Calorie deficit for dummies (a little long)
SHBoss1673
Posts: 7,161 Member
I wanted to break it down a bit for newbies and maybe a few long timers that have questions regarding calorie deficits. I see a lot of people on here just setting a 2 lb goal and not thinking about it again, I wanted to explain a few things.
INTRO:
OK so you're a newbie (or maybe not so new), you go through the goals wizard, and of course, you set your weight loss goal to the maximum. Everyone does it, but is it right? Maybe, maybe not. Moving to a healthy lifestyle with diet is trickier than just lowering your calorie deficit, there are things to consider, and work to be done. You need to make some hard choices along the way, and do some self-analysis to see where you really fit in this plan. Everything we do should be tailored to our individual needs. While there are general concepts that will work for everyone, results WILL vary. With that in mind, here's what I've come up with, boiled down to the important stuff that everyone should be able to digest. For a more detailed explaination of our metabolic process, please read this post:
http://www.myfitnesspal.com/topics/show/10589-for-those-confused-or-questioning-eating-your-exercise-calo
How your body thinks on calories:
Our body uses calories as energy. There are 3 main types of food out there called macro nutrients; they are carbohydrates, proteins, and fats. ALL macro nutrients are vital to good health, and while the body may subsist in the absence of one (namely carbohydrates) for most of us, living a carb free life is difficult at best, a serious commitment for sure, and untenable for most.
When the metabolism is in balance between energy taken in and energy expended (Total Daily Energy Expenditure or TDEE) we maintain our weight. When we create a REASONABLE deficit, we lose weight, when we create a calorie surplus, our body converts any unusable extra energy to one of 3 types of fat (none of which are good generally speaking). While we need a certain percentage of body fat to be healthy, over that amount is unnecessary, and when that fat percentage begins to become high (around 18% for men, and around 28% for women), it begins putting stress on other parts of the body (heart, lungs, joints, muscles ...etc)
What happens when the deficit becomes larger than the body likes:
The human body has evolved from a state where food sources were either abundant or scarce. Evolution has built mechanisms into our body to deal with this. The process commonly referred to as "starvation mode" is a response to less calories than the body needs to sustain full efficiency over an extended period (usually begins after 3 to 5 days of lower than required energy). Without going into the details of hormone responses, basically what happens during starvation mode is that the body recognizes a lack of fuel, and in order of importance it begins to shut down, or slow down organ function and brain activity. Because of the time involved, and that it takes extremes for organs to completely shut down, we may or may not immediately notice the changes that occur.
Why does this concern you? Because the TDEE goes down in starvation mode. This means that what you THOUGHT was your maintenance calories, and what any calorie calculator will say your TDEE is will be wrong, it will be lower. That means less of a deficit than expected, and sometimes none at all (surplus is even possible).
What else happens: as a secondary effect of starvation mode, our body begins fat conservation and muscle deterioration. These processes are symapthetic. When the body sees a calorie deficit, it will begin the process in earnest of breaking down existing muscle tissue to convert the amino acids into glycogen for fuel, it will also store any calories deemed non-vital as body fat. Muscles not being used are broken down, muscles in use will still be scavanged, but at a lower rate.
Caveats:
The above is all true for people with normal levels of fat. By that I mean someone who has a slightly low percentage of body fat, to someone who has a slightly high percentage of body fat. People who have abused their body and are considered very obese or morbidly obese (starting somewhere around 35% body fat) have a different set of rules. Starvation mode generally doesn't apply, or applies less to these people because the extreme availability of extra fuel resources blunts the body's need for extra energy, and while people who are morbidly obese can still have a stunted metabolic rate, they can still generally sustain a large calorie deficit (over 1000 calories below TDEE) without further lowering their metabolism.
What this means:
For all you guys out there that are relatively active, and/or don't have extreme amounts of weight to lose, setting that goal of 2 lbs per week is usually a mistake. For all the reasons above, you need to temper your attempt at weight loss, give it time, and be consistent.
Regarding exercise. Generally exercise is considered an add-on on the MFP site. That means that MFP allready gives you a calorie deficit. Exercising after should create a zero sum number after that deficit. That means that since you're already at a calorie deficit, any exercise you do should be balanced by eating that amount of calories to KEEP you at that pre-existing calorie deficit.
