If calories is a calorie-what's the issue with Sugar then? how to reduce intake? HELP!

goldthistime · August 2016

Could someone familiar with the subject help me understand the differences between glucose and fructose? And for that matter, the difference between fructose in fruit and the fructose in HFCS? I'd just google but a quick peek earlier had me concerned about the reliability of the source I was reading. Is it true, for instance, that fructose has a lower glycemic index? And yet has more potential to harm the liver if consumed in excess than glucose?

ninerbuff · August 2016

goldthistime wrote: »

Could someone familiar with the subject help me understand the differences between glucose and fructose? And for that matter, the difference between fructose in fruit and the fructose in HFCS? I'd just google but a quick peek earlier had me concerned about the reliability of the source I was reading. Is it true, for instance, that fructose has a lower glycemic index? And yet has more potential to harm the liver if consumed in excess than glucose?

Aaron_K123 is a molecular biologist and I believe he linked some sources to it, but I can't seem to find the thread. Maybe PM him?

A.C.E. Certified Personal and Group Fitness Trainer
IDEA Fitness member
Kickboxing Certified Instructor
Been in fitness for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition

goldthistime · August 2016

ninerbuff wrote: »

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goldthistime wrote: »

Could someone familiar with the subject help me understand the differences between glucose and fructose? And for that matter, the difference between fructose in fruit and the fructose in HFCS? I'd just google but a quick peek earlier had me concerned about the reliability of the source I was reading. Is it true, for instance, that fructose has a lower glycemic index? And yet has more potential to harm the liver if consumed in excess than glucose?

Aaron_K123 is a molecular biologist and I believe he linked some sources to it, but I can't seem to find the thread. Maybe PM him?

A.C.E. Certified Personal and Group Fitness Trainer
IDEA Fitness member
Kickboxing Certified Instructor
Been in fitness for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition

I will. Thanks.

rankinsect · August 2016

goldthistime wrote: »

Could someone familiar with the subject help me understand the differences between glucose and fructose? And for that matter, the difference between fructose in fruit and the fructose in HFCS? I'd just google but a quick peek earlier had me concerned about the reliability of the source I was reading. Is it true, for instance, that fructose has a lower glycemic index? And yet has more potential to harm the liver if consumed in excess than glucose?

Glucose and fructose are two different types of sugar. Sugar isn't a single substance, but rather a class of chemicals. Table sugar, sucrose, is actually a disaccharide - a chemical composed of two simpler sugars joined together (glucose and fructose).

Glucose is one of the more important sugars in the body. It forms an important energy source for muscle and brain tissue, but in higher levels is toxic to the body, requiring liver, muscle, and fat cells to store any excess lest it build to harmful levels.

Fructose is another type of sugar, one that is nearly entirely broken down by the liver rather than metabolized by the body tissue. It's mostly turned into glucose, or other carbohydrates (lactate, etc.).

Fructose isn't necessarily a bad thing. Consuming fructose along with glucose actually increases insulin sensitivity compared to glucose by itself, even in diabetics - making blood sugar control easier. Fructose is also sweeter tasting than glucose, so you can use a bit less of it. Fructose also is lower in calories per gram (due to requiring more energy to process).

Some studies have suggested a link between excessive fructose consumption and harm, but these tend to be one of two types:
1. Animal studies that give animals absurdly high amounts of fructose.
2. Correlation studies in humans, which are overall weak evidence for anything.

HFCS is made by breaking corn starch down into glucose, and then converting some of the glucose into fructose (HFCS is about 55% fructose / 45% glucose, compared to table sugar which is 50/50). It's a very popular sweetener particularly in the US due to corn subsidies making this a very, very cheap sweetener. There's no chemical difference between fructose from HFCS versus from any other source.

People consuming lots of HFCS tend to be more obese and less healthy, but it's not valid to make the claim that it's caused by the HFCS - people who eat a large amount of HFCS are eating large amounts of highly processed foods, and there are sure to be many aspects of their diet and lifestyle that differ from those who consume little to no HFCS.

psuLemon · August 2016

heartofplastic wrote: »

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viren19890 wrote: »

Saw a documentary "Fed up" and "Sugar Coated"

are there different types of sugar? like good sugar vs bad sugar? sugar in fruit vs sugarcane vs jaggery vs molasses vs honey?

