Supporting spouse in diet

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  • LKArgh
    LKArgh Posts: 5,179 Member
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    rosebette wrote: »
    I've been traveling a bit for Easter so just got back to all the posts. We're in the Boston area, and Dr. Ludwig, who is at Harvard and also in charge of the obesity program in Children's Hospital, was interviewed in the Boston Globe and has had a lot of press in our area, so both my husband and I heard and read about the plan, but I ended up buying the book. Hub's doctor suggested he watch a bunch of videos, like Food, Inc., which we've already seen, and keep a food journal. My husband is diabetic, so naturally a lower carb plan is something that he's been looking into. As I said before, my husband has a problem with portion control and cravings due carbs; the question is would he just be able to eat less of those kinds of foods, which might be "trigger foods" for him. What appealed about Ludwig's plan is that it does allow full-fat products and dairy, which he does enjoy. The plan isn't overly restrictive like Atkins or paleo, since it allows fruit (except for bananas and high GI fruits), beans, legumes, and dairy. After the first two weeks, he can have sweet potatoes and whole grain products, but only 3 servings a day. However, if he doesn't lose in the first two weeks, he's supposed to stay in the first phase until he starts seeing a loss. Years ago, Hub did Phase I South Beach, which is far more restrictive, and lost 18 lbs. in the first 6 weeks.

    Regarding exercise, he does move more during baseball season, which has just started, as he is a coach and umpire, but he is a computer guy (software development and project manager) and is sedentary. Other than a walk with me once or twice a week, he doesn't exercise during off-sports season. He has a gym at work, but because he has very early morning meetings, doesn't use it. He also tends to work into the late evening, so doesn't use it then, either. I just did the big shop for the diet and packed a grocery bag full of stuff for him to take to work, as he has a fridge there, but if he's going out to dinner or people are bringing catered stuff or pastries in, I can't control what goes on there.

    For my own behavior, obviously, I'm not going to chow down on cereal or eat a pasta meal if I'm eating with him. That would be cruel. However, as I'm not a diabetic, nor do I have an issue with carb cravings, is it "selfish" of me to eat an occasional sandwich or granola bar if that is what is convenient for me. I'm not talking a subway sub, but my usual half meat sandwich on whole wheat that I bring from home. When I have student conferences all day, I need something that's quick to eat and portable. Lettuce leaves and cheese are a wilted mess from that perspective. Also, if husband isn't coming home and my sons are at home, why should I not share a pasta meal or a serving of rice with them?

    Your husband is an adult. And if he can hold a job as a project manager, he has to have some basic intelligence and basic comprehension skills. He can understand he is ill and unless he takes control of his diet, his health will get worse. If he wants to lose weight, he can do it. Him, not you. I understand your frustration, I wish my husband would lose a bit of weight and get more physically active. But, other than tell our husbands we are concerned, we cannot do the work for them.
    Did you have your husband research what a healthy diet would be for you to reach your goals? Did he come to the dr with you, give you books, cook for you, share your portions, join you in your exercise routine to help you? No, it would have been crazy if he did all these things for you to get in better shape. It is equally crazy to think that you can control how he eats. You can tell him you are concerned, you can keep repeating you are concerned, you can tell him you are upset with him, you can invite him to join you for a walk or encourage him to eat less, but that's about it. You can make a huge effort to create the perfect meal plan for him and eat the same way too, but in the end, you will probably be the only one following the plan and he will be cheating.
    Years ago, my grandad was diagnosed with diabetes. His own mother had died because of it. At the time, he was very overweight. He loved to cook and to eat, and especially loved sweet things, baking and making things like jam, cakes, pastries etc was his hobby. At the time, he lived with my grandma, who was basically living on sweets (without health issues) and several kids still at home plus grandchildren. None of these people was on a diabetic diet. My granddad was not an educated person, and this was the pre-internet times, so resources were limited. But he was also scared. He managed to do his research, work with a dr, change his eating habits, lose a lot of weight, change his hobby from cooking to gardening and swimming and lived to a very old age. No one else changed their lifestyle to accommodate him. If you walked in the kitchen, there were chocolate bars and cookies for the young ones, lots of soda cans for his younger son, my grandma's daily treats. He just did not eat them.
  • rosebette
    rosebette Posts: 1,659 Member
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    Day 4 of program -- husband is full and satisfied with meals and passed up the pizza at work. I'm getting severe headaches and leg cramps that are waking me up at night from the lower carbs (I've started another thread on that!).
  • eldamiano
    eldamiano Posts: 2,667 Member
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    Incredibly unsupportive. Be ashamed...
  • goldthistime
    goldthistime Posts: 3,214 Member
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    rosebette wrote: »
    Day 4 of program -- husband is full and satisfied with meals and passed up the pizza at work. I'm getting severe headaches and leg cramps that are waking me up at night from the lower carbs (I've started another thread on that!).

