What would you want done?
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Thank you for all of the feedback! I'm still accepting as much as I can get!0
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Hm, let's see... your child misbehaved in class and was verbally disciplined by his teacher, who then communicated why this occurred to you when you went to collect him. Of course you thought he looked 'scared and sad' while she thought he was being insolent - there is a big difference in how parents and teachers view your little darling!
Your child later reports physical abuse that apparently no one else at the school witnessed, and the administration told you that with no evidence of this occurring, they would not fire the teacher. Seems pretty darned reasonable to me.
If you don't like the staff then take your child elsewhere, but what you're proposing here sounds like a witchhunt. If the woman did not, in fact, touch your child, you are potentially hounding her out of her job with no evidence - kids lie, particularly when they think they have a sympathetic audience - and I am sure this is not the first time a teacher has been accused of something by a child resentful of verbal and/or non-physical discipline.
You reported it, and the administration dealt with it as best they could given that there is no physical evidence or witnesses (apparently). If she did pinch your child on the cheek, I assume she is on notice that a complaint has been lodged and she will presumably lose her job if there is evidence of this occurring.
I'm not sure what else you can reasonably expect, to be honest.
Glad I'm not the only one who is thinking this way. I love my son to death, but rules and discipline are part of life. Your child was to be in timeout, not running to be oddled by Mommy when you came in the door. He knew the expectation and wasn't following it. I honestly think you're over reacting, and expecting someone to lose their job over it, or be arrested is ridiculous!
I'm one of the strictest parents you will ever meet. I'm a firm believer in discipline, rules, and solid boundaries for children. Again I spent ten years in childcare. I have taken pictures of my children following all house rules and have them posted in our home. I follow a system similar to "Boystown". When my children are given a command they're expected to look at me, say okay, do as they're told, and if necessary check back to let me know they have completed my request. They know exactly where the timeout spots are in my home and know to go immediately. Even my 18 month old puts himself in timeout. If they don't sit appropriately in timeout, they will be asked to stand nose to the wall. If they fail to do that, they go to their room until they are willing to sit in the timeout. When they are done with the timeout they are asked to do what they were originally told to do. When they do what they were told they are praised for proper behavior and listening skills. They also lose privleges such as treats, outings, television, toys,and video games when necessary or appropriate. No yelling, finger shaking, or degrading necessary. If he failed to comply with her direction then a timeout is warranted as was a redirection after the timeout. He was not non compliant during the interaction. The room was not too loud for him to hear her if she spoke normal. No one responds well to a finger in there face. Again I wouldn't want my child to learn and repeat the phrase used with him. It is rude and derogatory. Not once in the interaction did she show him what to do. Nor did she have him complete the appropriate behavior.
Again thank you for your feedback.:flowerforyou:0 -
Hm, let's see... your child misbehaved in class and was verbally disciplined by his teacher, who then communicated why this occurred to you when you went to collect him. Of course you thought he looked 'scared and sad' while she thought he was being insolent - there is a big difference in how parents and teachers view your little darling!
Your child later reports physical abuse that apparently no one else at the school witnessed, and the administration told you that with no evidence of this occurring, they would not fire the teacher. Seems pretty darned reasonable to me.
If you don't like the staff then take your child elsewhere, but what you're proposing here sounds like a witchhunt. If the woman did not, in fact, touch your child, you are potentially hounding her out of her job with no evidence - kids lie, particularly when they think they have a sympathetic audience - and I am sure this is not the first time a teacher has been accused of something by a child resentful of verbal and/or non-physical discipline.
You reported it, and the administration dealt with it as best they could given that there is no physical evidence or witnesses (apparently). If she did pinch your child on the cheek, I assume she is on notice that a complaint has been lodged and she will presumably lose her job if there is evidence of this occurring.
I'm not sure what else you can reasonably expect, to be honest.
