Define "healthy" food...
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I get it. Opinion, to fact....took me a second..;) No sarcasm meant, I just screwed up.
Well, darn. I guess I'll shut up, then.
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squirrelzzrule22 wrote: »squirrelzzrule22 wrote: »It is absolutely ludicrous to suggest that some foods are not healthier than others.
It would be similarly ludicrous to suggest that someone cannot be HEALTHY and eat UNHEALTHY foods sometimes.
However, a person cannot be HEALTHY and eat ONLY EXCLUSIVELY UNHEALTHY foods. (capitals for emphasis, not sass.)
Here is my simplified example:
Op said something along the lines of "I've hit my macros/micros for the day, why can't I have a donut?" No one is saying you can't. Go right ahead. Enjoy.
But if donuts were ALL you ate, you'd get pretty sick pretty quickly even if you ate them within a calorie limit. Now, in the context of WEIGHT LOSS, you would still lose weight eating 1000 calories of donuts per day and nothing else. But you would also be hungry, iron deficient, calcium deficient, protein deficient, etc.
If you eat a relatively balanced diet there is absolutely no reason you can't indulge in unhealthy treats. But suggesting that in the abstract a can of coke is as healthy as a bowl of raw kale is downright silly. I think most of the people suggesting this are trying to use semantics to make a controversial argument and fluff some feathers.
Someone a while back brought up the recommend diet for women during pregnancy, and it was dismissed as "well that's one of the only times it is reasonable to consider those things." I understand pregnant women need a greater amount of certain nutrients, like folic acid, etc, but I don't understand the logic of dismissing the implications of eating a better diet during pregnancy. Think about it this way- if you wouldn't want it going into the body of your growing child, why would you want it going into your own body? My personal answer? I don't, but I'm still going to have treats occasionally when I want to.
Also, and this is an aside to the main point, given that this is a weight loss website I think it is important to note that it is MUCH easier to overeat on UNHEALTHY foods for most people. Most (not all, but most) people to not become obese by eating a diet comprised solely of HEALTHY foods. That is something that I think deserves consideration in this debate.
This whole debate is a little like saying the following: Is smoking healthy? NO. Can a smoker BE a healthy person? YES. What determines whether or not that individual ends up dying at a young age of cancer? Who knows, it is a toss up. Some smokers will live to be 100. But many of us feel like we'd rather not take the risk.
why is the healthy eating crews immediate fall back to ALWAYS build a straw man argument about having 100% of your diet from donuts. No one is advocating that.
so if I eat kale, and ice cream and I have fulfilled micro/macro/calorie goals does that convert the ice cream from unhealthy to healthy?
No, that is absurd. Ice cream is still an unhealthy FOOD, but if it is part of an OVERALL HEALTHY DIET then it is not at all a problem to have it. I'm not sure how you are not getting that, I am not the first person to explain it.
Name something in it that is inherently detrimental to health.0 -
My local Kroger has recently started stocking frozen kale. Because it's store brand, it's actually cheaper than my favorite frozen turnip greens.Need2Exerc1se wrote: »I was raised eating kale and love it. But I also kind of hate that it's become a "superfood" too. The prices for it at the grocery are outrageous now.
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I only allow these in the house once or twice a month, as well the windows need to be open after the males in the house consume them in mass quantities, and yes they are considered healthy.AgentOrangeJuice wrote: »Eating broccoli, nuts/seeds, beans can put me in the hospital.
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Need2Exerc1se wrote: »
No....what people are saying is having a can of coke with a bowl of stew, that has veggies and proteins in it, is not considered unhealthy as I met all my macs and micros for the day, if I have room I will fit ice cream or a cookie or whatever.0 -
sweetdixie92 wrote: »So if I get 500 to 600 calories from ice cream and cookies to fill in my diet, does that make me less healthy than the person that is getting 75% of their calories from fish, rice, and vegetables?
Yes. Just look at the ingredient list.
Where your nutrients, fat, carbs, etc. are coming from do matter.
oh really??? care to elaborate?
so if my macors are 35p/35c/30 fats and I hit them all with eggs, chicken, rice, bread, etc and then filled in rest of day with ice cream and some cookies, you are saying that is an unhealthy day just because I got 500 - 600 from ice cream and cookies...really?0 -
I'll take someone defending me anytime
I get it. Opinion, to fact....took me a second..;) No sarcasm meant, I just screwed up.
