Vegetarian & Protein

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  • Sarauk2sf
    Sarauk2sf Posts: 28,072 Member
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    Thanks. :) I tried Tofurkey Italian Sausage in my salad today and it had 29g of protein in one link!

    Another one to keep an eye out for is products from the Field Roast Grain Co. Their products are really nice and very high in protein.
  • Albion147
    Albion147 Posts: 5
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    Protein does not help you get in shape a calorie setback does that, Getting enough protein, joined with an exceptional quality teaching project supports LBM, with the intention that your weight misfortune hefty misfortune...
  • benol1
    benol1 Posts: 867 Member
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    In Australia, Sanitarium make a number of products inc. nutmeat, nutolene, casserole mince, and tender pieces.
    http://www.sanitarium.com.au/products/vegetarian/vegie-delights-canned/tender-pieces
    They are peanut and gluten-based so would not be appropriate for those who have a nut allergy or suffer from coeliac's.

    My own preference for vegie protein inc:

    cooked beans,
    tofu,
    tempeh, and
    quorn
  • lilylux
    lilylux Posts: 109 Member
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    Not sure if its been said before, but eggs, whey protein and peanut butter are your friends. My stats are very similar to yours, 5'1, 26, 114 pounds, also a vegetarian, but recently an occassional pescatarian. Feel free to add me as I always like to check out other vege diets and have friends with similar goals.
  • CMansager
    CMansager Posts: 10
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    Hi! I am a vegetarian, too. I didn't see you mention it, but I swear by the quinoa (pronounced: Keen-wah) grain for my plant-based complete protein. It is one of the most protein rich foods we can eat, as well as having all nine essential amino acids. I already knew that, but found this link for you. (below) It provides all the other benefits of quinoa. Sometimes I make something I call "Confetti Quinoa" which means that I can decide what vegetables (corn, peas, peppers, etc) to add into my cooked quinoa. It's a great, heart smart, plant-based way to use up leftovers, too! :-) In addition, I've learned to make a variety of healthy sauces to cook tofu in. I snack on shelled edamame (boiled soybeans, for those unfamilar) at home, and even bring it to the movies, instead of popcorn and candy. I leave off the salt. I got to the bulk foods section of whole foods stores, and try to find a bit of something new in there, to make from scratch. It's cheaper than buying in a bag or box for quinoa, other grains, beans and different rices. You can also control how much to buy, and therefore, eat, that way, too. Oh, and here's the link: http://www.forbes.com/sites/juliewilcox/2012/06/26/7-benefits-of-quinoa-the-supergrain-of-the-future/
  • nataliescalories
    nataliescalories Posts: 292 Member
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    Thanks. :) I tried Tofurkey Italian Sausage in my salad today and it had 29g of protein in one link!

    Another one to keep an eye out for is products from the Field Roast Grain Co. Their products are really nice and very high in protein.

    That brand is one of my favorites! I love their apple sage sausage. Viana is also amazing--their gyro version is amazing (I can find it at Whole Foods).
  • CMansager
    CMansager Posts: 10
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    The scale that I was told is: 1g of protein for half your body weight. So, if you weigh 150 lbs. You'd need 75g protein. I was also told that was "too much," but I've never heard the 1g:1lb ration that this trainer suggests. Is this trainer a nutritionist or dietician of some kind as well? (curious) Where is your trainer getting this ratio?
  • nataliescalories
    nataliescalories Posts: 292 Member
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    I just started personal training last week and my trainer said that an adequate supply of protein for proper weight loss/muscle building and maintenance is 1g protein per pound you weigh. So if I weigh 120 pounds, I should be eating 120g protein.

    Does that sound right or are he and I completely wrong here?

    it's per pound of lean body mass I heard...so no, 120g of protein wouldn't be right unless your entire body is lean body mass which isn't possible, Your trainer can help you figure out your lean body mass.

    ^yep - it is per lb of LBM

    I came across this article (http://mennohenselmans.com/the-myth-of-1glb-optimal-protein-intake-for-bodybuilders/) a few weeks ago and I thought it was well written and the research behind it is thorough and seems to stand up. I'm not at all familiar with the writer beyond knowing he isn't trained in medicine, so I'm not sure of any opinions on him.

