Problem with carbs
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As adults, we don't need fat (not as much as the American culture is consuming) and I did say our body uses 10% of fat, we need little protein unless you are the exception (like body building). And I did say to go to a nutritionist/doctor to determine YOUR protein needs. I think however, I can generalize and say that fat is bad. I'll make another generalization and say that refined sugar is bad as well.
I suppose you CAN make a generalization but its simply wrong. We absolutely do need fat. And what does that even mean: "our body uses 10% of fat"?
Again, EVERYONE needs more than a little protein. Again, if you want to have normal functioning cells and repair tissue then you need protein. If you want to stave off the natural loss of mucle mass as you age then you need protein. If you want to feel full and satsfied when you eat then you need protein.
I seriously can't tell if what you are posting is just misinformed copy pasta or outright lies. Either way, you're all the way wrong.
When I say our body uses 10% of fat, I mean our body uses out of the whole fat we consume, it uses 10% of it. I never said we don't need protein, I said we don't need a lot of it but that is specific to your lifestyle. So, if you are sitting in front of a computer all day and all night, you don't need a lot of protein. If you are a body builder, you need protein--not that hard and it is specific, I did, again, say go to an expert to find out your specific needs. But generally speaking, as adults, we don't need a ton of protein.
If you want to feel satisfied, you don't eat protein but carbohydrates. Eating meat only and no/low carbs brings about Ketosis. You can listen to Dr. McDougall's interview with Dr. Atkins: http://www.drmcdougall.com/mcdougallcast/media/2007-05-03_01_track_1.mp3
I'll generalize here... I agree on a whole we do eat way too much fat, I also think we eat way too much carbs. You mentioned that if you sit in front of a computer all day that you don't need as much protein. I agree there as well but what I feel you are suggesting as the alternative is to consume primarily carbs as you macronutrient source and if you sit in front of a computer all day that's going to have a more negative effect on your body than consuming large amounts of protein. In other words I get the impression that you're suggesting a diet that is comprised of mostly carbohydrates and argue if you will I'm a firm believer that will lead to insulin tolerance and is the root cause of the weight problems that americans experience.
EDIT: sorry cant type and spell at the same time
Thank you. Insulin is another topic. My plea to the poster was not to eat fat after his work out as it seems to defeat the purpose of the work out. As for protein, I do not know the poster's lifestyle so I did tell him to see someone to find out.
I have no doubt that the Atkin's diet works, I have no doubt the McDougall Program works. Once healthy, eat what you like but I am talking from the stand point that all here, for the most part, want to lose weight (and this means we want to lose fat). So if we are exercising and we must eat back our calories, why eat fat from calories?0 -
As adults, we don't need fat (not as much as the American culture is consuming) and I did say our body uses 10% of fat, we need little protein unless you are the exception (like body building). And I did say to go to a nutritionist/doctor to determine YOUR protein needs. I think however, I can generalize and say that fat is bad. I'll make another generalization and say that refined sugar is bad as well.
But you're WRONG. If fat is bad then we must postulate that no fat is good. So if I eat no fat I will live a happy and healthy life. Epic Fail. We do most certainly need fat.
I can agree with you on the refined sugar. But it tastes SO GOOOOD
I am replying, giving you folks urls to look up. Please back up your claims as well. Dr. Atkins is the meat only doctor so I suggest you listen to the interview and we can talk afterwards about fat and sugar. Dr. Atkins does say that fat and sugar is bad.
I am not disagreeing that an excess of fat is not a good thing, but with your statement that fat is bad.
The American Heart Association does not appear to state that fat is bad - http://www.heart.org/HEARTORG/GettingHealthy/FatsAndOils/TheDishwithDrEckel/The-Dish-Personal-Daily-Calorie-and-Fat-Limits_UCM_304896_Article.jsp#mainContent and recommends that we consume some fat. Hence my comment that no fat is no good either.
I'm afraid I haven't listened to the interviews, I am interested in more controlled scientific studies and I am not swayed by either Dr. McDougall or Dr. Atkins - who is not actually a 'meat only' doctor. My beef is with some of the blanket statements you make which are just plain wrong0 -
As adults, we don't need fat (not as much as the American culture is consuming) and I did say our body uses 10% of fat, we need little protein unless you are the exception (like body building). And I did say to go to a nutritionist/doctor to determine YOUR protein needs. I think however, I can generalize and say that fat is bad. I'll make another generalization and say that refined sugar is bad as well.
