NEWSFLASH: McDonald’s existed back when I was a kid

I'm actually in Des Moines and we do NOT have a downtown grocer. They are all in the burbs/outlying residential areas of the city. So you're lucky in that respect. In the rural areas that I've worked, I'm not talking out on the farm. I'm talking small town that might have a local grocer (an IGA) who's prices are inflated because they don't have the benefit of purchasing on scale and maybe a Hardees and McDonalds. These are small rural 'towns' - not on the farm - where unemployment is rampant because the factory farming industry has run out the majority of farmers who did business in town. Meanwhile, insurance agents, doctors, lawyers, etc. all left those small towns leaving behind those who couldn't afford to do so. It's a sad state of affairs. Again, I've never implied it's the fast food industry's fault - but they certainly profit from misfortune.

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I'm so relieved all the personal responsibility folks don't live in abject poverty. The voices of those in extreme poverty aren't here and you know why? Because they don't have computers!!!! When I ate fast food, it was a choice. I gained weight and it was totally my choice. However, I also had/have the resources to make better choices. It's not just about education - it's about taking a hungry kid and making them feel full - and McD's and other fast food giants who provide calorie laden foods at a cheap price point take advantage (not necessarily intentionally) of that fact. there are kids who might get two meals a day during the school year and if my kid is hungry, i'm not so concerned with nutrition as quieting a hungry belly so my kid can sleep. i have worked for years with these families...it isn't always about 'choice' and 'responsibility.' what i am talking about has nothing to do with people on MFP who have time and resources to devote to health. i'm talking about people who we work with to grow community gardens and teach them to prepare fresh food because they don't know how because they have never had it and live in food deserts of the 'inner city' without access to produce besides the overripe bananas at the gas station, but can find as much fast food as your heart desires within a quarter mile of home, but the grocery is over 5 miles away and they have no car. the issue is bigger than just 'you choose or you don't choose.' maybe you, but not everyone.

Please stop. Advocating personal responsibility and worrying about food availability are not mutually exclusive. Plenty of people here who support consumers taking responsibility to educate themselves, reading the nutrition information that is available in stores and has been well before Super Size Me, and make choices about what to put in their bodies when it comes to fast food also do things like volunteer in and donate to food pantries, help run community gardens, and are active voices in helping people who live in food deserts or have food insecurity.

I do not deny personal responsibility, but your responsibility is limited by your choices.

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I think maybe you don't enjoy critically looking at problems. Which is fine, but McDonalds is part of the cheap fast food that is making people obese - it's unhealthy food that is cheap. They do have some duty towards their customers not to feed them crap. Yes, McDonalds existed when you were a kid. People became more and more obese during your lifetime so far.

Your comments about the Occupy Wall Street movements are similar.

It's possible to lose weight, but there's no known cure for conservatism/libertarianism/whatever it is that stops you seeing things in context. As Stephen Colbert pointed out, "Reality has a well-known liberal bias."

Nobody forces you to eat fast food. Just saying

I dont understand how anyone could become fat from McDonalds, that stuff tastes like ****.
The thought of eating enough of it to put on weight makes me shudder :sick:

I agree with OP- it's how the parents raise the kids. My mom didn't let me have much Mickey D's at all growing up and it was considered a "treat". After 6 years of not eating at McDonalds, I had some of their chicken nuggets for lunch because it was cheap and I was in a hurry. Never again!! Such awful flavor I that I couldn't eat them, and the aftertaste stuck in my mouth for hours.

As for the "it's cheap and it's the only thing poor people can afford"- that's actually false. When I was in college I had $50 per week for food, and most of the time I came under that. How?

Real oatmeal (not instant)= $3.50
Dried beans= $1.50
Loaf of (wheat) bread= $2
Dozen eggs= $2
5 Cans of tuna= $5
Pasta= $0.80
Pasta sauce= $1
Gallon of milk= $2.60
3 lb bag of apples= $3.50
4 lbs chicken breast = $10
5 lbs frozen veggies= $5
Various condiments= $5
Instant rice= $2
Store brand nutrigrain bars= $2
Multipack of greek yogurt =$4

This is more than enough for 1 person for a week and before taxes comes to around $50. It's very filling AND if you were to do the same in Mickey D's, you'd have to spend about $2.38/meal to beat that. Even if you ordered only off the dollar menu, you probably would have more calories and fat and not feel as full.

It's certainly not easy living like that since you have to cook everything, but if you prep all of your meals on a Sunday and have them ready to go in your fridge, it's actually faster and easier to do it because then you don't even have to stop through the drive thru!

People have full responsibility of what they put in their mouths. The odd treat here and there isn't going to do any harm, but it's using that as a crutch that's a problem.

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I'm so relieved all the personal responsibility folks don't live in abject poverty. The voices of those in extreme poverty aren't here and you know why? Because they don't have computers!!!! When I ate fast food, it was a choice. I gained weight and it was totally my choice. However, I also had/have the resources to make better choices. It's not just about education - it's about taking a hungry kid and making them feel full - and McD's and other fast food giants who provide calorie laden foods at a cheap price point take advantage (not necessarily intentionally) of that fact. there are kids who might get two meals a day during the school year and if my kid is hungry, i'm not so concerned with nutrition as quieting a hungry belly so my kid can sleep. i have worked for years with these families...it isn't always about 'choice' and 'responsibility.' what i am talking about has nothing to do with people on MFP who have time and resources to devote to health. i'm talking about people who we work with to grow community gardens and teach them to prepare fresh food because they don't know how because they have never had it and live in food deserts of the 'inner city' without access to produce besides the overripe bananas at the gas station, but can find as much fast food as your heart desires within a quarter mile of home, but the grocery is over 5 miles away and they have no car. the issue is bigger than just 'you choose or you don't choose.' maybe you, but not everyone.

