The French Paradox...

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J72FIT
J72FIT Posts: 5,948 Member
in Food and Nutrition
"Americans are amazed to learn that some of the cultures that set their culinary course by the light of habit and pleasure rather then nutritional science and marketing are actually healthier then we are–that is, suffer a lower incidence of diet-related health troubles.

The French paradox is the most famous such case, though as Paul Rozin points out, the French don't regard the matter as paradoxical at all. We Americans resort to that term because the French experience–a population of wine-swilling cheese eaters with lower rates of heart disease and obesity–confounds our orthodoxy about food. That orthodoxy regards certain tasty foods as poisons (carbs now, fats then), failing to appreciate that how we eat, and even how we feel about eating, may in the end be just as important as what we eat. The French eat all sorts of supposedly unhealthy foods, but they do it according to a strict and stable set of rules: They eat small portions and don't go back for seconds; they don't snack; they seldom eat alone; and communal meals are long, leisurely affairs. In other words, the French culture of food successfully negotiates the omnivore's dilemma, allowing the French to enjoy their meals without ruining their health.

Perhaps because we have no such culture of food in America almost every question about eating is up for grabs. Fats or carbs? Three squares or continuous grazing? Raw or cooked? Organic or industrial? Veg or vegan? Meat or mock meat? Foods of astounding novelty fill the shelves of our supermarket, and the line between a food and a "nutritional supplement" has fogged to the point where people make meals of protein bars and shakes. Consuming these neo-pseudo-foods alone in our cars, we have become a nation of antinomian eaters, each of us struggling to work out our dietary salvation on our own. Is it any wonder American's suffer from so many eating disorders? In the absence of any lasting consensus about what and how and where to eat, the omnivore's dilemma has returned to America with an almost atavistic force."

–Michael Pollan, The Omnivore's Dilemma
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Replies

  • LuckyNumbers
    LuckyNumbers Posts: 208 Member
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    So true, and such a problem for so many of us. Whenever I am tempted to eat dinner in front of the TV, I remind myself that eating at the table as a family is important for us nutritionally, emotionally, mentally, spiritually, and physically. I am so appreciative that my mom "made" us eat at the dinner table, and I'm going to make sure my two-year old daughter can be appreciative of that, too.

    Now to stop eating breakfast and lunch at my desk ...
  • lemurcat12
    lemurcat12 Posts: 30,886 Member
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    Yeah, I tend to agree with Pollan.

    People seem to think that humans should be able to naturally control how much we eat just based on hunger signals, but in pretty much all human cultures there have been cultural rules (in addition to scarcity) that did so. That the US has such a poor food culture, as well as such an emphasis on individuality and rejecting customs plays into the way we've been a worldwide leader in obesity.
  • Gamliela
    Gamliela Posts: 2,468 Member
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    I lived in France for a few years. We adopted the french ways of livng and I gained 20 pounds. The french people we lived around (that was in three different villages in southish france) were mostly a bit on the chubby side. Probably high normal and into overweight bmi. The thing was was that they are very healthy into old age in France, active, as in walk every day to groceries, play neighborhood games of bowling outside, bike ride rather than do automobiles.

    I was taken by surprise once when across the front of the grocery store I read a large banner that read ' This Week, All Duck Fat On Sale'! The thing is there that grocery stores sell a lot of foi gras, fatted duck liver in jars, not just that, they sell plain old duck fat by the can. These cans are large sized cans, like 2 liters! So they use it in lots of cooking. For instance white bean dishes with bits of duck and plenty of herbs and a lot of duck grease. Its really tasty! Of couse there is also the bread and the millions of types of cheeses too. And crepes of all kinds, ever kind of filling, from sweets to meats.

    The only skinny people I saw in France lived in Paris, who seemed to live off coffee and cigs.
  • msf74
    msf74 Posts: 3,498 Member
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    Let's not forget a healthy dose of vanity and food snobbery either.

