Think before you post.

cally69

Facts are facts.
Fact.

sullus

Facts are facts.
Fact.

Well that's *your* opinion. heh.

cally69

I was speaking factually.
And that's a fact.

michellechawner

Who needs facebook drama when we have this?

Rage_Phish

Not everybody on the site is trying to lose weight. I would say we're fighting *for* health.

Some of us aren't fighting at all. We're here for the hookers and blow.

I like your style

sullus

Not everybody on the site is trying to lose weight. I would say we're fighting *for* health.

Some of us aren't fighting at all. We're here for the hookers and blow.

I like your style

suzieqsmart

I personally think you should be able to post whatever you want to and each person has their right to approve or disapprove but not attack or try to make you look stupid. There are soooooo many different theories out there. I can pick up a new magazine every week and it will tell me to try something else. I don't judge people by their beliefs weather it be weight loss or religion or climate changes. Post anything you like and don't get caught up with the negative. Skip over it and move on! Enjoy your day and don't let others get you down :-)

Yup. Everyone is different. Different things work for different people. Each to their own.

ThickMcRunFast

Facts are facts.
Fact.

Well that's *your* opinion. heh.

Rage_Phish

I was speaking factually.
And that's a fact.

Facts are simple and facts are straight
Facts are lazy and facts are late
Facts all come with points of view
Facts don't do what I want them to
Facts just twist the truth around
Facts are living turned inside out
Facts are getting the best of them
Facts are nothing on the face of things
Facts don't stain the furniture
Facts go out and slam the door
Facts are written all over your face
Facts continue to change their shape

suzieqsmart

This is strictly my OPINION: There should be a "Like" button on MFP.

UKMarjie

Well, I found another brick wall to smash into. I have been studying diet and exercise for quite awhile now. I like to know how things work and why. I am really getting into the nitty gritty of things. It's been an amazing journey. I know you are supposed to eat your vegetables, but now I know why. But I fell for it once again. I assumed that we had all this stuff figured out and all I had to do is get up to speed. This has the same flavor as my Jesus study. I am currently at the proverbial cellular level of this study. When I learn something really cool, I want to share it with my friends. You have seen a few tid bits here and there. Well my current lesson is that we as humans do not know what the f##k is going on. I posted a gold nugget to motivate anyone to whom it might speak to. And then was attacked. These attackers have several years of forum posting. The mindset here is very negative. They are in attack mode. They are armed with resources to poke fun at you and humiliate you. And they run in packs.The facts they use against you are opinions from the worlds top researchers. They throw them at you mixed with their own opinions and insults. Here is where the lesson comes in. Most of you probably already know this, but I just got up to speed. These top researchers will publish a paper on a specific topic. Then a few years later they will publish another paper on the same topic saying they now have more evidence and that they were actually wrong before and now they have it figured out. Then another top researcher will come along and publish another paper contradicting the other guy. At any given time there are at least two theories on the same topic. There is no one all beat all fact. I have learned this and accepted this. But some people on the forum have not. Today they are backing the guy who is saying what they want to hear. God forbid he changes his theory. But this rant is a warning. I had my published papers and was ready to retaliate. But when I saw they were from the same top researchers as theirs I stopped myself. Apparently when the researcher changes universities or companies so does his opinion.


The people in the fitness world are fired up. Their is no shortage of testosterone. I honestly believe that one woman punched me in the face on her monitor. The car and motorcycle forums were fun. Those guys are just cool. The Jesus forums were frustrating but fun. Because of the topic they were forced to show patience and virtue. But these fitness forums are something else...I will be coming back.

Yes..I agree...our (myself and a few other community members) thoughts are...they all need twinkies..lots and lots of twinkies!! I have resorted to ignoring those that choose to live in a world of misery. There are quite a few cool cats here..sadly they are far and few in between!! Keep on doing you...keep posting your findings..just ignore the trash that battles you! :P

You mean ignore the ones that are trying to stop false information from spreading on the forums?

