Calories are NOT equal

And what in the name of all that's holy is a macro, please? Sounds like something Hubs might put on my computer for playing MMORPGs.

There are three (well, really four if you count alcohol) macros (macronutrient)

Protein, Fats and Carbs.

I clearly will have a lot to learn regarding this new venture. I try to balance out serving sizes when I'm eating. Generally, my own nutritional rules are:

The more fruits and veggies, the merrier; unless it's starchy veggies like peas which I suspect of smuggling calories to my hips.

Any serving of meat more than 3 ounces at a time is wasted.

Cheese is tasty, but only 2 ounces is one serving. Two ounces is frikkin small. That's too bad, but there it is.

Cheetos and donuts will do you in if you let them.

Just about everything (including restaurant food) is genetically modified. Deliciously genetically modified. Expect to mutate eventually.

Moderation. You can still have a sweet now and then. Just don't om nom nom yourself into double digit sized jeans.

That red solo cup holds sixteen ounces. It looks like one serving, but it is lying. It's really two. Might as well pour Tab in it and risk the cancer from the fake sugar, than the more possible heart attack from the sugars which your body will store as fat.

Yes you do have a lot to learn. Much broscience here.

A.C.E. Certified Personal and Group Fitness Trainer
IDEA Fitness member
Kickboxing Certified Instructor
Been in fitness industry for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition

I'm not altogether sure what broscience is. I like seeing someone with actual qualifications behind their name to back up nutritional advice, though.

Broscience is what people state without having any factual evidence to back it up and is often incorrect.

Serving size and large food receptacles:
That's documented. The larger the food receptacle, the more we pile on our plate and the longer our brain takes to tell us we're full as we eat. The smaller the food receptacle, the quicker our brains tell us we're full and to stop eating. Visual cues and presentation of food does really count.

Proteins and waste:
Well, I suppose that the protein bit might be only applicable to myself. I'm not an active sort. Making a bed leaves me winded sometimes. So there's not much of a need to eat more than 3 ounces of protein to fuel the teensy amount of physical activity I presently generate.

Sweets and moderation:
My sister, who lost 35 lbs under the strict guidance of an expert and won a weight loss and fitness challenge and was featured in a magazine for it, did not sneer at the cookies on a plate during a family celebration, and I do not think she over-exerted herself exercising after to purge herself of those sweets which she accepted. She was moderate in her consumption and had like one or two, I think. Enough to enjoy herself but not feel guilty. In fact, most successful dieters, myself included (when I diet) tend to reward themselves from time to time with a sweet with no real detriment to their over-all weight-loss. It's the ones who abstain, abstain, abstain who end up eventually caving in and finding themselves eating a whole box of Krispy Kremes at the front of the donut shop at midnight.

Genetically modified:
Nope, I don't actually expect to mutate. But it is good to be aware that most of the foods we consume here in the U.S. are going to have some tie to genetic modification. That doesn't mean to flee from that food, but to monitor just what the heck we're sticking in our craws at any time. If I eat a nice healthy meal at say a Village Inn, I'm going to expect that the foods were bought as cheaply as possible and the cheapest foods on the market are always modified, so I'm expecting that the manger practices good business sense to keep production prices down and pass the savings onto the customer in an effort to keep his business viable in a competitive market.

I'm enjoying this discussion, because I love learning new things, but if I am wrong in this, please let me know. The protein and GM I actually read about in articles from reputable sources (not on the net) or actually observed in practical application in my work in the food industry and personal observation from watching my family members struggle with weight.

I might not respond til later, though. Hubs wanted to run an MMO with me tonight and he is waiting patiently for me to finish typing so we can spend some time together.

Tell me what I'm doing wrong here, and I will check it out. I'd love expert advice on weight loss and fitness.

What does protein have to do with making beds?

And what in the name of all that's holy is a macro, please? Sounds like something Hubs might put on my computer for playing MMORPGs.

There are three (well, really four if you count alcohol) macros (macronutrient)

Protein, Fats and Carbs.