Figuring out what you SHOULD be eating every day to maintain (TDEE) and deciding how big your calorie deficit should be can be daunting, don't be afraid to query others on this site, there are many knowledgeable and helpful people on here. If you are still confused, seek out a registered dietitian and use their services. And by all means, check the general section of the forums for the sticky posts, which have lots of resources available to help you better understand.
hope this helps!
-Banks
INTRO:
OK so you're a newbie (or maybe not so new), you go through the goals wizard, and of course, you set your weight loss goal to the maximum. Everyone does it, but is it right? Maybe, maybe not. Moving to a healthy lifestyle with diet is trickier than just lowering your calorie deficit, there are things to consider, and work to be done. You need to make some hard choices along the way, and do some self-analysis to see where you really fit in this plan. Everything we do should be tailored to our individual needs. While there are general concepts that will work for everyone, results WILL vary. With that in mind, here's what I've come up with, boiled down to the important stuff that everyone should be able to digest. For a more detailed explaination of our metabolic process, please read this post:
http://www.myfitnesspal.com/topics/show/10589-for-those-confused-or-questioning-eating-your-exercise-calo
How your body thinks on calories:
Our body uses calories as energy. There are 3 main types of food out there called macro nutrients; they are carbohydrates, proteins, and fats. ALL macro nutrients are vital to good health, and while the body may subsist in the absence of one (namely carbohydrates) for most of us, living a carb free life is difficult at best, a serious commitment for sure, and untenable for most.
When the metabolism is in balance between energy taken in and energy expended (Total Daily Energy Expenditure or TDEE) we maintain our weight. When we create a REASONABLE deficit, we lose weight, when we create a calorie surplus, our body converts any unusable extra energy to one of 3 types of fat (none of which are good generally speaking). While we need a certain percentage of body fat to be healthy, over that amount is unnecessary, and when that fat percentage begins to become high (around 18% for men, and around 28% for women), it begins putting stress on other parts of the body (heart, lungs, joints, muscles ...etc)
What happens when the deficit becomes larger than the body likes:
The human body has evolved from a state where food sources were either abundant or scarce. Evolution has built mechanisms into our body to deal with this. The process commonly referred to as "starvation mode" is a response to less calories than the body needs to sustain full efficiency over an extended period (usually begins after 3 to 5 days of lower than required energy). Without going into the details of hormone responses, basically what happens during starvation mode is that the body recognizes a lack of fuel, and in order of importance it begins to shut down, or slow down organ function and brain activity. Because of the time involved, and that it takes extremes for organs to completely shut down, we may or may not immediately notice the changes that occur.
Why does this concern you? Because the TDEE goes down in starvation mode. This means that what you THOUGHT was your maintenance calories, and what any calorie calculator will say your TDEE is will be wrong, it will be lower. That means less of a deficit than expected, and sometimes none at all (surplus is even possible).
What else happens: as a secondary effect of starvation mode, our body begins fat conservation and muscle deterioration. These processes are symapthetic. When the body sees a calorie deficit, it will begin the process in earnest of breaking down existing muscle tissue to convert the amino acids into glycogen for fuel, it will also store any calories deemed non-vital as body fat. Muscles not being used are broken down, muscles in use will still be scavanged, but at a lower rate.
Caveats:
The above is all true for people with normal levels of fat. By that I mean someone who has a slightly low percentage of body fat, to someone who has a slightly high percentage of body fat. People who have abused their body and are considered very obese or morbidly obese (starting somewhere around 35% body fat) have a different set of rules. Starvation mode generally doesn't apply, or applies less to these people because the extreme availability of extra fuel resources blunts the body's need for extra energy, and while people who are morbidly obese can still have a stunted metabolic rate, they can still generally sustain a large calorie deficit (over 1000 calories below TDEE) without further lowering their metabolism.
What this means:
For all you guys out there that are relatively active, and/or don't have extreme amounts of weight to lose, setting that goal of 2 lbs per week is usually a mistake. For all the reasons above, you need to temper your attempt at weight loss, give it time, and be consistent.
