Cyclist v Motorist
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I'm glad I opened this thread. I've learned quite a bit. But I do have one question. Can someone please explain to me why someone would ride a bike on a two lane, extremely curvy, heavily wooded highway with practically no shoulder, where the speed limit is 55mph?
I can't tell you the number of times I've been trucking along doing 55-60mph, come around a curve, and found a bike right in front of me, with another car traveling towards me at 55-60mph. I have no choice at that point but to just barely squeeze between the bike and the other car, because it's not possible to slow down enough to ride behind the bike until it's safe to pass.
then you are driving to fast- or you forgot about your brake pedal. There is no reason to force the issue between an oncoming vehicle and the side vehicle/car/pedestrian.
When I'm doing the speed limit? I slow down as much as I can. It's not like I'm flying past them still doing 55, but it is impossible to slow down to the 10 or so mph that they're going. But nevermind, I obviously chose the wrong thread to ask a question, that still no one has tried to answer. They'd rather just attack me, even though I was trying to be respectful.
You just need to slow down enough so either you or the oncoming vehicle clears the bike so you have room to safely pass.
This seriously isn't rocket science. And slowing down for a brief moment isn't going to cause you any great angst- you lose at most 1-2 min of time at worst- and at best you prevent a catastrophic accident.
As for why people are out there- it's because it's what they do- it's their hobby their past time- or they are training. Although really- it doesn't matter why they are there- you still have to find a way to share the road with them.
And no one is attacking you.0 -
People who are rude to cyclists always have the same argument- " I am respectful but when they don't follow the rules of the road I get so mad. Why should I give them room if they don't play by the same rules?" First of all, being mad b/c a cyclist doesn't come to a complete stop at a red light or stop sign doesn't give you the right to kill them. Second, these same people wear their halos- I am sure none of them speed, or roll stop signs, or turn right on red against a sign or any of the other things we all do when driving. Just cut a wide path around a cyclist and get on with your day. Why is it so hard? Why the animosity?0
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It is illegal in most states to ride a bicyle on the sidewalk. Sidewalks are for pedestrians.0
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Cyclists should stay on the sidewalk where possible, and so should pedestrians, or on bike/walking trails.
Just FYI, in many jurisdictions it is illegal to ride a bike on the sidewalks.
Here, we have a distinction between sidewalks which are for pedestrians only, and "multi use paths" which are OK for cyclists and pedestrians.
According to my state law, bicycles are vehicular traffic. They are supposed to go on the road (or MUPs), and have the same rights to a lane and right of way as a car does.0 -
This has to be the most American thread I've seen in a long time. Here in the UK we'll probably just call you a rhymes-with-punt and be on our way, but I'm seeing people threatening to shoot and run eachother over for driving offences.
Although with the narrow roads here they can be frustrating sometimes, the escalation to outright violence in here is quite scary.
Edit to add; Bike lanes are few and far between in my area, and it's illegal to ride on the pavement. In Norway, they have a much better bike infrastructure from what I've seen, including bike lanes that are at least a car wide and physically divided from both the road and the pavement with a kerb.0 -
This has to be the most American thread I've seen in a long time. Here in the UK we'll probably just call you a rhymes-with-punt and be on our way, but I'm seeing people threatening to shoot and run eachother over for driving offences.
Although with the narrow roads here they can be frustrating sometimes, the escalation to outright violence in here is quite scary.
Edit to add; Bike lanes are few and far between in my area, and it's illegal to ride on the pavement. In Norway, they have a much better bike infrastructure from what I've seen, including bike lanes that are at least a car wide and physically divided from both the road and the pavement with a kerb.
Yeah uniquely American, the relationship between people and their cars in this country is pretty legendary.
Everyone and their cousin will go on about being environmentally friendly as they plow along in their SuV's running bikers off the road they drive to the gym on.
Europe (not so much the UK yet), seems to really be embracing bikes now though so hopefully we will catch up eventually.0 -
The difference is that in Europe, cars are tools. In America, they are status symbols.