    i don't think your husband's request was as childish as some here make it out to be. But this changes everything doesn't it?

  • rosebette
    rosebette Posts: 1,659 Member
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    eldamiano wrote: »
    Incredibly unsupportive. Be ashamed...

    I hope you're being sarcastic!
  • rosebette
    rosebette Posts: 1,659 Member
    edited April 2016
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    Must be the re-covering ex-Catholic in me. Anyway, he's not suffering at all. He feels great. This happened with South Beach about 6 years ago. Because he's a diabetic, going low-carb really benefits his overall feeling of health and well-being. Yesterday, he passed up cookies at work because he was too full to eat them. Meanwhile, I feel too rotten to finish most of the food I prepare for myself.
  • rosebette
    rosebette Posts: 1,659 Member
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    I think you misunderstood -- it's the self-sacrificing Catholic that is giving up the carbs (remember Lent)! I'm not a Catholic anymore, but an Episcopalian -- those are the folks, who on my first "Lenten retreat", introduced me to an "open bar" and a table of or d'ouevres before eating a 3-course meal.
  • concordancia
    concordancia Posts: 5,320 Member
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    Why not compromise? Do those very hard first two weeks in solidarity, then go back to eating according to your own nutritional needs.
  • rosebette
    rosebette Posts: 1,659 Member
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    Actually, after Week 2, more carbs are allowed, so it does get easier. The initial 2 weeks are supposed to help eliminate cravings and "jump start" weight loss. In my husband's case, it's definitely working. In my case, not so much. I don't have the extreme cravings and hunger he has, and I'm also not losing any weight because I'm still eating the same number of calories as I was before, just a different macro combination.
  • rosebette
    rosebette Posts: 1,659 Member
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    Latest update -- spouse lost 5 lbs. in a week. I lost zero. Of course, I'm eating the same calories, just different macros. So for me CICO is probably still the route; for him, low carb is definitely working, although there may be some CICO going on because there are a lot of foods he's not eating at work, such as pastries, pizza, etc.
  • rosebette
    rosebette Posts: 1,659 Member
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    Week 2 - spouse lost 4 lbs. this week. I lost one, even though I'm eating low carb only 2 meals a day (when he's around). That was a surprise because I'm breaking a yearlong plateau of not being able to get below 120 lbs.
  • scolaris
    scolaris Posts: 2,145 Member
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    Unreasonable and childlike. Part of the reason he's such an obese train wreck right now, no doubt. He should fall on the floor and literally kiss the ground you walk on that you are willing to help him while you two eat together. Puhleese!
  • scolaris
    scolaris Posts: 2,145 Member
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    My suggestion: let him research & implement his own plans. And up the life insurance.
  • scolaris
    scolaris Posts: 2,145 Member
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    Glad things are working out for you two.
  • rosebette
    rosebette Posts: 1,659 Member
    edited April 2016
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    scolaris wrote: »
    My suggestion: let him research & implement his own plans. And up the life insurance.