I suppose you CAN make a generalization but its simply wrong. We absolutely do need fat. And what does that even mean: "our body uses 10% of fat"?
Again, EVERYONE needs more than a little protein. Again, if you want to have normal functioning cells and repair tissue then you need protein. If you want to stave off the natural loss of mucle mass as you age then you need protein. If you want to feel full and satsfied when you eat then you need protein.
I seriously can't tell if what you are posting is just misinformed copy pasta or outright lies. Either way, you're all the way wrong.
When I say our body uses 10% of fat, I mean our body uses out of the whole fat we consume, it uses 10% of it. I never said we don't need protein, I said we don't need a lot of it but that is specific to your lifestyle. So, if you are sitting in front of a computer all day and all night, you don't need a lot of protein. If you are a body builder, you need protein--not that hard and it is specific, I did, again, say go to an expert to find out your specific needs. But generally speaking, as adults, we don't need a ton of protein.
If you want to feel satisfied, you don't eat protein but carbohydrates. Eating meat only and no/low carbs brings about Ketosis. You can listen to Dr. McDougall's interview with Dr. Atkins: http://www.drmcdougall.com/mcdougallcast/media/2007-05-03_01_track_1.mp3
I'll generalize here... I agree on a whole we do eat way too much fat, I also think we eat way too much carbs. You mentioned that if you sit in front of a computer all day that you don't need as much protein. I agree there as well but what I feel you are suggesting as the alternative is to consume primarily carbs as you macronutrient source and if you sit in front of a computer all day that's going to have a more negative effect on your body than consuming large amounts of protein. In other words I get the impression that you're suggesting a diet that is comprised of mostly carbohydrates and argue if you will I'm a firm believer that will lead to insulin tolerance and is the root cause of the weight problems that americans experience.
EDIT: sorry cant type and spell at the same time
Thank you. Insulin is another topic. My plea to the poster was not to eat fat after his work out as it seems to defeat the purpose of the work out. As for protein, I do not know the poster's lifestyle so I did tell him to see someone to find out.
I have no doubt that the Atkin's diet works, I have no doubt the McDougall Program works. Once healthy, eat what you like but I am talking from the stand point that all here, for the most part, want to lose weight (and this means we want to lose fat). So if we are exercising and we must eat back our calories, why eat fat from calories?
Fair enough, I think we can agree that we should not cut out any of the macronutrients. Certainly, making fat 60% of your intake is going to be counter productive in terms of most people goals and I think that was you original point . I'm of the opinion that protein on the other hand should make up the largest percentage of you diet, especially if weight loss is the goal. We're al going to do what works and if you can eat primarily carbohydrates and maintain you fitness goals than you've been blessed with a more productive metabolism than I have.0 -
Here is my two bits worth, for all they are worth. Let me back up by saying that I taught basic food, nutrition and cooking classes at the high school level for several years in a food service program. I am also a cooking merit badge counselor for the local boy scouts. If you look at the food guide pyramid, it says fats and oils in moderation. What I teach my scouts and my students is:
1. Make sure you get your servings from all the basic food groups each day.
2. Fats and oils in moderation
3. When you eat breads and grains, make sure they are whole grain and avoid white bread, pastas, rice, and sugar.
This advise is time tested and honored. Backed up with exercise, you will do fine overall.
Just so you know, I have my diary settings at 40% proteins and carbs, 20% fats. Again, eat clean, and cook everything you possibly can yourself so YOU have total control of what goes into your body.0 -
As adults, we don't need fat (not as much as the American culture is consuming) and I did say our body uses 10% of fat, we need little protein unless you are the exception (like body building). And I did say to go to a nutritionist/doctor to determine YOUR protein needs. I think however, I can generalize and say that fat is bad. I'll make another generalization and say that refined sugar is bad as well.
But you're WRONG. If fat is bad then we must postulate that no fat is good. So if I eat no fat I will live a happy and healthy life. Epic Fail. We do most certainly need fat.
I can agree with you on the refined sugar. But it tastes SO GOOOOD
I am replying, giving you folks urls to look up. Please back up your claims as well. Dr. Atkins is the meat only doctor so I suggest you listen to the interview and we can talk afterwards about fat and sugar. Dr. Atkins does say that fat and sugar is bad.
I am not disagreeing that an excess of fat is not a good thing, but with your statement that fat is bad.