I clearly will have a lot to learn regarding this new venture. I try to balance out serving sizes when I'm eating. Generally, my own nutritional rules are:

The more fruits and veggies, the merrier; unless it's starchy veggies like peas which I suspect of smuggling calories to my hips.

Any serving of meat more than 3 ounces at a time is wasted.

Cheese is tasty, but only 2 ounces is one serving. Two ounces is frikkin small. That's too bad, but there it is.

Cheetos and donuts will do you in if you let them.

Just about everything (including restaurant food) is genetically modified. Deliciously genetically modified. Expect to mutate eventually.

Moderation. You can still have a sweet now and then. Just don't om nom nom yourself into double digit sized jeans.

That red solo cup holds sixteen ounces. It looks like one serving, but it is lying. It's really two. Might as well pour Tab in it and risk the cancer from the fake sugar, than the more possible heart attack from the sugars which your body will store as fat.

Yes you do have a lot to learn. Much broscience here.

A.C.E. Certified Personal and Group Fitness Trainer
IDEA Fitness member
Kickboxing Certified Instructor
Been in fitness industry for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition

I'm not altogether sure what broscience is. I like seeing someone with actual qualifications behind their name to back up nutritional advice, though.

Broscience is what people state without having any factual evidence to back it up and is often incorrect.

Serving size and large food receptacles:
That's documented. The larger the food receptacle, the more we pile on our plate and the longer our brain takes to tell us we're full as we eat. The smaller the food receptacle, the quicker our brains tell us we're full and to stop eating. Visual cues and presentation of food does really count.

Proteins and waste:
Well, I suppose that the protein bit might be only applicable to myself. I'm not an active sort. Making a bed leaves me winded sometimes. So there's not much of a need to eat more than 3 ounces of protein to fuel the teensy amount of physical activity I presently generate.

Sweets and moderation:
My sister, who lost 35 lbs under the strict guidance of an expert and won a weight loss and fitness challenge and was featured in a magazine for it, did not sneer at the cookies on a plate during a family celebration, and I do not think she over-exerted herself exercising after to purge herself of those sweets which she accepted. She was moderate in her consumption and had like one or two, I think. Enough to enjoy herself but not feel guilty. In fact, most successful dieters, myself included (when I diet) tend to reward themselves from time to time with a sweet with no real detriment to their over-all weight-loss. It's the ones who abstain, abstain, abstain who end up eventually caving in and finding themselves eating a whole box of Krispy Kremes at the front of the donut shop at midnight.

Genetically modified:
Nope, I don't actually expect to mutate. But it is good to be aware that most of the foods we consume here in the U.S. are going to have some tie to genetic modification. That doesn't mean to flee from that food, but to monitor just what the heck we're sticking in our craws at any time. If I eat a nice healthy meal at say a Village Inn, I'm going to expect that the foods were bought as cheaply as possible and the cheapest foods on the market are always modified, so I'm expecting that the manger practices good business sense to keep production prices down and pass the savings onto the customer in an effort to keep his business viable in a competitive market.

I'm enjoying this discussion, because I love learning new things, but if I am wrong in this, please let me know. The protein and GM I actually read about in articles from reputable sources (not on the net) or actually observed in practical application in my work in the food industry and personal observation from watching my family members struggle with weight.

I might not respond til later, though. Hubs wanted to run an MMO with me tonight and he is waiting patiently for me to finish typing so we can spend some time together.

Tell me what I'm doing wrong here, and I will check it out. I'd love expert advice on weight loss and fitness.

What does protein have to do with making beds?

Any exercise involves muscle recovery. That's where proteins come in. Those proteins help you get stronger. Making beds is technically exercise. Lots of housework is exercise. You can burn calories making a bed. It's not as glamorous as a jog in the park or a Zumba session, and it certainly doesn't benefit a person nearly as much, but it is still physical activity which requires a person to bend and lift and reach.

I once had a job shelving books at a library. I started out normal, and ended after two years with a six pack from the way I decided to shelve them. Anything, properly conducted, could be exercise.

And what in the name of all that's holy is a macro, please? Sounds like something Hubs might put on my computer for playing MMORPGs.

