Thoughts on TDEE calculators and switching from MFP to TDEE.
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I'm not saying that your initial post lead me to figuring out my TDEE. I get what you're saying as far as calculating a targic caloric intake based on average daily intake by looking at your MFP history. I enjoyed the discussion by all with calculating daily goals.
As far as "starvation mode"... if I am consuming 1700ish calories/day & burning an average of 400calories/day. Calculating a TDEE with no activity is 2112.... my deficit would be around 800/day (also figuring in my exercise calories). My BMR is 1760. Why wouldn't this be considered a "starvation mode?"0 -
I do weigh all food & measure out everything that goes into my mouth (including condiments). All with the exception of a 4 day cruise we took. But even on the cruise, I made what I considered healthy decisions & went to the gym while I was on the ship & climbed the stairs instead of taking the elevator.
Just 3 weeks ago I started incorporting the carb cycling with a "cheat day" on Sunday (but still logging & tracking). Sunday's I have been eating around 2500cal/day.
I really am trying to figure out where to go from here because obviously what I'm doing right now is not working for me.0 -
I'm not saying that your initial post lead me to figuring out my TDEE. I get what you're saying as far as calculating a targic caloric intake based on average daily intake by looking at your MFP history. I enjoyed the discussion by all with calculating daily goals.
As far as "starvation mode"... if I am consuming 1700ish calories/day & burning an average of 400calories/day. Calculating a TDEE with no activity is 2112.... my deficit would be around 800/day (also figuring in my exercise calories). My BMR is 1760. Why wouldn't this be considered a "starvation mode?"
If you are eating at that level for several weeks and you are not losing weight then you are not in a caloric deficit. You are very likely eating at maintenance.
You think your BMR is 1760 because an online calculator told you so. In my original post I am suggesting that putting your faith in an online calculator and making hard decisions based on this without looking at the reality of the situation is where people tend to go wrong. The reality of your situation (in my opinion) is that your energy intake very very closely matches your energy expenditure.
Having said all of that, you can still do a diet break if you want to. There's no harm in it aside from the potential gain in weight that will likely happen initially.
If I were in your shoes though, I'd put all my emphasis on accurate logging of food intake for the next two weeks, and reduce intake to about 1650, monitor results and move on from there.
Secondarily, adaptive responses to dieting do exist but there is no starvation mode.0 -
I'm not saying that your initial post lead me to figuring out my TDEE. I get what you're saying as far as calculating a targic caloric intake based on average daily intake by looking at your MFP history. I enjoyed the discussion by all with calculating daily goals.
As far as "starvation mode"... if I am consuming 1700ish calories/day & burning an average of 400calories/day. Calculating a TDEE with no activity is 2112.... my deficit would be around 800/day (also figuring in my exercise calories). My BMR is 1760. Why wouldn't this be considered a "starvation mode?"
What are you defining as starvation mode? What do you mean by it?
However, an 800 calorie deficit at over 200lb is not a large deficit at all. That being, if you are not losing, you are not at a deficit (water weight fluctuations aside). Having a historic 800 cal deficit would not stress your body so much as to stop you losing.
What are your macros?0 -
For the past 2 months- my average:
Carbs: 28%
Protein: 30%
Fats: 42%0 -
I tend to think a lot of the devil is in the details. Logging calories in precisely is not easy. Estimates can be wildly off, even with the best intentions and sincere attempts to use things like food scales and measuring cups for everything.
When one reads up on how the calorie counts are developed for foods, you realize that no amount of precision in measuring at home will result in exact calorie counts. It is always an estimate based on USDA averages and certain assumptions about how the macros are digested.
In addition, we each differ as individuals. Even if you and I have identical heights, ages, and weights, we are unlikely to burn the same amount of calories on a daily basis.
That being said, TDEE-x% is a good place to start and then adjust for what works for you as the OP said. Same thing for the mix of macros that works for you and what foods you avoid or embrace.
There are certain underlying truths. Eating fewer calories than you use and moving more results in weight loss. Combine that with a nutritious diet and you will be healthier.0 -
argumentum ad auctoritatem - Appeal from authority
DO NOT trust an online tool to tell you what your body will tell you for free. If your body says "I'm gaining weight", you're eating at a surplus. If your body says "I'm not losing any weight", you're eating at maintenance. If your body says "I'm losing weight", then you're eating at a deficit.
