Your food is no cleaner than mine

It's not false, I'm saying I've never seen one - I've yet in my life to meet (online or in real life) an elitest clean eater

This cannot be true. You are on the MFP boards. You can't possibly not have come across that.

I personally have been on the receiving end of the jabs and actually name calling from a clean eater...

Why because I eat fruit loops...yup...fruit loops...

Then there is the rampant distain shown for those of us with AMG Chocolate in our diary...or prepackaged dinners etc.

I was once food-diary-shamed for having 13g of hershey's syrup in my protein drinks by a clean-eating disciple...that I was damaging my health (among other claims where he was completely oblivious to the concept of context and dose). That's just the most recent example of many.

And yet, I keep my food diary open...while it seems that so many of the loudest clean-eating zealots keep theirs locked up. Interesting, no?

okay let's be honest, 12 grams of Hershey syrup is acceptable, 13.....Good Lord....what were you thinking? Seriously, this thread has bounced all around. I appreciated the OP's comments, well done, top notch and I'd recommend a Fresca but is it clean?

It's not false, I'm saying I've never seen one - I've yet in my life to meet (online or in real life) an elitest clean eater

This cannot be true. You are on the MFP boards. You can't possibly not have come across that.

I personally have been on the receiving end of the jabs and actually name calling from a clean eater...

Why because I eat fruit loops...yup...fruit loops...

Then there is the rampant distain shown for those of us with AMG Chocolate in our diary...or prepackaged dinners etc.

I was once food-diary-shamed for having 13g of hershey's syrup in my protein drinks by a clean-eating disciple...that I was damaging my health (among other claims where he was completely oblivious to the concept of context and dose). That's just the most recent example of many.

And yet, I keep my food diary open...while it seems that so many of the loudest clean-eating zealots keep theirs locked up. Interesting, no?

Most of us who have been around for a bit have had certain experiences. I got a very nasty PM from a woman after I confessed that never in my more than 60 years have a eaten a store bought pizza, or one from any kind of restaurant. The woman did not know me, but implied that by eating pizza I could get a sex life among other things. I thought about it and a couple of weeks later bought a slice at a Sam's club.......well, I still don't like pizza and I still have no sex life....lol.
I also keep my diary open and have been put down; " Baby, your IF whole foods diet is **** ". I have never said that I eat whole foods only ( I usually call it a natural food based diet ) and have never told anyone what they ate was wrong unless I was specifically asked ( as in " Look at my diary and tell me how to get more protein " ) and would never foist the same diet I eat on anyone. I also don't want to be told that what I need is a decent cheat meal with a hamburger and a lot of bacon.
People usually eat a diet that was formed by the culture they live(d) in and by personal food experiences and the preferences that developed from those and that means that we are not all the same.
I agree with you some of the loudest clean-eating people keep their diary closed....but you know what ? So do some of the most loud mouthed dirty eaters.....some people on either side of the spectrum just like to stir the pot.

It's not false, I'm saying I've never seen one - I've yet in my life to meet (online or in real life) an elitest clean eater

This cannot be true. You are on the MFP boards. You can't possibly not have come across that.

I personally have been on the receiving end of the jabs and actually name calling from a clean eater...

Why because I eat fruit loops...yup...fruit loops...

Then there is the rampant distain shown for those of us with AMG Chocolate in our diary...or prepackaged dinners etc.

I was once food-diary-shamed for having 13g of hershey's syrup in my protein drinks by a clean-eating disciple...that I was damaging my health (among other claims where he was completely oblivious to the concept of context and dose). That's just the most recent example of many.

And yet, I keep my food diary open...while it seems that so many of the loudest clean-eating zealots keep theirs locked up. Interesting, no?

Most of us who have been around for a bit have had certain experiences. I got a very nasty PM from a woman after I confessed that never in my more than 60 years have a eaten a store bought pizza, or one from any kind of restaurant. The woman did not know me, but implied that by eating pizza I could get a sex life among other things. I thought about it and a couple of weeks later bought a slice at a Sam's club.......well, I still don't like pizza and I still have no sex life....lol.
I also keep my diary open and have been put down; " Baby, your IF whole foods diet is **** ". I have never said that I eat whole foods only ( I usually call it a natural food based diet ) and have never told anyone what they ate was wrong unless I was specifically asked ( as in " Look at my diary and tell me how to get more protein " ) and would never foist the same diet I eat on anyone. I also don't want to be told that what I need is a decent cheat meal with a hamburger and a lot of bacon.
People usually eat a diet that was formed by the culture they live(d) in and by personal food experiences and the preferences that developed from those and that means that we are not all the same.
I agree with you some of the loudest clean-eating people keep their diary closed....but you know what ? So do some of the most loud mouthed dirty eaters.....some people on either side of the spectrum just like to stir the pot.

I disagree that it is not decidedly lopsided from the several times I've checked so many of the threads where it was easy to determine which side of the argument someone was on. I suppose it could be selection bias (despite checking each poster) or I just had bad/nonrepresentative samples each time, but I'm convinced it's a solid conclusion.