The American Heart Association does not appear to state that fat is bad - http://www.heart.org/HEARTORG/GettingHealthy/FatsAndOils/TheDishwithDrEckel/The-Dish-Personal-Daily-Calorie-and-Fat-Limits_UCM_304896_Article.jsp#mainContent and recommends that we consume some fat. Hence my comment that no fat is no good either.
I'm afraid I haven't listened to the interviews, I am interested in more controlled scientific studies and I am not swayed by either Dr. McDougall or Dr. Atkins - who is not actually a 'meat only' doctor. My beef is with some of the blanket statements you make which are just plain wrong
The American Heart Association says not to eat more than 7% saturated fat, 1% trans fat. Those are low numbers.
If you don't want to add to the solution and just nit pick my argument, go right ahead.0 -
Well, animal fat is saturated fat, vegetable fat is either mono or poly. You can look up these types of fats. Saturated fats are clumped "tight" and is much denser than vegetable fat. This is why cooking and dipping oils are all considered liquid fat.
All fat is bad, but there are essential fats found in plants. So, I say this: fat is fat and fat (90%) of it will be placed as adipose tissue (under your skin and organs) because your body uses up carbs for engery first, then fat afterwards. Why would you work out and then eat olive oil or avocados when avocados have 34% fat per 150 g serving http://nutritiondata.self.com/facts/fruits-and-fruit-juices/1843/2 and olive oil has 332% fat per cup (216g). Now you say that you won't eat all that and that's fine, but that's still fat. Olive oil calories? 1910 Calories from Fat? 1910. http://nutritiondata.self.com/facts/fats-and-oils/509/2
So if the fat you eat can be easily stored, because your body uses carbs for energy when working out then fat, why would you eat fat especially if MFP advocates that we eat back our work out calories? If you are going to eat a salad (something healthy), why would you pour fat over it (olive oil)?
Now, I agree that body builders need protein, no doubt, but I did say, generally speaking, the rest of adults who don't need to build muscle don't need a lot of protein.
If you think you need meat to be strong, please watch this video:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eZwmluSn_T0
Are you being serious?
All fat is bad fat? Not only are you wrong, your post should be deleted for its amount of misinformation. If you want:
Normal cell growth
Nutrient absorption
Normal cell function
Normal hormone function
Feeling of being satiated
Then eat fat. Of ALL kinds. Animal fats are a very important part of our overall health and the link to animal fats and ANY negative effects (given you don't gorge yourself) has been disproven by SCIENCE time and again.
You owe it to yourself to do some more research lest you continue to rapidly grow weak with age and gain in body fat.
TC:
All macro nutrients are important and you should eat all of them. They all contribute to a healthy body. The breakdown is different for each person's goals but by and large we eat too many carbs and not enough protein.
It's true you NEED fat and it's supposed to be a part of your diet. Especially healthy fats found in olive oil, nuts and avocadoes
Yes you should not eat butter with a fork and knife but you're making ridiculous connections under the umbrella "fat" that are blatantly wrong0 -
Here is my two bits worth, for all they are worth. Let me back up by saying that I taught basic food, nutrition and cooking classes at the high school level for several years in a food service program. I am also a cooking merit badge counselor for the local boy scouts. If you look at the food guide pyramid, it says fats and oils in moderation. What I teach my scouts and my students is:
1. Make sure you get your servings from all the basic food groups each day.
2. Fats and oils in moderation
3. When you eat breads and grains, make sure they are whole grain and avoid white bread, pastas, rice, and sugar.
This advise is time tested and honored. Backed up with exercise, you will do fine overall.
Just so you know, I have my diary settings at 40% proteins and carbs, 20% fats. Again, eat clean, and cook everything you possibly can yourself so YOU have total control of what goes into your body.
I think 20% fat is great.
Please watch this youtube video as Dr. Caldwell Esselstyn gives a talk about heart disease and mentions oils (about 4 or 5 times). And he mentions his scientifically controlled group which he led himself.0 -
Well, animal fat is saturated fat, vegetable fat is either mono or poly. You can look up these types of fats. Saturated fats are clumped "tight" and is much denser than vegetable fat. This is why cooking and dipping oils are all considered liquid fat.
All fat is bad, but there are essential fats found in plants. So, I say this: fat is fat and fat (90%) of it will be placed as adipose tissue (under your skin and organs) because your body uses up carbs for engery first, then fat afterwards. Why would you work out and then eat olive oil or avocados when avocados have 34% fat per 150 g serving http://nutritiondata.self.com/facts/fruits-and-fruit-juices/1843/2 and olive oil has 332% fat per cup (216g). Now you say that you won't eat all that and that's fine, but that's still fat. Olive oil calories? 1910 Calories from Fat? 1910. http://nutritiondata.self.com/facts/fats-and-oils/509/2
So if the fat you eat can be easily stored, because your body uses carbs for energy when working out then fat, why would you eat fat especially if MFP advocates that we eat back our work out calories? If you are going to eat a salad (something healthy), why would you pour fat over it (olive oil)?