    That said, what about this research and the argument that "there is normally no advantage to consuming more than 0.82g/lb (1.8g/kg) of protein per day to preserve or build muscle. This already includes a very safe mark-up. There hasn’t been any recorded advantage of consuming more than 0.64g/lb. The only exceptions to this rule could be individuals with extraordinarily high anabolic hormone levels."

    I'm sure the .18g/lb difference isn't any huge deal, so 1g per lb seems like fine advice, but delving a bit deeper...any thoughts on this?

    Edit for paragraph breaks.
  • skinnybitcheslovecats
    skinnybitcheslovecats Posts: 42
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    http://www.defensenutrition.com/articles/the_ugly_truth_about_casein_protein.php
    http://www.alternet.org/story/134200/is_milk_a_culprit_for_bad_health

    Look up Dr. Colin T. Campbell the author of Forks over Knives and The China Study!
  • Sarauk2sf
    Sarauk2sf Posts: 28,072 Member
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    lolz at the China Study
  • Sarauk2sf
    Sarauk2sf Posts: 28,072 Member
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    I just started personal training last week and my trainer said that an adequate supply of protein for proper weight loss/muscle building and maintenance is 1g protein per pound you weigh. So if I weigh 120 pounds, I should be eating 120g protein.

    Does that sound right or are he and I completely wrong here?

    it's per pound of lean body mass I heard...so no, 120g of protein wouldn't be right unless your entire body is lean body mass which isn't possible, Your trainer can help you figure out your lean body mass.

    ^yep - it is per lb of LBM

    I came across this article (http://mennohenselmans.com/the-myth-of-1glb-optimal-protein-intake-for-bodybuilders/) a few weeks ago and I thought it was well written and the research behind it is thorough and seems to stand up. I'm not at all familiar with the writer beyond knowing he isn't trained in medicine, so I'm not sure of any opinions on him.

    That said, what about this research and the argument that "there is normally no advantage to consuming more than 0.82g/lb (1.8g/kg) of protein per day to preserve or build muscle. This already includes a very safe mark-up. There hasn’t been any recorded advantage of consuming more than 0.64g/lb. The only exceptions to this rule could be individuals with extraordinarily high anabolic hormone levels."

    I'm sure the .18g/lb difference isn't any huge deal, so 1g per lb seems like fine advice, but delving a bit deeper...any thoughts on this?

    Edit for paragraph breaks.

    There is a lot of debate as to the application/interpretation of that research. Also, when on a deficit, protein requirements increase.

    A really good video to watch is here:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SFObr7rc1kA

    Also, here is some research that shows advantages of being over that.

    http://www.myfitnesspal.com/topics/show/823505-research-on-protien-intake
  • skinnybitcheslovecats
    skinnybitcheslovecats Posts: 42
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    I've come to the conclusion that avid dairy/egg indulgers are just as ignorant as meat eaters, I gotta say. Do a little research, try Forks Over Knives for size. Maybe look into the China Study by Colin T. Campbell. How's your cholesterol? I'm curious. Do you ever have problems with constipation or bloating? Acne? Eating Boca burgers with your veggie superiority complex has got to be rather embarrassing.
  • nataliescalories
    nataliescalories Posts: 292 Member
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    I've come to the conclusion that avid dairy/egg indulgers are just as ignorant as meat eaters, I gotta say. Do a little research, try Forks Over Knives for size. Maybe look into the China Study by Colin T. Campbell. How's your cholesterol? I'm curious. Do you ever have problems with constipation or bloating? Acne? Eating Boca burgers with your veggie superiority complex has got to be rather embarrassing.

    Whoa there. I don't think this is directly addressing me, but I definitely was unimpressed by the China Study and even the other research you linked is limited to casein from A1 dairy sources, which hardly is reason to run from dairy altogether. Having watched Forks Over Knives, I have a similar dismissive response to that as well--again--a blanket statement when research points to one specific and only potential issue.

    The first article you linked to above states that "But let's put things in perspective. There is no conclusive evidence yet to the A1 casein issue, and if there is indeed a proven problem with A1 milk, most likely the same problem will apply to A2 milk as well."

    The second article concludes: "A1Beta-casein, common in American and European cows, releases an opiate-like chemical upon digestion called BCM-7, which is the exact culprit in the myriad of symptoms I have seen all these years"

    None of that at all even touches on eggs--which again can vary in quality depending on the source.