Regarding exercise. Generally exercise is considered an add-on on the MFP site. That means that MFP allready gives you a calorie deficit. Exercising after should create a zero sum number after that deficit. That means that since you're already at a calorie deficit, any exercise you do should be balanced by eating that amount of calories to KEEP you at that pre-existing calorie deficit.
Figuring out what you SHOULD be eating every day to maintain (TDEE) and deciding how big your calorie deficit should be can be daunting, don't be afraid to query others on this site, there are many knowledgeable and helpful people on here. If you are still confused, seek out a registered dietitian and use their services. And by all means, check the general section of the forums for the sticky posts, which have lots of resources available to help you better understand.
hope this helps!
-Banks
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Replies
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Wow! Fantastic post. Explains a lot of things for me. Thanks.0
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Thumbtack! Thumbtack! We need a thumbtack Mike!! :drinker:0
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Thanks Boss for always being informative...but now this brings me to another question b/c I don't want to be screwing myself over lol! :laugh:What this means:
For all you guys out there that are relatively active, and/or don't have extreme amounts of weight to lose, setting that goal of 2 lbs per week is usually a mistake. For all the reasons above, you need to temper your attempt at weight loss, give it time, and be consistent.
what do you consider "extreme" ??? :bigsmile:
last year I lost about 30lbs, a year later since I have started MFP in July I am down 15lbs [slow with a few set backs but yes I am one of the ones who's set to 2 lbs + eating most of my excercise burn]
so as a 215lb 5'6" woman, weight distributed fairly evenly, med-large bone structure..working out doing cardio/aerobics (starting some strength stuff) 5 days a week... looking to go down to about 180 (maybe 160)...would you consider this 40 lbs extreme amount of weight? or should I be lowering my weekly goal?
Again thank you for always providing us with a wealth of information.... I hope my rambling up there makes some sense
:flowerforyou: 0 -
Thanks for the information
:flowerforyou:0 -
Thank You....I have read your posts and learned a lot. Hence the reason I have done great.0
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That brings up a question, I am always lower on my calories by 100 to 200, but I am always over on my protein and carbs which I don't see as a bad thing now on days i do exercise and have more calories to burn is the extra 200 to 300 going to make a difference. I mean i am eating three meals a day with three snacks in there and I am never going hungry with this plan. So should I be eating more even though I am not hungry or should i eat an extra apple or orange throughout the day to give me those extra calories.0
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Thanks Boss for always being informative...but now this brings me to another question b/c I don't want to be screwing myself over lol! :laugh:What this means:
For all you guys out there that are relatively active, and/or don't have extreme amounts of weight to lose, setting that goal of 2 lbs per week is usually a mistake. For all the reasons above, you need to temper your attempt at weight loss, give it time, and be consistent.
what do you consider "extreme" ??? :bigsmile:
last year I lost about 30lbs, a year later since I have started MFP in July I am down 15lbs [slow with a few set backs but yes I am one of the ones who's set to 2 lbs + eating most of my excercise burn]
so as a 215lb 5'6" woman, weight distributed fairly evenly, med-large bone structure..working out doing cardio/aerobics (starting some strength stuff) 5 days a week... looking to go down to about 180 (maybe 160)...would you consider this 40 lbs extreme amount of weight? or should I be lowering my weekly goal?
Again thank you for always providing us with a wealth of information.... I hope my rambling up there makes some sense:flowerforyou:
No, I don't consider 40 lbs to be extreme. A lot depends on body fat %, if you have a ton of body fat (like say over 32% or so, then you probably could get away with 2 lbs a week for a little while, but eventually you have to decrease the deficit amount. About 32% is usually where you see a drop off in the ability to lose 2 lbs a week, in some cases it can still be done, but for the majority, that's where it begins to become harder to lose.0 -
That brings up a question, I am always lower on my calories by 100 to 200, but I am always over on my protein and carbs which I don't see as a bad thing now on days i do exercise and have more calories to burn is the extra 200 to 300 going to make a difference. I mean i am eating three meals a day with three snacks in there and I am never going hungry with this plan. So should I be eating more even though I am not hungry or should i eat an extra apple or orange throughout the day to give me those extra calories.