    We did that about 5 years ago and included a long-term care insurance rider. It's unbelievably expensive, but a "whole life" plan with cash value. One of the "Carrot and stick" motivators is that if his weight and A1C drop, our premiums will go down. I thought buying this insurance would help me "let go" of his eating and lifestyle -- but no such luck. When you love someone, you want them to live long and be healthy just because you have that image of the golden years together, not just because of the cost of illness and death. If he got to normal weight, we could actually consider dropping the policy and "cashing out" because we got into a very reasonable group long term care plan through his workplace (they didn't even require a physical for him because he's the employee -- I had to get one because I was over 55 when we applied!), and we have other life insurance as well.

    Actually, he's doing great on this eating plan and wants to continue Phase 1 (which has no grains or potatoes, vs. the next phase that allows modest amounts of whole grains and starchy vegetables) for another week, and he feels really good. He says he wants to feel "set" in resisting cravings before he goes to the next step.

    An added motivator -- Dr. Ludwig, who wrote the book we're using, runs the obesity clinic at Children's Hospital, and we found a mutual family friend whose teen actually saw this guy. She was morbidly obese as a teen and young adult, and now is normal weight and pursuing studies to become a nutritionist/dietician.

  • zoodocgirl
    zoodocgirl Posts: 163 Member
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    Sounds like you are already finding what works for you both, but wanted to chime in with my experience with Dr. Ludwig's book and plan in case it helps.

    My boyfriend and I started the "Always Hungry?" plan 3 weeks ago. We both have about 40-50 lbs to lose and just wanted to jumpstart out of some slippery slope habits (convenience food and drinking). He had a moderate freak out before we even started because he assumed he'd "fail" and I'd be mad. I started the plan technically without him while he worked his own head out, but he ate what I made for dinners regardless. After 3 days, he quietly just started following it even out of the house. After the 2 weeks of Phase 1, he was down 10 lbs and I was down 4 and we were both satisfied hunger and taste wise. Giving up wine was the hardest for me but it was only 2 weeks.

    You've probably already discovered this, but the recipes in the book are DELICIOUS, so there's really no "suffering". There is a great and active Facebook community that posts even more recipes, and the Ludwigs participate.

    The plan does specify lessening strenuous exercise during the first two weeks, because it is a shift to have less dietary carbs, so perhaps if you are exercising a lot, that may be part of your difficult adjustment. I definitely had to scale my hiking back at first, but last weekend we did a 25 mile, 3 day backpacking trip with all Phase 2 compliant foods (nuts, fruit, cheese, homemade jerky, quinoa with dehydrated veggies, dehydrated beans and cheese with chickpea flour tortillas) and we did great.

    I enjoy having quinoa, sweet potatoes and wine back in my life now that I'm in Phase 2, but honestly this way of eating has been very enjoyable for us. I started it after hearing Dr. Ludwig on Science Friday. I'm a veterinarian who works exclusively in pet nutrition and does a lot with pet obesity. The research he's done mirrors what we've found successful in other animals. CICO works when it works, but it is so hard for some people (for themselves and in restricting their pets) due to lifestyle, emotional, cravings, etc. that it doesn't succeed in the long term for them. It also takes nutrigenomics into account - nutrients can and do influence genetic expression of metabolism-related genes.
  • brb_2013
    brb_2013 Posts: 1,197 Member
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    stephanie20314 wrote: »
    Honestly I'd start thinking about an exit plan. He doesn't sound like a good partner or parent if he's going to blame his obesity on you and your children.

    Are you joking? What an awful thing to say.

    No where does OP suggest he has said anything of the sort. The diet was her idea in the first place, not his choice.

    I think telling someone they can't eat carbs is terrible. It's hard enough to change habits, but to exclude a whole food group is ridiculous regardless of what some book says. He can be successful and have a sandwich. I realize that's not your point but I know precisely how he feels, so I get it. He has no right to control the meals that happen outside the home or when he is not around. But of course he's going to have feelings about that.