    The choice between having another slice of cheese cake and possible not fitting into your glorious bespoke clothing? Pass on the cheesecake please.

    All you can eat buffet? Grand closing. Quality not quantity and good cooking please.

    The "no snacking" thing for me at least is the heart of weight control. It's pretty simple. If I can control my snacking I can control my weight.
  • French_Peasant
    French_Peasant Posts: 1,639 Member
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    Perhaps we should all take up petits dejeuners consisting of black coffee and a Gauloise, which would help us stay svelte, not to mention brooding and mysterious. It's a key part of the "French paradox" that Pollan leaves out for some reason.

    Déjeuner du matin

    Il a mis le café
    Dans la tasse
    Il a mis le lait
    Dans la tasse de café
    Il a mis le sucre
    Dans le café au lait
    Avec la petite cuiller
    Il a tourné
    Il a bu le café au lait
    Et il a reposé la tasse
    Sans me parler
    Il a allumé
    Une cigarette
    Il a fait des ronds
    Avec la fumée
    Il a mis les cendres
    Dans le cendrier
    Sans me parler
    Sans me regarder
    Il s’est levé
    Il a mis
    Son chapeau sur sa tête
    Il a mis
    Son manteau de pluie
    Parce qu’il pleuvait
    Et il est parti
    Sous la pluie
    Sans une parole
    Sans me regarder
    Et moi j’ai pris
    Ma tête dans mes mains
    Et j’ai pleuré.


    Anyway, I don't smoke, but as I have said before, you can pry my baguette out of my cold dead hands, and even then I will come back and haunt you. Because the baguette.
  • Gamliela
    Gamliela Posts: 2,468 Member
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    Maybe also its because food is a lot more expensive in France than in the States. French people seem to focus a lot on cooking and good food, its never about 'just fueling the body'.
  • lemurcat12
    lemurcat12 Posts: 30,886 Member
    edited April 2016
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    msf74 wrote: »
    The "no snacking" thing for me at least is the heart of weight control. It's pretty simple. If I can control my snacking I can control my weight.

    Yep. I know eating lots of snacks or grazing or mini meals works for some, but snacking is bad for me. If I just eat regular meals I'm happy and eat fewer calories and make better choices overall.

    It's remarkable how much food is constantly on offer (at least where I live and work), but up to me to decide when I will eat.

    I think a good food culture tends to weigh against thoughtless or mindless eating, just 'cause it's there, and making sure I appreciate the food I eat and make it really good is something else that works for me.
  • cbstewart88
    cbstewart88 Posts: 453 Member
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    ....I remember distinctly ordering a cheese omelette at a restaurant before my flight to Paris. It was HUGE - it hung off my plate like a dead fish. It tasted like wet cardboard. The next morning in Nice - I ordered a cheese omelette. It was tiny. About the size of a deck of cards. But it tasted like a yellow cloud. I lingered over every bite. I couldn't even finish it....
  • EvgeniZyntx
    EvgeniZyntx Posts: 24,208 Member
    edited April 2016
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    So many useless generalisations focused on a keyhole perception of a culture. Pollan's views are interesting, but he generally takes things to such an extreme that if you aren't pushing back... well, you aren't critically thinking.

    French average BMI or statistical spread isn't that different from Italy, Belgium, Norway or ... most of Europe. And it's largely based on social pressures, activity levels and to some extend eating habits.

    As to smoking, while the stereotype image will probably linger - bans on smoking (as a public health measure) have been getting stronger since the 70s and currently the per capita smoking is lower than in the US, Australia or Germany by about 15%. France has one of the lowest cigarette consumptions per capita in Europe.

