Sick and Tired of feeling Hungry

neandermagnon

and anyone who thinks that fructose is dangerous to human health, bear in mind that we're primates and most species of primates eat fruit (which is full of fructose). are you going to call the zoo and tell them they should stop feeding fruit to all the other species of primate?

This is not the issue. The issue is that the average American, (probably most overweight western countries) consumes 13% of their average daily energy from ADDED fructose. Big difference between a glass containing 240mls (8oz) of orange juice or a packet of oreos, or 4 oranges. You are full after the 4 oranges because of their fibre. You stop eating. You are full. Have a glass of OJ, then tuck into another 400 calories of breakfast. Try 1 small packet of raisins. Eat a pound (0.4kg) of grapes. Which makes you feel full?
This forum was about tired of feeling hungry. So avoid high energy foods that do not "fill you up". And that means cutting out sugar because that does 2 things. Calorie intake, and lack of hunger feedback means you keep eating.

Yes I know that refined fructose and fructose when it's still in fruit don't do the same things inside the body, because of the fibre water and everything else that's in fruit..... but fruit still contains a lot of fructose and fruit is not going to harm you unless you take fruit eating to ridiculous proportions, or you have a medical issue that means you can't eat fruit.

I'm sick to death of people demonising foods, and people going round saying fructose is bad and similar just leads to people eliminating all foods that contain fructose including whole fruit. They go from one unhealthy, unbalanced extreme to another. Eating more whole fruit is good advice for most people who currently eat the standard American diet.

Foods are not good or bad in themselves, you have to look at the whole diet in context. If someone was to eat nothing but fruit, their diet would be very unhealthy, as it would lack a number of key nutrients that are not found in fruit (or are not in big enough quantities). A good diet is balanced.... it provides everything that the body needs, without harming the body in the process. Even refined fructose won't do you any harm if you eat it as part of a balanced diet. You need to look at the big picture, not demonise individual foods, food groups or nutrients.

SanteMulberry

"...So you have a choice, eat food that you find bland(pain), or eat junk food and be hungry(pain). You have to pay the price either way. .."

To the contrary, I find the natural diet I follow to be very tasty. It is a matter of getting your palate adjusted to eating real food. In addition, I am never hungry. A natural diet full of nutrients is a win-win, all the way around.

SanteMulberry

and anyone who thinks that fructose is dangerous to human health, bear in mind that we're primates and most species of primates eat fruit (which is full of fructose). are you going to call the zoo and tell them they should stop feeding fruit to all the other species of primate?

This is not the issue. The issue is that the average American, (probably most overweight western countries) consumes 13% of their average daily energy from ADDED fructose. Big difference between a glass containing 240mls (8oz) of orange juice or a packet of oreos, or 4 oranges. You are full after the 4 oranges because of their fibre. You stop eating. You are full. Have a glass of OJ, then tuck into another 400 calories of breakfast. Try 1 small packet of raisins. Eat a pound (0.4kg) of grapes. Which makes you feel full?
This forum was about tired of feeling hungry. So avoid high energy foods that do not "fill you up". And that means cutting out sugar because that does 2 things. Calorie intake, and lack of hunger feedback means you keep eating.

You are so right, Fairlieboy, fructose researchers understand that there is an "anti-satiety" effect inherent in fructose metabolism. They believe that it is a major part of "food addiction". Not sure whether I posted this link further up in the thread and I don't have time to check right now but here is the link to a scientific conference on "food addiction": http://www.foodaddictionsummit.org/index.htm