I did not read his original post ...however from this one (the one I did read)..sounded as though people got really nasty towards him...this is what I said should be ignored., So many are too quick to jump down one's throat on here..that is what needs to be ignored so it does not turn into an all out MFP battle.
Far too many people for there not to be disagreements...however you can have a disagreement with out the hostility.

All the special snowflakes need is love.

I agree that civility should be maintained, however, with all the dangerous mis-information available regarding diet and exercise it would behoove people to be sure they are posting information from genuine scientific sources and not some mumbo-jumbo that they cannot find proper researched material to back up. Look at things like 'biggest looser' (and other such gimmicky nonsense) and the coaches on there who are touting unhealthy, unsustainable lifestyles and we shouldn't be surprised when there are epic fails in our society with finding and maintaining a healthy balance.

I am always grateful to see well researched posts on the subject come up and equally happy when misinformation is corrected. People on here are generally good but they don't sugar coat it or handle people with kid gloves. Why should they, we are all adults and surely we don't need condescension and pandering to accept when something we have posted was a bit silly or sucky. I have been schooled on here and when cooler heads prevailed realized that I deserved and needed it.

sullus

Facts are facts.
Fact.

Well that's *your* opinion. heh.

Siiiigh. I blew it in every way possible

Iron_Feline

I personally think you should be able to post whatever you want to and each person has their right to approve or disapprove but not attack or try to make you look stupid. There are soooooo many different theories out there. I can pick up a new magazine every week and it will tell me to try something else. I don't judge people by their beliefs weather it be weight loss or religion or climate changes. Post anything you like and don't get caught up with the negative. Skip over it and move on! Enjoy your day and don't let others get you down :-)

Yup. Everyone is different. Different things work for different people. Each to their own.

Enough said.

I'll get my information from the pack - people using actual science to help me get the body I want, not some magazine who wants me to stay fat so I keep buying it. :laugh: :noway: :laugh:

PS I totally judge people by their beliefs. I'm judging now.

jonnythan

I absolutely judge people on their beliefs.

If you believe something stupid, then you're probably stupid yourself.

UsedToBeHusky

I personally think you should be able to post whatever you want to and each person has their right to approve or disapprove but not attack or try to make you look stupid. There are soooooo many different theories out there. I can pick up a new magazine every week and it will tell me to try something else. I don't judge people by their beliefs weather it be weight loss or religion or climate changes. Post anything you like and don't get caught up with the negative. Skip over it and move on! Enjoy your day and don't let others get you down :-)

I think you are missing the point. People don't make me look stupid. I make myself look stupid and people correct me. Not everything out there is a theory. Honestly, I've seen many many scientific facts be completely disregarded as theory on this website just because someone read something somewhere that was biased, unobjective, or anecdotal. True studies follow the scientific model and have been carefully reviewed by unbiased parties to verify results and confirm that bias was removed. If someone's research isn't based on the scientific model, then they could be posting misinformation. It is not an attack to correct someone who has been misinformed.

cally69

I am so enjoying today on these forums.

quirkytizzy

I absolutely judge people on their beliefs.

If you believe something stupid, then you're probably stupid yourself.

Truth.

Kimdbro

Just had a seizure. **thud*

fiferize

OH BROTHER!

ninerbuff

You're on the Internet, people. Stop assuming any single one of you is more "knowledgeable" than any other. Virtually not a ONE of us is experts and most of us don't even have access to the full subscription databases that would be required to read any independent research. Even a flipping doctor on here would say he/she can't tell you SQUAT about you without examining you so it's all CONJECTURE.

We're all idiots. All of you on a high horse jump off and go outside or do something besides recieve gratification for use of this forum. All of you getting offended recognize these people on the Internet don't matter and being offended is a waste of your time. Everyone who can present their OPINION (that's what it is, an OPINION not fact) in a nice, friendly way and accept that others have different OPINIONS continue to use this site as it is intended.

When presenting actual studies and echoing sentiment from it, we're passing on correct information and not opinion. Granted everyone is different, but basic human physiology hasn't changed in thousands of years. We DO know that if you eat more than you burn, you'll store energy. You don't have to be an expert to figure that one out.
What does get misconstrued is information that gets posted by unfounded and unsubstantiated methods with no clinical studies to back them and pass them on as truth. So it's not just an opinion we spout, but actually backed information with links.
Choose to ignore it fine, but for those that want it, it's my pleasure to inform them.