Glad I'm not the only one who is thinking this way. I love my son to death, but rules and discipline are part of life. Your child was to be in timeout, not running to be oddled by Mommy when you came in the door. He knew the expectation and wasn't following it. I honestly think you're over reacting, and expecting someone to lose their job over it, or be arrested is ridiculous!
I'm one of the strictest parents you will ever meet. I'm a firm believer in discipline, rules, and solid boundaries for children. Again I spent ten years in childcare. I have taken pictures of my children following all house rules and have them posted in our home. I follow a system similar to "Boystown". When my children are given a command they're expected to look at me, say okay, do as they're told, and if necessary check back to let me know they have completed my request. They know exactly where the timeout spots are in my home and know to go immediately. Even my 18 month old puts himself in timeout. If they don't sit appropriately in timeout, they will be asked to stand nose to the wall. If they fail to do that, they go to their room until they are willing to sit in the timeout. When they are done with the timeout they are asked to do what they were originally told to do. When they do what they were told they are praised for proper behavior and listening skills. They also lose privleges such as treats, outings, television, toys,and video games when necessary or appropriate. No yelling, finger shaking, or degrading necessary. If he failed to comply with her direction then a timeout is warranted as was a redirection after the timeout. He was not non compliant during the interaction. The room was not too loud for him to hear her if she spoke normal. No one responds well to a finger in there face. Again I wouldn't want my child to learn and repeat the phrase used with him. It is rude and derogatory. Not once in the interaction did she show him what to do. Nor did she have him complete the appropriate behavior.
Again thank you for your feedback.:flowerforyou:
Well put. I am much the same. I agree that reachers should try to redirect your child. If the behavior is too bad then i would appreciate a phone call and I will pick my son p right away. I do not mine time outs or losing privelages at school. But they are teachers, not partents. They are not to touch my child unless it is to protect him or another child (ie: fighting, if it were to happen they bear hug because he is autistc but fortunately he has had no problems). If I found a teacher shaming my child,finger shaking, standing over him to yell/degrade (i do not mind them talking to him and asking/telling him to do something while standing). I want to be the parent, I get final say on how my child is diciplined just as the other parents on here have their own way.0 -
I was heavily abused by the 'teachers' at St. Mary's Catholic School for boys.
They beat me, tied my (left) hand behind my back, forced me to 'become a righty' (the left hand is apparently the devil's hand).
I stood in corners, peed my pants because I was scared to ask to use the RR. They were on a major power trip. When my mother (Jewish as opposed to my recovering catholic father) found out, she went totally bat-spit insane on them.
She did her best to get the teachers fired, but as it was a church school (in Ireland) it was next to impossible. The entire church closed ranks and they quickly became untouchable.
So I was pulled from the school and landed in a much better situation.
Personally I'd pull your baby, get yourself on a mission to get the 'teachers' fired and see where you go.
Keep a diary of interactions, back fill a diary of the current events, check for bruises etc.
Talk to the police too, there are rules nowadays.
Above all, get your baby out of harms way and fast...0 -
Sounds like you've already decided, but just to put my opinion in the mix:
I've been through at least three rounds of "Plan to Protect" which is essentially teaching safe/legal behaviour for adults working with children. I recognize all the appropriate ways that you have outlined to discipline and show affection. IF in fact what you and your son say happened EXACTLY the way you've outlined it, then there would be at least one or two other adults who would be able to corroborate. I also agree with the poster who recommended keeping a journal of incidents, speaking non-threateningly with the teacher in question and going to the appropriate supervisor if you still have concerns. And yes, pulling your child if your concerns aren't addressed. I would not encourage calling newspapers/media, calling for the teacher to be fired or filing lawsuits.
I have two great kids who I believe trust me enough to tell me if something is wrong, and at 13 and 15 they have also had to take the course so that they can volunteer with the younger kids at church - so they also know how false accusations can cause trouble. Something I wouldn't ever expect any child under 8 to fully grasp. It doesn't have to be a case of who is right or wrong, perhaps it was just a case of misunderstanding or confusion as the investigators seem to have concluded.
