Frustrated? Carb in , Carb out?

You are exactly like me. I am a carb-a-holic and today I actually went on a carb binge from emotions. Although it is ezekiel sprouted bread, it doesn't help when I had 6 slices and I normally stop at 2 a day. I too, am obsessed with oatmeal and cereals.

The best policy is to moderate, moderate, moderate.

One bowl of (non-instant) oatmeal. A couple pieces of breads a day. ONE potato a day. If you completely cut, you will go CRAZY. But don't ever go back to cereal... lol. Boxed and processed foods are bad. Fruits and veggies are wonderful cards and don't count.

My policy is this: if you are eating whole, natural foods, I don't necessarily "count" calories as much.

Makes sense?

Well I mean I am not saying going lower on carbs is a bad thing... but trying to cut them out completely like many do these days seems odd to me. I know that carbs can aid in weight loss and it depends on the person and their tolerance.

I am 112 pounds now. I lost my initial 70 in 6 months by this high carb lifestyle.

Be thankful you don't have insulin issues, then, since you apparently don't. If carbs can actually help you lose weight, great. You're very fortunate. There are many whose body has the exact opposite response.

If I may share this bit of advice:

I graduated H.S. weighing 117, could run for miles and couldn't put on fat or muscle if you put a gun to my head. I'm now in my 40s and have once reached 184. I've got some muscle and there wasn't THAT much fat, but for my slim frame that still was far too much to be lugging around. Part of the reason is an insulin problem that runs in my family. My dad has adult onset diabetes; I don't yet but every year my fasting blood sugar creeps up a little bit more...so I know it's only a matter of time. I do low carb not for weight issues as much as to delay diabetes as long as possible. Most hard-core low carb dieters also have some insulin problem so we're not just doing it to get into a small size of pants. We take it seriously because we HAVE to.

I say this to remind you, again, to be thankful and to be aware that however old you are, the body changes over time for most people. What you're able to do today with no ill effects...well...in 10 years or 20, could be a whole different story.

Just food for thought.

cutting carbs is just the latest get-thin-quick deprivation diet fad.

It's been around as a medically proven approach since at least 1797. The Atkins version dates to the early '70s but there were versions before that. If one wants to extend it to pre-agrarian or non-agrarian societies, it's been around for several thousand years.

BTW...I'm quite satiated, thanks, not feeling deprived at all.

Many people who tell me they don't eat carbs don't actually mean they don't eat carbs! lol

Real conversation:
Them: "I don't eat carbs"
Me: "so how do you get your fiber?"
Them: "Well I eat Whole Grains."

Me: DOH!

I think a lot of people think 'carbs' are only sugars and white bread and don't realize that there are simple and complex carbs.

For me, I eat 50-55% of my daily calories in carbs most of which (vast majority) are whole grains (rolled oats, whole grain rice, quinoa, wheat berries, chia, bran) and it's made a big difference in my weight loss I don't starve to death either! lol

Many people who tell me they don't eat carbs don't actually mean they don't eat carbs! lol

Real conversation:
Them: "I don't eat carbs"
Me: "so how do you get your fiber?"
Them: "Well I eat Whole Grains."

Me: DOH!

I think a lot of people think 'carbs' are only sugars and white bread and don't realize that there are simple and complex carbs.

For me, I eat 50-55% of my daily calories in carbs most of which (vast majority) are whole grains (rolled oats, whole grain rice, quinoa, wheat berries, chia, bran) and it's made a big difference in my weight loss I don't starve to death either! lol

if you're eating 50-55% carbs, you are most probably not getting enough protein and/or fats.

as a general rule, you should be getting 0.85g/lb of LBM in protein each day, and 0.35g/lb of bodyweight in fat each day. you need the protein for muscle repair/retention/growth. you need the fat for all sorts of things. FWIW.

Many people who tell me they don't eat carbs don't actually mean they don't eat carbs! lol

Real conversation:
Them: "I don't eat carbs"
Me: "so how do you get your fiber?"
Them: "Well I eat Whole Grains."

Me: DOH!

I think a lot of people think 'carbs' are only sugars and white bread and don't realize that there are simple and complex carbs.

