Thoughts on veganism?
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I agree. The myth that the vegan diet is healthier originates from ethical vegans, along with quite a few other myths such as that gorillas are vegans and humans evolved as herbivores.
The supposed health benefits from the vegan diet come from studies that show correlations, i.e. that vegans and vegetarians get less cancer and heart disease than people who eat the standard American diet. But firstly, correlation isn't causation and there are more diets than these two. The standard American diet is lacking in fibre, vitamins and minerals, while providing too much fat and carbohydrate - these factors could very easily explain the correlation, i.e. it's got nothing to do with giving up meat and everything to do with eating a lot of fresh plant foods.
I respect the opinions of people who are vegan for ethical reasons, even though I don't agree that eating animal products is wrong. But when it comes to people going vegan for health reasons, it worries me because while it's possible to be healthy on a vegan diet, it's difficult to get all the nutrients you need, a couple require supplementation and it takes a lot of work and planning.... and people are putting in all this work and effort for health benefits they can likely get from a diet that's much easier to stick to and manage, and when they might actually be healthier if they'd kept up eating animal products, while making an effort to eat a lot more fresh plant foods.0 -
astronomicals wrote: »thecycleofhappiness wrote: »Chief_Rocka wrote: »I disagree with the idea that the use of animal products is unethical.
Though I respect your opinion, and I agree that the use of animal products isn't all that bad, but the way we get these products is pretty messed up. Its sick.
You dont sound vegan to me. It sounds like you have no issue with family farm raised and slaughtered animals. Sounds more like ya watched a few netflix documentaries and got appalled by the food industry conglomerates. Thats not veganism.
Im gonna go put on some wool socks and rake some leaves.
Veganism has do with what you eat and nothing else.0 -
Have you even read the China Study?I would dispute the health benefits when compared to a nutrient dense diet that contains some portion of animal products. I think the China Study is silly. But having said both of those things I don't care if someone chooses to be vegan.
I do think that respecting all opinions is silly and wrong. People are entitled to their opinion but if their opinion is full of hatred then I don't respect it. Think of the opinions of certain hate mongering groups -- do you respect those opinions? I hope not. But that's an aside and I probably shouldn't derail your thread.
And do you really not believe ALL People have a right to their opinions. If you do, that IS respecting them. As for Hate mongering groups, while I do not agree with their opinions and might even make it my personal goal to help them to change their opinions, I don't hate them for having their opinions. They were formed from something they felt strongly about.
Veganism isn't just about not eating meat, it is respect for life. That means no leather shoes, coats, belts, furniture etc. . . It is a complete respect for all living things. No, I am not vegan, wish I could be but I've tried and it's just not in me to do it. Instead, I respect those who raise animals in a healthy and happy environment for our benefit. I raise my own hens and love those little girls for all they do for my family.
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RavenLibra wrote: »How can a person be vegan based on ethical grounds and NOT be against exploitation of ALL natural resources.( primarily Oil and Gas?) and IF they are against Oil and Gas? how would they feed themselves with only locally grown produce in a Northern Climate? OR for that matter reconcile their use of plastics and synthetic materials used to construct the majority of structures short of caves and holes dug into the ground?
Vegan... is the maxim of hypocracy... "green" is it's younger brother... of all the people on this planet... fully less than10% have the luxury of choosing their diet... the rest...scrounge, beg, scrape, or hold their hand out for 1/2 of what we consider an adequate diet.
Vegan for ethical reasons??? NICE... someone ought hand you a fiddle while the world burns
I'm just an average person doing my best, and my best isn't great, nor do I believe I'm a hero or superior. So cool down.-1 -
thecycleofhappiness wrote: »Because there is no such thing as "ethically killing" anything. At least in my opinion.
Tell that to Brittany Maynard.0 -
If you didn't think you were superior, why do we know you're a vegan?0
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I was vegan for about year about twenty years ago (and an overall lacto-ovo vegetarian for 10 years) and I lifted and put on muscle and was very lean. Back then it was much more difficult to be vegan. Today, there are much more resources and products that claim animal-free then there were back then, but it is not yet such an easy lifestyle to follow.0
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Trolling or clueless?Need2Exerc1se wrote: »astronomicals wrote: »thecycleofhappiness wrote: »Chief_Rocka wrote: »I disagree with the idea that the use of animal products is unethical.
Though I respect your opinion, and I agree that the use of animal products isn't all that bad, but the way we get these products is pretty messed up. Its sick.
You dont sound vegan to me. It sounds like you have no issue with family farm raised and slaughtered animals. Sounds more like ya watched a few netflix documentaries and got appalled by the food industry conglomerates. Thats not veganism.
Im gonna go put on some wool socks and rake some leaves.
Veganism has do with what you eat and nothing else.
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Need2Exerc1se wrote: »thecycleofhappiness wrote: »The_Enginerd wrote: »
If you are vegan for ethical reason because you don't agree with industry pratices, is there a reason you did not move to eating ethically produced animal products?thecycleofhappiness wrote: »thecycleofhappiness wrote: »astronomicals wrote: »Most vegans dont know wtf veganism is. Thats my thoughts.