I'm a momma bear too and will fight tooth and nail if I know for a fact that my kids are being victimized. Where I have to be careful is in making sure that in my righteous anger I don't victimize someone else. As much as I would want justice, I'd hate to be the one to destroy someone's life due to an error in judgement or a 'white lie'.0 -
I was heavily abused by the 'teachers' at St. Mary's Catholic School for boys.
They beat me, tied my (left) hand behind my back, forced me to 'become a righty' (the left hand is apparently the devil's hand).
I stood in corners, peed my pants because I was scared to ask to use the RR. They were on a major power trip. When my mother (Jewish as opposed to my recovering catholic father) found out, she went totally bat-spit insane on them.
She did her best to get the teachers fired, but as it was a church school (in Ireland) it was next to impossible. The entire church closed ranks and they quickly became untouchable.
So I was pulled from the school and landed in a much better situation.
Personally I'd pull your baby, get yourself on a mission to get the 'teachers' fired and see where you go.
Keep a diary of interactions, back fill a diary of the current events, check for bruises etc.
Talk to the police too, there are rules nowadays.
Above all, get your baby out of harms way and fast...
M
You are my hero and I love you! 0 -
Catholic institution? Lol, you're screwed. I went to Catholic school and my parents thought the discipline was a good thing!!:laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh:If you went to pick up your three year old at daycare and
1.the teacher stopped him from running to you to give you a hug saying they needed to "talk" about why he was in timeout (for putting his feet on the table)
2.Stood over him (not on his level)
3.Raised her voice and used an angry tone in front of everyone
4.shook and pointed her finger at him
5.Repeatedly told him to wipe the look of his face when he looked sad and scared
6.and later that night he told you that a teacher pinched his face when it was snack time (he didn't like the snack)
7.the next day you took him in and asked him to point out the teacher who hurt him (in front of other staff, the assistant director, and a family member for a witness) and he pointed at the same teacher and said that's the teacher who hurt me.
a. Teacher suspended
b. Teacher Fired
c. Teacher left in room with other children
d. Teacher reported to authorities
If it's in a Catholic institution would it change your answer on how you wanted it or expected it to be handled?
Accepting all feedback:flowerforyou:
Which is probably why I'm now an Atheist!:laugh: :laugh: :laugh:
A.C.E. Certified Personal/Group FitnessTrainer
IDEA Fitness member
Kickboxing Certified Instructor
Been in fitness for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition0 -
Catholic institution? Lol, you're screwed. I went to Catholic school and my parents thought the discipline was a good thing!!:laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh:If you went to pick up your three year old at daycare and
1.the teacher stopped him from running to you to give you a hug saying they needed to "talk" about why he was in timeout (for putting his feet on the table)
2.Stood over him (not on his level)
3.Raised her voice and used an angry tone in front of everyone
4.shook and pointed her finger at him
5.Repeatedly told him to wipe the look of his face when he looked sad and scared
6.and later that night he told you that a teacher pinched his face when it was snack time (he didn't like the snack)
7.the next day you took him in and asked him to point out the teacher who hurt him (in front of other staff, the assistant director, and a family member for a witness) and he pointed at the same teacher and said that's the teacher who hurt me.
a. Teacher suspended
b. Teacher Fired
c. Teacher left in room with other children
d. Teacher reported to authorities
If it's in a Catholic institution would it change your answer on how you wanted it or expected it to be handled?
Accepting all feedback:flowerforyou:
Which is probably why I'm now an Atheist!:laugh: :laugh: :laugh:
A.C.E. Certified Personal/Group FitnessTrainer
IDEA Fitness member
Kickboxing Certified Instructor
Been in fitness for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition
I'm so sorry for anything that happened to you and I'm sorry you weren't protected. Every child deserves to learn in a safe environment:flowerforyou:0 -
I do agree with Robyn in regards to "old-school" child rearing, and yes I think there should be discipline in school as long as it isn't verbally abusive (obscenities) and especially/obviously physical punishment should never be tolerated when it's done by a teacher or child care professional.