    My advice is to throw out the book, sign himself up for MFP and see just how many carbs he could enjoy as part of a balanced diet.

    And for real? Suggesting an "exit plan" because he'd like to not be the only person on a diet, which is always an emotional and embarrassing journey especially in front of a household of healthy weight folks? Purely awful and I'm hoping the OP has more sense than that.
  • rosebette
    rosebette Posts: 1,659 Member
    edited April 2016
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    Just read the two posts above. Thanks, Zoodocgirl, for relating your experiences, which echo ours. The recipes are excellent. We just had the gluten free pancakes this morning with whipped cream. We looked at our plates and thought, wow, this is a diet? We eat really big breakfasts, which cuts back on the cravings during the day. Also, thanks for letting me know about the Facebook, which I plan to join. Your explanation about exercising in Phase 1 also explains why I didn't fare so well on it. My husband is still pretty sedentary except week-ends, but I have an active job as a teacher on a large campus, where I put in 6000 steps a day just walking around, and I usually do additional walking or a work out besides that. So if I'm faithful to the Phase I version for 4-5 days, after about day 4 I usually get headaches, brain fog, etc., and have to add some carbs back. I experienced pretty much the same thing when I tried Phase I South Beach several years ago and had to go to Phase II within a week.

    Brb_213, my spouse has actually surprised me by choosing to continue with Phase I, which is the lower carb (not no carb, since we're allowed fruit, dairy, and beans), rather than move to the next Phase which allows some whole grains and starches. He has never been good at tracking -- he'll set up an account with Livestrong or one of those other sites, but not maintain it because it's too time-consuming for him, so perhaps limiting food groups is a strategy that is working for him. He likes the results and he feels so much better. He feels that he couldn't be successful eating a sandwich because the bread in the sandwich would just begin a cycle of craving more starches. Perhaps this is because he's diabetic, and a lower carb diet is the way he needed to eat all along. Ludwig's theory is that people who are overweight often process food differently, both physically and emotionally. As someone who is not overweight, I could eat a sandwich and be satisfied until the next meal; he couldn't. So I'm not getting grief for denying him a sandwich; he feels he's making his own choices now. My husband has actually become more responsible for what he eats. He goes to work with a clamshell pack of greens, salad tomatoes, and a bottle of full-fat dressing, plus some lean turkey (Boar's Head or Thin n Trim), fresh fruit, and natural peanut butter (to spread on an apple for a snack) and stores that in his work fridge and makes his own lunches, whereas I was making him sandwiches before, and he still was eating the crap at the office.
  • stephanie20314
    stephanie20314 Posts: 81 Member
    edited April 2016
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    I'm glad the diet you found is working for him. Is he expecting for you to continue doing stage 1 with him?
    Oh and I forgot the leg pain your experiencing might be caused by a drop in magnesium in your diet. A supplement could help if you're going to stay on phase 1.
  • rosebette
    rosebette Posts: 1,659 Member
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    stephanie20314 wrote: »
    I'm glad the diet you found is working for him. Is he expecting for you to continue doing stage 1 with him?
    Oh and I forgot the leg pain your experiencing might be caused by a drop in magnesium in your diet. A supplement could help if you're going to stay on phase 1.

    No, I only do Phase 1 when we are eating meals together. However, he worked from home most days this week, so I was doing Phase 1 until yesterday when I had a faculty meeting with a catered lunch. Also, we went out last night for Brazilian Radizio for my son's birthday (radizio is basically unlimited piles of prime cuts of roasted meat carved at your table), and I ate all the sides -- bread, rice, plantains, while my husband stuck to the salad and beans with his meat.

    I had posted another thread on my headaches and other symptoms and got similar advice to up my magnesium, as well as potassium and sodium. I've done this, but am still getting symptoms occasionally, but as someone who isn't overweight, I might not have the reserves to draw on that my husband has to support my activity level.

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