There are three (well, really four if you count alcohol) macros (macronutrient)

Protein, Fats and Carbs.

I clearly will have a lot to learn regarding this new venture. I try to balance out serving sizes when I'm eating. Generally, my own nutritional rules are:

The more fruits and veggies, the merrier; unless it's starchy veggies like peas which I suspect of smuggling calories to my hips.

Any serving of meat more than 3 ounces at a time is wasted.

Cheese is tasty, but only 2 ounces is one serving. Two ounces is frikkin small. That's too bad, but there it is.

Cheetos and donuts will do you in if you let them.

Just about everything (including restaurant food) is genetically modified. Deliciously genetically modified. Expect to mutate eventually.

Moderation. You can still have a sweet now and then. Just don't om nom nom yourself into double digit sized jeans.

That red solo cup holds sixteen ounces. It looks like one serving, but it is lying. It's really two. Might as well pour Tab in it and risk the cancer from the fake sugar, than the more possible heart attack from the sugars which your body will store as fat.

Yes you do have a lot to learn. Much broscience here.

A.C.E. Certified Personal and Group Fitness Trainer
IDEA Fitness member
Kickboxing Certified Instructor
Been in fitness industry for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition

I'm not altogether sure what broscience is. I like seeing someone with actual qualifications behind their name to back up nutritional advice, though.

Broscience is what people state without having any factual evidence to back it up and is often incorrect.

Serving size and large food receptacles:
That's documented. The larger the food receptacle, the more we pile on our plate and the longer our brain takes to tell us we're full as we eat. The smaller the food receptacle, the quicker our brains tell us we're full and to stop eating. Visual cues and presentation of food does really count.

Proteins and waste:
Well, I suppose that the protein bit might be only applicable to myself. I'm not an active sort. Making a bed leaves me winded sometimes. So there's not much of a need to eat more than 3 ounces of protein to fuel the teensy amount of physical activity I presently generate.

Sweets and moderation:
My sister, who lost 35 lbs under the strict guidance of an expert and won a weight loss and fitness challenge and was featured in a magazine for it, did not sneer at the cookies on a plate during a family celebration, and I do not think she over-exerted herself exercising after to purge herself of those sweets which she accepted. She was moderate in her consumption and had like one or two, I think. Enough to enjoy herself but not feel guilty. In fact, most successful dieters, myself included (when I diet) tend to reward themselves from time to time with a sweet with no real detriment to their over-all weight-loss. It's the ones who abstain, abstain, abstain who end up eventually caving in and finding themselves eating a whole box of Krispy Kremes at the front of the donut shop at midnight.

Genetically modified:
Nope, I don't actually expect to mutate. But it is good to be aware that most of the foods we consume here in the U.S. are going to have some tie to genetic modification. That doesn't mean to flee from that food, but to monitor just what the heck we're sticking in our craws at any time. If I eat a nice healthy meal at say a Village Inn, I'm going to expect that the foods were bought as cheaply as possible and the cheapest foods on the market are always modified, so I'm expecting that the manger practices good business sense to keep production prices down and pass the savings onto the customer in an effort to keep his business viable in a competitive market.

I'm enjoying this discussion, because I love learning new things, but if I am wrong in this, please let me know. The protein and GM I actually read about in articles from reputable sources (not on the net) or actually observed in practical application in my work in the food industry and personal observation from watching my family members struggle with weight.

I might not respond til later, though. Hubs wanted to run an MMO with me tonight and he is waiting patiently for me to finish typing so we can spend some time together.

Tell me what I'm doing wrong here, and I will check it out. I'd love expert advice on weight loss and fitness.

What does protein have to do with making beds?

Any exercise involves muscle recovery. That's where proteins come in. Those proteins help you get stronger. Making beds is technically exercise. Lots of housework is exercise. You can burn calories making a bed. It's not as glamorous as a jog in the park or a Zumba session, and it certainly doesn't benefit a person nearly as much, but it is still physical activity which requires a person to bend and lift and reach.

I once had a job shelving books at a library. I started out normal, and ended after two years with a six pack from the way I decided to shelve them. Anything, properly conducted, could be exercise.

