OPINION ON ATKINS

13

Replies

  • VeganCappy
    VeganCappy Posts: 122
    Ignore recommendations on a forum and look at the science.
  • Veil5577
    Veil5577 Posts: 868 Member
    I've never tried Atkins or any other of the "fad" diets or workout plans.

    I figure why should I pay a ton of money for something when I can create a calorie deficit myself for free?
  • parkscs
    parkscs Posts: 1,639 Member
    Ignore recommendations on a forum and look at the science.

    Read your own "science" (one of which you linked twice). The ones with negative conclusions generally involve a tiny sample of patients and acknowledge the inadequacy of their own research, or lack the controls to draw any specific conclusions about what might actually be causing the observed increase in mortality rate. Obes Rev. 2012 Nov;13(11):1048-66. doi: 10.1111/j.1467-789X.2012.01021.x. Epub 2012 Aug 21 actually concludes that the low carb diet had "favourable effects on body weight and major cardiovascular risk factors." Citing that study to suggest that "science" concludes low carb diets are deadly is just comical - it says the opposite. And there are plenty of other studies out there that found positive health benefits to these so-called "deadly" diets.

    Misunderstanding and misrepresenting "science" is just as bad as being completely ignorant on the subject. At the end of the day, your 5 links are just the tip of the iceberg when it comes to research in this area and there are tons of studies showing both pros and cons of low carb diets as well as high protein diets (which are not the same thing, as you also seem to be suggesting). Taking 5 studies that reach different conclusions and misrepresenting that as conclusive evidence does not a convincing argument make.
  • VeganCappy
    VeganCappy Posts: 122
    Ignore recommendations on a forum and look at the science.

    Read your own "science" (one of which you linked twice). The ones with negative conclusions generally involve a tiny sample of patients and acknowledge the inadequacy of their own research, or lack the controls to draw any specific conclusions about what might actually be causing the observed increase in mortality rate. Obes Rev. 2012 Nov;13(11):1048-66. doi: 10.1111/j.1467-789X.2012.01021.x. Epub 2012 Aug 21 actually concludes that the low carb diet had "favourable effects on body weight and major cardiovascular risk factors." Citing that study to suggest that "science" concludes low carb diets are deadly is just comical - it says the opposite. And there are plenty of other studies out there that found positive health benefits to these so-called "deadly" diets.

    Misunderstanding and misrepresenting "science" is just as bad as being completely ignorant on the subject. At the end of the day, your 5 links are just the tip of the iceberg when it comes to research in this area and there are tons of studies showing both pros and cons of low carb diets as well as high protein diets (which are not the same thing, as you also seem to be suggesting). Taking 5 studies that reach different conclusions and misrepresenting that as conclusive evidence does not a convincing argument make.

    You are cherry picking. Just like people do with the bible. You take what supports your lifestyle, and ignore anything that does''t.
  • parkscs
    parkscs Posts: 1,639 Member
    I would think if anyone is "cherry picking", it's the guy that's citing a whopping 5 studies out of the hundreds of relevant studies and attempting to suggest that these 5 studies (which reach conflicting conclusions) conclusively prove anything whatsoever. What I'm saying is that the evidence isn't nearly as clear as you're suggesting and, even if it was, you've done a piss poor job of proving your case. Actually, your anecdote about someone quoting specific passages from the bible in an attempt to prove a specific point is pretty accurate for your argument in this thread.
  • tennisdude2004
    tennisdude2004 Posts: 5,609 Member
    Atkins diet - Opinions?

    If you follow it correctly it can give you great results and is a very healthy diet.
  • criticaltodd
    criticaltodd Posts: 86
    I tried Atkins a long time ago and it worked but I didn't stick with it and gained it all back.

    You might look at the paleo-style nutrition/diets-- there's a ton of resources out there. I'm not sure how it compares to Atkins (I remember so little of it now) but it is also a low-carb style diet if that's what you're looking for.

    Myself, I've just starting going somewhat paleo and I'm digging it so far.
  • VeganCappy
    VeganCappy Posts: 122
    I would think if anyone is "cherry picking", it's the guy that's citing a whopping 5 studies out of the hundreds of relevant studies and attempting to suggest that these 5 studies (which reach conflicting conclusions) conclusively prove anything whatsoever. What I'm saying is that the evidence isn't nearly as clear as you're suggesting and, even if it was, you've done a piss poor job of proving your case. Actually, your anecdote about someone quoting specific passages from the bible in an attempt to prove a specific point is pretty accurate for your argument in this thread.