that's probably the wrong question to be asking. What I would think you should be asking is this: Is this working? If the answer is no, then you need to go back and analyze it, check your body fat, check your amounts per meal, check your sodium levels, check to see if you put the right numbers in, check to see if you're overtraining...etc.
but if the answer is yes, then you're body is tolerant of the difference you mentioned, and for now at least, you probably don't need to make many (any) changes.0 -
Ok for example I added another orange and apple today off day from working out, and I am still below my calorie intake for the day by 49. if this was a workout day which starting next week everyday will be. I am going to have a higher deficit on calories So what can I do.0
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Thanks for the awesome info!! :flowerforyou:0
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Ok for example I added another orange and apple today off day from working out, and I am still below my calorie intake for the day by 49. if this was a workout day which starting next week everyday will be. I am going to have a higher deficit on calories So what can I do.
well, to start you eat your exercise calories, normally. If you know you're working out that day, and you know approximately how many calories you'll be burning, then try to factor that in when you plan your food for the day, try to split up the extra calories throughout the day so you don't end up eating a ton at night just to make up the difference. Planning is a big part of success with MFP, if you plan you day with food, you'll find it a lot easier to succeed.0 -
I plan my whole day out in the morning or even the night before I have been making switches to eat more lean meat I have totally done away with beef, I now focus on turkey, chicken, fish, and shrimp as my main source of meats, once I get down to my goal weight I will increase my protein while decreasing my carbs from breads and such right now that is the only way to get those extra calories.0
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GREAT POST!!!!!!!!!!0
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I plan my whole day out in the morning or even the night before I have been making switches to eat more lean meat I have totally done away with beef, I now focus on turkey, chicken, fish, and shrimp as my main source of meats, once I get down to my goal weight I will increase my protein while decreasing my carbs from breads and such right now that is the only way to get those extra calories.
There's lots of ways to get good calories, my TDEE is 2850 and I have days where I burn 500 to 700 calories, it can be done, it just takes a little extra effort. Is it easy? Nope, I struggle with finding 3300 calories some days, but usually I make it. I'm no longer trying to lose weight (I've reached my goal) but even when I was at 2200 calories, sometimes making the right choices is a matter of expanding your thinking to include foods you never used to eat. I for one, became a big fan of almonds, cottage cheese, and avocados!0 -
Thanks for the post!0
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Great clarity and detail, as always - thanks!
Right now I am swimming 3X week on alternate days in the evening, so I'm confused as to when I calculate those deficite calories to make them up. I find that I am hungry the next day, so is it ok, that I eat those exercise calories the day AFTER or am I defeating the purpose? I am way +35%, so I am in the group where starvation mode isn't so much a factor. It is working for me, but is it optomized, or does it matter at this stage?0 -
Great clarity and detail, as always - thanks!
Right now I am swimming 3X week on alternate days in the evening, so I'm confused as to when I calculate those deficite calories to make them up. I find that I am hungry the next day, so is it ok, that I eat those exercise calories the day AFTER or am I defeating the purpose? I am way +35%, so I am in the group where starvation mode isn't so much a factor. It is working for me, but is it optomized, or does it matter at this stage?
You are correct about the 35%, and yes, it matters, but optimizing is pretty much finding what you can tweak without causing you to go "over the edge", I.E. make small changes, give them time to take affect (a couple of weeks at least), and then re-evaluate. If it's working for you, I wouldn't over analyze too much, you can make yourself crazy tweaking this, and changing that, for relatively little results. Just realize that what works now, probably won't work (or work as effectively) after you lose 20 or 30 more pounds.
As to when to eat, days of the week are a mental thing we impose on our selves. With all due respect to circadian rhythms, ideally, you want to eat relatively soon after you work out (for anaerobic work) or an hour or so before you work out (for aerobic work, cardiovascular work). Why? because cardio doesn't really increase your EPOC (google EPOC for more info), and anaerobic work (weight training, any training that causes muscular failure or the fatigue "burn" where you can't do another rep.) requires muscles to rebuild post workout, which requires fuel AND protein (I.E. carbs and protein).0 -
Thanks Boss!0
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I'm self bumping. Is that really so wrong? :ohwell:0
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Not when you are so right....I'm self bumping. Is that really so wrong? :ohwell:
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I'm self bumping. Is that really so wrong? :ohwell:
Definitely not
But just to make you feel better..