Well, darn. I guess I'll shut up, then.
but I buck up when I f___ up, too.
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a month of broccoli?
good lord- i would hate to be the plumber for THAT house!!! OIYBecause it is extremely high calorie, high sugar, and high fat for little volume and not a great deal of nutritional value. To be honest I didn't choose the ice cream metaphor, and don't find ice cream to be nearly as unhealthy as, say, a can of coke, but in comparison to a bunch of kale YES ice cream offers less nutritional value.
so much sadness and wrongess here.
also this: kale vs ice cream?
seriously?
no questions- the kales' in the trash- it's rubbish awful food. You want to talk about 'unhealthy' anything that tastes that bad before you put int your pie hole should never be considered healthy- much less a "super food"
PS Eff you women's health for making kale a thing.
seriously. die.
I really like kale....*ducks*
get out.
we can't be friends any more
<cries>
I had a raw kale salad at the brasilian place last night.
I guess db and I will have to go sit in a corner.
But, hey, I hear there's beer over here. And peanut butter. You won't be able to resist us for long.
peanut butter oreos, and FR squat plans.
I hate kale but I'll join you in the corner
You are always welcome in my corner. You AND your headband.
It's a pretty headband.
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That was one of the first way's I tried kale- and my friend is a very good cook. I was so crushed- and I just . I felt violated.MakePeasNotWar wrote: »
More than one person has told me that seasoned kale chips were a tasty alternative to potato chips. I guess I am naive, because I went out, bought some kale, rubbed it with oil, added my seasonings, etc., baked it for however long the recipe said (I don't remember), and you know what? It didn't taste like potato chips. It tasted like %$#^ kale!
I don't know if I can ever learn to trust again.
yeah nope- not at all.Anyone who compares kale to potato chips needs to GTFO. And I like kale. But they ain't no chip.I had a raw kale salad at the brasilian place last night.
WHO THE HELL ARE YOU AND WHAT DID YOU DO WITH MY AWESOME FRIEND.
<grump>
I'd also like to weigh in on broccoli vs Doritos at this time.
What's the drink of choice with this?
Because really I only drink Doritos with pepsi- so I mean if we are doing Doritos + pepsi for a month vs broccoli and OJ- I mean- I think I'd lean toward Pepsi/Doritos combo Honestly.
Who am I kidding- with out butter/bacon grease broccoli is nothing to me.
That's where I was at, too. This whole broccoli scenario can be changed with a good dose of Plugra.0 -
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Calcium, iron, Vitamins A, D, K, E, etc. are naturally occurring parts of nutrition in whole, unprocessed foods. You aren't going to find those quality micronutrients in pizza, ice cream, funnel cakes, candy bars, soda, etc. And, even if you do get some micronutrients in the ingredients used to make those foods, you will also get a huge dose of sodium (implicated in high blood pressure), saturated fats (implicated in cardiovascular diseases) and sugar (which has a whole slew of diet related health issues attributed with it).
A bonus: what sort of education or research do you have to assert this position? I'd love to know.
You need to do some research on salt and blood pressure (myth) and saturated fats and heart disease (myth).
Sugar isn't the devil. You need to get over that too...unless, of course, you are pre-diabetic or diabetic.
1/2 cup of Breyers vanilla ice cream is a great snack, fairly low cal, nice dose of calcium, and some protein. What's the difference between eating some ice cream or having a yogurt?
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MoiAussi93 wrote: »
That's what google is for!!! They have made BILLIONS helping people look up information on the Internet. Oh well, I posted it in the other thread...you snooze, you lose!MoiAussi93 wrote: »Actually, I did. But you amuse me and this might help somebody who is actually serious.
http://lmgtfy.com/?q=sugar+linked+to+death+from+CVD+study+CDC
awww look it took me to a google search ..how cool ..
still is not a link to specific study you referenced...
if you reference a study that you have read then you should be able to readily access it...0 -
squirrelzzrule22 wrote: »squirrelzzrule22 wrote: »It is absolutely ludicrous to suggest that some foods are not healthier than others.