    A lot of rhetoric. No science.
  • cdn_beaver
    cdn_beaver Posts: 130 Member
    I've been eating low carb/high fat/moderate protein (keto) for almost two years now. I dropped the first 60lbs relatively quickly and I'm down over 85lbs total now. This is a lifestyle change for me so I won't go back to the way I ate before. I feel great eating this way, don't feel deprived or starving, and the weight keeps dropping.
  • _John_
    _John_ Posts: 8,646 Member
    I would think if anyone is "cherry picking", it's the guy that's citing a whopping 5 studies out of the hundreds of relevant studies and attempting to suggest that these 5 studies (which reach conflicting conclusions) conclusively prove anything whatsoever. What I'm saying is that the evidence isn't nearly as clear as you're suggesting and, even if it was, you've done a piss poor job of proving your case. Actually, your anecdote about someone quoting specific passages from the bible in an attempt to prove a specific point is pretty accurate for your argument in this thread.

    A lot of rhetoric. No science.

    "high protein, low carbohydrate" is quite vague in the scientific literature, and often links to just abstracts makes it hard to get what definition they even used for the meta analysis.

    a 40%, 30%, 30% carbs/protein/fats diet as is often spewed here has a LOT of room for including adequate nutrition and is often fit under the low carb, high protein umbrella selected by scientific studies.

    Again, I know just rhetoric, but I've not been overly fond of the lack of a uniform definition I've seen in research doing direct experiments or meta analysis.
  • Sage812
    Sage812 Posts: 10
    Not really recommended for very active people maybe ok for those who are sedentary. For instance I ran 10 miles today and no way am I eating very low carb let alone atkins level carbs unless I want to pass out and feel like crap. But ultimately weight loss come down to a calorie deficet. If Atkins helps people do that then that's great.
  • tennisdude2004
    tennisdude2004 Posts: 5,609 Member
    Not really recommended for very active people maybe ok for those who are sedentary. For instance I ran 10 miles today and no way am I eating very low carb let alone atkins level carbs unless I want to pass out and feel like crap. But ultimately weight loss come down to a calorie deficet. If Atkins helps people do that then that's great.

    Low carb certainly can work well for active people - for more information on how check out Tim Noakes literature.

    I eat low carb myself and my weekly activity is

    Monday - 2 hours tennis
    Tuesday - 2 hours tennis
    Wednesday - 1 1/2 hours Ju Jitsu
    Saturday - 2 - 3 hours tennis
    Sunday 8 mile hike (not every Sunday)

    Of those I only ever need to up my carbs for the Ju Jitsu and then it's still low carb relative to my increase in calories.
  • FunkyTobias
    FunkyTobias Posts: 1,776 Member
    Ignore recommendations on a forum and look at the science.

    Read your own "science" (one of which you linked twice). The ones with negative conclusions generally involve a tiny sample of patients and acknowledge the inadequacy of their own research, or lack the controls to draw any specific conclusions about what might actually be causing the observed increase in mortality rate. Obes Rev. 2012 Nov;13(11):1048-66. doi: 10.1111/j.1467-789X.2012.01021.x. Epub 2012 Aug 21 actually concludes that the low carb diet had "favourable effects on body weight and major cardiovascular risk factors." Citing that study to suggest that "science" concludes low carb diets are deadly is just comical - it says the opposite. And there are plenty of other studies out there that found positive health benefits to these so-called "deadly" diets.

    Misunderstanding and misrepresenting "science" is just as bad as being completely ignorant on the subject. At the end of the day, your 5 links are just the tip of the iceberg when it comes to research in this area and there are tons of studies showing both pros and cons of low carb diets as well as high protein diets (which are not the same thing, as you also seem to be suggesting). Taking 5 studies that reach different conclusions and misrepresenting that as conclusive evidence does not a convincing argument make.