Obviously, that doesn't apply to all and is just a broad generalization.0 -
I just bought a bike a few months ago after probably not riding one since I was 16. I rode it on the sidewalks in my neighborhood mainly b/c the main streets are very busy with no bike lanes. There are very few pedestrians on the sidewalks, but one day I did encounter one who was bouncing (literally...running on these springy things) right in the middle of the sidewalk with headphones on. I yelled twice "passing on the left" and she didn't budge from the center. I ended up yelling again and startling her as I was so close by the time she heard me. Yep...I should have just stopped and tried to walk quickly around her...my fault. The next day I posted in a forum here asking what the etiquette was and that is when a lot of people let me know that I shouldn't have been on the sidewalk at all. That was truly news to me. I ended up calling the Police Department in my town and asked about it. He said that I should ride on the sidewalk and that he would rather I startle a few pedestrians or runners rather than getting hit by a car. So yes, all places are different. I am only on the sidewalk for a little while though as I generally head over to a business park area that on the weekends is practically empty. I can ride in the bike lanes there and through parking lots for hours at a time and maybe see one or two cars.
I do agree with others though that it is both the responsibility of driver and the cyclists to make sure everyone is safe. Look for bikes on the road and on the sidewalk that might be passing in front of you when exiting a parking lot or street.0 -
I just bought a bike a few months ago after probably not riding one since I was 16. I rode it on the sidewalks in my neighborhood mainly b/c the main streets are very busy with no bike lanes. There are very few pedestrians on the sidewalks, but one day I did encounter one who was bouncing (literally...running on these springy things) right in the middle of the sidewalk with headphones on. I yelled twice "passing on the left" and she didn't budge from the center. I ended up yelling again and startling her as I was so close by the time she heard me. Yep...I should have just stopped and tried to walk quickly around her...my fault. The next day I posted in a forum here asking what the etiquette was and that is when a lot of people let me know that I shouldn't have been on the sidewalk at all. That was truly news to me. I ended up calling the Police Department in my town and asked about it. He said that I should ride on the sidewalk and that he would rather I startle a few pedestrians or runners rather than getting hit by a car. So yes, all places are different. I am only on the sidewalk for a little while though as I generally head over to a business park area that on the weekends is practically empty. I can ride in the bike lanes there and through parking lots for hours at a time and maybe see one or two cars.
I do agree with others though that it is both the responsibility of driver and the cyclists to make sure everyone is safe. Look for bikes on the road and on the sidewalk that might be passing in front of you when exiting a parking lot or street.
I would check your city ordinances before trusting a cop just answering off the cuff.
And I don't mean disrespect to police- but there are a lot of laws that get kicked around by people who forget or don't actually know and they just "think" they know.0 -
I just bought a bike a few months ago after probably not riding one since I was 16. I rode it on the sidewalks in my neighborhood mainly b/c the main streets are very busy with no bike lanes. There are very few pedestrians on the sidewalks, but one day I did encounter one who was bouncing (literally...running on these springy things) right in the middle of the sidewalk with headphones on. I yelled twice "passing on the left" and she didn't budge from the center. I ended up yelling again and startling her as I was so close by the time she heard me. Yep...I should have just stopped and tried to walk quickly around her...my fault. The next day I posted in a forum here asking what the etiquette was and that is when a lot of people let me know that I shouldn't have been on the sidewalk at all. That was truly news to me. I ended up calling the Police Department in my town and asked about it. He said that I should ride on the sidewalk and that he would rather I startle a few pedestrians or runners rather than getting hit by a car. So yes, all places are different. I am only on the sidewalk for a little while though as I generally head over to a business park area that on the weekends is practically empty. I can ride in the bike lanes there and through parking lots for hours at a time and maybe see one or two cars.
I do agree with others though that it is both the responsibility of driver and the cyclists to make sure everyone is safe. Look for bikes on the road and on the sidewalk that might be passing in front of you when exiting a parking lot or street.
I would check your city ordinances before trusting a cop just answering off the cuff.
And I don't mean disrespect to police- but there are a lot of laws that get kicked around by people who forget or don't actually know and they just "think" they know.
http://www.floridabicycle.org/resources/pdfs/PEGLEG_2012.pdf0 -
As to the UK - we have a major problem in that our road network was developed at a time when large volumes of traffic simply didn't exist, so except for modernisation programmes and wide open spaces, there really isn't room for cycle lanes without moving people's houses - hell, a lot of places there's only room for one car on a two-way street.This has to be the most American thread I've seen in a long time. Here in the UK we'll probably just call you a rhymes-with-punt and be on our way, but I'm seeing people threatening to shoot and run eachother over for driving offences.
Although with the narrow roads here they can be frustrating sometimes, the escalation to outright violence in here is quite scary.
Edit to add; Bike lanes are few and far between in my area, and it's illegal to ride on the pavement. In Norway, they have a much better bike infrastructure from what I've seen, including bike lanes that are at least a car wide and physically divided from both the road and the pavement with a kerb.
