Employer charging smokers.. Thoughts?

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  • Heaven71
    Heaven71 Posts: 706 Member
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    Quit, problem solved. Why would you want to smoke anyway? As an ex smoker, I wish I had never!

    Yeah not new though and yes, there are Insurance companies that charge for being over weight.
  • mdinardo73
    mdinardo73 Posts: 15 Member
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    i only smoke when i drink... so, i dont take breaks to smoke at work. and, i dont know where this money goes, i will learn more later. in my head, why not charge folks that are obese with awful eating habits & that are sedentary.


    Never heard of someone getting fat sitting next to an overweight person.

    GOOD POINT!! Haha, nicely said... and I agree
  • mrs_schultz2012
    mrs_schultz2012 Posts: 395 Member
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    I think it's a good idea.

    Also, some insurance companies do offer an insentive for working out....go to the gym so many times per month, and they put like $20 into your checking account toward your gym membership or whatever....I love that!
  • gerbies
    gerbies Posts: 444 Member
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    I have worked in the insurance industry for almost 20 years. Insurance (of any type) is based upon risk factors and the "probability" of a claim or payment. In general, data shows that "active" smokers have more long-term illnesses and are susceptible to ongoing illnesses more often (e.g., flu, bronchitis); in addition, "smoking" has been shown in clinical studies to be a direct risk factor in serious illnesses such as heart disease and cancer. While a person who is a smoker may not have been sick for 20 years, as a characteristic, it shows a higher probability of illness. This is how insurance rates are calculated.

    The same pricing theory is applied to the prices charged for a 20 year-old versus a 60 year-old. Both may have experienced similar health histories (e.g., a 60 year-old with little to no health issues or major illnesses), but data shows that a 60 year-old person has a higher probability of near-term and more serious illness.

    Most large companies who subscribe through group benefits insurance programs will charge an additional premium for smoking, or to say it in a different way, offer a deduction or lower rate for non-smokers. In addition, some companies will do the same for individuals with a high BMI. For my company, we are offered "credits" for our insurance if, as a smoker, you commit to going through a smoking cessation program during the year.

    It's really just about paying for the "exposure" you present to the insurance company in terms of the likelihood of a claim being paid.

    I think it makes sense...but, I come from the industry.

    If you only smoke occassionally, I would not identify yourself as a smoker. Unless you're drinking/smoking multiple times a week.
  • Laces_0ut
    Laces_0ut Posts: 3,750 Member
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    great idea...they should be charging overweight people too.
  • squishymissay
    squishymissay Posts: 37 Member
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    I think it's BS... if she's getting a clean bill of health from her doctor it's BS that they are charging her for something that could happen to her in her 40's 50's 60's 70's.... I haven't seen many 20 something's die from smoking cigs. And the way employment is today who is to say she will be working there long-term. Smoking has been demonized as a sin and there for that group can be targeted to be charged more. There are plenty of other groups that use more healthcare than the avg. but they are protected by claims of discrimination.


    Are they protected? My husband pays more for life insurance because of his weight. I think it makes sense and encourages a healthier lifestyle. I think if I make healthy choices, I should get the benefit of cheaper insurance. Trust me, just because you dont see 20 year olds dying from smoking, doesn't mean much. The health costs as they age are so much more, and you can't undo the damage of 20 years of smoking. I do see your point about them feeling targeted though. i'm just waiting for my pepsi drinking to be the next target. That sugar has to be a health risk--but boy do I love it!
  • TheRoadDog
    TheRoadDog Posts: 11,793 Member
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    The Company I used to work for is doing this. The thing is, several of the guys from there come to my house on the first Tuesday of every month for Cigar Night.

    Our creed is now "If you didn't catch me with a cigar in my hand, I wasn't smoking one."

    --followed by---

    "If you caught me with a cigar in my hand, I wasn't smoking it. I'm just holding it for Road Dog. He had to take a leak."

    My personal opinion is, don't make me lie to you by enacting such a dumb law.
  • Melolicious
    Melolicious Posts: 71 Member
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    My employer has a comprehensive wellness plan... our head office location has it's own Weight Watchers meeting on site as well as a bootcamp, yoga and zumba classes during lunch hours. Every other week there is a lunch'n'learn seminar on almost any topic you can think of under the banner of wellness. I can call our EFAP (employee and family assistance program) and have a stress management, new parent, new caregiver or smoking cessation program sent to me. The smoking cessation pack includes the patch and nicorrette gum!!! We also have a dietician that we can book with. My employer wants healthy, productive employees and they figure that it's cheaper to provide this than have unhealthy or sick employees.

    Insurance companies use huge actuary databases... you are not a person, you are a statistic. And they look at fat people the same way. The OP looks fairly young in the profile picture - do you know what your health will be in 20 years? Willing to guarantee it?
  • taylor5877
    taylor5877 Posts: 1,792 Member
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    great idea...they should be charging overweight people too.

