How long to lose 10lbs body fat,and add 10lbs muscle?
Replies
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Carlos_421 wrote: »finneyjason218 wrote: »Don't listen to the whole, you can't build muscle while losing fat logic. It's hard - very hard - but not impossible. You're young and male (like me) so we have it easier. It takes a lot of discipline, because you pretty much have to eat right at your BMR everyday and get enough fats (for hormone stability) and protein (for muscle building). You are going to be at a deficit, so you need to eat .8-1.2 grams of protein per pound of lean body mass, which is a lot of reheated chicken breast. You'r going to have to lift - a lot, and continuously be adding volume. If you can't get all the weight for the same number of reps you did last week on that exercise - do an extra set, and another one, until you have moved more weight than you did last week. Every time. This is going to make your workouts longer as you progress, because your body is trying to get weaker (you aren't feeding it enough), but you aren't letting it. Swapping ten lbs of fat for ten lbs of muscle is definitely possible. If you are dedicated, you can probably get there in 16 weeks (unless you have been lifting for >3 years, in which case this could take years, but seeing as how you are 22%BF, I'd say you can do it). If you falter a few days in between, you might be looking at closer to 20 or even 24 depending on how bad the slip up is.
Incidentally, I'm doing the same thing you are. I started back at the end of Thanksgiving at 236lbs and around 30%BF. I'm now around 221lbs and around 20%BF. I'm trying to get back down to around 200-205lbs and 8-9%BF. I know it's possible because I was there just 2 years ago
Did you mean eat at TDEE every day instead of BMR? If you train hard and eat at BMR every day for 16 weeks you are going to regret it, if you do happen to survive.
How do you come to this conclusion? If he's tall his BMR is likely fairly high. Even if he's training 2 hours in the gym his performance might suffer, but it's not going to kill him.
What are you referring to as bmr?How do you come to that number?
BMR is your Basal Metabolic Rate. It's the number of calories you burn by being alive (heartbeat, breathing, thermoregulating, etc.).
@whinebag
Your TDEE (the energy you use in the day) is
TDEE = BMR * Acivity level
Activity level ranges from 1.2 (sedentary) to about 1.9 (very very active).
To calculate your BMR, there are many calculators on the web.0 -
Death is hyperbole, but I am calculating about 1k daily deficit. With heavy lifting 3 days per week and progressively added volume every workout as prescribed, I would predict serious injury well before week 16.
injury comes from accidents and bad form, not caloric deficit. He may not be able to adequately recover, and his training will suffer, but I don't see how that relates to injury. I eat at a large deficit and lift heavy 3x a week, and I am old too. Been just fine for a long time, and I have lost fat and maintained muscle.0 -
great reading about this http://www.bodyrecomposition.com/fat-loss/adding-muscle-while-losing-fat-qa.html/
Very good that one.
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EvgeniZyntx wrote: »Carlos_421 wrote: »finneyjason218 wrote: »Don't listen to the whole, you can't build muscle while losing fat logic. It's hard - very hard - but not impossible. You're young and male (like me) so we have it easier. It takes a lot of discipline, because you pretty much have to eat right at your BMR everyday and get enough fats (for hormone stability) and protein (for muscle building). You are going to be at a deficit, so you need to eat .8-1.2 grams of protein per pound of lean body mass, which is a lot of reheated chicken breast. You'r going to have to lift - a lot, and continuously be adding volume. If you can't get all the weight for the same number of reps you did last week on that exercise - do an extra set, and another one, until you have moved more weight than you did last week. Every time. This is going to make your workouts longer as you progress, because your body is trying to get weaker (you aren't feeding it enough), but you aren't letting it. Swapping ten lbs of fat for ten lbs of muscle is definitely possible. If you are dedicated, you can probably get there in 16 weeks (unless you have been lifting for >3 years, in which case this could take years, but seeing as how you are 22%BF, I'd say you can do it). If you falter a few days in between, you might be looking at closer to 20 or even 24 depending on how bad the slip up is.
Incidentally, I'm doing the same thing you are. I started back at the end of Thanksgiving at 236lbs and around 30%BF. I'm now around 221lbs and around 20%BF. I'm trying to get back down to around 200-205lbs and 8-9%BF. I know it's possible because I was there just 2 years ago
Did you mean eat at TDEE every day instead of BMR? If you train hard and eat at BMR every day for 16 weeks you are going to regret it, if you do happen to survive.
How do you come to this conclusion? If he's tall his BMR is likely fairly high. Even if he's training 2 hours in the gym his performance might suffer, but it's not going to kill him.
What are you referring to as bmr?How do you come to that number?
BMR is your Basal Metabolic Rate. It's the number of calories you burn by being alive (heartbeat, breathing, thermoregulating, etc.).
@whinebag
Your TDEE (the energy you use in the day) is
TDEE = BMR * Acivity level
Activity level ranges from 1.2 (sedentary) to about 1.9 (very very active).
To calculate your BMR, there are many calculators on the web.EvgeniZyntx wrote: »Carlos_421 wrote: »finneyjason218 wrote: »Don't listen to the whole, you can't build muscle while losing fat logic. It's hard - very hard - but not impossible. You're young and male (like me) so we have it easier. It takes a lot of discipline, because you pretty much have to eat right at your BMR everyday and get enough fats (for hormone stability) and protein (for muscle building). You are going to be at a deficit, so you need to eat .8-1.2 grams of protein per pound of lean body mass, which is a lot of reheated chicken breast. You'r going to have to lift - a lot, and continuously be adding volume. If you can't get all the weight for the same number of reps you did last week on that exercise - do an extra set, and another one, until you have moved more weight than you did last week. Every time. This is going to make your workouts longer as you progress, because your body is trying to get weaker (you aren't feeding it enough), but you aren't letting it. Swapping ten lbs of fat for ten lbs of muscle is definitely possible. If you are dedicated, you can probably get there in 16 weeks (unless you have been lifting for >3 years, in which case this could take years, but seeing as how you are 22%BF, I'd say you can do it). If you falter a few days in between, you might be looking at closer to 20 or even 24 depending on how bad the slip up is.
Incidentally, I'm doing the same thing you are. I started back at the end of Thanksgiving at 236lbs and around 30%BF. I'm now around 221lbs and around 20%BF. I'm trying to get back down to around 200-205lbs and 8-9%BF. I know it's possible because I was there just 2 years ago
Did you mean eat at TDEE every day instead of BMR? If you train hard and eat at BMR every day for 16 weeks you are going to regret it, if you do happen to survive.
How do you come to this conclusion? If he's tall his BMR is likely fairly high. Even if he's training 2 hours in the gym his performance might suffer, but it's not going to kill him.
What are you referring to as bmr?How do you come to that number?
BMR is your Basal Metabolic Rate. It's the number of calories you burn by being alive (heartbeat, breathing, thermoregulating, etc.).
@whinebag
Your TDEE (the energy you use in the day) is
TDEE = BMR * Acivity level
Activity level ranges from 1.2 (sedentary) to about 1.9 (very very active).
To calculate your BMR, there are many calculators on the web.
Ok cool,what would you all think on my activity level,I at least take 5k steps at work which is up and down on my knees and climbing Scaffles as I'm a painter,then when I get home I do at least 30min cardio and 3days a week I workout,rest on Sunday.0 -
EvgeniZyntx wrote: »Carlos_421 wrote: »finneyjason218 wrote: »Don't listen to the whole, you can't build muscle while losing fat logic. It's hard - very hard - but not impossible. You're young and male (like me) so we have it easier. It takes a lot of discipline, because you pretty much have to eat right at your BMR everyday and get enough fats (for hormone stability) and protein (for muscle building). You are going to be at a deficit, so you need to eat .8-1.2 grams of protein per pound of lean body mass, which is a lot of reheated chicken breast. You'r going to have to lift - a lot, and continuously be adding volume. If you can't get all the weight for the same number of reps you did last week on that exercise - do an extra set, and another one, until you have moved more weight than you did last week. Every time. This is going to make your workouts longer as you progress, because your body is trying to get weaker (you aren't feeding it enough), but you aren't letting it. Swapping ten lbs of fat for ten lbs of muscle is definitely possible. If you are dedicated, you can probably get there in 16 weeks (unless you have been lifting for >3 years, in which case this could take years, but seeing as how you are 22%BF, I'd say you can do it). If you falter a few days in between, you might be looking at closer to 20 or even 24 depending on how bad the slip up is.
Incidentally, I'm doing the same thing you are. I started back at the end of Thanksgiving at 236lbs and around 30%BF. I'm now around 221lbs and around 20%BF. I'm trying to get back down to around 200-205lbs and 8-9%BF. I know it's possible because I was there just 2 years ago
Did you mean eat at TDEE every day instead of BMR? If you train hard and eat at BMR every day for 16 weeks you are going to regret it, if you do happen to survive.
