I'm "skinny fat" and stuck in a rut

zSandman wrote: »

Springfield1970 wrote: »

khloesdad0124 wrote: »

actually JoRocka Cardio does help burn belly fat.

Cardio helps to burn fat AND muscle (if you're in the higher heart rate zones) only when you're in caloric deficit. It doesn't get burned from any specific area. You can't spot reduce. Cardio has its benefits but it actually gets in the way of building muscle and getting the body fat percentage down if you don't understand what you're doing or how you're fuelling.

I've been there many times.

ayyylmao. Cardio doesnt burn muscle, it just increases tdee leading to muscle loss due to improper dieting.

Body fat burn limit
add a little piece of data that I found very useful for calculating calorie deficits:
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/15615615.

QUOTE:
Abstract
A limit on the maximum energy transfer rate from the human fat store in hypophagia is deduced from experimental data of underfed subjects maintaining moderate activity levels and is found to have a value of (290+/-25) kJ/kgd. A dietary restriction which exceeds the limited capability of the fat store to compensate for the energy deficiency results in an immediate decrease in the fat free mass (FFM). In cases of a less severe dietary deficiency, the FFM will not be depleted. The transition between these two dietary regions is developed and a criterion to distinguish the regions is defined. An exact mathematical solution for the decrease of the FFM is derived for the case where the fat mass (FM) is in its limited energy transfer mode. The solution shows a steady-state term which is in agreement with conventional ideas, a term indicating a slow decrease of much of the FFM moderated by the limited energy transferred from the fat store, and a final term showing an unprotected rapid decrease of the remaining part of the FFM. The average resting metabolic rate of subjects undergoing hypophagia is shown to decrease linearly as a function of the FFM with a slope of (249+/-25) kJ/kgd. This value disagrees with the results of other observers who have measured metabolic rates of diverse groups. The disagreement is explained in terms of individual metabolic properties as opposed to those of the larger population.


Basically, the maximum amount of energy that can be extracted from fat stores per day is ~290KJ per kg of body fat, or 31 calories / pound of fat. Anything over that deficit will have to come from other reserves and contributes to underfeeding.

So bearing this in mind, and after you've run out of glycogen stores, where does the energy come from?

Tour de France cyclists experience a fair amount of muscle loss.

I did too, tri training above lactate threshold for long periods at a deficit. But my protein intake was more than adequate and I was heavy lifting 3x per week. Cardio CAN be a muscle cataboliser.

Springfield1970 wrote: »

Cardio done in an aerobic capacity, in the 'fat burn zone' or the lower heart rate zones, CAN burn fat, if it is putting you in a deficit for the day. Just walking and eating less is a PERFECT way to lose the fat. There's less wear and tear and chance for injury whilst you're on a deficit.
If you're going to do high intensity cardio, you need to be meticulous with your fuelling and numbers, so you burn fat without catabolising anything else.
Trust me, I have been at very low body fat percentages, I know how to do it. I've also been at very high bf percentages, I know how to do them too!

Belly fat MAY only come down when you are under a certain bf. I have no problem with belly fat, my lower half looks like mush if I'm over 20% even with my heavy lifting and bulking routine. I store everything on my lower half.

Thanks so much for sharing your experience, and the study!

Walking makes sense and I'm on board with that, but I also like high intensity cardio for the mood boost. What kind of fuelling and numbers do you mean, just high protein and only a modest deficit?

Great info, thanks again

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Pippinberry wrote: »

Hi,
I agree abs are made in the kitchen but it definitely does matter the kind of food you're eating. Eat lower saturated fat food (don't exclude all fat of course as it's necessary for brain health etc), and get your carbs from starchy veg instead of pasta/bread.

I have never heard this. Why does saturated fat and pasta and bread in particular lead to a flabby tummy?

Pippinberry wrote: »

Hi,
I agree abs are made in the kitchen but it definitely does matter the kind of food you're eating. Eat lower saturated fat food (don't exclude all fat of course as it's necessary for brain health etc), and get your carbs from starchy veg instead of pasta/bread.
I was in a similar boat to you, although I'm a little older (24) and started at a slighter higher fat % (26) - all my weight goes straight to my hips and lower back.
- Exercise wise, what helped me was HIIT instead of steady-state cardio and high rep, low weight strength exercises. Now I'm trying to add serious muscle I'm doing low rep, high weight. If you're trying to build muscle I'd suggest starting with the former to ensure you have proper form on all exercises before adding weight, as you don't want an injury.
- Don't be disheartened. It'll take a while but the first thing I'd suggest is to get your diet in order. I read up on why I store fat in certain areas, and mine is to do with the way I process insulin (apparently). So eat less of the food which is going to give you a sugar spike
- I'm by no means an expert and of course none of this advice may work for you. You'll reach your goal I'm sure

Do you think perhaps you just lost weight because you were in deficit?

It's quite common to correlate the wrong thing to your result. Many, many of us have lost body fat, bulked, and completely changed our body composition whilst eating all kinds of foods, high glycemic, high sat fat, the whole shebang. We just got our macros (protein fat and carbs) and micros (vitamins) right and created the right calorific deficit or excess.

In fact, you NEED an insulin spike after weight training as it transports the amino acids from the proteins into the muscle cells. Body builders know this.

No need to even worry about slow release carbs for weight loss unless you have diabetes. I personally choose them because they fill me up for longer, but have lost body fat on white pasta, bagels, cake, alcohol. I just make sure all my nutritional needs are met first.

Springfield1970 wrote: »

khloesdad0124 wrote: »

actually JoRocka Cardio does help burn belly fat.

Cardio helps to burn fat AND muscle (if you're in the higher heart rate zones) only when you're in caloric deficit. It doesn't get burned from any specific area. You can't spot reduce. Cardio has its benefits but it actually gets in the way of building muscle and getting the body fat percentage down if you don't understand what you're doing or how you're fuelling.

I've been there many times.

OP, I do all sorts of cardio and I love to run since I enjoy races and eating, but lifting is the key to physique.