Protein's only function isn't to help muscle recovery post-exercise. Protein is calories and protein is used for day-to-day maintenance of all body tissue, muscle included.

I wish I knew how to cut down this quote tree. It's threatening to take over the whole page at this point.

My day to day maintenance is not so very ambitious. It usually requires only that my brain and other vital organs are doing their jobs and that I can walk from my home to a bus stop and from there the remaining two blocks to a desk where I sit and fidget (I have severe hyperactivity, diagnosed in 1975) until get off work.

So far, there is zero exercise in my regimen. I plan to amend that, but that is for later...after I have acclimated myself to a mare balanced diet, the new job, purchasing a new car, renovating the house, running the family, keeping my 90 year old grandmother happy, and quitting smoking on the 12th.

I don't want to bite off more than I can chew. Then I will only become overwhelmed and lose my motivation. My family is very sedentary. It's not my job to demand that every one else here eat healthier and exercise. I only control my own life. So I am being careful in my goals and choosing my goals very carefully. Once you get to be my age in my family, things can rapidly overwhelm you. The family expects more and more and one slip up can result in a eff-it, response from an over-stressed workload. At least that has been my experience. I expect that around winter, I will be ready to try out adding exercise to my goals. For now, I am working on my waistline and measurements.

I wish I knew how to cut down this quote tree. It's threatening to take over the whole page at this point.

What disappoints me about this site is the way people are so nasty in these threads! The lady here makes a perfectly reasonable point that healthy food is healthy which is surely hard to argue with. Of course you need good sources of vitamins and minerals, along with your calories and fresh vegetables, salads and some fruit are universally understood to be good ways to get those.
You may have a different opinion, which should be respected, but note that her post ends with 'What do you think?' - a clear invitation for polite, reasoned and civilized debate which seems singularly lacking.
When I lived in south America I ate only fresh meat, fish, local and recently picked veg and maybe a bit too much fruit for the 'recommended' sugar intake, and I had perfect skin, shiny hair, a great figure and was fit without doing any training or dieting. Since being back in Europe with the great Mediterranean diet, this has not been the case, so without any scientific sources and purely from experience I totally agree with the original post.
What you eat is entirely your own affair. It's just a topic of conversation, not a ***** fight!

Look at it a different way:

What disappoints me about this site is the way people are so nasty in these threads! The lady here in the OP is trying to shame the eating habits of others by implying they're making poor choices that will ruin their health, despite all evidence to the contrary. Of course you need to eat "healthy" foods if you want to have the kind of success she has.

See how silly this is? This entire thread is the OP proclaiming the superiority of her food choices because they are more "healthy".

I don't think the OP is trying to shame people at all. She is just sharing her beliefs about healthy eating. I know healthy eating is important if you struggle with health problems. They can be lessened or "cured" by eating healthy. Many people have done it by just changing what they eat, so what you eat does matter in these cases.

What do I think? I think your tone is nasty and judgemental, your arguments are incoherent and your understanding of basic scientific principles is fundamentally lacking.

A calorie is a calorie. It's a unit of measure of one specific thing - energy content. You may not agree with other people's food choices (why the blazes are you even looking, by the way?). I might not agree with yours. But the basic calories in/calories out mathematics cannot be dodged. It is impossible to meet calorie goals day after day, week after week, year after year, if one is making fundamentally unhealthy food choices. The discipline of meeting a daily calorie limit is absolutely the best way for people to alter their food choices over time. e.g. Will I eat that cake now and feel hungry by mid-evening, or the apple that will make me feel better now and leave me some calories for a snack later?

Anyone who is eating unhealthy food is making weight loss harder for themselves. So, 3 options:

1) They have insanely strong willpower and lose weight regardless (but are more likely to put it back on afterwards)
2) They don't have high willpower and fall off the wagon
3) They adjust what they eat to meet their calorie limits without feeling hungry for hours each day

In any of these cases, it is not up to you to judge other people's food diaries. The only food diary you should concern yourself with is your own.

Strongest first post ever.

