Anyone else have issues with low carb diets?
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I don't have issues with any kind of diet. If something works for you, then that's great. Why would you assume that any one way of eating would work for everybody? All I know is that a high carbohydrate diet does not work for me.
FYI, I've never shot for ketosis, but I've set my carbohydrate goal to 75-150 or so, or around 25% of my diet.
The only part of your rant that offended me was your insinuation that I'm somehow taking the easy way out by going with a strategy that actually works for me. In other words my inability to succeed with your kind of diet somehow indicates a flaw in my character.
you, Sir, have certainly earned my respect with your reply... I appreciate all your points and apologize for offending with the "easy way out" comment. I guess definitions of low carb differ, and I certainly wasn't talking about people who maintain it for health reasons, or who are educated enough on it to aim to prevent longterm ketosis - I was only commenting on those frustrating "carbs make you fat" individuals who eat extremely low carb long term without understanding what they're doing to their body.
kudos to you, though, for pointing these things out.0 -
you might be confusing me with someone else - I never posted anything from Mark's Daily Apple - I think that guy is nuts.
That was me and it was a TERRIBLE example of my point. I am ashamed.0 -
I love it when uninformed people mouth off about other people's eating habits. Read the books and understand what each of these plans are before posting. If you wish to have some sort of educational discourse, don't ask more uninformed individuals to comment on it. Everybody has an opinion, but that doesn't mean it has value.
why don't you start by telling me what I'm uninformed about instead of just b!tching about the thread?
lol - touchy now, aren't we, when folks disagree with you? What the hello did you expect? Balloons and confetti???0 -
:drinker: :drinker: :drinker: THANK YOU!!!!!I don't have issues with any kind of diet. If something works for you, then that's great. Why would you assume that any one way of eating would work for everybody? All I know is that a high carbohydrate diet does not work for me.
FYI, I've never shot for ketosis, but I've set my carbohydrate goal to 75-150 or so, or around 25% of my diet.
Why on earth would you be horrified to state your opinion?I see all this stuff on low carb and ketogenic diets and I'm horrified to tell you the god's honest truth.
Yep. Sure do. I'm just not disciplined enough to consistently do ketosis, but I don't see any problem with it.I understand that it works and it works fast, but does anyone ever care to know what's actually happening to their body during ketosis?
The operative word is CAN. Lots of things can lead to kidney damage.How it lowers the pH of your blood and can lead to kidney damage long term?
You really need to define terms here. Are you only arguing against ketotic diets, or anything that restricts carbs, or just things that limit fruits & veggies? I think you have to separate grains from fruit here. I don't limit fruit, but that's because I was never a big fan in the first place....I was just curious if anyone shares my frustration with the Atkins and South Beach diets? Paleo is another one - I agree with the quality of foods, but banning grains and limiting fruit and replacing that with meat and fats is just another low carb diet.
I do, yes. I have researched the heck out of the impacts of macronutrient mixes for years.Anyone know anything about biology? About metabolic processes?
Defined "preferred". This is pseudoscience without defining terms. Of course the body burns sugar first because we have very little ability to store it.Glucose is the body's preferred form of energy
You are correct. The brain cannot survive without glucose, but the body can create glucose without consuming carbohydrates. Technically speaking, carbohydrate is the only macronutrient that we survive entirely without, thought I wouldn't particularly want to.- it's the only macronutrient that is digested and utilized for energy the fastest and without any waste products (unlike protein/uric acid and fat/ketones) - the brain cannot survive without it and that's a fact.
Why of course? If I eat 5000 calories of olive oil a day, I'm pretty sure I'm NOT going to lose weight.If you starve your body of glucose, OF COURSE you're going to lose weight.
So you're telling me that fad dieting is dangerous? mmm hmmm... A deliberate conscious choice to go with a ketotic diet is not any more dangerous than the standard American diet.Short term, I get it, it serves its purpose, but long term? not healthy. If you're looking to cut some weight before a competition, it's useful, but the normal fad dieters out there?