A.C.E. Certified Personal/Group FitnessTrainer
IDEA Fitness member
Kickboxing Certified Instructor
Been in fitness for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition

hannakengu

I'll get my information from the pack - people using actual science to help me get the body I want, not some magazine who wants me to stay fat so I keep buying it. :laugh: :noway: :laugh:

PS I totally judge people by their beliefs. I'm judging now.

I used to like reading weight loss magazines since they motivated me. Then, I decided to test a recipe from a weight loss magazine, and logged all the ingredients. The outcome was that my meal had about 100kcals more than what the recipe said there would be per serving - and I followed the recipe without changing anything. Haven't bought that mag since.

On the actual topic - I actually went and read the original topic, and found three kinds of people there: people telling him he's special and should believe on what he wants to (which is sort of true, he can believe in whatever he wants to and others have the same right), people telling him he's wrong because of XYZ (who are probably also correct and have every right to throw in an argument that contradicts what he's saying, and then back it up with facts), and then the people I'm guessing got him most upset (the people who only said things like "this is horses**t" without any other fact, opinion, or any indication of why they think that). I think all these groups have the right to exist, speak and comment (it's a free forum, and freedom of speech is a pretty cool thing), but I do feel the last group is still kind of rude and unnecessary - your point is that you think he's wrong, you could just say "I think you're wrong/I think what you said is incorrect", or better yet, move on to the group that says things like "I think you're wrong because of XYZ, which was proved in this study LINK".

But then again, the forums would be far less entertaining if everybody knew how to behave.

Warchortle

Wait, life has contradictions?

likitisplit

I'll get my information from the pack - people using actual science to help me get the body I want, not some magazine who wants me to stay fat so I keep buying it. :laugh: :noway: :laugh:

PS I totally judge people by their beliefs. I'm judging now.

I used to like reading weight loss magazines since they motivated me. Then, I decided to test a recipe from a weight loss magazine, and logged all the ingredients. The outcome was that my meal had about 100kcals more than what the recipe said there would be per serving - and I followed the recipe without changing anything. Haven't bought that mag since.

On the actual topic - I actually went and read the original topic, and found three kinds of people there: people telling him he's special and should believe on what he wants to (which is sort of true, he can believe in whatever he wants to and others have the same right), people telling him he's wrong because of XYZ (who are probably also correct and have every right to throw in an argument that contradicts what he's saying, and then back it up with facts), and then the people I'm guessing got him most upset (the people who only said things like "this is horses**t" without any other fact, opinion, or any indication of why they think that). I think all these groups have the right to exist, speak and comment (it's a free forum, and freedom of speech is a pretty cool thing), but I do feel the last group is still kind of rude and unnecessary - your point is that you think he's wrong, you could just say "I think you're wrong/I think what you said is incorrect", or better yet, move on to the group that says things like "I think you're wrong because of XYZ, which was proved in this study LINK".

But then again, the forums would be far less entertaining if everybody knew how to behave.

Well, what clinches it is that he was all like "I'm not going to dig up the research I was referring to. I'm wrong. Sorry." And then posts a classic "You are all soooo mean." He should have just posted the research he was referring to.

MireyGal76

Didn't read, but thought OP needed a hug...



there there, it will be ok. all the mean bullies are just mean.

breeshabebe

I think that people need to be shown a little bit of grace in both giving and recieving advice. Sure, there are people out there that know more... but no one knows everything for certain... there is always some measure of faith that they are putting into someone else's studies. I think that at every point in my weight loss, I have been looking back at my previous self and saying "Wow... I didn't know jack, then!" I'm pretty sure that in a few years I will be saying the same of my current self.

CrazyTrackLady

Don't we all have a bigger common enemy?

What do you mean? Like, Kim Jong Un?

Technically wouldn't he be a smaller common enemy?