Just an opinion but I think it can vary. I know for me personally I am with you. I burn so much faster if I eat healthy. If I eat junk I can stay under calories and it comes off slower but I have met the odd person for whom the rule doesn't stand true.

I've found the research in 'Good Calories Bad Calories' to be borne out by my own experience. However weaning most folks on this site from the myth that 'A Calorie is Just a Calorie' is pretty difficult. The site is set up for and appeals to 'calorie counters'. But the research supporting low carbohydrate diets is increasingly impressive and my own experience for two years now supported by lab and blood work bears it out. In short, I agree with you - calories are not equal. it's that simple.

I have been surprised to find so many people staying under their calorie goal, yet when you see what they eat is shocks me. Yes, they stayed under, BUT they ate crap! Fast food, processed foods, white breads, and soda.

This site is great for calorie counting and nutrition data, but it doesn't teach how to eat to fuel your body the best way possible. You body is not going to burn/use those crap calories the same way healthy foods will. When you eat healthy, your body burns it fast and uses pretty much every bit of that food, but when you eat processed, high sodium and fat foods, you will more then likely store some of that food into fat. Proof? Give a person the same number of calories but one eats all the healthy/clean foods while the other eats the junk. Whose body looks better? Also, it's not just weight gain that's affected, it's your hair and skin health too.

When you eat healthy, you feel healthy

What do YOU think?

I absolutely agree.

But it's not just who looks better. It's also about who is healthier. Somehow on this web site healthy =healthy weight. But you can be in healthy weight and exercise regularly but have problems with digestion, or high cholesterol, or other problems that were results of bad diet.

Not all calories are equal. Not all slim people have healthy diets either.

Please describe how you determine who is and who isn't healthy. If you lack a manner in which to quantify 'healthy' then your assertion is kind of lacking legs on which to stand.

I'm not interested in pointless discussion. It's common knowledge that unhealthy eating habits cause health problems. If you think that healthy weight in combination with junk food is ok for you, that's your life and your health.

I've found the research in 'Good Calories Bad Calories' to be borne out by my own experience. However weaning most folks on this site from the myth that 'A Calorie is Just a Calorie' is pretty difficult. The site is set up for and appeals to 'calorie counters'. But the research supporting low carbohydrate diets is increasingly impressive and my own experience for two years now supported by lab and blood work bears it out. In short, I agree with you - calories are not equal. it's that simple.

I have been surprised to find so many people staying under their calorie goal, yet when you see what they eat is shocks me. Yes, they stayed under, BUT they ate crap! Fast food, processed foods, white breads, and soda.

This site is great for calorie counting and nutrition data, but it doesn't teach how to eat to fuel your body the best way possible. You body is not going to burn/use those crap calories the same way healthy foods will. When you eat healthy, your body burns it fast and uses pretty much every bit of that food, but when you eat processed, high sodium and fat foods, you will more then likely store some of that food into fat. Proof? Give a person the same number of calories but one eats all the healthy/clean foods while the other eats the junk. Whose body looks better? Also, it's not just weight gain that's affected, it's your hair and skin health too.

When you eat healthy, you feel healthy

What do YOU think?

I absolutely agree.

But it's not just who looks better. It's also about who is healthier. Somehow on this web site healthy =healthy weight. But you can be in healthy weight and exercise regularly but have problems with digestion, or high cholesterol, or other problems that were results of bad diet.

Not all calories are equal. Not all slim people have healthy diets either.

Well, then it is simple, really. Give us a measure of how "healthy" is determined.

Hey. I demanded that first.



Not that anyone ever gives it. It always comes down to handwavey 'take it on faith/my say-so' crap or my favorite "Well you'll see when you're 70." copout.

COME AT ME BRO

Back off both of you...I asked first.

Just an opinion but I think it can vary. I know for me personally I am with you. I burn so much faster if I eat healthy. If I eat junk I can stay under calories and it comes off slower but I have met the odd person for whom the rule doesn't stand true.

Open your diary and point us to the date ranges where you ate "junk" please. Also give us your weight over time. That way we can look at how your weight loss went eating "junk" and compare it to how you're doing now.

Thanks.