Explain?
I am guessing it's because a lot of people do it because they think it's healthier, or that they can lose faster with it, and things of that nature rather than for ethical reasons which is really the only reason to be a vegan.
Oh, okay. Yeah thats true. Veganism is -not- a weight loss plan! And I did it for ethical reasons because I don't agree with anything the meat/egg/dairy industry does.
Because there is no such thing as "ethically killing" anything. At least in my opinion.
Since you asked for opinions, I think this is a highly debatable point. In many areas predators have been driven or killed out to the point that without hunting non-predator animals would flourish to the point that many would die a slow painful death of starvation were it not for hunting. A good hunter can kill quickly and with little pain.
Also, eating eggs does a chicken no harm, so I can't see what would unethical about that. I do realize that not all commercial eggs come from farms where chicken are done no harm, but you can get eggs from humanely raised chickens.
I think you have this all wrong. Wiping out predators was good! That way, animals won't die at the hands of other animals.
When an entire ecosystem collapses and the wildlife in an area begins to starve... it's not really starvation, they're just going on a crash diet.0 -
I'd become vegan only if for some medical reason I can't eat animal products. I live in a place where most of things are very "artisan", so, I don't worry much about that. And, I really like meat, milk, eggs, cheese, pork, fish... so, while I respect other's food choices, I wouldn't choose to be vegan unless I had no other choice.0
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I have to say, I love the term "artisan".
I make bread, bacon. Once I slap an artisan sticker and affectation on my bacon, I've been selling it for $20 a pound to hipsters, while everyone else gets it at $10 a pound.0 -
I used to be an omnivore till I watched a television program about Charles Darwin and I realised looking into the eyes of an animal I was probably looking at something which has too many genetic similarities to myself, I couldn't do that any more.
Its hard for me because I am salicylate sensitive, equals a real problems with fruit, veggies and herbs and other stuff. I also have low thyroid function which behaves better with higher protein levels, I'd need to eat so many beans, they do not provide much protein. On medication I can eat some quorn and soy protein but not much. A free range well fed chicken will lay eggs, fertilised or not, I very much hope not. Milk is more controversial, unless you can keep your own animal and then the problem is, what do you do with excess animals?.
Once a plant has successfully set seeds its life is coming to a close....... We needs to respect all food this is not just something we can buy more and more of, or grow and then throw away wastefully. We have lost so much knowledge in order to increase our civilisation at this great cost, a lack of respect for everything.0 -
JenAndSome wrote: »This is just not going to end well. Why do you care what other people think about veganism? If you want to be a vegan, go ahead.
^this.
I don't veganism is radical or unhealthy. I don't think it's the only way to eat healthy. I think you do need to understand and read about what you are doing if you choose to be vegan, because it is not mainstream, and if you're not used to the lifestyle it can take some adjusting and work at first. I have heard some omnivores and some vegans with strong opinions saying rediculous and hurtful comments to each other. I don't have the energy or desire to have discussions with people like that.0 -
if you feel great being a vegan (and you blood results etc are good too) i don't see why it would be bad to be a vegan. i'm vegetarian but i don't really eat eggs because i think they are gross, same with milkproducts.. but i'm not vegan because i'm lazy and i dont feel like checking every label on food :')
also the 'tell everyone you are vegan' comments are very annoying. i don't see people going into other threads "OMG WHY ARE YOU TELLING ME HOW YOU EAT DO YOU THINK YOU ARE SUPERIOR?!?!?!?!1111" -.-0 -
PhoebeGrey wrote: »
Have you even read the China Study?I would dispute the health benefits when compared to a nutrient dense diet that contains some portion of animal products. I think the China Study is silly. But having said both of those things I don't care if someone chooses to be vegan.
I do think that respecting all opinions is silly and wrong. People are entitled to their opinion but if their opinion is full of hatred then I don't respect it. Think of the opinions of certain hate mongering groups -- do you respect those opinions? I hope not. But that's an aside and I probably shouldn't derail your thread.
And do you really not believe ALL People have a right to their opinions. If you do, that IS respecting them. As for Hate mongering groups, while I do not agree with their opinions and might even make it my personal goal to help them to change their opinions, I don't hate them for having their opinions. They were formed from something they felt strongly about.
Veganism isn't just about not eating meat, it is respect for life. That means no leather shoes, coats, belts, furniture etc. . . It is a complete respect for all living things. No, I am not vegan, wish I could be but I've tried and it's just not in me to do it. Instead, I respect those who raise animals in a healthy and happy environment for our benefit. I raise my own hens and love those little girls for all they do for my family.
You are making a strawman argument. I very clearly stated in my original post that people are entitled to their opinion. I do not have to respect that opinion, neither should you.0 -
thecycleofhappiness wrote: »Hello! I'm a vegan (only of a month, but it still counts right? Haha.)
Well you've mastered the first rule of veganism: Tell everyone you're vegan.
Haha!
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OP, thank you for prompting this discussion.0
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