:::bump:::
Thanks for the post & all the good info!!!0 -
My favorite part out of all of that was your advice to step back and see if it's working. For me, it's not. I need to re-evaluate and come up with a new game plan. Thanks for adding that part in. Sometimes people (myself included) just keep going with something (dieting or otherwise) without taking the time to look around and see if it's working or not. Great point! :flowerforyou:0
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This was great, I would like to request you start another topic on "switching tactics" after you've lost that initial 25-30 pounds. For example, I'm doing a 1200-calorie diet right now, with high-yield food that keeps me full all day long, and 5 hours of cardio a week. After I lose the first 25 pounds, I am thinking of doing a low-carb diet to switch things up for my metabolism.
I just think the topic of breaking plateaus isn't broached upon enough. The focus is always initial weightloss, blah blah.0 -
Excellent post--- thanks so much.0
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This was great, I would like to request you start another topic on "switching tactics" after you've lost that initial 25-30 pounds. For example, I'm doing a 1200-calorie diet right now, with high-yield food that keeps me full all day long, and 5 hours of cardio a week. After I lose the first 25 pounds, I am thinking of doing a low-carb diet to switch things up for my metabolism.
I just think the topic of breaking plateaus isn't broached upon enough. The focus is always initial weightloss, blah blah.
http://www.myfitnesspal.com/topics/show/20343-how-i-have-avoided-plateauing-length-warning0 -
This was great, I would like to request you start another topic on "switching tactics" after you've lost that initial 25-30 pounds. For example, I'm doing a 1200-calorie diet right now, with high-yield food that keeps me full all day long, and 5 hours of cardio a week. After I lose the first 25 pounds, I am thinking of doing a low-carb diet to switch things up for my metabolism.
I just think the topic of breaking plateaus isn't broached upon enough. The focus is always initial weightloss, blah blah.
http://www.myfitnesspal.com/topics/show/20343-how-i-have-avoided-plateauing-length-warning
ahh, you did it already. Good, I don't have to hunt for the link.
I have slowly lost an addl 5 pounds since hitting my goal weight. I can afford to lose another 10 or 15 pounds, so this is a good thing.
I was shooting for maintaining my weight, and by watching what I eat, and continueing on a generally healthier lifestyle, I lost 5 more pounds over the past year.
For me, not thinking about each ounce has been very beneficial. I read and learn and try new things. Cutting out the sugar and whites has helped a lot in the tummy area(thanks Marla:flowerforyou: ).........or I am just at the stage where that crummy belly fat is going away:ohwell:
I guess my point is..................it takes time. Once you are in a normal range, it is harder to lose. Exercise more, DON'T go back to that junk food that made you feel like crap both physically and mentally, and know that you will lose more weight! :flowerforyou:
Steve-thanks for another great article. :smooched:0 -
Banks...you are an AWESOME man!! Such an inspiration and SO full of knowledge...I'm active duty millitary and now that my husband and I have "completed" our family and I am completely focused on getting myself back in a healthy "war-fighter" state of mind...I am taking in between 1100-1200 cals a day and feeling very satisfied...I am working out 2 times a day 6 times a week and so far it seems to be working...my stats are as follows: SW:208.6, CW:202.8 and I just started the hard core focus on food and exercise on the 19th...I did a Bod Pod analysis and my BF was 48% (YUCK!!) and my TEE was around 1750 or so...I will be doing the Bod Pod once a month until I reach my goal weight...
Once again...thank you SO much for all your wonderful knowledge!!0 -
Fantastic post as always Banks! Thanks!0
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Awe thanks guys! Good luck to all!0
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BUMP AND:
all these great Banks posts (and some other smart peoplel's musings) are also in ONE CONVENIENT SPOT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Go Here:
http://www.myfitnesspal.com/topics/show/23912-links-in-mfp-you-want-to-read-again-and-again
scroll through the pages on the link, I add on when I find another good one. :flowerforyou:
Hi Steve!
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