How do you come to this conclusion? If he's tall his BMR is likely fairly high. Even if he's training 2 hours in the gym his performance might suffer, but it's not going to kill him.
What are you referring to as bmr?How do you come to that number?
BMR is your Basal Metabolic Rate. It's the number of calories you burn by being alive (heartbeat, breathing, thermoregulating, etc.).
@whinebag
Your TDEE (the energy you use in the day) is
TDEE = BMR * Acivity level
Activity level ranges from 1.2 (sedentary) to about 1.9 (very very active).
To calculate your BMR, there are many calculators on the web.EvgeniZyntx wrote: »Carlos_421 wrote: »finneyjason218 wrote: »Don't listen to the whole, you can't build muscle while losing fat logic. It's hard - very hard - but not impossible. You're young and male (like me) so we have it easier. It takes a lot of discipline, because you pretty much have to eat right at your BMR everyday and get enough fats (for hormone stability) and protein (for muscle building). You are going to be at a deficit, so you need to eat .8-1.2 grams of protein per pound of lean body mass, which is a lot of reheated chicken breast. You'r going to have to lift - a lot, and continuously be adding volume. If you can't get all the weight for the same number of reps you did last week on that exercise - do an extra set, and another one, until you have moved more weight than you did last week. Every time. This is going to make your workouts longer as you progress, because your body is trying to get weaker (you aren't feeding it enough), but you aren't letting it. Swapping ten lbs of fat for ten lbs of muscle is definitely possible. If you are dedicated, you can probably get there in 16 weeks (unless you have been lifting for >3 years, in which case this could take years, but seeing as how you are 22%BF, I'd say you can do it). If you falter a few days in between, you might be looking at closer to 20 or even 24 depending on how bad the slip up is.
Incidentally, I'm doing the same thing you are. I started back at the end of Thanksgiving at 236lbs and around 30%BF. I'm now around 221lbs and around 20%BF. I'm trying to get back down to around 200-205lbs and 8-9%BF. I know it's possible because I was there just 2 years ago
Did you mean eat at TDEE every day instead of BMR? If you train hard and eat at BMR every day for 16 weeks you are going to regret it, if you do happen to survive.
How do you come to this conclusion? If he's tall his BMR is likely fairly high. Even if he's training 2 hours in the gym his performance might suffer, but it's not going to kill him.
What are you referring to as bmr?How do you come to that number?
BMR is your Basal Metabolic Rate. It's the number of calories you burn by being alive (heartbeat, breathing, thermoregulating, etc.).
@whinebag
Your TDEE (the energy you use in the day) is
TDEE = BMR * Acivity level
Activity level ranges from 1.2 (sedentary) to about 1.9 (very very active).
To calculate your BMR, there are many calculators on the web.
Ok cool,what would you all think on my activity level,I at least take 5k steps at work which is up and down on my knees and climbing Scaffles as I'm a painter,then when I get home I do at least 30min cardio and 3days a week I workout,rest on Sunday.
1.4-1.6...pick one.
Then log accurately and consistently and adjust as needed to make progress towards your goals. Repeat until goals reached. Make new goals. Repeat process again.0 -
jofjltncb6 wrote: »EvgeniZyntx wrote: »Carlos_421 wrote: »finneyjason218 wrote: »Don't listen to the whole, you can't build muscle while losing fat logic. It's hard - very hard - but not impossible. You're young and male (like me) so we have it easier. It takes a lot of discipline, because you pretty much have to eat right at your BMR everyday and get enough fats (for hormone stability) and protein (for muscle building). You are going to be at a deficit, so you need to eat .8-1.2 grams of protein per pound of lean body mass, which is a lot of reheated chicken breast. You'r going to have to lift - a lot, and continuously be adding volume. If you can't get all the weight for the same number of reps you did last week on that exercise - do an extra set, and another one, until you have moved more weight than you did last week. Every time. This is going to make your workouts longer as you progress, because your body is trying to get weaker (you aren't feeding it enough), but you aren't letting it. Swapping ten lbs of fat for ten lbs of muscle is definitely possible. If you are dedicated, you can probably get there in 16 weeks (unless you have been lifting for >3 years, in which case this could take years, but seeing as how you are 22%BF, I'd say you can do it). If you falter a few days in between, you might be looking at closer to 20 or even 24 depending on how bad the slip up is.
Incidentally, I'm doing the same thing you are. I started back at the end of Thanksgiving at 236lbs and around 30%BF. I'm now around 221lbs and around 20%BF. I'm trying to get back down to around 200-205lbs and 8-9%BF. I know it's possible because I was there just 2 years ago
Did you mean eat at TDEE every day instead of BMR? If you train hard and eat at BMR every day for 16 weeks you are going to regret it, if you do happen to survive.
How do you come to this conclusion? If he's tall his BMR is likely fairly high. Even if he's training 2 hours in the gym his performance might suffer, but it's not going to kill him.
What are you referring to as bmr?How do you come to that number?
BMR is your Basal Metabolic Rate. It's the number of calories you burn by being alive (heartbeat, breathing, thermoregulating, etc.).
@whinebag
Your TDEE (the energy you use in the day) is
TDEE = BMR * Acivity level
Activity level ranges from 1.2 (sedentary) to about 1.9 (very very active).
To calculate your BMR, there are many calculators on the web.EvgeniZyntx wrote: »Carlos_421 wrote: »finneyjason218 wrote: »Don't listen to the whole, you can't build muscle while losing fat logic. It's hard - very hard - but not impossible. You're young and male (like me) so we have it easier. It takes a lot of discipline, because you pretty much have to eat right at your BMR everyday and get enough fats (for hormone stability) and protein (for muscle building). You are going to be at a deficit, so you need to eat .8-1.2 grams of protein per pound of lean body mass, which is a lot of reheated chicken breast. You'r going to have to lift - a lot, and continuously be adding volume. If you can't get all the weight for the same number of reps you did last week on that exercise - do an extra set, and another one, until you have moved more weight than you did last week. Every time. This is going to make your workouts longer as you progress, because your body is trying to get weaker (you aren't feeding it enough), but you aren't letting it. Swapping ten lbs of fat for ten lbs of muscle is definitely possible. If you are dedicated, you can probably get there in 16 weeks (unless you have been lifting for >3 years, in which case this could take years, but seeing as how you are 22%BF, I'd say you can do it). If you falter a few days in between, you might be looking at closer to 20 or even 24 depending on how bad the slip up is.
Incidentally, I'm doing the same thing you are. I started back at the end of Thanksgiving at 236lbs and around 30%BF. I'm now around 221lbs and around 20%BF. I'm trying to get back down to around 200-205lbs and 8-9%BF. I know it's possible because I was there just 2 years ago
Did you mean eat at TDEE every day instead of BMR? If you train hard and eat at BMR every day for 16 weeks you are going to regret it, if you do happen to survive.
How do you come to this conclusion? If he's tall his BMR is likely fairly high. Even if he's training 2 hours in the gym his performance might suffer, but it's not going to kill him.
What are you referring to as bmr?How do you come to that number?
BMR is your Basal Metabolic Rate. It's the number of calories you burn by being alive (heartbeat, breathing, thermoregulating, etc.).
@whinebag
Your TDEE (the energy you use in the day) is
TDEE = BMR * Acivity level
Activity level ranges from 1.2 (sedentary) to about 1.9 (very very active).
To calculate your BMR, there are many calculators on the web.
Ok cool,what would you all think on my activity level,I at least take 5k steps at work which is up and down on my knees and climbing Scaffles as I'm a painter,then when I get home I do at least 30min cardio and 3days a week I workout,rest on Sunday.
1.4-1.6...pick one.
Then log accurately and consistently and adjust as needed to make progress towards your goals. Repeat until goals reached. Make new goals. Repeat process again.
Well looks like I'll die lol,I don't eat my bmr for someone my size without moving at all so there ya go lol.0 -
Death is hyperbole, but I am calculating about 1k daily deficit. With heavy lifting 3 days per week and progressively added volume every workout as prescribed, I would predict serious injury well before week 16.
injury comes from accidents and bad form, not caloric deficit. He may not be able to adequately recover, and his training will suffer, but I don't see how that relates to injury. I eat at a large deficit and lift heavy 3x a week, and I am old too. Been just fine for a long time, and I have lost fat and maintained muscle.
Injury also comes from inadequate recovery during intense training.
http://clevelandphysio.com.au/phy/common-injuries/overtraining-injuries
https://www.acsm.org/docs/current-comments/overtrainwithresistance.pdf?sfvrsn=4
http://philmaffetone.com/the-overtraining-syndrome/
Glad to hear you are staying injury-free. But have you been losing 2 lbs per week every week for the last several months while adding more volume to each workout? I would like to know how it is possible to recover from that. If you know how to read MRIs, you will notice my profile pic shows an inoperable torn pectoral and a torn rotator cuff. Those were injuries obtained last year during pushing too much volume during aggressive caloric deficit. They did not come from lifting heavy weight or bad form, they both came from overuse with inadequate recovery. Just two of many injuries I have experienced over the years from overtraining while cutting.