Yeah uniquely American, the relationship between people and their cars in this country is pretty legendary.
Everyone and their cousin will go on about being environmentally friendly as they plow along in their SuV's running bikers off the road they drive to the gym on.
Europe (not so much the UK yet), seems to really be embracing bikes now though so hopefully we will catch up eventually.
Will be interesting to see how it's dealt with.0 -
I had this happen to me yesterday on my way to work. This girl had along side of me in traffic for several blocks, she zoomed up past me and went to parallel park AS I'M IN THE BIKE LANE. ***** almost backs into me. I yell at her and flip her off on my way past, so what's she do? FLIP ME OFF AND SMILE. I parked my bike, got off, smacked her hood like the HULK and asked her WTF her problem was. Then I proceeded to tell her that you don't flip people off when you almost hit them WITH YOUR CAR, you apologize. I scared her so bad that I don't think she'll ever park downtown again. WATCH FOR CYCLISTS and STOP TRYING TO HIT US, YOU ALWAYS WIN, *kitten*.0
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As to the UK - we have a major problem in that our road network was developed at a time when large volumes of traffic simply didn't exist, so except for modernisation programmes and wide open spaces, there really isn't room for cycle lanes without moving people's houses - hell, a lot of places there's only room for one car on a two-way street.This has to be the most American thread I've seen in a long time. Here in the UK we'll probably just call you a rhymes-with-punt and be on our way, but I'm seeing people threatening to shoot and run eachother over for driving offences.
Although with the narrow roads here they can be frustrating sometimes, the escalation to outright violence in here is quite scary.
Edit to add; Bike lanes are few and far between in my area, and it's illegal to ride on the pavement. In Norway, they have a much better bike infrastructure from what I've seen, including bike lanes that are at least a car wide and physically divided from both the road and the pavement with a kerb.
Yeah uniquely American, the relationship between people and their cars in this country is pretty legendary.
Everyone and their cousin will go on about being environmentally friendly as they plow along in their SuV's running bikers off the road they drive to the gym on.
Europe (not so much the UK yet), seems to really be embracing bikes now though so hopefully we will catch up eventually.
Will be interesting to see how it's dealt with.
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DITTO!
Cyclists should stay on the sidewalk where possible, and so should pedestrians, or on bike/walking trails. Don't think you'd be too happy about being tailgated by a car while on a bike trail, eh? I spend a fair amount of time driving from appointment to appointment, and it's really frustrating being behind someone who's going half the speed limit for recreational purposes
To be frank, and not to attack you, but you can take the "ride your bike on the sidewalk" suggestion and stuff it. As a motorist, you need to suck it up and learn the laws that cyclists can, and do ride on the same roads that you drive your car. If you can't handle it - well, take public transportation where a professional driver is trained to interface with all modes of transportation that legally are allowed to use the roads.
It's actually quite dangerous (and illegal in many states/communities) to ride your bike on the sidewalk. Lots of blind spots with driveways, lots of pedestrians, and lots of street crossings - all make for dangerous and poor mode of transportation via a bicycle. Not only dangerous for cyclists, but for cars as well that interface with those intersections, and driveways.
The road, unless posted that it is not allowed, is legal for cyclists to ride.
http://bikeleague.org/content/state-bike-laws-00 -
The difference is that in Europe, cars are tools. In America, they are status symbols.
Obviously, that doesn't apply to all and is just a broad generalization.
I'm pretty sure that there are tools driving Ferraris in both places.0 -
Where would you be going on a bike in the middle of nowhere? Literally at least 20 miles to any sort of "town" or business either direction.
A long training ride?
I have a 20 mile circuit route from the end of my driveway that is all on roads with a 60mph limit.
I'll do that then jump off for a 5Km run
20 is a fairly short ride
This.^^ 20-30 miles is a run of the mill, ordinary ride, and I'm not even very hard core. I rode 70 miles last Saturday. About 60% of my rides are for transportation purposes (commuting etc.) and 40% are for health and fun. People who don't ride don't seem to understand that it's not only possible, it's entirely reasonable to ride more than a few miles at a time.
And for those who think bicycles belong on sidewalks, I echo those who replied that a) it's illegal where I live b) it poses a danger to pedestrians and c) it's far more dangerous for the cyclists. I know of a community in my home state (not where I live, but where I vacation) that has lovely bike paths but no sensible cyclist uses them. I asked the local bike shop why that was the case, and they said it's because it's a good way to get hit by a car. Every intersection, driveway, exit from a gated community, etc is a hazard spot. Cars are looking at the street, not the sidewalk/multi use path, and a cyclist coming down that path not going to be seen by drivers.