For me, I eat 50-55% of my daily calories in carbs most of which (vast majority) are whole grains (rolled oats, whole grain rice, quinoa, wheat berries, chia, bran) and it's made a big difference in my weight loss I don't starve to death either! lol

if you're eating 50-55% carbs, you are most probably not getting enough protein and/or fats.

as a general rule, you should be getting 0.85g/lb of LBM in protein each day, and 0.35g/lb of bodyweight in fat each day. you need the protein for muscle repair/retention/growth. you need the fat for all sorts of things. FWIW.

Nonsense.

The rules I see people posting on proteins are all biased and based on one fad or another. Fact is you can live quite well on 25% protein and 20% fat with the rest remaining as carbs. It ALL depends on what you are trying to achieve.

When I wanted to bulk up (you're typing to a guy who was cramming down protein long before it became the hip thing to do) I cranked up my protein intake to levels even paleo eaters (which aren't I might add) would be surprised by and I had no problems associated with the high levels I was cramming down (try 3g/lbs of LBM and more). I pushed myself to bench 350lbs with a body fat in the single digits. However, If I only wanted to maintain that mass I could cut that down dramatically based on my work out routine and daily activity levels.

On the other hand when I want more endurance and am willing to sacrifice the bulk I'm quite happy cutting my protein to levels below your numbers. At an LBM of 184 (roughly using online calculators based on various measurements) I'd need about 160g of protein a day based on your post however I can assure you that as long as I'm not out exercising the 93 I'm eating today will be just fine.

After over 900 miles of walking and cycling I can tell you that the muscle I have retained would argue with you! lol Sure I've lost some size but most of that I'm quite certain is fat (note: I quit working out over a decade ago and lost the muscle bulk I'd gained in the years following -- replaced by fat of course or I wouldn't be here). For a comparison the largest my arms ever got was 19" (1999) and today they are 16" and I'm only now starting to work out again. My thighs are 25" and well defined, calves are 17.5" and chiseled and I do not suffer from muscle pain or the inability to recover from a workout (15.74 miles riding on Sunday at 12.5mph and I recovered easily).

The thing is I ate 160 grams of protein on Sunday (the day of that ride) and when I workout I eat up the burned calories in protein. That I think is the key.

Anyway, I don't agree with the blanket statement above and I think many people in various other countries would easily disprove it. Doesn't mean it isn't good to retain more muscle but you can certainly eat less protein and more complex carbs -- heck, MFP sets your carbs higher then I eat for that matter and sets protein at 15%.

As for fat, you need 20% of your diet (min) to be fat and I won't raise it above that when I'm carrying plenty! lol

...and your response is still irrelevant to my point. the low-carb diet FAD is recent.

your use of an undefined emotive term adds nothing to the debate, even if you had to shout it.

it's not shouting, it's emphasis.

there is no debate. what i said was factually correct. it may not be what the low-carbers want to hear, but it's factually correct.

Many people who tell me they don't eat carbs don't actually mean they don't eat carbs! lol

Real conversation:
Them: "I don't eat carbs"
Me: "so how do you get your fiber?"
Them: "Well I eat Whole Grains."

Me: DOH!

I think a lot of people think 'carbs' are only sugars and white bread and don't realize that there are simple and complex carbs.

For me, I eat 50-55% of my daily calories in carbs most of which (vast majority) are whole grains (rolled oats, whole grain rice, quinoa, wheat berries, chia, bran) and it's made a big difference in my weight loss I don't starve to death either! lol

if you're eating 50-55% carbs, you are most probably not getting enough protein and/or fats.

as a general rule, you should be getting 0.85g/lb of LBM in protein each day, and 0.35g/lb of bodyweight in fat each day. you need the protein for muscle repair/retention/growth. you need the fat for all sorts of things. FWIW.

Nonsense.

The rules I see people posting on proteins are all biased and based on one fad or another. Fact is you can live quite well on 25% protein and 20% fat with the rest remaining as carbs. It ALL depends on what you are trying to achieve.

When I wanted to bulk up (you're typing to a guy who was cramming down protein long before it became the hip thing to do) I cranked up my protein intake to levels even paleo eaters (which aren't I might add) would be surprised by and I had no problems associated with the high levels I was cramming down (try 3g/lbs of LBM and more). I pushed myself to bench 350lbs with a body fat in the single digits. However, If I only wanted to maintain that mass I could cut that down dramatically based on my work out routine and daily activity levels.