MFP, and TDEE calculators, and other online tools are general guidelines to get you in the ballpark. Your own body is the deciding factor. If your body is fat, guess what? You're fat. If a body fat calculator says your fat and you look like Sarauk2sf or SideSteel, guess what? You're not fat.
Super simple stuff.
DO use MFP and IIFYM and TDEE and [insert acronym here] as tracking tools and general guidelines. That's what they're meant for. Do not appeal to their authority.0 -
I guess I am one of those people who is still learning. I recently changed from eating MFP's recommendation of 1260 calories to eating at my TDEE - 20% at 1989 calories. I was losing 1-2lbs a week with MFP's way and eating back my exercise calories, but I was starving, drained, and was finding it hard to complete the day. Which is why I started looking into using the TDEE method. I can focus on eating the same calories and adjusting every 5lbs or so. I feel more energized and I am able to complete the day and no longer starving. But I have been gaining about a pound a week using this method, but I have been losing inches...so I am a little confused.
I have a desk job for 8 hours of the day...and I walk/jog 30-40 mins 3 days a week and about 20 mins of 30 day shred 3 times a week with 2 rest days. (One of the days I do both)
I used Scooby's calculator to get my TDEE of 2486 MFP says my daily activity is 2440 which is not too far off.
Does this make sense that I am gaining after switching (2 weeks ago) but losing inches? Do I need to allow 6 weeks for my body to adjust before the lbs start to come off?
Probably means your body for the exercise you do is finally getting enough resources to do something with, whereas before it was a choice, repair muscle used or grow hair and replace skin?
Only glucose stores with water weight add up that fast while losing inches of fat, as well as water retained in muscle for repair from a good strong workout.
Which if you were tired before, maybe wasn't happening well at all.
Need about a months worth of data with no change to workout to decide if you are at right level.
Did you ever compare prior eating levels to what TDEE Deficit method is doing now? You may have increased too much.
Thanks...that's about what I'm thinking as well...I will stick it out and see what happens.
I am eating an average of 250 calories extra then before once I ate back exercise calories.....0 -
Tag for later. I would like to have better handle on this as well.0
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Thanks so much for this! I have been contemplating switching for a while but I was nervous about the calories that the online calculators were suggesting (too good to be true LOL). I think I will stick with MFP for now.0
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Bump for all the great info!0
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I guess I am one of those people who is still learning. I recently changed from eating MFP's recommendation of 1260 calories to eating at my TDEE - 20% at 1989 calories. I was losing 1-2lbs a week with MFP's way and eating back my exercise calories, but I was starving, drained, and was finding it hard to complete the day. Which is why I started looking into using the TDEE method. I can focus on eating the same calories and adjusting every 5lbs or so. I feel more energized and I am able to complete the day and no longer starving. But I have been gaining about a pound a week using this method, but I have been losing inches...so I am a little confused.
I have a desk job for 8 hours of the day...and I walk/jog 30-40 mins 3 days a week and about 20 mins of 30 day shred 3 times a week with 2 rest days. (One of the days I do both)
I used Scooby's calculator to get my TDEE of 2486 MFP says my daily activity is 2440 which is not too far off.
Does this make sense that I am gaining after switching (2 weeks ago) but losing inches? Do I need to allow 6 weeks for my body to adjust before the lbs start to come off?
Probably means your body for the exercise you do is finally getting enough resources to do something with, whereas before it was a choice, repair muscle used or grow hair and replace skin?
Only glucose stores with water weight add up that fast while losing inches of fat, as well as water retained in muscle for repair from a good strong workout.
Which if you were tired before, maybe wasn't happening well at all.
Need about a months worth of data with no change to workout to decide if you are at right level.
Did you ever compare prior eating levels to what TDEE Deficit method is doing now? You may have increased too much.
Thanks...that's about what I'm thinking as well...I will stick it out and see what happens.
I am eating an average of 250 calories extra then before once I ate back exercise calories.....
Well, and if you have higher BF% than average or expected, and you used the Harris BMR for the TDEE math, you may be another 200 inflated for that reason. Meaning upwards of 500 more than where you were eating before.