    And even as a morbidly obese individual (luckily, one who has been a pescatarian for 18 years), my cholesterol is shockingly ideal (both HDL and LDL). I have glowing skin. No constipation. No bloating (minus some PMS bloating for a day or so). And my only issue with Boca products is the use of cellulose which I have trouble with.
  • Sarauk2sf
    Sarauk2sf Posts: 28,072 Member
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    I've come to the conclusion that avid dairy/egg indulgers are just as ignorant as meat eaters, I gotta say. Do a little research, try Forks Over Knives for size. Maybe look into the China Study by Colin T. Campbell. How's your cholesterol? I'm curious. Do you ever have problems with constipation or bloating? Acne? Eating Boca burgers with your veggie superiority complex has got to be rather embarrassing.

    The China Study is a cherry picked biased book that has been pretty much ripped apart. I suggest that you do a little research and actually read the research behind the China Study..which, by the way is a book.

    No I have no issues at all. My GI is very healthy, my cholesterol in the very healthy range and my skin is nice and clear, but than you for your very kind concern. Also, there is absolutely no need for personal attacks. I really do not know what your issue is but you should calm down...stress is not good for you.

    Oh, and my bone density if off the charts good.
  • nataliescalories
    nataliescalories Posts: 292 Member
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    I just started personal training last week and my trainer said that an adequate supply of protein for proper weight loss/muscle building and maintenance is 1g protein per pound you weigh. So if I weigh 120 pounds, I should be eating 120g protein.

    Does that sound right or are he and I completely wrong here?

    it's per pound of lean body mass I heard...so no, 120g of protein wouldn't be right unless your entire body is lean body mass which isn't possible, Your trainer can help you figure out your lean body mass.

    ^yep - it is per lb of LBM

    I came across this article (http://mennohenselmans.com/the-myth-of-1glb-optimal-protein-intake-for-bodybuilders/) a few weeks ago and I thought it was well written and the research behind it is thorough and seems to stand up. I'm not at all familiar with the writer beyond knowing he isn't trained in medicine, so I'm not sure of any opinions on him.

    That said, what about this research and the argument that "there is normally no advantage to consuming more than 0.82g/lb (1.8g/kg) of protein per day to preserve or build muscle. This already includes a very safe mark-up. There hasn’t been any recorded advantage of consuming more than 0.64g/lb. The only exceptions to this rule could be individuals with extraordinarily high anabolic hormone levels."

    I'm sure the .18g/lb difference isn't any huge deal, so 1g per lb seems like fine advice, but delving a bit deeper...any thoughts on this?

    Edit for paragraph breaks.

    There is a lot of debate as to the application/interpretation of that research. Also, when on a deficit, protein requirements increase.

    A really good video to watch is here:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SFObr7rc1kA

    Also, here is some research that shows advantages of being over that.

    http://www.myfitnesspal.com/topics/show/823505-research-on-protien-intake

    Thanks! The article I linked does address the intake in terms of a deficit, but the conclusion is still the same. I think the interesting thing about the research included in the myth link is that it addresses the following: "All of these studies controlled for energy intake, either based on individual requirements or by setting energy intake to be equal in all experimental conditions, so that only the proportion of protein in the diet varied between groups [which the MFP listed studies did not necessarily do]. If the studies were based on unreliable methods such as nitrogen balance, a marker of lean body mass changes, I only included them if they controlled for sweating and dietary adaptation periods."

    That video will take some time to get to...an hour and a half...whew. Looking forward to it. :smile:
  • EvgeniZyntx
    EvgeniZyntx Posts: 24,208 Member
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    It's not the lactose that's bad for you, it's the casein that's in the dairy. It caused a lot of health problems. The dairy is what makes it so high calorie and fat. And what gives it the cholesterol. Casein can cause kidney stones and intestinal problems, along with bone damage, enamel erosion, and mucus build up.

    Ummm - fat free dairy is not high fat...explain that one. Also, please cite where you are getting this information from.

    Time for a little science.