I dunno. Dude's not very tall, but he's definitely in need of some calorie counting.

He has been eating too many carbs after 8pm.

I think he's been eating too many imprisoned North Koreans after 8 pm.

hannakengu

Well, what clinches it is that he was all like "I'm not going to dig up the research I was referring to. I'm wrong. Sorry." And then posts a classic "You are all soooo mean." He should have just posted the research he was referring to.

Yes, exactly. I think ANYONE, whether they started the topic or just made a different argument in their comment, should post the research they are referring to.

CrazyTrackLady

You're on the Internet, people. Stop assuming any single one of you is more "knowledgeable" than any other. Virtually not a ONE of us is experts and most of us don't even have access to the full subscription databases that would be required to read any independent research. Even a flipping doctor on here would say he/she can't tell you SQUAT about you without examining you so it's all CONJECTURE.

We're all idiots. All of you on a high horse jump off and go outside or do something besides recieve gratification for use of this forum. All of you getting offended recognize these people on the Internet don't matter and being offended is a waste of your time. Everyone who can present their OPINION (that's what it is, an OPINION not fact) in a nice, friendly way and accept that others have different OPINIONS continue to use this site as it is intended.

When presenting actual studies and echoing sentiment from it, we're passing on correct information and not opinion. Granted everyone is different, but basic human physiology hasn't changed in thousands of years. We DO know that if you eat more than you burn, you'll store energy. You don't have to be an expert to figure that one out.
What does get misconstrued is information that gets posted by unfounded and unsubstantiated methods with no clinical studies to back them and pass them on as truth. So it's not just an opinion we spout, but actually backed information with links.
Choose to ignore it fine, but for those that want it, it's my pleasure to inform them.

A.C.E. Certified Personal/Group FitnessTrainer
IDEA Fitness member
Kickboxing Certified Instructor
Been in fitness for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition

Sooooo, you're telling me that a pound of muscle DOES weigh more than a pound of fat???? And here I was sooo proud of my fat turning into muscle. I hate truthiness!

ETA: I just snarked all over my keyboard.

ninerbuff

OP, I haven't read any of the posts to which you are referring, but I do agree with you. There is a "Pack" mentality on the forums. I often wonder if the phone tree gets activated, "we got another one", and these particular people show up in droves. Ignore them. They are so set in their own ideas and way of doing things, they are incapable of really listening or understanding anything else. If they aren't open to learning new things, they'll just miss out on a lot of great new things. Their loss. Pity them, and live your best life! :drinker:

totally this! there are so many schools of thought. just because someone can use google scholar doesn't mean they know anything. different schools of thoughts, different paradigms. let the haters hate and keep doing what works for you.

Schools of thought without actual studies to back them are just that..............thought. And lots of times it's inaccurate to say "keep doing what works for you". If someone is eating 500 calories a day, would I be a hater for correcting that? Or maybe saving someone the grief of going through it?

A.C.E. Certified Personal/Group FitnessTrainer
IDEA Fitness member
Kickboxing Certified Instructor
Been in fitness for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition

myofibril

Meh.

I could deconstruct the CICO model if I wanted to using PubMed abstracts. In an area of such inherent uncertainty as nutrition and fitness I am always wary of people who pontificate with absolutely certainty on most areas within it.

One of the brightest minds in fitness in my view is Matt Perryman and he has this to say:

The problem to me isn’t the fact that science is used as a tool, but rather the reverence for, and certainty given to, the findings of published research with no further context. There’s an awful lot of confidence there for an awfully shaky set of assumptions, especially given the realities of exercise science and nutritional research. This is not to say that the research is useless — far from it — but more often than not it becomes fodder for a rider looking to justify the elephant’s intuitive choice. Constructing a story out of Pubmed abstracts is not a particularly compelling case.

Personally speaking I’m less confident than ever that looking at published research can provide all the answers; and likewise, I’m much less willing to be so vocal in pushing arguments which have so much inherent uncertainty (and when I can’t be sure of eliminating my own biases).

link: http://www.myosynthesis.com/two-minds-flame-war