Please stop. Advocating personal responsibility and worrying about food availability are not mutually exclusive. Plenty of people here who support consumers taking responsibility to educate themselves, reading the nutrition information that is available in stores and has been well before Super Size Me, and make choices about what to put in their bodies when it comes to fast food also do things like volunteer in and donate to food pantries, help run community gardens, and are active voices in helping people who live in food deserts or have food insecurity.

I do not deny personal responsibility, but your responsibility is limited by your choices.

The lack of choice *isn't McDonalds fault though*!! or 7-11 or any other food outlet

if this really is what's going on in poor communities in the USA then the USA needs to start providing affordable public transport and encouraging cheaper supermarkets to open branches in poor residential areas.

It seems, going by the posts here, that the USA has a problem with accessibility to fresh food options, i.e. cheap fruit, veg, meat, etc. The UK has this, because there are cheap supermarkets within walking distance of pretty much any residential areal (there are probably exceptions, but they'd be rare exceptions), and most places have at least a semi-decent public transport system, as in you can get to anywhere around the town/city during the day at least.

Seems to me that's the problem, not McDonalds. Asking McDonalds to make their menus more healthy is an utterly crazy way to address this problem...

AGAIN, so right on.

If the problem is a lack of accessible food, or means to get to accessible food, then it seems silly to me that we focus on one company (out of so many!). All this energy would be better spent developing plans for affordable grocery within walking distance of most communities, reliable PT systems, safe parks to play in and making time for recess and gym again in schools.

Completely agree. I conceded McD's is a scapegoat. But the bottom line is accessibility. What are YOU doing to make it accessible? I am a master gardener and volunteer for 5 inner city community gardens and consult on a school gardening project. But until everyone has access to healthy food, it means at this moment in time, their option is fast food. which means they aren't getting healthy food. And who supplies it? Who profits from it? It's a problem that is bigger than the fast food industry, but as i noted several pages back, they profit from an infrastructure that fails our kids.

What do I do?! Well, since you ask, I'm the internal champion for a program that my company is very active in called Move for Hunger. We take unused pantry items from customers when they are moving and we deliver it to the local food banks and pantries. We love the program AND it ties is exceptionally well with our business model. That's a win-win for me.

That's wonderful. But food banks don't address making people self sufficient and actually creating personal responsibility. Give the man a fish versus teach a man to fish. Again, not to diminish what you do, but for all the talk about responsibility, you aren't creating access, you're organizing a hand out. It doesn't address the root of the problem which is what the problem is with the way our charity system is set up. It doesn't provide a means not to rely on the system.

Youre such a peach.

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And I agree that McD's is the 'scapegoat' for all fast food because they are THE giant chain. When I talk about lack of accessibility to fresh food and only fast food options, I mean all fast-food. I also mean gas stations that serve up chips and hot dogs. Yes, eating less will help with obesity, but it doesn't have the nutrition kids need. I never said there was NO personal responsibility. if you go back a few pages, my response was pretty measured saying that yes, responsibility is needed. And no restaurant 'makes' anyone fat. BUT, it's when there are no other choices. It's a bigger problem than just saying eat here or don't eat there. It's a system that disproportionately affects the poor.

I don't disagree with you - but I am curious what you believe to be the solution to this problem? Do you think it lies with the government, or restaurant chains, or elsewhere?

I think there are a number of things that need to happen. Big picture, It starts with infrastructure in poor neighborhoods. It means investing in schools. It means paying a living wage. It means owner-occupied housing - until those things happen, good luck luring in the grocer. It's not a simple answer. It's not a cheap answer. In fact, the problem is quite large. A good starting point for everyone here would be go in and volunteer to start a neighborhood garden in your local 'inner city' or impoverished neighborhood. Find resources to help fund the project. Teach people how to start seeds, how to plant, cultivate and harvest. Teach them how to prepare the fresh resources and how to can for the winter. Volunteer at a local high-poverty school to start a school garden. Encourage your state/local legislators to push for healthier food in school lunchrooms. Get kids to develop a taste for veggies instead of fast food. It's a huge problem that will only be solved by people demanding it.

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DID YOU KNOW THAT YOU BRAIN IS STIMULATED THE SAME ON SUGAR AND COCAINE?? And 80% of the food at the supermarket has sugar, sometimes as diligent as you think you are being there could be something sabotaging you efforts.

TWO SIDES to every discussion ... this is just my thought on it ♥
SUGAR.. THE BITTER TRUTH I highly recommend watching it !!!

Have you ever seen someone who's taken Cocaine, never mind tried it your self?

They offer a VERY different stimulating experience. Would people really be paying £50 a gram if they could get the same from sugar?

I'd suggest you go and read some scientific studies and avoid propagating a commercial entity with a ridiculous agenda .


Incidentally; overally I'd say I tend to go to McDonalds because of the LOW calories. Basic hamburger is 250 calories or something.

Also - I often seen greengrocers on the same street as a McDonalds. There's nothing stopping parents stopping at them instead for healthy (sic) food.