Now, I agree that body builders need protein, no doubt, but I did say, generally speaking, the rest of adults who don't need to build muscle don't need a lot of protein.
If you think you need meat to be strong, please watch this video:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eZwmluSn_T0
Are you being serious?
All fat is bad fat? Not only are you wrong, your post should be deleted for its amount of misinformation. If you want:
Normal cell growth
Nutrient absorption
Normal cell function
Normal hormone function
Feeling of being satiated
Then eat fat. Of ALL kinds. Animal fats are a very important part of our overall health and the link to animal fats and ANY negative effects (given you don't gorge yourself) has been disproven by SCIENCE time and again.
You owe it to yourself to do some more research lest you continue to rapidly grow weak with age and gain in body fat.
TC:
All macro nutrients are important and you should eat all of them. They all contribute to a healthy body. The breakdown is different for each person's goals but by and large we eat too many carbs and not enough protein.
It's true you NEED fat and it's supposed to be a part of your diet. Especially healthy fats found in olive oil, nuts and avocadoes
Yes you should not eat butter with a fork and knife but you're making ridiculous connections under the umbrella "fat" that are blatantly wrong
I said that 90% of fat eaten is stored on your body as fat. 10% therefore is used so, yes, fat is needed. But as the statistics show, 1/3 of Americans are overweight and 1/3 are obese. So do you tell them to eat fat? As I said, most here are here to lose fat so we can lose weight so we can be healthy again. I never said as a healthy person don't eat avocados and almonds and olive oil. Please check out the amount of fat there is in those three products and tell me, would you tell someone who just finished his or her work out to eat fat to eat back their calories?
Would you eat fat after your work-out? What is the point of exercise then?0 -
I always seem to go over on my carbs each day but miles under on Fat and Protein. Does anyone know what the appropriate levels for each of these should be each day, I just get so confused as I seem to get conflicting reports.
Any suggestions for the Carbs, Fat and Protein levels is appreciated. :huh:
Can't speak for anyone else, but what works for me is having my percentages as 40-40-20 for protein-carbs-fats (mostly whole foods).0 -
I said that 90% of fat eaten is stored on your body as fat. 10% therefore is used so, yes, fat is needed. But as the statistics show, 1/3 of Americans are overweight and 1/3 are obese. So do you tell them to eat fat? As I said, most here are here to lose fat so we can lose weight so we can be healthy again. I never said as a healthy person don't eat avocados and almonds and olive oil. Please check out the amount of fat there is in those three products and tell me, would you tell someone who just finished his or her work out to eat fat to eat back their calories?
Would you eat fat after your work-out? What is the point of exercise then?
Why does it have to be an all or nothing situation when consuming fat? Just have a nice, well-balanced meal meal that contains adequate carbs, protein and moderate fat after working out.
And as for the amount of fat that is stored on your body as fat, doesn't that depend more on how many calories are consumed?
As for the point of exercise, there are just too many to list..... Exercise has enriched my life in SO MANY WAYS. Losing weight is just one among the many points toward exercise.0 -
Would you eat fat after your work-out? What is the point of exercise then?
If the fat is in something like and avacado, then OH HECK YEAH!!!!!!0 -
As adults, we don't need fat (not as much as the American culture is consuming) and I did say our body uses 10% of fat, we need little protein unless you are the exception (like body building). And I did say to go to a nutritionist/doctor to determine YOUR protein needs. I think however, I can generalize and say that fat is bad. I'll make another generalization and say that refined sugar is bad as well.
I suppose you CAN make a generalization but its simply wrong. We absolutely do need fat. And what does that even mean: "our body uses 10% of fat"?
Again, EVERYONE needs more than a little protein. Again, if you want to have normal functioning cells and repair tissue then you need protein. If you want to stave off the natural loss of mucle mass as you age then you need protein. If you want to feel full and satsfied when you eat then you need protein.
I seriously can't tell if what you are posting is just misinformed copy pasta or outright lies. Either way, you're all the way wrong.