    Not to mention the fact that these 5 studies were published in low-impact and/or open access journals.
  • FitnessBellaBarbie
    FitnessBellaBarbie Posts: 46
    It works for awhile, then you start feeling like total crap until you can't take anymore and binge nonstop on carbs until you gain all the weight back you lost. Other than that it's awesome!


    Story of my life
  • AllOutof_Bubblegum
    AllOutof_Bubblegum Posts: 3,646 Member
    That it's terrible for your health and absolutely, completely unnecessary to lose weight and look good.
  • Leonidas_meets_Spartacus
    Leonidas_meets_Spartacus Posts: 6,198 Member
    I don't do Atkins but my macros or similar. I eat some of the stuff atkins says avoid, I avoid some stuff stuff atkins says you can eat. Figure out what works. This thread made me laugh by people commenting with out knowing about the diet, I guess bro science at its best. I find it easy to sustain low carb because I can eat ton of yummy food with out counting every single calorie i eat.
  • Leonidas_meets_Spartacus
    Leonidas_meets_Spartacus Posts: 6,198 Member
    That it's terrible for your health and absolutely, completely unnecessary to lose weight and look good.
    Lol what? Terrible? LMAO.
  • tennisdude2004
    tennisdude2004 Posts: 5,609 Member
    That it's terrible for your health and absolutely, completely unnecessary to lose weight and look good.

    Any evidence on that?
  • Leonidas_meets_Spartacus
    Leonidas_meets_Spartacus Posts: 6,198 Member
    Ignore opinions and read the science.

    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/23372809
    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/11108325
    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/11108325
    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/22850317
    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/22905670
    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/10959514


    High protein diets will only help you fit into a smaller casket.

    Atkins and most of the ketogenic diets are not high protein diets. How about educating yourself before you post something.
  • Leonidas_meets_Spartacus
    Leonidas_meets_Spartacus Posts: 6,198 Member
    That it's terrible for your health and absolutely, completely unnecessary to lose weight and look good.

    Any evidence on that?

    Bro Science at its best.
  • No_Finish_Line
    No_Finish_Line Posts: 3,661 Member
    same as any other diet, you only burn body fat as fast as the defecit you create.

    if people see extra success on this diet, IMO its due to two reasons:

    1) its exceptionally good at eliminating water weight, much of what you lose in the begining will be water weight.

    2) everything fun to eat is loaded with fat AND carbs, or is just carbs. its my feeling that people end up eating less (creating a bigger defecit) then they may typically on other diets because the choices end up getting bland fast, even if its bacon all day everday lol. so if you are strict, or options aren't so tempting.

    because of number 2 there is often a backlash. and nearly everyone i know that just did atkins (didn't exercise or entertain alternative diet approaches) ended up gaining the weight back
  • No_Finish_Line
    No_Finish_Line Posts: 3,661 Member
    That it's terrible for your health and absolutely, completely unnecessary to lose weight and look good.

    Any evidence on that?

    well i suppose the jury is out on it being unhealthy, but its certainly not necessary to eat this way in order to lose weight
  • SCV34
    SCV34 Posts: 2,048 Member
    Gym and food can get expensive!! : P

    I lost 15 pounds in six months. No gym membership required, I exercised at home. As far as food goes, I pretty much ate the same food just less of it. Pretty easy, nothing special involved.
  • FitnessBellaBarbie
    FitnessBellaBarbie Posts: 46
    Sorry everyone if i started some "bickering" that was not at all my intention... And i want you all to know i am NOT a troll... I am just trying to figure this out for myself.. I was curious to get some opinions on this diet..

    Right now i am at 125 pounds
    I have a 1600 calorie diet
    30% carbs 30% fat and 40% protien
    I also workout everyday but i dont log my workouts - and i notice a lor of people dont - Should i be? Should i be adding more calories?
    I JUST started doing IIFYMM and i think its a great idea but i find it diffucult for me to be able to eat ALL my calories in one day without going over one of my percentages...
    I just dont know if i am doing this right and i am in desperate NEED of help.
    I feel like i just need an eating plan for my goals that i can follow without being so stressed out all the time about what to eat. I really am driving myself crazy.
  • tennisdude2004
    tennisdude2004 Posts: 5,609 Member
    Ignore opinions and read the science.

    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/23372809
    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/11108325
    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/11108325
    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/22850317
    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/22905670
    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/10959514


    High protein diets will only help you fit into a smaller casket.