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I can see being off 2-400 calories but even then I'm under if you can read my log it's got everything I eat,I drink water and no calorie drinks0 -
Injury also comes from inadequate recovery during intense training.
http://clevelandphysio.com.au/phy/common-injuries/overtraining-injuries
https://www.acsm.org/docs/current-comments/overtrainwithresistance.pdf?sfvrsn=4
http://philmaffetone.com/the-overtraining-syndrome/
Glad to hear you are staying injury-free. But have you been losing 2 lbs per week every week for the last several months while adding more volume to each workout? I would like to know how it is possible to recover from that. If you know how to read MRIs, you will notice my profile pic shows an inoperable torn pectoral and a torn rotator cuff. Those were injuries obtained last year during pushing too much volume during aggressive caloric deficit. They did not come from lifting heavy weight or bad form, they both came from overuse with inadequate recovery. Just two of many injuries I have experienced over the years from overtraining while cutting.
OK fair enough, but I consider overtraining very similar to bad form (ie the form issue was you were doing too much volume for your recovery level, I suppose form is not the right word, programming and form is better). We need to know when to take time off. I have been at a caloric deficit for almost 2 years doing powerlifting progressive loading, varying deficit from -500cals to multiple PSMF sessions eating barely above BMR. For most of it I ate either low or no carb (keto). I deload when I need to, I take a week or two off when I need to, my sleep is excellent and my nutrition is as good as it can possibly be for this deficit. Not getting injured is one of my top priorities since I am a recovering herniated disc sufferer and I know injuries. I switched from 5x5 to 3x5 when I got a year in and I could not recover in time, then I switched to ramped 5x5 sets with only 1x5 at max weight, which is where I am now.0 -
Death is hyperbole, but I am calculating about 1k daily deficit. With heavy lifting 3 days per week and progressively added volume every workout as prescribed, I would predict serious injury well before week 16.
injury comes from accidents and bad form, not caloric deficit. He may not be able to adequately recover, and his training will suffer, but I don't see how that relates to injury. I eat at a large deficit and lift heavy 3x a week, and I am old too. Been just fine for a long time, and I have lost fat and maintained muscle.
Injury also comes from inadequate recovery during intense training.
http://clevelandphysio.com.au/phy/common-injuries/overtraining-injuries
https://www.acsm.org/docs/current-comments/overtrainwithresistance.pdf?sfvrsn=4
http://philmaffetone.com/the-overtraining-syndrome/
Glad to hear you are staying injury-free. But have you been losing 2 lbs per week every week for the last several months while adding more volume to each workout? I would like to know how it is possible to recover from that. If you know how to read MRIs, you will notice my profile pic shows an inoperable torn pectoral and a torn rotator cuff. Those were injuries obtained last year during pushing too much volume during aggressive caloric deficit. They did not come from lifting heavy weight or bad form, they both came from overuse with inadequate recovery. Just two of many injuries I have experienced over the years from overtraining while cutting.
Ouch. Are they gonna recover? The word inoperable always sounds really scary.0 -
3dogsrunning wrote: »finneyjason218 wrote: »Don't listen to the whole, you can't build muscle while losing fat logic. It's hard - very hard - but not impossible. You're young and male (like me) so we have it easier. It takes a lot of discipline, because you pretty much have to eat right at your BMR everyday and get enough fats (for hormone stability) and protein (for muscle building). You are going to be at a deficit, so you need to eat .8-1.2 grams of protein per pound of lean body mass, which is a lot of reheated chicken breast. You'r going to have to lift - a lot, and continuously be adding volume. If you can't get all the weight for the same number of reps you did last week on that exercise - do an extra set, and another one, until you have moved more weight than you did last week. Every time. This is going to make your workouts longer as you progress, because your body is trying to get weaker (you aren't feeding it enough), but you aren't letting it. Swapping ten lbs of fat for ten lbs of muscle is definitely possible. If you are dedicated, you can probably get there in 16 weeks (unless you have been lifting for >3 years, in which case this could take years, but seeing as how you are 22%BF, I'd say you can do it). If you falter a few days in between, you might be looking at closer to 20 or even 24 depending on how bad the slip up is.
Incidentally, I'm doing the same thing you are. I started back at the end of Thanksgiving at 236lbs and around 30%BF. I'm now around 221lbs and around 20%BF. I'm trying to get back down to around 200-205lbs and 8-9%BF. I know it's possible because I was there just 2 years ago
16 weeks? To add 10lbs of muscle? While eating a severe deficit?
Sure thing.
"Severe" is eating at BMR now? Wow0 -
finneyjason218 wrote: »Don't listen to the whole, you can't build muscle while losing fat logic. It's hard - very hard - but not impossible. You're young and male (like me) so we have it easier. It takes a lot of discipline, because you pretty much have to eat right at your BMR everyday and get enough fats (for hormone stability) and protein (for muscle building). You are going to be at a deficit, so you need to eat .8-1.2 grams of protein per pound of lean body mass, which is a lot of reheated chicken breast. You'r going to have to lift - a lot, and continuously be adding volume. If you can't get all the weight for the same number of reps you did last week on that exercise - do an extra set, and another one, until you have moved more weight than you did last week. Every time. This is going to make your workouts longer as you progress, because your body is trying to get weaker (you aren't feeding it enough), but you aren't letting it. Swapping ten lbs of fat for ten lbs of muscle is definitely possible. If you are dedicated, you can probably get there in 16 weeks (unless you have been lifting for >3 years, in which case this could take years, but seeing as how you are 22%BF, I'd say you can do it). If you falter a few days in between, you might be looking at closer to 20 or even 24 depending on how bad the slip up is.
Incidentally, I'm doing the same thing you are. I started back at the end of Thanksgiving at 236lbs and around 30%BF. I'm now around 221lbs and around 20%BF. I'm trying to get back down to around 200-205lbs and 8-9%BF. I know it's possible because I was there just 2 years ago
@finneyjason218 How are you measuring your body fat percentage?finneyjason218 wrote: »Don't listen to the whole, you can't build muscle while losing fat logic. It's hard - very hard - but not impossible. You're young and male (like me) so we have it easier. It takes a lot of discipline, because you pretty much have to eat right at your BMR everyday and get enough fats (for hormone stability) and protein (for muscle building). You are going to be at a deficit, so you need to eat .8-1.2 grams of protein per pound of lean body mass, which is a lot of reheated chicken breast. You'r going to have to lift - a lot, and continuously be adding volume. If you can't get all the weight for the same number of reps you did last week on that exercise - do an extra set, and another one, until you have moved more weight than you did last week. Every time. This is going to make your workouts longer as you progress, because your body is trying to get weaker (you aren't feeding it enough), but you aren't letting it. Swapping ten lbs of fat for ten lbs of muscle is definitely possible. If you are dedicated, you can probably get there in 16 weeks (unless you have been lifting for >3 years, in which case this could take years, but seeing as how you are 22%BF, I'd say you can do it). If you falter a few days in between, you might be looking at closer to 20 or even 24 depending on how bad the slip up is.
Incidentally, I'm doing the same thing you are. I started back at the end of Thanksgiving at 236lbs and around 30%BF. I'm now around 221lbs and around 20%BF. I'm trying to get back down to around 200-205lbs and 8-9%BF. I know it's possible because I was there just 2 years ago
@finneyjason218 How are you measuring your body fat percentage?
Calipers. I know they aren't 100% accurate, hence the word "about". All I can say precisely is that I am pinching way less fat than I was 10 weeks ago0 -
finneyjason218 wrote: »3dogsrunning wrote: »finneyjason218 wrote: »Don't listen to the whole, you can't build muscle while losing fat logic. It's hard - very hard - but not impossible. You're young and male (like me) so we have it easier. It takes a lot of discipline, because you pretty much have to eat right at your BMR everyday and get enough fats (for hormone stability) and protein (for muscle building). You are going to be at a deficit, so you need to eat .8-1.2 grams of protein per pound of lean body mass, which is a lot of reheated chicken breast. You'r going to have to lift - a lot, and continuously be adding volume. If you can't get all the weight for the same number of reps you did last week on that exercise - do an extra set, and another one, until you have moved more weight than you did last week. Every time. This is going to make your workouts longer as you progress, because your body is trying to get weaker (you aren't feeding it enough), but you aren't letting it. Swapping ten lbs of fat for ten lbs of muscle is definitely possible. If you are dedicated, you can probably get there in 16 weeks (unless you have been lifting for >3 years, in which case this could take years, but seeing as how you are 22%BF, I'd say you can do it). If you falter a few days in between, you might be looking at closer to 20 or even 24 depending on how bad the slip up is.