When I say our body uses 10% of fat, I mean our body uses out of the whole fat we consume, it uses 10% of it. I never said we don't need protein, I said we don't need a lot of it but that is specific to your lifestyle. So, if you are sitting in front of a computer all day and all night, you don't need a lot of protein. If you are a body builder, you need protein--not that hard and it is specific, I did, again, say go to an expert to find out your specific needs. But generally speaking, as adults, we don't need a ton of protein.
If you want to feel satisfied, you don't eat protein but carbohydrates. Eating meat only and no/low carbs brings about Ketosis. You can listen to Dr. McDougall's interview with Dr. Atkins: http://www.drmcdougall.com/mcdougallcast/media/2007-05-03_01_track_1.mp3
Where did I say anything about ketosis or Atkins? You are apparently living in an all or nothing world. Examples you've used:
You either sit in front of a computer all day and need no protein or you are a body builder and need a lot.
You either eat primarily carbs or go into ketosis.
Your numbers on the amount of fat we "use" is just plain wrong, once again. Where did you get this 10% from? And if that's true how does someone like myself who eats about 80-100 grams of fat per day (mostly animal fat) have 9% body fat at 6'3" 220 pounds? By your numbers I should be a blimp.0 -
I said that 90% of fat eaten is stored on your body as fat. 10% therefore is used so, yes, fat is needed. But as the statistics show, 1/3 of Americans are overweight and 1/3 are obese. So do you tell them to eat fat? As I said, most here are here to lose fat so we can lose weight so we can be healthy again. I never said as a healthy person don't eat avocados and almonds and olive oil. Please check out the amount of fat there is in those three products and tell me, would you tell someone who just finished his or her work out to eat fat to eat back their calories?
Would you eat fat after your work-out? What is the point of exercise then?
Why does it have to be an all or nothing situation when consuming fat? Just have a nice, well-balanced meal meal that contains adequate carbs, protein and moderate fat after working out.
And as for the amount of fat that is stored on your body as fat, doesn't that depend more on how many calories are consumed?
If you are fit and not overweight or obese, then go ahead and enjoy.
Yes, calories from fat is important, so go look up olive oil and avocados and tell me if those numbers are good enough for you and then would you recommend to an over weight person to go ahead and eat.
Olive oil: calories from fat (%) is 149% saturated fat (total fat 332%) per 216 g serving
almonds: calories from fat (%) is 18% (total fat is 72%) per 95 g
avocados: calories from fat (%) is 16% (total fat is 34%) per 150 g
http://nutritiondata.self.com/facts/fats-and-oils/509/2
http://nutritiondata.self.com/facts/nut-and-seed-products/3085/2
http://nutritiondata.self.com/facts/fruits-and-fruit-juices/1843/2
The American Heart Association recommends up to 7% of saturated fat and no more of 1% trans fat.
http://www.americanheart.org/presenter.jhtml?identifier=4582
"Total fat intake (saturated, trans, monounsaturated, polyunsaturated) should be adjusted to fit total caloric needs. Overweight people should consume no more than 30 percent of total calories from fat."
Now that you have the facts, make up your own mind and see if you would recommend a person who just finished exercising and who wants to lose fat to eat these products.0 -
Well, animal fat is saturated fat, vegetable fat is either mono or poly. You can look up these types of fats. Saturated fats are clumped "tight" and is much denser than vegetable fat. This is why cooking and dipping oils are all considered liquid fat.
All fat is bad, but there are essential fats found in plants. So, I say this: fat is fat and fat (90%) of it will be placed as adipose tissue (under your skin and organs) because your body uses up carbs for engery first, then fat afterwards. Why would you work out and then eat olive oil or avocados when avocados have 34% fat per 150 g serving http://nutritiondata.self.com/facts/fruits-and-fruit-juices/1843/2 and olive oil has 332% fat per cup (216g). Now you say that you won't eat all that and that's fine, but that's still fat. Olive oil calories? 1910 Calories from Fat? 1910. http://nutritiondata.self.com/facts/fats-and-oils/509/2
So if the fat you eat can be easily stored, because your body uses carbs for energy when working out then fat, why would you eat fat especially if MFP advocates that we eat back our work out calories? If you are going to eat a salad (something healthy), why would you pour fat over it (olive oil)?
Now, I agree that body builders need protein, no doubt, but I did say, generally speaking, the rest of adults who don't need to build muscle don't need a lot of protein.