Well I know for myself that after having my diary and weight loss progress bashed by oppositional people, I chose to avoid that kind of confrontation by simply closing my diary off from public viewing. I don't come on to MFP to be told by IIFYMers or moderation eaters or what have you that my views on food must be wrong because I have eaten a box of Smarties or because I haven't lost a lot of weight yet (god forbid someone have views on food but only be starting out on their serious weight loss journey....).

MFP is decidedly pro moderation/IIFYM and against clean eating or Paleo, etc. which means that more often it will be the clean eaters, Paleo eaters, etc. that get bashed simply because there's fewer of them and more of the moderates, etc., so there'll likely be more bashers from the other side which means clean eaters and Paleo eaters, etc. will probably get attacked more often. Which probably means more will choose as I did to avoid being personally attacked by closing their diary and getting rid of their weight loss tickers.


I've never once made fun of someone for their weight loss success or lack thereof, but I have been made fun of for mine. It's incredibly demeaning, insulting and unhelpful in a community that's supposed to be supportive, so I chose to avoid it - I don't need that kind of shaming from people who are against food shaming but apparently actively support people shaming.

My food diary was also open when I was paleo for all of calendar 2012...and I have been called out for my food diary far more frequently during the times I was *not* paleo. Weird, huh?

Perhaps I'm just a special snowflake in that regard.

It's weird how the majority of "clean eater" threads are by people comaining about clean eating.

I think the word you're looking for is typical.

What makes "I eat clean" more self-righteous than "Have some self control and willpower and eat in moderation"

Since I think I'm the one who used the term self-righteous, I'll answer that IMO it's not. If someone makes the call, based on their understanding of themselves that they can't, or can't enjoyably, eat something in moderation that's a perfectly reasonable decision, and that someone else doesn't feel the need to do so is obviously a bad reason to put anyone down or proclaim superiority. Also, if someone just decides they don't want to eat a particular type of food, that's their business. It's too bad when people buy into these superstitious notions that if they eat something bad the diet won't work, which seems a not uncommon idea of new posters and might explain the desire for eating plans, but people can quite reasonably decide that for the most part they don't want to waste calories on certain food or that it makes them feel bad or whatever. I expect most do.

But that doesn't make the term clean eating any more helpful.

It's not false, I'm saying I've never seen one - I've yet in my life to meet (online or in real life) an elitest clean eater

This cannot be true. You are on the MFP boards. You can't possibly not have come across that.

I personally have been on the receiving end of the jabs and actually name calling from a clean eater...

Why because I eat fruit loops...yup...fruit loops...

Then there is the rampant distain shown for those of us with AMG Chocolate in our diary...or prepackaged dinners etc.

I was once food-diary-shamed for having 13g of hershey's syrup in my protein drinks by a clean-eating disciple...that I was damaging my health (among other claims where he was completely oblivious to the concept of context and dose). That's just the most recent example of many.

And yet, I keep my food diary open...while it seems that so many of the loudest clean-eating zealots keep theirs locked up. Interesting, no?

Most of us who have been around for a bit have had certain experiences. I got a very nasty PM from a woman after I confessed that never in my more than 60 years have a eaten a store bought pizza, or one from any kind of restaurant. The woman did not know me, but implied that by eating pizza I could get a sex life among other things. I thought about it and a couple of weeks later bought a slice at a Sam's club.......well, I still don't like pizza and I still have no sex life....lol.
I also keep my diary open and have been put down; " Baby, your IF whole foods diet is **** ". I have never said that I eat whole foods only ( I usually call it a natural food based diet ) and have never told anyone what they ate was wrong unless I was specifically asked ( as in " Look at my diary and tell me how to get more protein " ) and would never foist the same diet I eat on anyone. I also don't want to be told that what I need is a decent cheat meal with a hamburger and a lot of bacon.
People usually eat a diet that was formed by the culture they live(d) in and by personal food experiences and the preferences that developed from those and that means that we are not all the same.
I agree with you some of the loudest clean-eating people keep their diary closed....but you know what ? So do some of the most loud mouthed dirty eaters.....some people on either side of the spectrum just like to stir the pot.

I disagree that it is not decidedly lopsided from the several times I've checked so many of the threads where it was easy to determine which side of the argument someone was on. I suppose it could be selection bias (despite checking each poster) or I just had bad/nonrepresentative samples each time, but I'm convinced it's a solid conclusion.

The choice to keep their diary closed remains solely with the member. There are a multitude of reasons why a member would keep their diary closed and in some cases it would be best if they did for the sake of their own progress. If they are asking for help with their food choices or asking why they aren't losing, perhaps opening the diary briefly would help others in their replies BUT in many cases it just opens that person up to unnecessary criticism. I personally don't need the negativity others would bring over any entry in my diary and I really don't feel it is anyone's business what I eat since I'm not asking for help with my food choices and I have lost the weight I wanted to plus some. I also do not feel it is proper for other to shame or pressure those who choose to keep their food diaries private. You do you, I will do me!

We get people like that at my Costco on the weekends! So obnoxious and rude!