Incidentally, I'm doing the same thing you are. I started back at the end of Thanksgiving at 236lbs and around 30%BF. I'm now around 221lbs and around 20%BF. I'm trying to get back down to around 200-205lbs and 8-9%BF. I know it's possible because I was there just 2 years ago
16 weeks? To add 10lbs of muscle? While eating a severe deficit?
Sure thing.
"Severe" is eating at BMR now? Wow
TDEE less 36ish% seems severe to me.
What percent do you need to consider it severe?0 -
finneyjason218 wrote: »Don't listen to the whole, you can't build muscle while losing fat logic. It's hard - very hard - but not impossible. You're young and male (like me) so we have it easier. It takes a lot of discipline, because you pretty much have to eat right at your BMR everyday and get enough fats (for hormone stability) and protein (for muscle building). You are going to be at a deficit, so you need to eat .8-1.2 grams of protein per pound of lean body mass, which is a lot of reheated chicken breast. You'r going to have to lift - a lot, and continuously be adding volume. If you can't get all the weight for the same number of reps you did last week on that exercise - do an extra set, and another one, until you have moved more weight than you did last week. Every time. This is going to make your workouts longer as you progress, because your body is trying to get weaker (you aren't feeding it enough), but you aren't letting it. Swapping ten lbs of fat for ten lbs of muscle is definitely possible. If you are dedicated, you can probably get there in 16 weeks (unless you have been lifting for >3 years, in which case this could take years, but seeing as how you are 22%BF, I'd say you can do it). If you falter a few days in between, you might be looking at closer to 20 or even 24 depending on how bad the slip up is.
Incidentally, I'm doing the same thing you are. I started back at the end of Thanksgiving at 236lbs and around 30%BF. I'm now around 221lbs and around 20%BF. I'm trying to get back down to around 200-205lbs and 8-9%BF. I know it's possible because I was there just 2 years ago
Did you mean eat at TDEE every day instead of BMR? If you train hard and eat at BMR every day for 16 weeks you are going to regret it, if you do happen to survive.finneyjason218 wrote: »Don't listen to the whole, you can't build muscle while losing fat logic. It's hard - very hard - but not impossible. You're young and male (like me) so we have it easier. It takes a lot of discipline, because you pretty much have to eat right at your BMR everyday and get enough fats (for hormone stability) and protein (for muscle building). You are going to be at a deficit, so you need to eat .8-1.2 grams of protein per pound of lean body mass, which is a lot of reheated chicken breast. You'r going to have to lift - a lot, and continuously be adding volume. If you can't get all the weight for the same number of reps you did last week on that exercise - do an extra set, and another one, until you have moved more weight than you did last week. Every time. This is going to make your workouts longer as you progress, because your body is trying to get weaker (you aren't feeding it enough), but you aren't letting it. Swapping ten lbs of fat for ten lbs of muscle is definitely possible. If you are dedicated, you can probably get there in 16 weeks (unless you have been lifting for >3 years, in which case this could take years, but seeing as how you are 22%BF, I'd say you can do it). If you falter a few days in between, you might be looking at closer to 20 or even 24 depending on how bad the slip up is.
Incidentally, I'm doing the same thing you are. I started back at the end of Thanksgiving at 236lbs and around 30%BF. I'm now around 221lbs and around 20%BF. I'm trying to get back down to around 200-205lbs and 8-9%BF. I know it's possible because I was there just 2 years ago
Did you mean eat at TDEE every day instead of BMR? If you train hard and eat at BMR every day for 16 weeks you are going to regret it, if you do happen to survive.
No, because if you eat at TDEE everyday, you will not lose weight. Also eating at BMR will only work until you in the beginning. I have found I plateau at around 12%, and to go lower I need to use carb cycling0 -
jamarbelly wrote: »If you have a significant amount of body fat, you CAN reduce it while building muscle. I know, because I am in a similar situation and having fantastic results.
I am 4 weeks into a 12 week program that was built for me by Sam Shorkey at jackedonthebeanstalk. I work very hard doing fasted cardio in the morning and lifting weights in the afternoon/evening. I am eating way more than I usually do, and in fact have some days struggled to get all the food into my system. Check her site out, and if you're vegan (or willing to give it a go) send her an email (she only trains/coaches vegans). I have been a vegan for 3 years, which is a drastic change from the guy who would order 4 cheese burgers, fries, nuggets and a shake. I got sick, and I got educated!
I have had my measurements professionally taken at the start of my program, and again at the end of week 4, and so far on the scale I have only lost 3.4 pounds in 4 weeks, BUT, that breaks down to putting on 3.8 pounds of lean body mass and dropping 7.2 pounds of body fat. Overall I've reduced my body fat from 28.5% to 25.6%, and I can't wait to see where I am at week 8.
I think these boards are great for general questions and info, but many of the questions include a huge variable, YOU. I would start by finding a good trainer/coach who will give you the individual attention you need to build a successful plan.
Good luck!
so in four weeks you lost four pounds and gained four pounds of muscle????
wait, how did you lose 3.4 pounds and drop 7.2 pounds of body fat??
or am I missing something here....
You are missing the part where I said "Thanksgiving", I am currently on week 11 of my plan0 -
finneyjason218 wrote: »finneyjason218 wrote: »Don't listen to the whole, you can't build muscle while losing fat logic. It's hard - very hard - but not impossible. You're young and male (like me) so we have it easier. It takes a lot of discipline, because you pretty much have to eat right at your BMR everyday and get enough fats (for hormone stability) and protein (for muscle building). You are going to be at a deficit, so you need to eat .8-1.2 grams of protein per pound of lean body mass, which is a lot of reheated chicken breast. You'r going to have to lift - a lot, and continuously be adding volume. If you can't get all the weight for the same number of reps you did last week on that exercise - do an extra set, and another one, until you have moved more weight than you did last week. Every time. This is going to make your workouts longer as you progress, because your body is trying to get weaker (you aren't feeding it enough), but you aren't letting it. Swapping ten lbs of fat for ten lbs of muscle is definitely possible. If you are dedicated, you can probably get there in 16 weeks (unless you have been lifting for >3 years, in which case this could take years, but seeing as how you are 22%BF, I'd say you can do it). If you falter a few days in between, you might be looking at closer to 20 or even 24 depending on how bad the slip up is.
Incidentally, I'm doing the same thing you are. I started back at the end of Thanksgiving at 236lbs and around 30%BF. I'm now around 221lbs and around 20%BF. I'm trying to get back down to around 200-205lbs and 8-9%BF. I know it's possible because I was there just 2 years ago
@finneyjason218 How are you measuring your body fat percentage?finneyjason218 wrote: »Don't listen to the whole, you can't build muscle while losing fat logic. It's hard - very hard - but not impossible. You're young and male (like me) so we have it easier. It takes a lot of discipline, because you pretty much have to eat right at your BMR everyday and get enough fats (for hormone stability) and protein (for muscle building). You are going to be at a deficit, so you need to eat .8-1.2 grams of protein per pound of lean body mass, which is a lot of reheated chicken breast. You'r going to have to lift - a lot, and continuously be adding volume. If you can't get all the weight for the same number of reps you did last week on that exercise - do an extra set, and another one, until you have moved more weight than you did last week. Every time. This is going to make your workouts longer as you progress, because your body is trying to get weaker (you aren't feeding it enough), but you aren't letting it. Swapping ten lbs of fat for ten lbs of muscle is definitely possible. If you are dedicated, you can probably get there in 16 weeks (unless you have been lifting for >3 years, in which case this could take years, but seeing as how you are 22%BF, I'd say you can do it). If you falter a few days in between, you might be looking at closer to 20 or even 24 depending on how bad the slip up is.
Incidentally, I'm doing the same thing you are. I started back at the end of Thanksgiving at 236lbs and around 30%BF. I'm now around 221lbs and around 20%BF. I'm trying to get back down to around 200-205lbs and 8-9%BF. I know it's possible because I was there just 2 years ago
@finneyjason218 How are you measuring your body fat percentage?
Calipers. I know they aren't 100% accurate, hence the word "about". All I can say precisely is that I am pinching way less fat than I was 10 weeks ago
Who is using the calipers? You or someone with a few years of experience? Is this calculated with the Parrillo method or one of the Jackson/Pollock methods (3, 4, or 7)?0 -
jofjltncb6 wrote: »finneyjason218 wrote: »3dogsrunning wrote: »finneyjason218 wrote: »Don't listen to the whole, you can't build muscle while losing fat logic. It's hard - very hard - but not impossible. You're young and male (like me) so we have it easier. It takes a lot of discipline, because you pretty much have to eat right at your BMR everyday and get enough fats (for hormone stability) and protein (for muscle building). You are going to be at a deficit, so you need to eat .8-1.2 grams of protein per pound of lean body mass, which is a lot of reheated chicken breast. You'r going to have to lift - a lot, and continuously be adding volume. If you can't get all the weight for the same number of reps you did last week on that exercise - do an extra set, and another one, until you have moved more weight than you did last week. Every time. This is going to make your workouts longer as you progress, because your body is trying to get weaker (you aren't feeding it enough), but you aren't letting it. Swapping ten lbs of fat for ten lbs of muscle is definitely possible. If you are dedicated, you can probably get there in 16 weeks (unless you have been lifting for >3 years, in which case this could take years, but seeing as how you are 22%BF, I'd say you can do it). If you falter a few days in between, you might be looking at closer to 20 or even 24 depending on how bad the slip up is.