BUT...that being said...
Realistically, put on "leave without pay" and investigated pending firing and then prosecution if there is evidence found of physical abuse. This is why all daycares should have cameras...but even cameras don't catch everything and leave blind spots.0 -
I always see these threads way after the fact :grumble:0
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Oh my SweetSomething. If they don't don anything there, it may be time to look at a new daycare. That woman needs some education. Even working in the ER they tell us NOT to stand over our peds patients,but get down eye to eye with them. Her actions are inexcusable. WOW,this just makes me irrate to even think about. So sorry that he had to go through that.
Prayer for you all ~ and hugs.0 -
Oh my SweetSomething. If they don't don anything there, it may be time to look at a new daycare. That woman needs some education. Even working in the ER they tell us NOT to stand over our peds patients,but get down eye to eye with them. Her actions are inexcusable. WOW,this just makes me irrate to even think about. So sorry that he had to go through that.
Prayer for you all ~ and hugs.
Thank you You're a good friend! Eye level just seems like common sense to me. All of that could've been treated with training, but physically harming a child for not eating is just not acceptable.:frown: 0 -
e. shrieking eels0
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Most definitely fired. If she treated your son that way, she has probably treated other children that way as well. And it wont stop.
My son is 6 and his bus monitor decided to show him and other children a video of "weeping angels" from the show DR Who (if you dont know what they are, they are creeping to me, and most def terrifying to children of a young age, google it)......My son was TERRIFIED for DAYS actually, he is STILL having nightmares. Needless to say, that monitor is out a job because of my simple email with the attached video to the head of transportation.0 -
Most definitely fired. If she treated your son that way, she has probably treated other children that way as well. And it wont stop.
My son is 6 and his bus monitor decided to show him and other children a video of "weeping angels" from the show DR Who (if you dont know what they are, they are creeping to me, and most def terrifying to children of a young age, google it)......My son was TERRIFIED for DAYS actually, he is STILL having nightmares. Needless to say, that monitor is out a job because of my simple email with the attached video to the head of transportation.
Oh my gosh that is awful! Sometimes I just don't get why people make the choices they make concerning children! There really should be a better screening process.0 -
I know, its kinda scary!! I would make sure that the head of the daycare is FULLY aware of whats going on and make them aware of how you are feeling without holding anything back. A simple "i am beginning to question my decision to leave ____ here. I wonder all day long whats happening to him. If this isnt rectified to my fullest satisfaction, i will no longer be able to continue using your services and i will be sure the media writes a story so that everyone is aware of the irresponsible teacher and the lack of actions that were taken on your part."0
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First thing I would do is call a friend and tell them to get ready to bail me out of jail.
Then I wouldn't except anything less then suspension until a investigation by the police that I would call on my second phone call..
Finally if in anyway teacher touched my child in a hurtful way, I would push for termination til the cows came home.0 -
@Robyn, do you even have kids? If you do I am really, really sorry . . .for them
Hm, I find that rather insulting. But thanks for the expression of concern for their welfare. I am of the non-american school of child-rearing that says that teachers have a right to tell you that your child has been naughty, and they have the right to impose their authority by verbal and non-physical discipline in school. I couldn't care less about 'on their level' reasoning with small, naughty children.
I also have seen children (my own and others) tell bald-face lies when they think it will get them out of being disciplined. And I have a huge amount of respect for teachers, who have a tough enough job dealing with ill-disciplined children, without having to deal with parents who think their kids can do no wrong.
I guess that makes me a terrible mother. Feel free to call the authorities.
you sound like a wicked witch, no wonder your kids lie, you would scare the crap out of me too!