How do I reduce my intake? -i'm not diabetic or have any one in my family or extended family suffering from it or have history of but those documentaries make me think.

I finally accepted that eating a pizza vs eating regular home made food is no different for weight loss as long as I maintain a deficit and now this?

The more I learn the more confused I get -who is right? who is wrong?

I'm not an expert but I've read that not all calories are equal because it takes a different amount of calories for your body to digest it after it's been consumed. For instance, 100 calories of carrots is not exactly the same as a 100 calorie cookie because your body will burn more calories digesting the carrots (some veggies like celery and broccoli are known to have "negative calories" because of this) so in the end, the 100 calorie carrot is a much better choice than the 100 calorie cookie... Or so I've read, but that was in just one article so who knows.

The argument against a cookie (which in many cases has more fat than sugar) vs a veggies is the macronutrient and micronutrient profile. Comparing one item against another is not really a good argument since peoples diets are a composition of multiple foods. Overall, a healthy or even unhealthy diet could have both of those foods in it. This is why many on this board advocator for a diet of wholesome food, but if you do have a little bit of calories left over, than it's ok to incorporate some treats, especially if you feel it's going to help you stay on track. A lot of people tend to forget that dieting is also a psychological battle.

stevencloser · August 2016

psulemon wrote: »

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Raptor2763 wrote: »

A calorie is NOT a calorie - THAT'S the issue. Calories from proteins, fat, and sugar are used in a set sequence. To be clear, sugar is fairly common. I think what you're referring to is refined sugar - as in the kind found in candy, cake frosting, or even the cake itself. Calories from refined sugar - also called "empty calories - have ZERO nutritional value (hence the term "empty").

Now, if the best solution is to avoid the problem, how to deal with refined sugar?
1. You're gonna have to become expert at reading labels. HINT: anything ending in "ose" such as "sucrose", "dextrose", or "glucose" should trigger a red flag. Also, be on the lookout for sugar-type substitutes, like stevia and truvia.
2. Shopping the periphery of the store physically avoids the problem - the sugar-laden products are on the shelves in the middle.

BTW - same general idea holds for salt. You'll find all the salt you need in the food you eat. No need for more.

Just pointing out that the body runs on glucose. It's so important that if you don't eat enough of it, your body will produce it through glucenogenesis.

Also would like to point out that cakes are mainly fat and many cookies have less sugar than many fruits. They are just void of fiber.

OP, there are a variety of sugars and largely they are processed the same, with the exception of fructose. Either way, one should look to get adequate nutrition and not consume large amounts of added sugar.

And even the fructose is in large parts turned to glucose.

viren19890 · August 2016

So basically it was indeed a "shockumentary". Whatever I thought I learned was not worth learning however, I did see them talking about a study done on rats/mice- in which they were given cocaine and sugar water and they got addicted to sugar water lol

Basically sugar is sugar -it was to make things easier for people to understand when one did not have fancy calculators or websites with the label of "good" vs "bad" -there was nothing inherently bad in ice-cream sugar vs sugar in an apple other than the whole caloric levels and composition of the said food item.

Good to learn another lesson in nutrition.

Thanks all the posters.

Carlos_421 · August 2016

viren19890 wrote: »

So basically it was indeed a "shockumentary". Whatever I thought I learned was not worth learning however, I did see them talking about a study done on rats/mice- in which they were given cocaine and sugar water and they got addicted to sugar water lol

Basically sugar is sugar -it was to make things easier for people to understand when one did not have fancy calculators or websites with the label of "good" vs "bad" -there was nothing inherently bad in ice-cream sugar vs sugar in an apple other than the whole caloric levels and composition of the said food item.

Good to learn another lesson in nutrition.

Thanks all the posters.

Exactly.
And even that rat study...it only showed that rats would rather eat than get high.