Incidentally, I'm doing the same thing you are. I started back at the end of Thanksgiving at 236lbs and around 30%BF. I'm now around 221lbs and around 20%BF. I'm trying to get back down to around 200-205lbs and 8-9%BF. I know it's possible because I was there just 2 years ago
16 weeks? To add 10lbs of muscle? While eating a severe deficit?
Sure thing.
"Severe" is eating at BMR now? Wow
TDEE less 36ish% seems severe to me.
What percent do you need to consider it severe?
Not only does it seem severe, but ain't nobody putting on 10 pounds of muscle on a cut that deep. Not unless they're running a pretty strong AAS stack at the same time.0 -
stevencloser wrote: »Death is hyperbole, but I am calculating about 1k daily deficit. With heavy lifting 3 days per week and progressively added volume every workout as prescribed, I would predict serious injury well before week 16.
injury comes from accidents and bad form, not caloric deficit. He may not be able to adequately recover, and his training will suffer, but I don't see how that relates to injury. I eat at a large deficit and lift heavy 3x a week, and I am old too. Been just fine for a long time, and I have lost fat and maintained muscle.
Injury also comes from inadequate recovery during intense training.
http://clevelandphysio.com.au/phy/common-injuries/overtraining-injuries
https://www.acsm.org/docs/current-comments/overtrainwithresistance.pdf?sfvrsn=4
http://philmaffetone.com/the-overtraining-syndrome/
Glad to hear you are staying injury-free. But have you been losing 2 lbs per week every week for the last several months while adding more volume to each workout? I would like to know how it is possible to recover from that. If you know how to read MRIs, you will notice my profile pic shows an inoperable torn pectoral and a torn rotator cuff. Those were injuries obtained last year during pushing too much volume during aggressive caloric deficit. They did not come from lifting heavy weight or bad form, they both came from overuse with inadequate recovery. Just two of many injuries I have experienced over the years from overtraining while cutting.
Ouch. Are they gonna recover? The word inoperable always sounds really scary.
I have had chronic RC tears, so my physio talked me into retiring from all OHP. My pec is expected to regain most of its strength, but he joked that my career as a chest model is over. Lulz, people get paid for that?
Sorry for derailing your thread OP, my point was to be careful with your lifting when you are running big deficits like that.0 -
finneyjason218 wrote: »jamarbelly wrote: »If you have a significant amount of body fat, you CAN reduce it while building muscle. I know, because I am in a similar situation and having fantastic results.
I am 4 weeks into a 12 week program that was built for me by Sam Shorkey at jackedonthebeanstalk. I work very hard doing fasted cardio in the morning and lifting weights in the afternoon/evening. I am eating way more than I usually do, and in fact have some days struggled to get all the food into my system. Check her site out, and if you're vegan (or willing to give it a go) send her an email (she only trains/coaches vegans). I have been a vegan for 3 years, which is a drastic change from the guy who would order 4 cheese burgers, fries, nuggets and a shake. I got sick, and I got educated!
I have had my measurements professionally taken at the start of my program, and again at the end of week 4, and so far on the scale I have only lost 3.4 pounds in 4 weeks, BUT, that breaks down to putting on 3.8 pounds of lean body mass and dropping 7.2 pounds of body fat. Overall I've reduced my body fat from 28.5% to 25.6%, and I can't wait to see where I am at week 8.
I think these boards are great for general questions and info, but many of the questions include a huge variable, YOU. I would start by finding a good trainer/coach who will give you the individual attention you need to build a successful plan.
Good luck!
so in four weeks you lost four pounds and gained four pounds of muscle????
wait, how did you lose 3.4 pounds and drop 7.2 pounds of body fat??
or am I missing something here....
You are missing the part where I said "Thanksgiving", I am currently on week 11 of my plan
funny because you said this "I am 4 weeks into a 12 week program that was built for me by Sam Shorkey at jackedonthebeanstalk"
I don't see thanksgiving anywhere in your post….0 -
finneyjason218 wrote: »finneyjason218 wrote: »Don't listen to the whole, you can't build muscle while losing fat logic. It's hard - very hard - but not impossible. You're young and male (like me) so we have it easier. It takes a lot of discipline, because you pretty much have to eat right at your BMR everyday and get enough fats (for hormone stability) and protein (for muscle building). You are going to be at a deficit, so you need to eat .8-1.2 grams of protein per pound of lean body mass, which is a lot of reheated chicken breast. You'r going to have to lift - a lot, and continuously be adding volume. If you can't get all the weight for the same number of reps you did last week on that exercise - do an extra set, and another one, until you have moved more weight than you did last week. Every time. This is going to make your workouts longer as you progress, because your body is trying to get weaker (you aren't feeding it enough), but you aren't letting it. Swapping ten lbs of fat for ten lbs of muscle is definitely possible. If you are dedicated, you can probably get there in 16 weeks (unless you have been lifting for >3 years, in which case this could take years, but seeing as how you are 22%BF, I'd say you can do it). If you falter a few days in between, you might be looking at closer to 20 or even 24 depending on how bad the slip up is.
Incidentally, I'm doing the same thing you are. I started back at the end of Thanksgiving at 236lbs and around 30%BF. I'm now around 221lbs and around 20%BF. I'm trying to get back down to around 200-205lbs and 8-9%BF. I know it's possible because I was there just 2 years ago
@finneyjason218 How are you measuring your body fat percentage?finneyjason218 wrote: »Don't listen to the whole, you can't build muscle while losing fat logic. It's hard - very hard - but not impossible. You're young and male (like me) so we have it easier. It takes a lot of discipline, because you pretty much have to eat right at your BMR everyday and get enough fats (for hormone stability) and protein (for muscle building). You are going to be at a deficit, so you need to eat .8-1.2 grams of protein per pound of lean body mass, which is a lot of reheated chicken breast. You'r going to have to lift - a lot, and continuously be adding volume. If you can't get all the weight for the same number of reps you did last week on that exercise - do an extra set, and another one, until you have moved more weight than you did last week. Every time. This is going to make your workouts longer as you progress, because your body is trying to get weaker (you aren't feeding it enough), but you aren't letting it. Swapping ten lbs of fat for ten lbs of muscle is definitely possible. If you are dedicated, you can probably get there in 16 weeks (unless you have been lifting for >3 years, in which case this could take years, but seeing as how you are 22%BF, I'd say you can do it). If you falter a few days in between, you might be looking at closer to 20 or even 24 depending on how bad the slip up is.
Incidentally, I'm doing the same thing you are. I started back at the end of Thanksgiving at 236lbs and around 30%BF. I'm now around 221lbs and around 20%BF. I'm trying to get back down to around 200-205lbs and 8-9%BF. I know it's possible because I was there just 2 years ago
@finneyjason218 How are you measuring your body fat percentage?
Calipers. I know they aren't 100% accurate, hence the word "about". All I can say precisely is that I am pinching way less fat than I was 10 weeks ago
Who is using the calipers? You or someone with a few years of experience? Is this calculated with the Parrillo method or one of the Jackson/Pollock methods (3, 4, or 7)?finneyjason218 wrote: »finneyjason218 wrote: »Don't listen to the whole, you can't build muscle while losing fat logic. It's hard - very hard - but not impossible. You're young and male (like me) so we have it easier. It takes a lot of discipline, because you pretty much have to eat right at your BMR everyday and get enough fats (for hormone stability) and protein (for muscle building). You are going to be at a deficit, so you need to eat .8-1.2 grams of protein per pound of lean body mass, which is a lot of reheated chicken breast. You'r going to have to lift - a lot, and continuously be adding volume. If you can't get all the weight for the same number of reps you did last week on that exercise - do an extra set, and another one, until you have moved more weight than you did last week. Every time. This is going to make your workouts longer as you progress, because your body is trying to get weaker (you aren't feeding it enough), but you aren't letting it. Swapping ten lbs of fat for ten lbs of muscle is definitely possible. If you are dedicated, you can probably get there in 16 weeks (unless you have been lifting for >3 years, in which case this could take years, but seeing as how you are 22%BF, I'd say you can do it). If you falter a few days in between, you might be looking at closer to 20 or even 24 depending on how bad the slip up is.