It would be similarly ludicrous to suggest that someone cannot be HEALTHY and eat UNHEALTHY foods sometimes.
However, a person cannot be HEALTHY and eat ONLY EXCLUSIVELY UNHEALTHY foods. (capitals for emphasis, not sass.)
Here is my simplified example:
Op said something along the lines of "I've hit my macros/micros for the day, why can't I have a donut?" No one is saying you can't. Go right ahead. Enjoy.
But if donuts were ALL you ate, you'd get pretty sick pretty quickly even if you ate them within a calorie limit. Now, in the context of WEIGHT LOSS, you would still lose weight eating 1000 calories of donuts per day and nothing else. But you would also be hungry, iron deficient, calcium deficient, protein deficient, etc.
If you eat a relatively balanced diet there is absolutely no reason you can't indulge in unhealthy treats. But suggesting that in the abstract a can of coke is as healthy as a bowl of raw kale is downright silly. I think most of the people suggesting this are trying to use semantics to make a controversial argument and fluff some feathers.
Someone a while back brought up the recommend diet for women during pregnancy, and it was dismissed as "well that's one of the only times it is reasonable to consider those things." I understand pregnant women need a greater amount of certain nutrients, like folic acid, etc, but I don't understand the logic of dismissing the implications of eating a better diet during pregnancy. Think about it this way- if you wouldn't want it going into the body of your growing child, why would you want it going into your own body? My personal answer? I don't, but I'm still going to have treats occasionally when I want to.
Also, and this is an aside to the main point, given that this is a weight loss website I think it is important to note that it is MUCH easier to overeat on UNHEALTHY foods for most people. Most (not all, but most) people to not become obese by eating a diet comprised solely of HEALTHY foods. That is something that I think deserves consideration in this debate.
This whole debate is a little like saying the following: Is smoking healthy? NO. Can a smoker BE a healthy person? YES. What determines whether or not that individual ends up dying at a young age of cancer? Who knows, it is a toss up. Some smokers will live to be 100. But many of us feel like we'd rather not take the risk.
why is the healthy eating crews immediate fall back to ALWAYS build a straw man argument about having 100% of your diet from donuts. No one is advocating that.
so if I eat kale, and ice cream and I have fulfilled micro/macro/calorie goals does that convert the ice cream from unhealthy to healthy?
No, that is absurd. Ice cream is still an unhealthy FOOD, but if it is part of an OVERALL HEALTHY DIET then it is not at all a problem to have it. I'm not sure how you are not getting that, I am not the first person to explain it.
Name something in it that is inherently detrimental to health.
Arsenic, but that's what I add for people that make me grumpy.0 -
sweetdixie92 wrote: »So if I get 500 to 600 calories from ice cream and cookies to fill in my diet, does that make me less healthy than the person that is getting 75% of their calories from fish, rice, and vegetables?
Yes. Just look at the ingredient list.
Where your nutrients, fat, carbs, etc. are coming from do matter.
you do realize you don't get bonus points for hitting macros right?
also good luck trying to bulk one day on that type of food.0 -
a month of broccoli?
good lord- i would hate to be the plumber for THAT house!!! OIYBecause it is extremely high calorie, high sugar, and high fat for little volume and not a great deal of nutritional value. To be honest I didn't choose the ice cream metaphor, and don't find ice cream to be nearly as unhealthy as, say, a can of coke, but in comparison to a bunch of kale YES ice cream offers less nutritional value.
so much sadness and wrongess here.
also this: kale vs ice cream?
seriously?
no questions- the kales' in the trash- it's rubbish awful food. You want to talk about 'unhealthy' anything that tastes that bad before you put int your pie hole should never be considered healthy- much less a "super food"
PS Eff you women's health for making kale a thing.
seriously. die.
I really like kale....*ducks*
get out.
we can't be friends any more
<cries>
I had a raw kale salad at the brasilian place last night.
I guess db and I will have to go sit in a corner.
But, hey, I hear there's beer over here. And peanut butter. You won't be able to resist us for long.
peanut butter oreos, and FR squat plans.
