianity. Prior to World War II Hitler had promoted "positive Christianity", a movement which purged Christianity of its Jewish elements and instilled it with Nazi philosophy.
Here's an excerpt from a speech he gave to a crowd in Munich just prior to his ascension to power:
"My feeling as a Christian points me to my Lord and Savior as a fighter. It points me to the man who once in loneliness, surrounded only by a few followers, recognized these Jews for what they were and summoned men to fight against them and who, God's truth! was greatest not as a sufferer but as a fighter. In boundless love as a Christian and as a man I read through the passage which tells us how the Lord at last rose in His might and seized the scourge to drive out of the Temple the brood of vipers and adders. How terrific was his fight against the Jewish poison. Today, after two thousand years, with deepest emotion I recognize more profoundly than ever before the fact that it was for this that He had to shed his blood upon the Cross. As a Christian I have no duty to allow myself to be cheated, but I have the duty to be a fighter for truth and justice."
He may not be the kind of Xtian you are or the kind of person you associate with Xtianity, but he never disavowed his Xtian faith.
He used the church to gain power.
That is true, but that doesn't obviate the fact that he believed that Jesus Christ was his Lord and Savior and he never disavowed that belief.
I get what you are trying to say however I kindly disagree because he could not have possibly had a relationship with Jesus Christ, a Jew. A relationship with Christ is far beyond just being religious and saying HEY I"M A CHRISTIAN!! Yeahhhh!
How could he believe that Jesus Christ was his Savior if he hated and despised the Jewish people? If he decided that Jesus must have been white, as the catholic/protestant church history also shows, he can't possibly be worshipping the real Jesus! Jesus was a Jewish man. He came from a rugged life in Israel. He wasn't an anglo-saxon blue eyed, blonde haired model. Therefore, just in those things along Hitler could not have been a true christian - - - it doesn't matter if he disavowed catholicism or not.0 -
Yes! That's the point! XD Don't have to listen to me, just a request based on...my opinion! lol
Ok, I should leave anyway. Looks like all this is gonna keep coming back to is religion. People should just learn to coexist and stop focusing so much on religion. Atheism is my life choice, but I can have friends from all walks of life without being a complete douchenozzel about their religious views. *shrug*0 -
As to the atheist/christian discrimination thing- I was speaking more from personal experience than anything. I've never made fun of or belittled any of my atheist family/friends yet I was seeing my facebook newsfeed bombarded by posts about people who believe in God or are religious are brainwashed, dumb, and the root of all problems, ect... and basically saying that we're old fashioned idiots. It was kinda hurtful! I base my belief in God on the fact that I've had a very personal experience and I am without a shadow of a doubt in my mind that God is real and not a fairytale. So you can see why my faith is something extremely precious and important to me. Still, I've never gone up to an atheist and told them they were dumb and a bad person. Everyone has to make the decision whether or not they believe in God for themselves
this just shows there are lots of stupid ppl in the world...and we cant let any stupid person who decides to yell at you for having an opinion get to ya...thats definitely the "dont throw your pearls b4 swine" ideology0
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