Incidentally, I'm doing the same thing you are. I started back at the end of Thanksgiving at 236lbs and around 30%BF. I'm now around 221lbs and around 20%BF. I'm trying to get back down to around 200-205lbs and 8-9%BF. I know it's possible because I was there just 2 years ago
@finneyjason218 How are you measuring your body fat percentage?finneyjason218 wrote: »Don't listen to the whole, you can't build muscle while losing fat logic. It's hard - very hard - but not impossible. You're young and male (like me) so we have it easier. It takes a lot of discipline, because you pretty much have to eat right at your BMR everyday and get enough fats (for hormone stability) and protein (for muscle building). You are going to be at a deficit, so you need to eat .8-1.2 grams of protein per pound of lean body mass, which is a lot of reheated chicken breast. You'r going to have to lift - a lot, and continuously be adding volume. If you can't get all the weight for the same number of reps you did last week on that exercise - do an extra set, and another one, until you have moved more weight than you did last week. Every time. This is going to make your workouts longer as you progress, because your body is trying to get weaker (you aren't feeding it enough), but you aren't letting it. Swapping ten lbs of fat for ten lbs of muscle is definitely possible. If you are dedicated, you can probably get there in 16 weeks (unless you have been lifting for >3 years, in which case this could take years, but seeing as how you are 22%BF, I'd say you can do it). If you falter a few days in between, you might be looking at closer to 20 or even 24 depending on how bad the slip up is.
Incidentally, I'm doing the same thing you are. I started back at the end of Thanksgiving at 236lbs and around 30%BF. I'm now around 221lbs and around 20%BF. I'm trying to get back down to around 200-205lbs and 8-9%BF. I know it's possible because I was there just 2 years ago
@finneyjason218 How are you measuring your body fat percentage?
Calipers. I know they aren't 100% accurate, hence the word "about". All I can say precisely is that I am pinching way less fat than I was 10 weeks ago
Who is using the calipers? You or someone with a few years of experience? Is this calculated with the Parrillo method or one of the Jackson/Pollock methods (3, 4, or 7)?
Any good tips on how to use them correctly?0 -
finneyjason218 wrote: »finneyjason218 wrote: »Don't listen to the whole, you can't build muscle while losing fat logic. It's hard - very hard - but not impossible. You're young and male (like me) so we have it easier. It takes a lot of discipline, because you pretty much have to eat right at your BMR everyday and get enough fats (for hormone stability) and protein (for muscle building). You are going to be at a deficit, so you need to eat .8-1.2 grams of protein per pound of lean body mass, which is a lot of reheated chicken breast. You'r going to have to lift - a lot, and continuously be adding volume. If you can't get all the weight for the same number of reps you did last week on that exercise - do an extra set, and another one, until you have moved more weight than you did last week. Every time. This is going to make your workouts longer as you progress, because your body is trying to get weaker (you aren't feeding it enough), but you aren't letting it. Swapping ten lbs of fat for ten lbs of muscle is definitely possible. If you are dedicated, you can probably get there in 16 weeks (unless you have been lifting for >3 years, in which case this could take years, but seeing as how you are 22%BF, I'd say you can do it). If you falter a few days in between, you might be looking at closer to 20 or even 24 depending on how bad the slip up is.
Incidentally, I'm doing the same thing you are. I started back at the end of Thanksgiving at 236lbs and around 30%BF. I'm now around 221lbs and around 20%BF. I'm trying to get back down to around 200-205lbs and 8-9%BF. I know it's possible because I was there just 2 years ago
@finneyjason218 How are you measuring your body fat percentage?finneyjason218 wrote: »Don't listen to the whole, you can't build muscle while losing fat logic. It's hard - very hard - but not impossible. You're young and male (like me) so we have it easier. It takes a lot of discipline, because you pretty much have to eat right at your BMR everyday and get enough fats (for hormone stability) and protein (for muscle building). You are going to be at a deficit, so you need to eat .8-1.2 grams of protein per pound of lean body mass, which is a lot of reheated chicken breast. You'r going to have to lift - a lot, and continuously be adding volume. If you can't get all the weight for the same number of reps you did last week on that exercise - do an extra set, and another one, until you have moved more weight than you did last week. Every time. This is going to make your workouts longer as you progress, because your body is trying to get weaker (you aren't feeding it enough), but you aren't letting it. Swapping ten lbs of fat for ten lbs of muscle is definitely possible. If you are dedicated, you can probably get there in 16 weeks (unless you have been lifting for >3 years, in which case this could take years, but seeing as how you are 22%BF, I'd say you can do it). If you falter a few days in between, you might be looking at closer to 20 or even 24 depending on how bad the slip up is.
Incidentally, I'm doing the same thing you are. I started back at the end of Thanksgiving at 236lbs and around 30%BF. I'm now around 221lbs and around 20%BF. I'm trying to get back down to around 200-205lbs and 8-9%BF. I know it's possible because I was there just 2 years ago
@finneyjason218 How are you measuring your body fat percentage?
Calipers. I know they aren't 100% accurate, hence the word "about". All I can say precisely is that I am pinching way less fat than I was 10 weeks ago
Who is using the calipers? You or someone with a few years of experience? Is this calculated with the Parrillo method or one of the Jackson/Pollock methods (3, 4, or 7)?finneyjason218 wrote: »finneyjason218 wrote: »Don't listen to the whole, you can't build muscle while losing fat logic. It's hard - very hard - but not impossible. You're young and male (like me) so we have it easier. It takes a lot of discipline, because you pretty much have to eat right at your BMR everyday and get enough fats (for hormone stability) and protein (for muscle building). You are going to be at a deficit, so you need to eat .8-1.2 grams of protein per pound of lean body mass, which is a lot of reheated chicken breast. You'r going to have to lift - a lot, and continuously be adding volume. If you can't get all the weight for the same number of reps you did last week on that exercise - do an extra set, and another one, until you have moved more weight than you did last week. Every time. This is going to make your workouts longer as you progress, because your body is trying to get weaker (you aren't feeding it enough), but you aren't letting it. Swapping ten lbs of fat for ten lbs of muscle is definitely possible. If you are dedicated, you can probably get there in 16 weeks (unless you have been lifting for >3 years, in which case this could take years, but seeing as how you are 22%BF, I'd say you can do it). If you falter a few days in between, you might be looking at closer to 20 or even 24 depending on how bad the slip up is.
Incidentally, I'm doing the same thing you are. I started back at the end of Thanksgiving at 236lbs and around 30%BF. I'm now around 221lbs and around 20%BF. I'm trying to get back down to around 200-205lbs and 8-9%BF. I know it's possible because I was there just 2 years ago
@finneyjason218 How are you measuring your body fat percentage?finneyjason218 wrote: »Don't listen to the whole, you can't build muscle while losing fat logic. It's hard - very hard - but not impossible. You're young and male (like me) so we have it easier. It takes a lot of discipline, because you pretty much have to eat right at your BMR everyday and get enough fats (for hormone stability) and protein (for muscle building). You are going to be at a deficit, so you need to eat .8-1.2 grams of protein per pound of lean body mass, which is a lot of reheated chicken breast. You'r going to have to lift - a lot, and continuously be adding volume. If you can't get all the weight for the same number of reps you did last week on that exercise - do an extra set, and another one, until you have moved more weight than you did last week. Every time. This is going to make your workouts longer as you progress, because your body is trying to get weaker (you aren't feeding it enough), but you aren't letting it. Swapping ten lbs of fat for ten lbs of muscle is definitely possible. If you are dedicated, you can probably get there in 16 weeks (unless you have been lifting for >3 years, in which case this could take years, but seeing as how you are 22%BF, I'd say you can do it). If you falter a few days in between, you might be looking at closer to 20 or even 24 depending on how bad the slip up is.
Incidentally, I'm doing the same thing you are. I started back at the end of Thanksgiving at 236lbs and around 30%BF. I'm now around 221lbs and around 20%BF. I'm trying to get back down to around 200-205lbs and 8-9%BF. I know it's possible because I was there just 2 years ago
@finneyjason218 How are you measuring your body fat percentage?
Calipers. I know they aren't 100% accurate, hence the word "about". All I can say precisely is that I am pinching way less fat than I was 10 weeks ago
Who is using the calipers? You or someone with a few years of experience? Is this calculated with the Parrillo method or one of the Jackson/Pollock methods (3, 4, or 7)?
Any good tips on how to use them correctly?