If you think you need meat to be strong, please watch this video:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eZwmluSn_T0
you say 'all fat is bad', but is it? I mean, are there actually any scientific studies that unequivocally show that fats (of any kind) are actually something we should avoid in totality? After all, that is what you are saying we should be doing if 'all fats are bad'.
I don't think it fair to compare avocados and olive oil. After all, you can't pour avocado juice over a salad in the way you do olive oil - each has its place in our diet and food choices. I certainly couldn't drink a cup of olive oil (I once tried it. I lost a challenge and the forfeit was to eat a huge chilli and drink the oil. I won't describe what it felt like)
I am happily an omnivore and firmly believe that we humans have evolved to be so. There are people who choose not to eat meat, and that is fine, but I do not think the nutritional or evolutionary argument holds water.
Total agreement here--not "all fats are bad." That's a gross generalization that could cause health problems for folks who decide to just nuke all the fat in their diet. Some vitamins require fat for proper breakdown and digestion. Skin and hair suffer with insufficient fat intake, as does hormone production and regulation (not to mention fertility). Cut fat back hard enough and even basic cellular functions begin to suffer. And good luck with that neuron myelination and cognitive development with a fat-free diet.
Kris0 -
As adults, we don't need fat (not as much as the American culture is consuming) and I did say our body uses 10% of fat, we need little protein unless you are the exception (like body building). And I did say to go to a nutritionist/doctor to determine YOUR protein needs. I think however, I can generalize and say that fat is bad. I'll make another generalization and say that refined sugar is bad as well.
I suppose you CAN make a generalization but its simply wrong. We absolutely do need fat. And what does that even mean: "our body uses 10% of fat"?
Again, EVERYONE needs more than a little protein. Again, if you want to have normal functioning cells and repair tissue then you need protein. If you want to stave off the natural loss of mucle mass as you age then you need protein. If you want to feel full and satsfied when you eat then you need protein.
I seriously can't tell if what you are posting is just misinformed copy pasta or outright lies. Either way, you're all the way wrong.
When I say our body uses 10% of fat, I mean our body uses out of the whole fat we consume, it uses 10% of it. I never said we don't need protein, I said we don't need a lot of it but that is specific to your lifestyle. So, if you are sitting in front of a computer all day and all night, you don't need a lot of protein. If you are a body builder, you need protein--not that hard and it is specific, I did, again, say go to an expert to find out your specific needs. But generally speaking, as adults, we don't need a ton of protein.
If you want to feel satisfied, you don't eat protein but carbohydrates. Eating meat only and no/low carbs brings about Ketosis. You can listen to Dr. McDougall's interview with Dr. Atkins: http://www.drmcdougall.com/mcdougallcast/media/2007-05-03_01_track_1.mp3
Where did I say anything about ketosis or Atkins? You are apparently living in an all or nothing world. Examples you've used:
You either sit in front of a computer all day and need no protein or you are a body builder and need a lot.
You either eat primarily carbs or go into ketosis.
Your numbers on the amount of fat we "use" is just plain wrong, once again. Where did you get this 10% from? And if that's true how does someone like myself who eats about 80-100 grams of fat per day (mostly animal fat) have 9% body fat at 6'3" 220 pounds? By your numbers I should be a blimp.
The 10% number I found from Dr. McDougall's book. As for your lifestyle, I do not know, you can answer that best.0 -
Well, animal fat is saturated fat, vegetable fat is either mono or poly. You can look up these types of fats. Saturated fats are clumped "tight" and is much denser than vegetable fat. This is why cooking and dipping oils are all considered liquid fat.
All fat is bad, but there are essential fats found in plants. So, I say this: fat is fat and fat (90%) of it will be placed as adipose tissue (under your skin and organs) because your body uses up carbs for engery first, then fat afterwards. Why would you work out and then eat olive oil or avocados when avocados have 34% fat per 150 g serving http://nutritiondata.self.com/facts/fruits-and-fruit-juices/1843/2 and olive oil has 332% fat per cup (216g). Now you say that you won't eat all that and that's fine, but that's still fat. Olive oil calories? 1910 Calories from Fat? 1910. http://nutritiondata.self.com/facts/fats-and-oils/509/2
So if the fat you eat can be easily stored, because your body uses carbs for energy when working out then fat, why would you eat fat especially if MFP advocates that we eat back our work out calories? If you are going to eat a salad (something healthy), why would you pour fat over it (olive oil)?
Now, I agree that body builders need protein, no doubt, but I did say, generally speaking, the rest of adults who don't need to build muscle don't need a lot of protein.