Of course kids lie, but if my kid says they were abused, i am not going to sweep it under the rug. I hope to God your kids remain safe because I would hate if some monster got ahold of them and then mommy dearest is in their face yelling "naughty, bratty little liars"
*edited to add a key fact, adults lie too honey and this one has more on the line than a kid trying to get out of trouble! Plus parents can tell when their kids are lying
Sigh... this is getting rather out of hand, don't you think? There's nothing quite as vicious as mothers discussing child-rearing! At no point did I suggest you should disregard a child's report of abuse - I am suggesting that once you have reported it to the school and they cannot find any further evidence of it, demanding the firing of a teacher is not terribly appropriate.
I've got to say this is just so wrong....my son was being bullied by another child, we have complained and complained to various teachers at various levels...we have been told it's not bullying and there is no evidence!! Our son has suffered bullying and NOTHING has been done.
I believe my son.0 -
He is so docile that when his 18 month old brother beats him up he just cries for help and won't fight back!
After the first part I said "Some people shouldn't be working in daycare" and then she left the room.
The next morning when I brought him in and he identified her I told the assistant director that I didn't want him in the same room and I wanted a resolution. They left her in the room but moved my child to the next level up. I told them I was reporting her. I went out to my car and called cps then proceeded to the parish office to speak to the pastor. He assured me something would be done. Police came to look at my son, but no mark=no crime. At the end of the day the teacher was still with children. My friend who has her son in saw the teacher alone in the bathroom with several children and she was yelling at them. I again spoke to the director and demanded a resolution and to know their policies. She said there would be a resolution, but probably not the one I wanted. The next morning I called her and she said they decided to keep her on staff because they couldn't prove she did anything. I called the pastor and told him I hoped it wasn't the Churches policy to keep people accused of abuse on staff. He promised to suspend her until after the investigation. It has been handed from CPS to day care licensing and I am waiting for it to be assigned to a caseworker.
i would have taken my kid out of the preschool. i dont care how they resolve it. that is not a safe place for my kid, i would not have brought him back the next day, or any day after that.
i would have gone to the higher ups and told them exactly why i was taking my kids out, and hoped they did the right thing and fired her. i would have called cps on her, if for no other reason than to get a file started on her. she sounds like a sadist. people who hate kids should not work with them, what a piece of work.0 -
If you went to pick up your three year old at daycare and
1.the teacher stopped him from running to you to give you a hug saying they needed to "talk" about why he was in timeout (for putting his feet on the table)
2.Stood over him (not on his level)
3.Raised her voice and used an angry tone in front of everyone
4.shook and pointed her finger at him
5.Repeatedly told him to wipe the look of his face when he looked sad and scared
6.and later that night he told you that a teacher pinched his face when it was snack time (he didn't like the snack)
7.the next day you took him in and asked him to point out the teacher who hurt him (in front of other staff, the assistant director, and a family member for a witness) and he pointed at the same teacher and said that's the teacher who hurt me.
a. Teacher suspended
b. Teacher Fired
c. Teacher left in room with other children
d. Teacher reported to authorities
If it's in a Catholic institution would it change your answer on how you wanted it or expected it to be handled?
Accepting all feedback:flowerforyou:
I work as a Nursery Nurse (in Scotland ) looking after 3 year olds & i have a 3 year old myself~ i cant believe what im reading,
Firstly i dont think she should have stopped him running to you, this should've been handled differently i.e. she should have let him run to you then explained to you that he had been on time out or gave him a chance to tell to you. She should not have stood over him, she should always be at the childs height, not raise her voice, it should be firm & clear for child to understand but not raised (hope you know what i mean), there should be no finger pointing, no.4 - 6 is a definate NO WAY & as for being Catholic my Daughter went to a Catholic School i'd be one angry mum if this happened Catholic school/daycare or not.
I dont know what the process is over there ~ but if i were you, you go to the manager of the daycare or whoever is above her, you make a formal complaint both in person & in writing keep a record you want the matter delt with & you want a record of it, this should result in the said person being disciplined, suspended depending on how things panned out it may result in them being fired. If they are disciplined it will be on there record, if they are suspended it will be until who ever runs the daycare gathers all possible evidence from other staff members etc, which will either result in them being fired or some other form of action. I hope this info helps0
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