The human body is actually really good at burning fat, but I grant you that there is an adjustment from using sugar as a primary fuel to using fat as the primary fuel. I don't understand why you assume that because you are unable to do a thing, that others are also unable to do that thing.I just think it's straight up dangerous. ESPECIALLY when you add exercise to the equation.
I could never go low carb (and yes, I have type 1 diabetes), because I exercise so much - how are you expected to fuel your workouts?
Again with the fear of offense. I don't understand. Let's just have a dialog without the drama. As for the easy out - Easy? There's nothing easy about losing weight for me, and this is the only part of your rant that bothered me.I'm sorry, I know I'm going to ruffle some feathers here, and that's not necessarily my intention (please believe me). I just think low carb is almost like an easy way out vs. long term vitality and health.
I have not read that book or seen that movie, but I've read a few blog posts on Forks Over Knives and I wasn't impressed. What makes these media better than the other side of the argument?I'm not talking about carbs from breads, pastas and potatoes, by the way, I'm talking about carbs from fruits and vegetables. How can anyone argue that fruits and vegetables are NOT healthy? If you look at the percentage of fats and proteins in relation to carbs in naturally occurring fruits and vegetables, why would you think that a diet that is the direct INVERSE of that is healthy?
Anyone ever read that book 80/10/10 by Dr. Douglas Graham? Anyone ever see that movie Forks Over Knives? I guess those were eye openers for me.
So you've never heard of low-carb vegetarians?... if you're a veggie eater, of course you're going to lean towards vegetarian/vegan. But when it comes to weight loss and health, I just don't agree with the low carb approach. I believe the best approach is to watch overall calories and portions, keep it simple and everything in moderation.
/end rant (sorry - seriously not trying to offend people here, just would like to start an open discussion on the topic)
The only part of your rant that offended me was your insinuation that I'm somehow taking the easy way out by going with a strategy that actually works for me. In other words my inability to succeed with your kind of diet somehow indicates a flaw in my character.0 -
you might be confusing me with someone else - I never posted anything from Mark's Daily Apple - I think that guy is nuts.
That was me and it was a TERRIBLE example of my point. I am ashamed.
LOLOL
I honestly don't know if you're being sarcastic or not, but that was just hysterical.0 -
I love it when uninformed people mouth off about other people's eating habits. Read the books and understand what each of these plans are before posting. If you wish to have some sort of educational discourse, don't ask more uninformed individuals to comment on it. Everybody has an opinion, but that doesn't mean it has value.
why don't you start by telling me what I'm uninformed about instead of just b!tching about the thread?
lol - touchy now, aren't we, when folks disagree with you? What the hello did you expect? Balloons and confetti???
um, no? I fully expected to ruffle a few feathers, as I stated in my original post. I just think if you're going to disagree, at least tell me WHY and be constructive about it, adding to the conversation. I don't think there's anything wrong with what I said. the person was just whining... not actually adding anything to the discussion. I felt the need to point that out.0 -
It really was the worst possible link I could have picked...0
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I see all this stuff on low carb and ketogenic diets and I'm horrified to tell you the god's honest truth. I understand that it works and it works fast, but does anyone ever care to know what's actually happening to their body during ketosis? How it lowers the pH of your blood and can lead to kidney damage long term? I generally feel that people should do whatever works for them and am not bashing all low carbers out there or anything (it definitely has its place), but I was just curious if anyone shares my frustration with the Atkins and South Beach diets? Paleo is another one - I agree with the quality of foods, but banning grains and limiting fruit and replacing that with meat and fats is just another low carb diet.
Anyone know anything about biology? About metabolic processes? Glucose is the body's preferred form of energy - it's the only macronutrient that is digested and utilized for energy the fastest and without any waste products (unlike protein/uric acid and fat/ketones) - the brain cannot survive without it and that's a fact. If you starve your body of glucose, OF COURSE you're going to lose weight. Short term, I get it, it serves its purpose, but long term? not healthy. If you're looking to cut some weight before a competition, it's useful, but the normal fad dieters out there? I just think it's straight up dangerous. ESPECIALLY when you add exercise to the equation.