If you think you need meat to be strong, please watch this video:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eZwmluSn_T0
you say 'all fat is bad', but is it? I mean, are there actually any scientific studies that unequivocally show that fats (of any kind) are actually something we should avoid in totality? After all, that is what you are saying we should be doing if 'all fats are bad'.
I don't think it fair to compare avocados and olive oil. After all, you can't pour avocado juice over a salad in the way you do olive oil - each has its place in our diet and food choices. I certainly couldn't drink a cup of olive oil (I once tried it. I lost a challenge and the forfeit was to eat a huge chilli and drink the oil. I won't describe what it felt like)
I am happily an omnivore and firmly believe that we humans have evolved to be so. There are people who choose not to eat meat, and that is fine, but I do not think the nutritional or evolutionary argument holds water.
Total agreement here--not "all fats are bad." That's a gross generalization that could cause health problems for folks who decide to just nuke all the fat in their diet. Some vitamins require fat for proper breakdown and digestion. Skin and hair suffer with insufficient fat intake, as does hormone production and regulation (not to mention fertility). Cut fat back hard enough and even basic cellular functions begin to suffer. And good luck with that neuron myelination and cognitive development with a fat-free diet.
Kris
I did say there are essential fats found in plants. I ask that you listen to the podcast by Dr. John McDougall and Pritikin posted earlier as it talks about fat as it relates to cardio vascular disease.0 -
I said that 90% of fat eaten is stored on your body as fat. 10% therefore is used so, yes, fat is needed. But as the statistics show, 1/3 of Americans are overweight and 1/3 are obese. So do you tell them to eat fat? As I said, most here are here to lose fat so we can lose weight so we can be healthy again. I never said as a healthy person don't eat avocados and almonds and olive oil. Please check out the amount of fat there is in those three products and tell me, would you tell someone who just finished his or her work out to eat fat to eat back their calories?
Would you eat fat after your work-out? What is the point of exercise then?
Why does it have to be an all or nothing situation when consuming fat? Just have a nice, well-balanced meal meal that contains adequate carbs, protein and moderate fat after working out.
And as for the amount of fat that is stored on your body as fat, doesn't that depend more on how many calories are consumed?
If you are fit and not overweight or obese, then go ahead and enjoy.
Yes, calories from fat is important, so go look up olive oil and avocados and tell me if those numbers are good enough for you and then would you recommend to an over weight person to go ahead and eat.
Olive oil: calories from fat (%) is 149% saturated fat (total fat 332%) per 216 g serving
almonds: calories from fat (%) is 18% (total fat is 72%) per 95 g
avocados: calories from fat (%) is 16% (total fat is 34%) per 150 g
http://nutritiondata.self.com/facts/fats-and-oils/509/2
http://nutritiondata.self.com/facts/nut-and-seed-products/3085/2
http://nutritiondata.self.com/facts/fruits-and-fruit-juices/1843/2
The American Heart Association recommends up to 7% of saturated fat and no more of 1% trans fat.
http://www.americanheart.org/presenter.jhtml?identifier=4582
"Total fat intake (saturated, trans, monounsaturated, polyunsaturated) should be adjusted to fit total caloric needs. Overweight people should consume no more than 30 percent of total calories from fat."
Now that you have the facts, make up your own mind and see if you would recommend a person who just finished exercising and who wants to lose fat to eat these products.
Please re-read my post. Out of all that stuff you just said, the only thing that relates to what I said is
""Total fat intake (saturated, trans, monounsaturated, polyunsaturated) should be adjusted to fit total caloric needs. Overweight people should consume no more than 30 percent of total calories from fat."
.....which is to have a nice balanced meal with a moderate amount of fat with adequate carb and protein.0 -
Rae, I would encourage you to do your own research and find out what the body uses for energy first: carbs or fat (google search it and you'll find out that the body uses carbs for energy and then fat and then muscle). You will also find out that adults need very little protein (unless you are rebuilding muscle) and so you should check with a professional (nutrionist/trainer) what your specific protein needs are as you are exercising. But generally speaking, adults do not need a lot of protein, not when you compare it to our need for carbohydrates. Lastly, do not consume (any) type of fat, especially animal fat. Animal fat is a denser fat compared to vegetable fat and it offers nothing in terms of "essentials" whereas plant fat is "lighter" (not saturated) and has the essential nutrients. For more information about carbs, proteins and fat, read some of Dr. John McDougall's books and read up on his opinion on the carbs vs protein debate.
Good health to you.