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What makes "I eat clean" more self-righteous than "Have some self control and willpower and eat in moderation?"

Why is it not food shaming to acknowledge that some foods are 80 foods and some are 20 foods?

MFP is a world where shaming is the norm. You're shamed if you say you eat clean. You're shamed if you do cardio. You're shamed if you don't lift heavy. You're shamed if you avoid pizza, ice cream, coffee etc. It's ****ing *** backwards.

BINGO. And everyone claims someone else is doing the shaming.
I truly think it stems, in part, from the fact that everyone believes they are doing it right (this time), but everyone harbors doubts.

We get people like that at my Costco on the weekends! So obnoxious and rude!

Aside of the MFP forums, I really don't run into the obnoxious, rude or judgmental comments over my food choices. If anyone has an opinion, they politely keep them to themselves. In all honesty, that is the way it should be.

I can recall two incidents with naive and obviously new vegetarians at a campus eatery being very vocal about the choice of food for everyone in line so it wasn't personally at me alone. In general, my grocery cart does look odd compared to others because there's never any meat, poultry, packaged (eg. dry cereal, boxed meals), bakery or canned foods. Now one could assume we don't eat those things or draw a conclusion that we are clean eaters BUT they don't say anything. For the most part, I get more questions on how to cook something because they know we eat that and know how to.

I'm going to look for a house over there in Pleasantville where you live. Does each house have a rainbow over it?

Snark doesn't become you! You see, we actually spend our time between three of our homes, one main, two vacation, only at our main residence 8 months of the year. At home, we know many of the folks we see in grocery store AND they don't comment on our food choices. So far, we have not run into any comments at either of our vacation homes. On the other hand, I spend very, very little time in a grocery store since only a very small portion of our food dollar is spent in on so I am not being exposed to the rude and obnoxious shoppers self appointed food police.

I actually went to Costco yesterday and purchased some more snark by the bulk. I was running low and didn't want to have a crisis.
I did get criticized by some people while at the checkout because they were a little butt hurt at how much snark I was buying. They cried a little inside, I laughed a lot on the outside.

Next time though, I'm taking my larger unicorn shopping with me because the boxes were to heavy for the youngin' to carry comfortably.

It's not worth a strike. You have a great day!

It's not false, I'm saying I've never seen one - I've yet in my life to meet (online or in real life) an elitest clean eater

This cannot be true. You are on the MFP boards. You can't possibly not have come across that.

I personally have been on the receiving end of the jabs and actually name calling from a clean eater...

Why because I eat fruit loops...yup...fruit loops...

Then there is the rampant distain shown for those of us with AMG Chocolate in our diary...or prepackaged dinners etc.

I was once food-diary-shamed for having 13g of hershey's syrup in my protein drinks by a clean-eating disciple...that I was damaging my health (among other claims where he was completely oblivious to the concept of context and dose). That's just the most recent example of many.

And yet, I keep my food diary open...while it seems that so many of the loudest clean-eating zealots keep theirs locked up. Interesting, no?

Most of us who have been around for a bit have had certain experiences. I got a very nasty PM from a woman after I confessed that never in my more than 60 years have a eaten a store bought pizza, or one from any kind of restaurant. The woman did not know me, but implied that by eating pizza I could get a sex life among other things. I thought about it and a couple of weeks later bought a slice at a Sam's club.......well, I still don't like pizza and I still have no sex life....lol.
I also keep my diary open and have been put down; " Baby, your IF whole foods diet is **** ". I have never said that I eat whole foods only ( I usually call it a natural food based diet ) and have never told anyone what they ate was wrong unless I was specifically asked ( as in " Look at my diary and tell me how to get more protein " ) and would never foist the same diet I eat on anyone. I also don't want to be told that what I need is a decent cheat meal with a hamburger and a lot of bacon.
People usually eat a diet that was formed by the culture they live(d) in and by personal food experiences and the preferences that developed from those and that means that we are not all the same.
I agree with you some of the loudest clean-eating people keep their diary closed....but you know what ? So do some of the most loud mouthed dirty eaters.....some people on either side of the spectrum just like to stir the pot.

I disagree that it is not decidedly lopsided from the several times I've checked so many of the threads where it was easy to determine which side of the argument someone was on. I suppose it could be selection bias (despite checking each poster) or I just had bad/nonrepresentative samples each time, but I'm convinced it's a solid conclusion.

The choice to keep their diary closed remains solely with the member. There are a multitude of reasons why a member would keep their diary closed and in some cases it would be best if they did for the sake of their own progress. If they are asking for help with their food choices or asking why they aren't losing, perhaps opening the diary briefly would help others in their replies BUT in many cases it just opens that person up to unnecessary criticism. I personally don't need the negativity others would bring over any entry in my diary and I really don't feel it is anyone's business what I eat since I'm not asking for help with my food choices and I have lost the weight I wanted to plus some. I also do not feel it is proper for other to shame or pressure those who choose to keep their food diaries private. You do you, I will do me!

And in some cases diaries are closed because the poster isn't logging at all.