That could mean no deficit. Perhaps you wanted minor deficit, but potentially none?0 -
This is just my opinion.
Often times in the forums people will post questions about moving from MFP's exercise calorie model to a TDEE method.
I like the TDEE method a great deal but one thing people tend to do is put their trust into an equation without considering their previous energy intake. This doesn't always end well.
This doesn't mean switching is bad, but often times someone will end up gaining weight because they've just jacked their energy intake upwards by a significant amount. Sometimes I think this is the draw to using a TDEE method. It appears as though you get to eat more. That sounds great, but it's only great if you can still lose weight when you eat at that intake level.
(So for example if you are using MFP and averaging 1600 calories over the past 7 weeks and you're losing 1lb/week, and a TDEE calculator tells you that your TDEE is 2625, and you figure "Hey I'll take TDEE-20% and set my intake to 2100", I'm suggesting this is not likely to end in favorable results.)
We have seen multiple examples in our ETP group where someone makes the switch to a TDEE method and starts gaining weight and many times it's because they are now over-eating. It sounds like I'm bashing the TDEE method, and that's not my intent.
What I'm really getting at, is that your results are a great indicator and if you have accurate data from tracking your food intake and accurate data by tracking your progress over several weeks, you should be using that data to the best of your ability to make conclusions about your intake needs.
I think a more reasonable approach for most people would be to take the previous 4-8 weeks worth of intake data that they have on MFP and average that out. This will tell you your average caloric intake and you can then use your change in weight to at least give you some approximation as to what that intake level does for you as far as change in weight.
It's not going to be perfect of course, but it's certainly valuable data and I am suggesting that it's probably going to be superior to a calculator.
Assuming your results are somewhat reasonable, setting your daily intake to that average value seems like a good idea.
If your results are not reasonable, you can make adjustments upwards or downwards to that average intake to try and produce the desired results. If for some reason you need to start increasing food intake and you want to avoid gaining excessive amounts of fat, you're probably best off gradually increasing intake by slowly adding calories on a weekly basis and monitoring change in weight on the way up. (As an aside, I'd also use this gradual increase method when it comes time to move out of an energy deficit into maintenance or a surplus depending on your goals).
Using your current data and paying attention to the results of that data are going to lead you to a reasonable intake in most situations/for most people.
That's really the end of this rant. This is just my opinion but I'm going to post it here in case it helps anyone.
If not, well then you can just .gif me.
saved to read later!0 -
I'm confused with the TDEE calculators. When they mentioned exercise, is it only cardio? Because I lift weights (stronglifts minus the bench press) about 3 days a week and do HIIT once and steady state cardio once a week. So do I count it as 5 days of exercise/week? Newbie here :P
I know I have to see the mirror to track my progress also but I'm concerned about the intake. I measure every food I consume with a digital scale. If I have to track my maintenance for a week, do I not exercise for that week? My weight fluctuates a lot though, it's getting pretty hard to track.0 -
I'm confused with the TDEE calculators. When they mentioned exercise, is it only cardio? Because I lift weights (stronglifts minus the bench press) about 3 days a week and do HIIT once and steady state cardio once a week. So do I count it as 5 days of exercise/week? Newbie here :P
I know I have to see the mirror to track my progress also but I'm concerned about the intake. I measure every food I consume with a digital scale. If I have to track my maintenance for a week, do I not exercise for that week? My weight fluctuates a lot though, it's getting pretty hard to track.
TDEE calculators include all activity.0 -
So I would put it as 5 days of exercise/week?0
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So I would put it as 5 days of exercise/week?
Try that and adjust accordingly if you lose/gain. However, your actual results will be a better gauge.0 -
Okay thank you so much!
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I'm having success maintaining using the TDEE method, but my change in calorie goals was a modest one -- I went from eating 1550 plus my exercise calories using the MFP model to 1750 using TDEE.
I used an online TDEE calculator that I can't find now, but it included a section to break down the amount of time I do all kinds of activities during a 24 hour period in order to calculate an estimated energy expenditure (i.e. 8 hours sleeping, 1.5 hours preparing food, 8 hours desk job, etc.), rather than just using basic categories of sedentary/lightly active/active. Anyone know the site I'm remembering?
Was it this one, i stumbled upon it today
http://www.caloriesperhour.com/index_burn.php0
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