A trainer with several years of experience. It's nearly impossible to get an accurate reading doing it on yourself due to not being able to take measurements on your back (which is very important for accuracy).0 -
finneyjason218 wrote: »finneyjason218 wrote: »Don't listen to the whole, you can't build muscle while losing fat logic. It's hard - very hard - but not impossible. You're young and male (like me) so we have it easier. It takes a lot of discipline, because you pretty much have to eat right at your BMR everyday and get enough fats (for hormone stability) and protein (for muscle building). You are going to be at a deficit, so you need to eat .8-1.2 grams of protein per pound of lean body mass, which is a lot of reheated chicken breast. You'r going to have to lift - a lot, and continuously be adding volume. If you can't get all the weight for the same number of reps you did last week on that exercise - do an extra set, and another one, until you have moved more weight than you did last week. Every time. This is going to make your workouts longer as you progress, because your body is trying to get weaker (you aren't feeding it enough), but you aren't letting it. Swapping ten lbs of fat for ten lbs of muscle is definitely possible. If you are dedicated, you can probably get there in 16 weeks (unless you have been lifting for >3 years, in which case this could take years, but seeing as how you are 22%BF, I'd say you can do it). If you falter a few days in between, you might be looking at closer to 20 or even 24 depending on how bad the slip up is.
Incidentally, I'm doing the same thing you are. I started back at the end of Thanksgiving at 236lbs and around 30%BF. I'm now around 221lbs and around 20%BF. I'm trying to get back down to around 200-205lbs and 8-9%BF. I know it's possible because I was there just 2 years ago
@finneyjason218 How are you measuring your body fat percentage?finneyjason218 wrote: »Don't listen to the whole, you can't build muscle while losing fat logic. It's hard - very hard - but not impossible. You're young and male (like me) so we have it easier. It takes a lot of discipline, because you pretty much have to eat right at your BMR everyday and get enough fats (for hormone stability) and protein (for muscle building). You are going to be at a deficit, so you need to eat .8-1.2 grams of protein per pound of lean body mass, which is a lot of reheated chicken breast. You'r going to have to lift - a lot, and continuously be adding volume. If you can't get all the weight for the same number of reps you did last week on that exercise - do an extra set, and another one, until you have moved more weight than you did last week. Every time. This is going to make your workouts longer as you progress, because your body is trying to get weaker (you aren't feeding it enough), but you aren't letting it. Swapping ten lbs of fat for ten lbs of muscle is definitely possible. If you are dedicated, you can probably get there in 16 weeks (unless you have been lifting for >3 years, in which case this could take years, but seeing as how you are 22%BF, I'd say you can do it). If you falter a few days in between, you might be looking at closer to 20 or even 24 depending on how bad the slip up is.
Incidentally, I'm doing the same thing you are. I started back at the end of Thanksgiving at 236lbs and around 30%BF. I'm now around 221lbs and around 20%BF. I'm trying to get back down to around 200-205lbs and 8-9%BF. I know it's possible because I was there just 2 years ago
@finneyjason218 How are you measuring your body fat percentage?
Calipers. I know they aren't 100% accurate, hence the word "about". All I can say precisely is that I am pinching way less fat than I was 10 weeks ago
Who is using the calipers? You or someone with a few years of experience? Is this calculated with the Parrillo method or one of the Jackson/Pollock methods (3, 4, or 7)?finneyjason218 wrote: »finneyjason218 wrote: »Don't listen to the whole, you can't build muscle while losing fat logic. It's hard - very hard - but not impossible. You're young and male (like me) so we have it easier. It takes a lot of discipline, because you pretty much have to eat right at your BMR everyday and get enough fats (for hormone stability) and protein (for muscle building). You are going to be at a deficit, so you need to eat .8-1.2 grams of protein per pound of lean body mass, which is a lot of reheated chicken breast. You'r going to have to lift - a lot, and continuously be adding volume. If you can't get all the weight for the same number of reps you did last week on that exercise - do an extra set, and another one, until you have moved more weight than you did last week. Every time. This is going to make your workouts longer as you progress, because your body is trying to get weaker (you aren't feeding it enough), but you aren't letting it. Swapping ten lbs of fat for ten lbs of muscle is definitely possible. If you are dedicated, you can probably get there in 16 weeks (unless you have been lifting for >3 years, in which case this could take years, but seeing as how you are 22%BF, I'd say you can do it). If you falter a few days in between, you might be looking at closer to 20 or even 24 depending on how bad the slip up is.
Incidentally, I'm doing the same thing you are. I started back at the end of Thanksgiving at 236lbs and around 30%BF. I'm now around 221lbs and around 20%BF. I'm trying to get back down to around 200-205lbs and 8-9%BF. I know it's possible because I was there just 2 years ago
@finneyjason218 How are you measuring your body fat percentage?finneyjason218 wrote: »Don't listen to the whole, you can't build muscle while losing fat logic. It's hard - very hard - but not impossible. You're young and male (like me) so we have it easier. It takes a lot of discipline, because you pretty much have to eat right at your BMR everyday and get enough fats (for hormone stability) and protein (for muscle building). You are going to be at a deficit, so you need to eat .8-1.2 grams of protein per pound of lean body mass, which is a lot of reheated chicken breast. You'r going to have to lift - a lot, and continuously be adding volume. If you can't get all the weight for the same number of reps you did last week on that exercise - do an extra set, and another one, until you have moved more weight than you did last week. Every time. This is going to make your workouts longer as you progress, because your body is trying to get weaker (you aren't feeding it enough), but you aren't letting it. Swapping ten lbs of fat for ten lbs of muscle is definitely possible. If you are dedicated, you can probably get there in 16 weeks (unless you have been lifting for >3 years, in which case this could take years, but seeing as how you are 22%BF, I'd say you can do it). If you falter a few days in between, you might be looking at closer to 20 or even 24 depending on how bad the slip up is.
Incidentally, I'm doing the same thing you are. I started back at the end of Thanksgiving at 236lbs and around 30%BF. I'm now around 221lbs and around 20%BF. I'm trying to get back down to around 200-205lbs and 8-9%BF. I know it's possible because I was there just 2 years ago
@finneyjason218 How are you measuring your body fat percentage?
Calipers. I know they aren't 100% accurate, hence the word "about". All I can say precisely is that I am pinching way less fat than I was 10 weeks ago
Who is using the calipers? You or someone with a few years of experience? Is this calculated with the Parrillo method or one of the Jackson/Pollock methods (3, 4, or 7)?
Any good tips on how to use them correctly?
A trainer with several years of experience. It's nearly impossible to get an accurate reading doing it on yourself due to not being able to take measurements on your back (which is very important for accuracy).
Yea I bought one and realized I didn't know how to use it correctly lol0 -
Ok, so I got confused and may have responded to some stuff that wasn't directed at me.
Bottom line is this, losing 10lbs of fat and gaining 10lbs of muscle is possible it is just very hard.
Just to show you guys I'm not full of *kitten* here's the pictures. First one is right after Thanksgiving at ABOUT 235lbs and ABOUT 30%BF. Second one is yesterday at ABOUT 220lbs and ABOUT 20%. Third one is me summer 2014, before I started traveling for work and my diet fell to crap. The actual BF numbers aren't particularly important to me, just that I am pinching less fat and I see progress in the mirror.
OP, I was just trying to help. If you want any tips on how to do this, feel free to PM me. If you think I'm just some obnoxious blowhard on the internet, I wouldn't blame you for that either.
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jesus those came in huge sorry about that0
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finneyjason218 wrote: »finneyjason218 wrote: »Don't listen to the whole, you can't build muscle while losing fat logic. It's hard - very hard - but not impossible. You're young and male (like me) so we have it easier. It takes a lot of discipline, because you pretty much have to eat right at your BMR everyday and get enough fats (for hormone stability) and protein (for muscle building). You are going to be at a deficit, so you need to eat .8-1.2 grams of protein per pound of lean body mass, which is a lot of reheated chicken breast. You'r going to have to lift - a lot, and continuously be adding volume. If you can't get all the weight for the same number of reps you did last week on that exercise - do an extra set, and another one, until you have moved more weight than you did last week. Every time. This is going to make your workouts longer as you progress, because your body is trying to get weaker (you aren't feeding it enough), but you aren't letting it. Swapping ten lbs of fat for ten lbs of muscle is definitely possible. If you are dedicated, you can probably get there in 16 weeks (unless you have been lifting for >3 years, in which case this could take years, but seeing as how you are 22%BF, I'd say you can do it). If you falter a few days in between, you might be looking at closer to 20 or even 24 depending on how bad the slip up is.