I could never go low carb (and yes, I have type 1 diabetes), because I exercise so much - how are you expected to fuel your workouts? I'm sorry, I know I'm going to ruffle some feathers here, and that's not necessarily my intention (please believe me). I just think low carb is almost like an easy way out vs. long term vitality and health. I'm not talking about carbs from breads, pastas and potatoes, by the way, I'm talking about carbs from fruits and vegetables. How can anyone argue that fruits and vegetables are NOT healthy? If you look at the percentage of fats and proteins in relation to carbs in naturally occurring fruits and vegetables, why would you think that a diet that is the direct INVERSE of that is healthy?
Anyone ever read that book 80/10/10 by Dr. Douglas Graham? Anyone ever see that movie Forks Over Knives? I guess those were eye openers for me.
At the end of the day, people are going to follow a diet that condones their initial preferences. If you're a meat eater, of course you are going to lean towards Atkins or Paleo... if you're a veggie eater, of course you're going to lean towards vegetarian/vegan. But when it comes to weight loss and health, I just don't agree with the low carb approach. I believe the best approach is to watch overall calories and portions, keep it simple and everything in moderation.
/end rant (sorry - seriously not trying to offend people here, just would like to start an open discussion on the topic)
There are multiple inaccurate statements in this post, which leads me to conclude that the real reason you're so anti-low carb is simply due to being misinformed. To clear some things up:
1. Your body has ZERO need for dietary carbs. We know this because there are Eskimo's doing just fine on practically zero carb diets. They're not all on dialysis either! So it looks like you're the one who needs to learn something about biology.
2. Most low carb diet plans, like the Atkins diet, don't recomend consistently staying in ketosis chronically for the rest of your life. Most recomend cycling through periods of ketosis, or simply doing an induction ketosis phase followed by slowing adding back some carbs so you end up eating only relatively low carb for the long haul.
3. According to your logic, since glucose is the body's "preferred energy source," we should just eat diets high in sugar . . . yeah that would be super healthy!
4. Low carb ain't for everyone. I don't personally recomend it (I think the LOGI diet is better). But if it works for someone then that's great. It's most likely a lot better then high carb low fat diets.0 -
And that's your problem. Your "beliefs" are making you willfully ignorant of the current research.I just don't agree with the low carb approach. I believe the best approach is to watch overall calories and portions, keep it simple and everything in moderation.0 -
1. Your body has ZERO need for dietary carbs. We know this because there are Eskimo's doing just fine on practically zero carb diets. They're not all on dialysis either! So it looks like you're the one who needs to learn something about biology.
2. Most low carb diet plans, like the Atkins diet, don't recomend consistently staying in ketosis chronically for the rest of your life. Most recomend cycling through periods of ketosis, or simply doing an induction ketosis phase followed by slowing adding back some carbs so you end up eating only relatively low carb for the long haul.
3. According to your logic, since glucose is the body's "preferred energy source," we should just eat diets high in sugar . . . yeah that would be super healthy!
4. Low carb ain't for everyone. I don't personally recomend it (I think the LOGI diet is better). But if it works for someone then that's great. It's most likely a lot better then high carb low fat diets.
you're wrong - carbs provide your body with more than just energy... they prevent catabolism of muscle (muscle wasting), they aid in the absorption of calcium, they feed the microbiota in your gut. I'm talking about this stuff from a HEALTH perspective, not just a diet perspective. can you live off of zero carbs? yes, for a while, but you're not going to be healthy.