    World_map_of_countries_by_number_of_cigarettes_smoked_per_adult_per_year.svg

    (I've lived in France (and Germany) for the past 25 years - in Bordeaux, Paris, Lille, etc... and find that people tend to make their view of French culture extremely focused on the small microcosm that they experience - there is, for example, very little use of duck fat in the north region.)
  • Gamliela
    Gamliela Posts: 2,468 Member
    edited April 2016
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    Oui, its true, ice cream and pastries and macaroons and etc. ce' la vie
  • Gamliela
    Gamliela Posts: 2,468 Member
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    Like I said above, a few years in France and 10 kilo heavier. Most french people aren't skinny as the book seems to say.
    In fact most are over normal, some chubs around the middle. But no one seems to care, the isn't any shame about that in South France anyhow. Paris is another story.
  • EvgeniZyntx
    EvgeniZyntx Posts: 24,208 Member
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    Gamliela wrote: »
    Like I said above, a few years in France and 10 kilo heavier. Most french people aren't skinny as the book seems to say.
    In fact most are over normal, some chubs around the middle. But no one seems to care, the isn't any shame about that in South France anyhow. Paris is another story.

    And considering a certain Paris body culture as the reference for the country is like considering LA body culture as the reference for the rest of the USA.
  • sunnybeaches105
    sunnybeaches105 Posts: 2,831 Member
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    Oh good. Another wild generalization about nationalities.
  • KombuchaKat
    KombuchaKat Posts: 134 Member
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    Since the French still eat real food that is satiating they do not have to try and circumvent the blood sugar roller coaster with the latest scientific "discovery." Snacks/lots of small meals are a new phenomenon that I believe is mostly the result of our eating more processed carbs and sugar as well as too little fat. When you eat fat and nutritionally dense food you can go for hours and hours without eating. Most people I know that seem to do well with eating very often are "skinny fat" and would be skinny no matter what they ate. That doesn't mean that their insides aren't a mess, though.
  • cityruss
    cityruss Posts: 2,493 Member
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    I'm married to a French national, and spend a lot of time in France.

    And I can tell you now that this idealized and romanticized version of 'French eating' does not exist.

    They snack, we snack, you snack. Some people over eat, some don't. Some people are overweight, some aren't. They buy bread, we buy bread, you buy bread.

    Their stores, supermarkets, and hypermarkets are full of the same things as ours. There's isle upon isle of convienience food, snacks, ice cream and sweets.
  • KombuchaKat
    KombuchaKat Posts: 134 Member
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    EvgeniZyntx wrote: »
    Gamliela wrote: »
    Like I said above, a few years in France and 10 kilo heavier. Most french people aren't skinny as the book seems to say.
    In fact most are over normal, some chubs around the middle. But no one seems to care, the isn't any shame about that in South France anyhow. Paris is another story.

    And considering a certain Paris body culture as the reference for the country is like considering LA body culture as the reference for the rest of the USA.

    Even if the French are not all super in shape or bean polls I think it's safe to say there are not nearly as many morbidly obese people. Health does not mean you have to look like a fashion model, but it also doesn't look like My 500 lb life or whatever that show is.
  • johnnylakis
    johnnylakis Posts: 812 Member
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    It's no coincidence that the French are healthier. A work week in France is famously limited by law to 35 hours. In the US, there is no limit. The food in France is much healthier than the food in the US. There are so many chemicals in US food. The French walk everywhere. Americans drive everywhere. The French have no military and free healthcare. The US has a huge military and expensive healthcare. (This is expected to change for France and the US when Trump becomes president)
  • janejellyroll
    janejellyroll Posts: 25,763 Member
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    johnnylakis wrote: »
    It's no coincidence that the French are healthier. A work week in France is famously limited by law to 35 hours. In the US, there is no limit. The food in France is much healthier than the food in the US. There are so many chemicals in US food. The French walk everywhere. Americans drive everywhere. The French have no military and free healthcare. The US has a huge military and expensive healthcare. (This is expected to change for France and the US when Trump becomes president)

    The French don't have a military? I'm pretty sure that will surprise the 365,000 people who are currently active members of the French Armed Forces.

    And French food has chemicals.

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