I would love to see you go up against some of the low carb zealots here...honestly, it would be fun to watch...lol. At least you are of the understanding that when carbs are ingested and insulin goes up, your body is still burning energy....just not from lipids.0 -
I said that 90% of fat eaten is stored on your body as fat. 10% therefore is used so, yes, fat is needed. But as the statistics show, 1/3 of Americans are overweight and 1/3 are obese. So do you tell them to eat fat? As I said, most here are here to lose fat so we can lose weight so we can be healthy again. I never said as a healthy person don't eat avocados and almonds and olive oil. Please check out the amount of fat there is in those three products and tell me, would you tell someone who just finished his or her work out to eat fat to eat back their calories?
Would you eat fat after your work-out? What is the point of exercise then?
Why does it have to be an all or nothing situation when consuming fat? Just have a nice, well-balanced meal meal that contains adequate carbs, protein and moderate fat after working out.
And as for the amount of fat that is stored on your body as fat, doesn't that depend more on how many calories are consumed?
If you are fit and not overweight or obese, then go ahead and enjoy.
Yes, calories from fat is important, so go look up olive oil and avocados and tell me if those numbers are good enough for you and then would you recommend to an over weight person to go ahead and eat.
Olive oil: calories from fat (%) is 149% saturated fat (total fat 332%) per 216 g serving
almonds: calories from fat (%) is 18% (total fat is 72%) per 95 g
avocados: calories from fat (%) is 16% (total fat is 34%) per 150 g
http://nutritiondata.self.com/facts/fats-and-oils/509/2
http://nutritiondata.self.com/facts/nut-and-seed-products/3085/2
http://nutritiondata.self.com/facts/fruits-and-fruit-juices/1843/2
The American Heart Association recommends up to 7% of saturated fat and no more of 1% trans fat.
http://www.americanheart.org/presenter.jhtml?identifier=4582
"Total fat intake (saturated, trans, monounsaturated, polyunsaturated) should be adjusted to fit total caloric needs. Overweight people should consume no more than 30 percent of total calories from fat."
Now that you have the facts, make up your own mind and see if you would recommend a person who just finished exercising and who wants to lose fat to eat these products.
Please re-read my post. Out of all that stuff you just said, the only thing that relates to what I said is
""Total fat intake (saturated, trans, monounsaturated, polyunsaturated) should be adjusted to fit total caloric needs. Overweight people should consume no more than 30 percent of total calories from fat."
.....which is to have a nice balanced meal with a moderate amount of fat with adequate carb and protein.
I wasn't disagreeing with you. But as an overweight person who needs to eat back their calories, would you eat fat or something else? The original post was that he was concerned with being over in carbs and was thinking of upping protein and fat and was asking for information.
My point is, if you are going to exercise to lose weight (fat and not muscle), why would you eat fatty foods? Again, if you are healthy, go ahead and eat a balanced meal. So I am not a either one way or nothing IF you are healthy.0 -
Rae, I would encourage you to do your own research and find out what the body uses for energy first: carbs or fat (google search it and you'll find out that the body uses carbs for energy and then fat and then muscle). You will also find out that adults need very little protein (unless you are rebuilding muscle) and so you should check with a professional (nutrionist/trainer) what your specific protein needs are as you are exercising. But generally speaking, adults do not need a lot of protein, not when you compare it to our need for carbohydrates. Lastly, do not consume (any) type of fat, especially animal fat. Animal fat is a denser fat compared to vegetable fat and it offers nothing in terms of "essentials" whereas plant fat is "lighter" (not saturated) and has the essential nutrients. For more information about carbs, proteins and fat, read some of Dr. John McDougall's books and read up on his opinion on the carbs vs protein debate.
Good health to you.
I would love to see you go up against some of the low carb zealots here...honestly, it would be fun to watch...lol. At least you are of the understanding that when carbs are ingested and insulin goes up, your body is still burning energy....just not from lipids.
I said earlier that a high protein/low carb no carb diet works, I have no doubt and gave a podcast url where Dr. Atkins talks to Dr. McDougall where they discuss their diametrically opposed diets and how they both agree that for overweight people, fat and refined sugar is the enemy and should be restricted.
I personally stopped eating meat because I am worried about other things. But this is because I am not healthy and I am overweight. When I talk to someone on this forum, I assume that people are overweight and want to lose weight and by that, lose fat.
So, if I had to chose from foods high in carbs but low in fat and foods high in fat and low in carbs, I would pick high in carbs but low in fat.0
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