I'm assuming you're talking about the Inuit? their diets are low in carbs, yes, but not zero carbs. therefore, I don't understand your analogy. Also, you clearly don't know much about the Inuit because it has been documented that they die an average of 10 years earlier and have cancer rates higher than the overall Canadian population: http://www.diseaseproof.com/archives/diet-myths-are-the-inuit-healthy.html
the very cyclic methods you're referring to, why do you think they're recommended? why don't you think a long term state of ketosis is recommended? because it's healthy? why would you put your body in a state of anything where there's a major health risk associated with it and you have to be careful to "cycle"?
glucose is not the same as sucrose (sugar) - you should probably do a little more research on terminology there. I clearly wasn't suggesting we eat diets high in sugar, just that perhaps it's not healthy to adamantly avoid carbs - and I'm not even suggesting processed carbs, I'm talking about fruit and vegetables.
there are definitely benefits to LOGI - I agree with you there.0 -
You obviously have trouble with reading comprehension, too. I called you a troll because you are introducing a post just so you can start an argument. That isn't whining, it's stating a fact. Now back to my very important research..0
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And that's your problem. Your "beliefs" are making you willfully ignorant of the current research.I just don't agree with the low carb approach. I believe the best approach is to watch overall calories and portions, keep it simple and everything in moderation.
possibly.0 -
Wow. Everyone seems a little testy. Is it lunch time or something?
I think that diets are considered low-carb if they have less than 80g of carbohydrates per day (if memory serves me).
I did try Southbeach a few years back and it taught me that refined carbs were not my friend. It helped me realize that when I ate them that I was constantly hungry. Now I have a vegan diet. I checked my numbers and I eat about 200g of carbohydrates per day mostly in the form of fruit. I try to avoid grains for the most part only because of portion control issues (that's just me).
I know that I do not get enough protein. I average about 40-60g per day and I think I should have around 80g. The odd thing is that I consume more protein now than I did when I was on Southbeach.
I guess what I am saying is that there are risks for every kind of diet and you just have to be smart about it.
Oh, and if your breath ever smells like something died in the back of your throat go to the doctor ASAP.0 -
sorry, but I prefer to get my info from actual studies, not articles on Livestrong:
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/2826524
Livestrong > Mark's Daily Apple! :laugh: :laugh: :laugh:
But um, yeah. Science rules! :flowerforyou:
you might be confusing me with someone else - I never posted anything from Mark's Daily Apple - I think that guy is nuts.
I agree with you. No, not confusing you, just using your statement to make a joke. :laugh:0 -
You obviously have trouble with reading comprehension, too. I called you a troll because you are introducing a post just so you can start an argument. That isn't whining, it's stating a fact. Now back to my very important research..
actually, this whole thread has been eye opening in a way and it's provided a bit of truth from both sides... I certainly didn't start it to spur an argument, but you would probably see it that way through your narrow lens of comprehension. very few people are actually arguing... in fact, a lot of useful information is being offered, but you prefer to focus on me and speculate as to why I'd present the topic rather than working on your very important research. good luck with that.0 -
sorry, but I prefer to get my info from actual studies, not articles on Livestrong:
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/2826524
Livestrong > Mark's Daily Apple! :laugh: :laugh: :laugh:
But um, yeah. Science rules! :flowerforyou:
you might be confusing me with someone else - I never posted anything from Mark's Daily Apple - I think that guy is nuts.
I agree with you. No, not confusing you, just using your statement to make a joke. :laugh:
woops, okay sorry... I'm still getting used to the whole posting on a message board thingie.0 -
You obviously have trouble with reading comprehension, too. I called you a troll because you are introducing a post just so you can start an argument. That isn't whining, it's stating a fact. Now back to my very important research..
actually, this whole thread has been eye opening in a way and it's provided a bit of truth from both sides... I certainly didn't start it to spur an argument, but you would probably see it that way through your narrow lens of comprehension. very few people are actually arguing... in fact, a lot of useful information is being offered, but you prefer to focus on me and speculate as to why I'd present the topic rather than working on your very important research. good luck with that.