Incidentally, I'm doing the same thing you are. I started back at the end of Thanksgiving at 236lbs and around 30%BF. I'm now around 221lbs and around 20%BF. I'm trying to get back down to around 200-205lbs and 8-9%BF. I know it's possible because I was there just 2 years ago
@finneyjason218 How are you measuring your body fat percentage?finneyjason218 wrote: »Don't listen to the whole, you can't build muscle while losing fat logic. It's hard - very hard - but not impossible. You're young and male (like me) so we have it easier. It takes a lot of discipline, because you pretty much have to eat right at your BMR everyday and get enough fats (for hormone stability) and protein (for muscle building). You are going to be at a deficit, so you need to eat .8-1.2 grams of protein per pound of lean body mass, which is a lot of reheated chicken breast. You'r going to have to lift - a lot, and continuously be adding volume. If you can't get all the weight for the same number of reps you did last week on that exercise - do an extra set, and another one, until you have moved more weight than you did last week. Every time. This is going to make your workouts longer as you progress, because your body is trying to get weaker (you aren't feeding it enough), but you aren't letting it. Swapping ten lbs of fat for ten lbs of muscle is definitely possible. If you are dedicated, you can probably get there in 16 weeks (unless you have been lifting for >3 years, in which case this could take years, but seeing as how you are 22%BF, I'd say you can do it). If you falter a few days in between, you might be looking at closer to 20 or even 24 depending on how bad the slip up is.
Incidentally, I'm doing the same thing you are. I started back at the end of Thanksgiving at 236lbs and around 30%BF. I'm now around 221lbs and around 20%BF. I'm trying to get back down to around 200-205lbs and 8-9%BF. I know it's possible because I was there just 2 years ago
@finneyjason218 How are you measuring your body fat percentage?
Calipers. I know they aren't 100% accurate, hence the word "about". All I can say precisely is that I am pinching way less fat than I was 10 weeks ago
Who is using the calipers? You or someone with a few years of experience? Is this calculated with the Parrillo method or one of the Jackson/Pollock methods (3, 4, or 7)?finneyjason218 wrote: »finneyjason218 wrote: »Don't listen to the whole, you can't build muscle while losing fat logic. It's hard - very hard - but not impossible. You're young and male (like me) so we have it easier. It takes a lot of discipline, because you pretty much have to eat right at your BMR everyday and get enough fats (for hormone stability) and protein (for muscle building). You are going to be at a deficit, so you need to eat .8-1.2 grams of protein per pound of lean body mass, which is a lot of reheated chicken breast. You'r going to have to lift - a lot, and continuously be adding volume. If you can't get all the weight for the same number of reps you did last week on that exercise - do an extra set, and another one, until you have moved more weight than you did last week. Every time. This is going to make your workouts longer as you progress, because your body is trying to get weaker (you aren't feeding it enough), but you aren't letting it. Swapping ten lbs of fat for ten lbs of muscle is definitely possible. If you are dedicated, you can probably get there in 16 weeks (unless you have been lifting for >3 years, in which case this could take years, but seeing as how you are 22%BF, I'd say you can do it). If you falter a few days in between, you might be looking at closer to 20 or even 24 depending on how bad the slip up is.
Incidentally, I'm doing the same thing you are. I started back at the end of Thanksgiving at 236lbs and around 30%BF. I'm now around 221lbs and around 20%BF. I'm trying to get back down to around 200-205lbs and 8-9%BF. I know it's possible because I was there just 2 years ago
@finneyjason218 How are you measuring your body fat percentage?finneyjason218 wrote: »Don't listen to the whole, you can't build muscle while losing fat logic. It's hard - very hard - but not impossible. You're young and male (like me) so we have it easier. It takes a lot of discipline, because you pretty much have to eat right at your BMR everyday and get enough fats (for hormone stability) and protein (for muscle building). You are going to be at a deficit, so you need to eat .8-1.2 grams of protein per pound of lean body mass, which is a lot of reheated chicken breast. You'r going to have to lift - a lot, and continuously be adding volume. If you can't get all the weight for the same number of reps you did last week on that exercise - do an extra set, and another one, until you have moved more weight than you did last week. Every time. This is going to make your workouts longer as you progress, because your body is trying to get weaker (you aren't feeding it enough), but you aren't letting it. Swapping ten lbs of fat for ten lbs of muscle is definitely possible. If you are dedicated, you can probably get there in 16 weeks (unless you have been lifting for >3 years, in which case this could take years, but seeing as how you are 22%BF, I'd say you can do it). If you falter a few days in between, you might be looking at closer to 20 or even 24 depending on how bad the slip up is.
Incidentally, I'm doing the same thing you are. I started back at the end of Thanksgiving at 236lbs and around 30%BF. I'm now around 221lbs and around 20%BF. I'm trying to get back down to around 200-205lbs and 8-9%BF. I know it's possible because I was there just 2 years ago
@finneyjason218 How are you measuring your body fat percentage?
Calipers. I know they aren't 100% accurate, hence the word "about". All I can say precisely is that I am pinching way less fat than I was 10 weeks ago
Who is using the calipers? You or someone with a few years of experience? Is this calculated with the Parrillo method or one of the Jackson/Pollock methods (3, 4, or 7)?
Any good tips on how to use them correctly?
A trainer with several years of experience. It's nearly impossible to get an accurate reading doing it on yourself due to not being able to take measurements on your back (which is very important for accuracy).
Yea I bought one and realized I didn't know how to use it correctly lol
http://www.linear-software.com/online.html
Here is a good site that I use. I generally aim for either the Jackson/Pollock 7 Caliper Method or Parrillo Caliper Method. More areas = better accuracy chance. Additionally, when I measure bf for someone, I required myself to get 3 consistent readings as a means to more accuracy.
But you generally want a knowledgeable person if you want an accurate reading.. well as accurate as possible.
If you really wanted to know, and didn't mind selling out a little cash, then you can see if any university in your area has a hydrostatic (water immersion) or DEXA scan.0 -
finneyjason218 wrote: »Ok, so I got confused and may have responded to some stuff that wasn't directed at me.
Bottom line is this, losing 10lbs of fat and gaining 10lbs of muscle is possible it is just very hard.
Just to show you guys I'm not full of *kitten* here's the pictures. First one is right after Thanksgiving at ABOUT 235lbs and ABOUT 30%BF. Second one is yesterday at ABOUT 220lbs and ABOUT 20%. Third one is me summer 2014, before I started traveling for work and my diet fell to crap. The actual BF numbers aren't particularly important to me, just that I am pinching less fat and I see progress in the mirror.
Ahhh you have something he doesn't, muscle memory. You are going to gain faster than most people, even on a deficit, because you've been there before. That's actually a very important piece of information. The OP can take advantage of newbie gains and the fact that he has higher than athletic body fat.0 -
finneyjason218 wrote: »Ok, so I got confused and may have responded to some stuff that wasn't directed at me.
Bottom line is this, losing 10lbs of fat and gaining 10lbs of muscle is possible it is just very hard.
Just to show you guys I'm not full of *kitten* here's the pictures. First one is right after Thanksgiving at ABOUT 235lbs and ABOUT 30%BF. Second one is yesterday at ABOUT 220lbs and ABOUT 20%. Third one is me summer 2014, before I started traveling for work and my diet fell to crap. The actual BF numbers aren't particularly important to me, just that I am pinching less fat and I see progress in the mirror.
OP, I was just trying to help. If you want any tips on how to do this, feel free to PM me. If you think I'm just some obnoxious blowhard on the internet, I wouldn't blame you for that either.
One semantic note... your calculations indicate lean body mass (muscle, tissue, water, etc) not dry muscle gains. You would need at least a dexa scan to determine how much is actually muscle. But knowing the limitations of muscle growth with people in a surplus, i would put too much into the calculations...
Either way, still good results.
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finneyjason218 wrote: »Ok, so I got confused and may have responded to some stuff that wasn't directed at me.
Bottom line is this, losing 10lbs of fat and gaining 10lbs of muscle is possible it is just very hard.
Just to show you guys I'm not full of *kitten* here's the pictures. First one is right after Thanksgiving at ABOUT 235lbs and ABOUT 30%BF. Second one is yesterday at ABOUT 220lbs and ABOUT 20%. Third one is me summer 2014, before I started traveling for work and my diet fell to crap. The actual BF numbers aren't particularly important to me, just that I am pinching less fat and I see progress in the mirror.
OP, I was just trying to help. If you want any tips on how to do this, feel free to PM me. If you think I'm just some obnoxious blowhard on the internet, I wouldn't blame you for that either.finneyjason218 wrote: »Ok, so I got confused and may have responded to some stuff that wasn't directed at me.
Bottom line is this, losing 10lbs of fat and gaining 10lbs of muscle is possible it is just very hard.
Just to show you guys I'm not full of *kitten* here's the pictures. First one is right after Thanksgiving at ABOUT 235lbs and ABOUT 30%BF. Second one is yesterday at ABOUT 220lbs and ABOUT 20%. Third one is me summer 2014, before I started traveling for work and my diet fell to crap. The actual BF numbers aren't particularly important to me, just that I am pinching less fat and I see progress in the mirror.
OP, I was just trying to help. If you want any tips on how to do this, feel free to PM me. If you think I'm just some obnoxious blowhard on the internet, I wouldn't blame you for that either.
I tried to pm but no luck for some reason.0
This discussion has been closed.
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