    Atkins and most of the ketogenic diets are not high protein diets. How about educating yourself before you post something.

    What's the fun in that.

    Surely it's better to get all your information from Dave down the gym and then base your opinions on something from that.
  • tennisdude2004
    tennisdude2004 Posts: 5,609 Member
    That it's terrible for your health and absolutely, completely unnecessary to lose weight and look good.

    Any evidence on that?

    well i suppose the jury is out on it being unhealthy, but its certainly not necessary to eat this way in order to lose weight

    I don't think the jury's out! I think people have educated themselves about how to do it correctly and the science has proven LCHF healthy.

    Is it more healthy than just eating in moderation? That's where the jury is out IMO.
  • parkscs
    parkscs Posts: 1,639 Member
    Ignore opinions and read the science.

    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/23372809
    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/11108325
    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/11108325
    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/22850317
    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/22905670
    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/10959514


    High protein diets will only help you fit into a smaller casket.

    Atkins and most of the ketogenic diets are not high protein diets. How about educating yourself before you post something.

    What's the fun in that.

    Surely it's better to get all your information from Dave down the gym and then base your opinions on something from that.

    I gave up when I saw him talking about eating fruit to cleanse the toxins in another thread. :huh:
  • tennisdude2004
    tennisdude2004 Posts: 5,609 Member
    Ignore opinions and read the science.

    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/23372809
    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/11108325
    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/11108325
    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/22850317
    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/22905670
    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/10959514


    High protein diets will only help you fit into a smaller casket.

    Atkins and most of the ketogenic diets are not high protein diets. How about educating yourself before you post something.

    What's the fun in that.

    Surely it's better to get all your information from Dave down the gym and then base your opinions on something from that.

    I gave up when I saw him talking about eating fruit to cleanse the toxins in another thread. :huh:

    But fruit does doesn't it? Or am I thinking of my liver!
  • parkscs
    parkscs Posts: 1,639 Member
    Sorry everyone if i started some "bickering" that was not at all my intention... And i want you all to know i am NOT a troll... I am just trying to figure this out for myself.. I was curious to get some opinions on this diet..

    Right now i am at 125 pounds
    I have a 1600 calorie diet
    30% carbs 30% fat and 40% protien
    I also workout everyday but i dont log my workouts - and i notice a lor of people dont - Should i be? Should i be adding more calories?
    I JUST started doing IIFYMM and i think its a great idea but i find it diffucult for me to be able to eat ALL my calories in one day without going over one of my percentages...
    I just dont know if i am doing this right and i am in desperate NEED of help.
    I feel like i just need an eating plan for my goals that i can follow without being so stressed out all the time about what to eat. I really am driving myself crazy.

    You're overthinking it. If 1600 is what MFP gave you, you should try to eat your exercise calories back. If 1600 is your deficit as calculated from your TDEE, you should not eat your exercise calories back.

    As for your macros, protein is really the only one that shouldn't vary much based on your choice of diet and rather should be calculated based on your lean body mass and your exercise routine. You don't need to do anything special like Atkins in order to lose weight. Just focus on tracking what you eat as accurately as possible, tracking the calories you burn and hitting your calorie/nutrient goals as best you can. You can fine tune things (e.g., adjusting a particular macro up or down) as you go.
  • brianpperkins
    brianpperkins Posts: 6,124 Member
    Sorry everyone if i started some "bickering" that was not at all my intention... And i want you all to know i am NOT a troll... I am just trying to figure this out for myself.. I was curious to get some opinions on this diet..

    Right now i am at 125 pounds
    I have a 1600 calorie diet
    30% carbs 30% fat and 40% protien
    I also workout everyday but i dont log my workouts - and i notice a lor of people dont - Should i be? Should i be adding more calories?
    I JUST started doing IIFYMM and i think its a great idea but i find it diffucult for me to be able to eat ALL my calories in one day without going over one of my percentages...
    I just dont know if i am doing this right and i am in desperate NEED of help.
    I feel like i just need an eating plan for my goals that i can follow without being so stressed out all the time about what to eat. I really am driving myself crazy.

    What is your height?
    What is your goal weight?
    What is your ED history?
    What is your thought process behind wanting information on such a restrictive eating plan?

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