I think your OP made it quite clear that you were hoping for discussion, not a flame war.0 -
sorry, but I prefer to get my info from actual studies, not articles on Livestrong:
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/2826524
Livestrong > Mark's Daily Apple! :laugh: :laugh: :laugh:
But um, yeah. Science rules! :flowerforyou:
you might be confusing me with someone else - I never posted anything from Mark's Daily Apple - I think that guy is nuts.
I agree with you. No, not confusing you, just using your statement to make a joke. :laugh:
woops, okay sorry... I'm still getting used to the whole posting on a message board thingie.
It's all good! :flowerforyou:0 -
you're wrong - carbs provide your body with more than just energy... they prevent catabolism of muscle (muscle wasting), they aid in the absorption of calcium, they feed the microbiota in your gut. I'm talking about this stuff from a HEALTH perspective, not just a diet perspective. can you live off of zero carbs? yes, for a while, but you're not going to be healthy.
There are no "low carb diets" recomend actually eating zero carbs! Almost all "low carb" diets include lots of veggies. And all the benefits you just listed about carbs are not exclusive to carbs. You don't need carbs to prevent muscle breakdown, just ask any body builder who's been around for awhile.
I agree that eating zero carbs would be suboptimal for long term health, primarily because you'd be missing all the fiber, anti-oxidants, and micronutrients from fruits and starchy veggies. But you would not be malnourished.I'm assuming you're talking about the Inuit? their diets are low in carbs, yes, but not zero carbs. therefore, I don't understand your analogy. Also, you clearly don't know much about the Inuit because it has been documented that they die an average of 10 years earlier and have cancer rates higher than the overall Canadian population: http://www.diseaseproof.com/archives/diet-myths-are-the-inuit-healthy.html
You're arguing against a strawman. Nobody is using the Inuit to say low carb dieting is superior for longevity. It's simply proof that you do not truly need carbs in your diet. Your original post inaccurately indicates that low carb dieting acutely causes all sorts of horrible diseases. Furthermore there are many possible reasons for the Inuit's shorter life span other than diet.the very cyclic methods you're referring to, why do you think they're recommended? why don't you think a long term state of ketosis is recommended? because it's healthy? why would you put your body in a state of anything where there's a major health risk associated with it and you have to be careful to "cycle"?
There are many reasons, but "a major health risk" is not one of them. Regardless, since nobody recomends actually eating zero carbs, you're arguing against a strawman again. You seem to think "low carb" dieting is something that it's not.glucose is not the same as sucrose (sugar) - you should probably do a little more research on terminology there. I clearly wasn't suggesting we eat diets high in sugar, just that perhaps it's not healthy to adamantly avoid carbs - and I'm not even suggesting processed carbs, I'm talking about fruit and vegetables.
LOL. Of course you weren't suggesting that, but that's where your logic leads. And you say that you're not suggesting we adamantly avoid carbs, but most "low carb" diets do actually include some carbs.
As I said earlier, I would agree that avoiding fruits, legumes, and starchy veggies in order to eat lower carbs is probably suboptimal for longevity simply because of all the fiber, anti-oxidants, and micronutrients you'd be missing. NOT because of the carbs you'd be missing.0 -
I always do better if I make protein a priority over carbs. I think people eat too many carbs in general in the form of high-calorie snacks and ultra-processed foods, so just being mindful of that helps you change your eating habits for the better.
That being said, rice and pasta are cheap and delicious, especially mixed with tons of veggies and just about any lean protein. They will always be around ♪
Food will always be villainized because we want to point the finger at one specific thing and lay blame on it instead of ourselves. Also, it helps sell books and diet programs that are usually so expensive and ridiculous, they wouldn't fly without making outrageous claims which promise to give us magical answers and absolve us of guilt.
It's not my excessive caloric intake and desk job that made me fat, it was THAT BANANA.
*shakes fist*
I just had to say I love your pic, hilarious banana lol
as to the topic, I do eat low carb, but not that low, I try to stay around 130, but do net below 100 because I eat a lot of fiber. I do not go into ketosis.
I think you only go into ketosis if you are under 20? Don't quote me on that but I think that is around the number it happens.0
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