Besides which, in answer to the poster who noted that animals eat fruit: Richard J. Johnson, M.D. (head of the renal division at the University of Colorado Medical Center) has noted that animals do eat fruit. They eat fruit in order to add body fat for periods when food will be scarce. (Such as black bears gorging on vast quantities of wild blueberries, and adding a great deal of body fat in preparation for the winter's hibernation.) One problem that humans have when they ingest a lot of fructose is that we do not possess the uricase enzyme (as most other animals have) and fructose metabolism raises uric acid levels--setting off a host of health problems: hypertension, Type II diabetes, CVD and renal disease. Many fructose researchers recommend that obese individuals eat no more than 15 grams of fructose per day (and limit carbohydrates as their bodies are quite efficient in converting high blood glucose into fructose). They recommend that normal weight individuals limit their fructose intake to 25 grams or less of fructose (2 or 3 servings of fruit per day). It isn't that our bodies are incapable of dealing with fructose any more than they are incapable of dealing with alcohol (and by the way, fructose and alcohol are metabolized in similar ways). It is that high doses of fructose (such as would be in a big slice of cake) overwhelm our body's ability to cope with it. There are other protective effects that fruit eating confers that eating cake does not. For one, the fructose in fruit is encased in fiber and released slowly over time. An orange has approximately 4 to 6 grams of fructose (depending on the size and sweetness). A can of "orange" soda has 44 grams of fructose (AND there is no fiber to slow down the transmission of the fructose). The dose makes the poison.



I have to go right now, but I will be back later to comment...

rowanwood

I cannot stop laughing.

Thin people know how to eat? A calorie isn't a calorie? What is it then, magic?

I eat carrots because they take up more room than chocolate and I don't like a rumbling belly. My metabolism could care less.

mistesh

yes your palate has to "adjust" to it. It takes time won't happen over night. I like food that is less processed. Doesn't mean that someone who is stuffing their face with pizza, and root beer, burgers, fries, chips, and Twinkies everyday who weighs 500+ lbs will be able to do your recommendations. That's my point. you guys are doing extremes.

Haha, there's nothing extreme about eating real food. Most people used to do it most of the time. Your someone, while not far from today's average American, is the extreme, wouldn't you agree? Sure, improving your taste sensitivity takes time. A few weeks are likely to show a considerable difference. Nicely aligns with the 21 day habit forming rule. The nice reward is that taste sensitivity can be linked to weight. Sure, it's not easy overcoming food addiction, but if you believe that habit matters more than food choice, then automate your habits. Figure out your triggers. Look into what drives emotional eating. Some willingness has be present, but that goes without saying.

SanteMulberry

"...So you have a choice, eat food that you find bland(pain), or eat junk food and be hungry(pain). You have to pay the price either way. .."

To the contrary, I find the natural diet I follow to be very tasty. It is a matter of getting your palate adjusted to eating real food. In addition, I am never hungry. A natural diet full of nutrients is a win-win, all the way around.

yes your palate has to "adjust" to it. It takes time won't happen over night. I like food that is less processed. Doesn't mean that someone who is stuffing their face with pizza, and root beer, burgers, fries, chips, and Twinkies everyday who weighs 500+ lbs will be able to do your recommendations. That's my point. you guys are doing extremes.

I am currently counseling a woman in that category. She is 486 pounds and eats NOTHING that isn't heavily processed. Cake, cookies, ice cream, pizza, and the occasional restaurant meal ordered out. She is clearly a food addict. Eats no vegetables (she has made one concession and orders a few more veggies on her pepperoni pizza occasionally). Eats no fruit (she will have the odd glass of orange juice and considers that healthier than soda). I have told her that she has a physical addiction in addition to an emotional illness that she is attempting to medicate with food. I issued a challenge to her the other day. I asked her if she thought she could eat anything she wanted except anything with added sugar and/or gluten. She started to cry because she realized that she was addicted to foods that contains both of those. After she got done crying, she thought for a moment and asked that maybe could she give up sugary foods first? I said, "Good choice." She is on Day 3 and is experiencing some difficulty but she has been gamely eating pizza, burgers and fries, and lots of bread and butter. She has Type II diabetes and her doc has made it clear that she will not see another decade without major complications and/or death (she is 34) if she continues to ignore her blood sugar problems and gain at the rate that she has been gaining. She MUST do something extreme.

If someone has 20-40 pounds to lose, it is no big deal if they "cheat" here and there. I am close enough to my goal weight now that I could have the odd ice cream cone if I wanted to (which I do not). When someone has an extreme problem like this woman has, she MUST avoid the foods that send her off into oblivion--just as an alcoholic must never take a taste of an alcoholic beverage (I used to know a Christian man who would not even take Communion until they went from wine to grape juice in the service). We'll see how it goes.

run_way

Seriously