    1) Casein actually helps enamel. http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/16433964
    2) High Calorie and fat? Casein is neither. Or is that the milk? Anyway, I think Sara answered that
    3) Casein effect on cholesterol is actually dependent on the amount of cholesterol consumed. http://ajcn.nutrition.org/content/50/4/786.short
    Anyone using pure epidemiological studies to suggest that casein is the culprit of increases in cholesterol (aka "The China Study") should be laughed at. A variety of studies have countered that one claim.
    4) Cholesterol is an essential protein. Can't live without it and one should not try to eliminate it. However, given that LDL to HDL ratios have been implicated as indicators in cardiovascular diseases - it is of interest, especially for those with genetic predisposition to have relative high LDL, to monitor and address this. The single best marker of LDL seems to be total body fat - get it down and studies indicate Cholesterol ratios will improve, independent of diet.
    4b) LDL reduction by isoflavones in Soy protein is interesting. The overall effect, in summary, is somewhere in between 5-10% at reasonable dietary levels. But it is important to note that the extraction method of soy protein can significantly effect this. Ethanol extracted soy protein? Forget about it - http://archinte.jamanetwork.com/article.aspx?articleid=485126
    4c) Hemp protein does not have the LDL reducing effect of soy, AFAIK
    4d) Hemp protein amino acid profile can be criticized when compared to soy or whey - one can look into that, I'm personally not a fan of profile studies as I believe that a wide variability of sources addresses that nicely.
    5) Kidney stones - there is evidence that soy (not hemp) proteins protects from some forms of kidney disease degeneration, in rats. For someone with undamaged kidneys, not a rat, AFAIK casein consumption does not have a role as an epidemiological factor, however, I can see how the mechanism of phospho/calcium transport and binding might be a physiological factor. I'm going stay neutral on this one.

    Casein has been looked at as a possible immunological inducer of a variety of diseases from type 1 diabetes to acute myelomas (this last, is why I am reading up a lot on this - current personal event have me focused on myelofibrosis and leukemia) and have not been shown to have role in these. We could discuss Casein Kinases but that's a totally different molecule.

    Wow, that was long. >j<

    tl;dr - except for specific allergies and/or disease states there is little to suggest that the casein proteins are bad for you. Second, if one is looking at a non-casein protein for biologically active reason (LDL reduction, etc...) soy and not hemp proteins should be looked into. And not all soy preparation is worthwhile.
  • Sarauk2sf
    Sarauk2sf Posts: 28,072 Member
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    A really good video to watch is here:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SFObr7rc1kA

    Also, here is some research that shows advantages of being over that.

    http://www.myfitnesspal.com/topics/show/823505-research-on-protien-intake

    Thanks! The article I linked does address the intake in terms of a deficit, but the conclusion is still the same. I think the interesting thing about the research included in the myth link is that it addresses the following: "All of these studies controlled for energy intake, either based on individual requirements or by setting energy intake to be equal in all experimental conditions, so that only the proportion of protein in the diet varied between groups [which the MFP listed studies did not necessarily do]. If the studies were based on unreliable methods such as nitrogen balance, a marker of lean body mass changes, I only included them if they controlled for sweating and dietary adaptation periods."

    That video will take some time to get to...an hour and a half...whew. Looking forward to it. :smile:

    (taking off some of the infiniquotes)

    It is pretty long - I have a long commute so I don't mind them as those types of videos keep me entertained. They discuss the fundamental issues with using nitrogen balance as a proxy for protein synthesis at the beginning of it.
  • EvgeniZyntx
    EvgeniZyntx Posts: 24,208 Member
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    I've come to the conclusion that avid dairy/egg indulgers are just as ignorant as meat eaters, I gotta say. Do a little research, try Forks Over Knives for size. Maybe look into the China Study by Colin T. Campbell. How's your cholesterol? I'm curious. Do you ever have problems with constipation or bloating? Acne? Eating Boca burgers with your veggie superiority complex has got to be rather embarrassing.

    If that is your gold standard for educating yourself you should not be tossing around the label of ignorance.
  • Miiimii
    Miiimii Posts: 279 Member
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    http://www.theiflife.com/how-much-protein-per-day-build-muscle/

    I posted that link a few times today already.... 0.34 - 0.8 grams per LEAN body weight is all thats needed. the rest is **** out. You don't need a whole lot. Whey isn't the best protein source either.

    Try Genuine Health Vegan Proteins - pea, hemp, brown rice, cranberry, alfalfa proteins all mixed in one. A much more natural source too.

    And your body can only absorb 20-30g of protein at a time, so no need to double scoop it.

    Would love to order these proteins, but shipping to Europe costs as much as the product itself. :-(

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