On the other hand when I want more endurance and am willing to sacrifice the bulk I'm quite happy cutting my protein to levels below your numbers. At an LBM of 184 (roughly using online calculators based on various measurements) I'd need about 160g of protein a day based on your post however I can assure you that as long as I'm not out exercising the 93 I'm eating today will be just fine.

After over 900 miles of walking and cycling I can tell you that the muscle I have retained would argue with you! lol Sure I've lost some size but most of that I'm quite certain is fat (note: I quit working out over a decade ago and lost the muscle bulk I'd gained in the years following -- replaced by fat of course or I wouldn't be here). For a comparison the largest my arms ever got was 19" (1999) and today they are 16" and I'm only now starting to work out again. My thighs are 25" and well defined, calves are 17.5" and chiseled and I do not suffer from muscle pain or the inability to recover from a workout (15.74 miles riding on Sunday at 12.5mph and I recovered easily).

The thing is I ate 160 grams of protein on Sunday (the day of that ride) and when I workout I eat up the burned calories in protein. That I think is the key.

Anyway, I don't agree with the blanket statement above and I think many people in various other countries would easily disprove it. Doesn't mean it isn't good to retain more muscle but you can certainly eat less protein and more complex carbs -- heck, MFP sets your carbs higher then I eat for that matter and sets protein at 15%.

As for fat, you need 20% of your diet (min) to be fat and I won't raise it above that when I'm carrying plenty! lol

suit yourself. i was simply alerting you to something you may or may not have known. whether the 0.85g/lb of LBM is necessary or not is still under investigating by scientists. some think it's higher, some think it's lower. 0.85 seems a safe number to me.

you'll notice that i used the terms "most probably" and "FWIW".

I might add that it is difficult to get enough dietary fiber while eating as much protein as many seem to think they need today, all the while keeping calories down. 1g of protein = 4 cals 1g of fat = 9 cals so let's do the math:

184LBM * .85 * 4 = 625.6
184LBM * .35 * 9 = 579.6
That's 1205.2 calories and I haven't had a single carb....

Somehow, without eating too much I have to now get close to 38g of fiber....225 calories of Rice and Quinoa gets me about 5g of fiber...

Exactly where do I get the rest?
http://www.mayoclinic.com/health/fiber/NU00033

My advice, for what it's worth, is to learn about complex carbs and dietary fiber and to get plenty of it unless you spend a lot of time weight training or doing a lot of cardio and then only increase the protein cals on those days.

are you suggesting that an adult man should be eating 1200-1500 calories at maintenance?

you can get plenty more fiber eating lentils, black beans, and peas.

are you suggesting that an adult man should be eating 1200-1500 calories at maintenance?

you can get plenty more fiber eating lentils, black beans, and peas.

Not at all. For me to maintain without losing weight I'd have to eat 2450 cals a day assuming I did not work out....working out changes that to possibly well beyond 3000-3500

you can get plenty more fiber eating lentils, black beans, and peas.

230 cals only equals 16g of dietary fiber but good point.

http://www.battlediabetes.com/insulin-resistance-and-complex-carbohydrates

One of the biggest mistakes that weight loss failures make is cutting out carbs altogether. An example of this flawed ideology is the Atkins diet. Clinical studies have proven that the low-carb, high fat diet has a negative impact on the health of your heart and blood.

At the other end of the spectrum are complex carbohydrates like vegetables, fruits, whole grains, legumes, and nuts. Complex carbohydrates enhance our health in the following ways:

They are typically rich in both fiber and micronutrients, offering real nutrition that the body needs to function.
This added nutrition takes longer to digest, and the slower break-down process helps maintain healthier insulin and blood sugar levels, keeping moods on a more even keel and diminishing risk for insulin resistance.
The slower rate of absorption of the sugars they provide means we have a steadier supply of energy and results in less sugar being converted into storage forms in the liver and as fat.
Slow-acting, complex carbohydrates also satisfy hunger better and for longer periods, limiting the dramatic peaks and troughs — and the vicious cycle of cravings — we experience with simple carbohydrates.

http://www.womentowomen.com/insulinresistance/carbohydratefoods.aspx