PaulaWallaDingDong · August 2016

Carlos_421 wrote: »

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viren19890 wrote: »

So basically it was indeed a "shockumentary". Whatever I thought I learned was not worth learning however, I did see them talking about a study done on rats/mice- in which they were given cocaine and sugar water and they got addicted to sugar water lol

Basically sugar is sugar -it was to make things easier for people to understand when one did not have fancy calculators or websites with the label of "good" vs "bad" -there was nothing inherently bad in ice-cream sugar vs sugar in an apple other than the whole caloric levels and composition of the said food item.

Good to learn another lesson in nutrition.

Thanks all the posters.

Exactly.
And even that rat study...it only showed that rats would rather eat than get high.

Good for the rats. So many people can't even pull off priorities like that.

Unknown · August 2016

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upoffthemat · August 2016

lemurcat12 wrote: »

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J72FIT wrote: »

Budjola wrote: »

good sugar would be the one that u got or took while eating veggies and fruit, bad one would be from sodas and stuff

But the sugar is the same...

I think I've finally figured this out. Please excuse the rather passe or sexist analogies.

A good girl hangs out with nice, respectful, well-dressed boys who get good grades. A bad girl lurks around with the smokers who swear and drink and skip class. Both girls may be the same in terms of their own actual behavior, but they are judged by their companions.

Good sugars and bad sugars are the same, but one hangs out with fiber and lots of micros (or just looks all respectable, since those in a banana don't actually come with much fiber). The other (the bad one) hangs out with fat and calories.

It's all about judging by appearance and association!

Hmm. Or maybe it's an anti immigration thing: good sugars stay where they started out. Bad sugars go somewhere else.

This may be the best thing I have read on here in months

hamlet1222 · August 2016

Only problem with sugar is its easy to go over your daily calorie requirement with it, especially from drinks. Complex carbs fill you up more and a harder to overconsume.

cerise_noir · August 2016

ninerbuff wrote: »

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Raptor2763 wrote: »

A calorie is NOT a calorie - THAT'S the issue.

So a question: if I have 1 liter of water and 1 liter of soda, are you saying the liter of soda isn't a liter?

A.C.E. Certified Personal and Group Fitness Trainer
IDEA Fitness member
Kickboxing Certified Instructor
Been in fitness for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition

So much this. It annoys the crap out of me whenever I see 'a calorie is not a calorie'. It's basic *kitten* science.

jessiferrrb · August 2016

BreezeDoveal wrote: »

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psulemon wrote: »

BreezeDoveal wrote: »

SusanMFindlay wrote: »

BreezeDoveal wrote: »

SusanMFindlay wrote: »

BreezeDoveal wrote: »

I think if they made people have to stop and think when crossing into the nutrition desert of the center aisles, that might make America great again, or at least make our waists not so great. They could even have passports. You'd get less pages to stamp and limit your visits for some people.

So, we should have to "stop and think" before we're allowed access to the dried beans, oats, frozen fruits and frozen vegetables? All of which are in the center aisles in my grocery store (and most others I've been to). But the cakes and ready-made meals (on the perimeter) are fine? I don't think so.

Or maybe you'd have to think about what grocery store you go to if they think that's a good way to organize food.

I go to the grocery store that has the best selection of fresh produce and the best prices. There's no inherent reason to put "healthier" foods around the edges of the store. I'd be very surprised if your grocery store has oats and legumes on the edges either. Edges tend to be bakery, produce, deli and fish. Plus whatever else fits - which tends to include convenience foods since they have those right at the front to stimulate impulse buying (and near to deli so as to take advantage of the cold shelves).

We have our route that takes us past all the important sections and skip the ones we're not interested in.

Well if you'd let me get in there and redo the grocery store, it'd be great. Real top-notch, designer quality food arrangement, let me tell ya. You'd love the lay out, I really think you would. We'd take back the impulse buys and make these diets great again.

If it's not wegmans i am not going. And they can only out so much on the outside.

You can just make the outside bigger. This is why I'm a big picture guy, real top notch thinking. No one thinks outside the box or boxed food like I do.

breeze gives great trump

If calories is a calorie-what's the issue with Sugar then? how to reduce intake? HELP!

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