I hate kale but I'll join you in the corner
You are always welcome in my corner. You AND your headband.
It's a pretty headband.
Well I am a pretty man - couldn't wear an ugly headband could I?0 -
a month of broccoli?
good lord- i would hate to be the plumber for THAT house!!! OIYBecause it is extremely high calorie, high sugar, and high fat for little volume and not a great deal of nutritional value. To be honest I didn't choose the ice cream metaphor, and don't find ice cream to be nearly as unhealthy as, say, a can of coke, but in comparison to a bunch of kale YES ice cream offers less nutritional value.
so much sadness and wrongess here.
also this: kale vs ice cream?
seriously?
no questions- the kales' in the trash- it's rubbish awful food. You want to talk about 'unhealthy' anything that tastes that bad before you put int your pie hole should never be considered healthy- much less a "super food"
PS Eff you women's health for making kale a thing.
seriously. die.
I really like kale....*ducks*
get out.
we can't be friends any more
<cries>
I had a raw kale salad at the brasilian place last night.
I guess db and I will have to go sit in a corner.
But, hey, I hear there's beer over here. And peanut butter. You won't be able to resist us for long.
peanut butter oreos, and FR squat plans.
I hate kale but I'll join you in the corner
You are always welcome in my corner. You AND your headband.
It's a pretty headband.
It is, especially the flower!0 -
a month of broccoli?
good lord- i would hate to be the plumber for THAT house!!! OIYBecause it is extremely high calorie, high sugar, and high fat for little volume and not a great deal of nutritional value. To be honest I didn't choose the ice cream metaphor, and don't find ice cream to be nearly as unhealthy as, say, a can of coke, but in comparison to a bunch of kale YES ice cream offers less nutritional value.
so much sadness and wrongess here.
also this: kale vs ice cream?
seriously?
no questions- the kales' in the trash- it's rubbish awful food. You want to talk about 'unhealthy' anything that tastes that bad before you put int your pie hole should never be considered healthy- much less a "super food"
PS Eff you women's health for making kale a thing.
seriously. die.
I really like kale....*ducks*
get out.
we can't be friends any more
<cries>
I had a raw kale salad at the brasilian place last night.
I guess db and I will have to go sit in a corner.
But, hey, I hear there's beer over here. And peanut butter. You won't be able to resist us for long.
peanut butter oreos, and FR squat plans.
I hate kale but I'll join you in the corner
You are always welcome in my corner. You AND your headband.
It's a pretty headband.
Well I am a pretty man - couldn't wear an ugly headband could I?
NEVER.
gotta be fabulous- not fugly!0 -
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<-google queen. I googled red dye which took me to a wiki article, which led me to Red No. 3 and other Colourful Controversies.
Did you find this illusive Red Dye #5 while you were about it?0 -
heh.
That was one of the first way's I tried kale- and my friend is a very good cook. I was so crushed- and I just . I felt violated.MakePeasNotWar wrote: »
More than one person has told me that seasoned kale chips were a tasty alternative to potato chips. I guess I am naive, because I went out, bought some kale, rubbed it with oil, added my seasonings, etc., baked it for however long the recipe said (I don't remember), and you know what? It didn't taste like potato chips. It tasted like %$#^ kale!
I don't know if I can ever learn to trust again.
yeah nope- not at all.Anyone who compares kale to potato chips needs to GTFO. And I like kale. But they ain't no chip.I had a raw kale salad at the brasilian place last night.
WHO THE HELL ARE YOU AND WHAT DID YOU DO WITH MY AWESOME FRIEND.
<grump>
I'd also like to weigh in on broccoli vs Doritos at this time.
What's the drink of choice with this?
Because really I only drink Doritos with pepsi- so I mean if we are doing Doritos + pepsi for a month vs broccoli and OJ- I mean- I think I'd lean toward Pepsi/Doritos combo Honestly.
Who am I kidding- with out butter/bacon grease broccoli is nothing to me.
That's where I was at, too. This whole broccoli scenario can be changed with a good dose of Plugra.
cheese goes a long way!!!
God I couldn't even imagine that much fiber with no fat content. seriously.
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