    I'm 5'10" 230"....

    does that in and of itself make me overweight?
  • magj0y
    magj0y Posts: 1,911 Member
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    Insurance companies charge companies more if there are smokers. Instead of making all the employees pay for the smokers, they charge each person.

    I would ask if he's charging the obese extra as well, because that also cranks up your insurance. People who drink excessive amounts of alcohol? can he prove you've smoked in the last 12 months?
  • magj0y
    magj0y Posts: 1,911 Member
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    great idea...they should be charging overweight people too.

    I'm 5'10" 230"....

    does that in and of itself make me overweight?

    go to the dr and find out, they'll tell you your fat ratio, cholesterol level and all that fun stuff.
  • gerbies
    gerbies Posts: 444 Member
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    My personal opinion is, don't make me lie to you by enacting such a dumb law.

    From an insurance company perspective, smoking a cigar once a week would not meet the criteria of a regular "smoker". You and your buddies are safe to puff away :).
  • BrettPGH
    BrettPGH Posts: 4,720 Member
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    great idea...they should be charging overweight people too.

    I'm 5'10" 230"....

    does that in and of itself make me overweight?

    Yep. Enjoy your higher premiums for the way you choose to live your life.

    It's a sad day when people take the side of insurance companies over personal freedoms.
  • Laces_0ut
    Laces_0ut Posts: 3,750 Member
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    great idea...they should be charging overweight people too.

    I'm 5'10" 230"....

    does that in and of itself make me overweight?

    i dont know...whats your body fat percentage?


    edit to add my guess is you are extremely overweight.
  • gerbies
    gerbies Posts: 444 Member
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    One other point to consider when it comes to group benefits or employer-based insurance (particularly large companies). Generally, with these plans, insurance companies are not able to decline a person. That is, the employer buys a "group benefit" to make available to any/all employees. In the last several years, in order to a) keep coverage available to all employees and b) keep costs relatively manageable for both the employer and the employee, insurance companies have asked employers to build wellness strategies to help improve employee's health, thus lowering the probabillity of claims.

    In many cases, people who are able to obtain insurance through their company (and are cranky about having to pay a bit more if they are a smoker, or are cranky they must take some sort of action to earn a "credit" for their insurance) would otherwise be DECLINED for a new policy if they were someone applying for insurance as an average citizen.

    There are great benefits to having insurance coverage available through your employer. People have the freedom to smoke if they want to. Insurance companies have the freedom to charge a rate based on risk factors, which are based on science. No bullying, just data-based decisions.
  • cowgirlup327
    cowgirlup327 Posts: 58 Member
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    I've been looking for independent health insurance recently, as is a friend who is a smoker. I am a non-smoker and know that the rates provided in the basic insurance premium quotes are for non-smokers. My friend, on the other hand, has had to jump through hoops and authorize release of various medical records partly due to being a smoker. Plus his premiums are going to be higher. My guess is that it's covering the higher rate for the smokers. Your employer probably doesn't want to foot the extra cost of the insurance premiums for that handful of people.
  • taylor5877
    taylor5877 Posts: 1,792 Member
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    great idea...they should be charging overweight people too.

    I'm 5'10" 230"....

    does that in and of itself make me overweight?

    i dont know...whats your body fat percentage?


    edit to add my guess is you are extremely overweight.

    My body fat % was recently measured at 17% with an Omron at the gym (notoriously inaccurate, but usually high).
  • Laces_0ut
    Laces_0ut Posts: 3,750 Member
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    great idea...they should be charging overweight people too.

    I'm 5'10" 230"....

    does that in and of itself make me overweight?

    i dont know...whats your body fat percentage?


    edit to add my guess is you are extremely overweight.

    My body fat % was measured at 17% with an Omron at the gym (notoriously inaccurate, but usually high).

    thats fantastic...so your rate shouldnt be elevated...but do you disagree that soemone who has a 50% bf should pay the same as you?
  • lbetancourt
    lbetancourt Posts: 522 Member
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    i have been an occassional smoker for the last 20 years. I am now 41. At times, i do want to quit smoking. and, as someone mentioned, having a drink & smoking is nice. and, no, i dont want to quit drinking either. this past year, i visited a doctor 3 times. all routine check ups. and, similiar to the last 5 years with my current employer, primarily routine check ups. i know many coworkers don't even take the time to get routine check ups or physicals and/or are always sick, overweight, etc. I feel i am doing my part managing my health with preventive health care, keeping my weight down with exercise & diet. for pete's sake, i run the half marathon every year. i smoke, i am not perfect. but, damn... i am trying. this all new for me. so, i am feeling some frustration & i feel i am being targeted for my one "bad" health flaw.

    thanks for all your thoughts.
  • DamnImASexyBitch
    DamnImASexyBitch Posts: 740 Member
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    The insurance company charges those who smoke a higher premium. Your boss isn't ringing his hands making money of the choice of those who smoke. It's covering the cost of the higher premium. Insurance companies charge it because ultimately they have to pay more out in services to smokers. They also do charge those that are obese when it comes to life insurance. It costs nearly twice as much to take out a policy if you are not physically fit vs are.

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