Where I live, State code says cyclists have a right to use the road AND a responsibility to obey all traffic laws. Granted there is room for improvement on both sides of this debate, but telling cyclists to get off of roads is not the answer.0 -
Below is a link to a video that I really wish everyone who has spoken negatively about cyclists watch. It is a video of a cyclist in Australia who always rides in the bike lane (legal), obeys traffic laws and you can see what a cyclist faces out on the road when riding legally in a bike line.
This pretty much represents what riding a bike is like (a bad video game with near death experiences) in whatever country - even when riding in the legal bike lane. The lane is usually on the right side in the US, but not always. And the same stuff happens in the US legally riding along in the provided bike lane to all of us on a daily basis...
https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?v=10152137540937647
Interesting video. I'm usually sympathetic to the cyclists POV, but this guy ignored a yield sign (0:36) that lead to that near collision. Also, the truck that moved in his lane to make a left had to get over for a left turn too....the cyclist should have had some more awareness of need for large vehicles that might want to turn left there and cooperated with the driver to allow room for the maneuver.
The collision at the end was the fault of the car driver. But I get the impression this cyclist has the attitude of: I expect drivers to see me and follow the rules of the road, so I can fly along at 25mph through busy intersections! I think cyclists should also be prepared for the unexpected at all times. As been pointed out, the cyclist may be right, but what does that matter if that puts you under a moving vehicle? Slow down, be prepared for cars to rudely make mistakes. It is your cyclist's body that is going to pay no matter who is at fault.0 -
I just bought a bike a few months ago after probably not riding one since I was 16. I rode it on the sidewalks in my neighborhood mainly b/c the main streets are very busy with no bike lanes. There are very few pedestrians on the sidewalks, but one day I did encounter one who was bouncing (literally...running on these springy things) right in the middle of the sidewalk with headphones on. I yelled twice "passing on the left" and she didn't budge from the center. I ended up yelling again and startling her as I was so close by the time she heard me. Yep...I should have just stopped and tried to walk quickly around her...my fault. The next day I posted in a forum here asking what the etiquette was and that is when a lot of people let me know that I shouldn't have been on the sidewalk at all. That was truly news to me. I ended up calling the Police Department in my town and asked about it. He said that I should ride on the sidewalk and that he would rather I startle a few pedestrians or runners rather than getting hit by a car. So yes, all places are different. I am only on the sidewalk for a little while though as I generally head over to a business park area that on the weekends is practically empty. I can ride in the bike lanes there and through parking lots for hours at a time and maybe see one or two cars.
I do agree with others though that it is both the responsibility of driver and the cyclists to make sure everyone is safe. Look for bikes on the road and on the sidewalk that might be passing in front of you when exiting a parking lot or street.
I would check your city ordinances before trusting a cop just answering off the cuff.
And I don't mean disrespect to police- but there are a lot of laws that get kicked around by people who forget or don't actually know and they just "think" they know.
http://www.floridabicycle.org/resources/pdfs/PEGLEG_2012.pdf
werd-just as a suggestion to follow it up.. glad you did!!!The collision at the end was the fault of the car driver. But I get the impression this cyclist has the attitude of: I expect drivers to see me and follow the rules of the road, so I can fly along at 25mph through busy intersections! I think cyclists should also be prepared for the unexpected at all times. As been pointed out, the cyclist may be right, but what does that matter if that puts you under a moving vehicle? Slow down, be prepared for cars to rudely make mistakes. It is your cyclist's body that is going to pay no matter who is at fault.
didn't watch- but you nailed it.
As a motorcyclist it's the same concept and I have found by being proactive- assertive- not aggressive- not defensive- but being aware and running through common issues you can avert some really bad situations.
two vehicles travelling in the middle lane- second vehicle- pumping his brakes and tailgaiting- odds are he's looking to dart to the right or left to get around the vehicle in front. You start watching traffic behavioral patterns- and learning to watch and see what they do before they do it- you can avoid A. being irritated- and B being dead. which as I have learned- are both good things to avoid!!!0 -
The difference is that in Europe, cars are tools. In America, they are status symbols.
Obviously, that doesn't apply to all and is just a broad generalization.
Lol. Obviously doesn't understand the Germans and their car-love.0 -
Lol. Obviously doesn't understand the Germans and their car-love.
How true. At least Germans stop for pedestrians in cross walks and are used to sharing roads with cyclists.0
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