Protein after running
Replies
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Angelfire365 wrote: »I'm noticing about half the comments are taking the perspective the question is about lifting, and timing for meals/snacks there.
Just to be clear this about a long run - aerobic endurance. Which is different.
Though I'd wager the question with idea that protein is main thing to think about was taken from lifting advice that was read.
Then again as many pointed out and applies no matter which sport - if general training isn't at elite level (must you hit elite performance to be doing daily strenuous elite level though?) - then it doesn't matter to performance.
I'm not sure if I'm understanding you correctly but why would a performance not matter for training irrespective of beginner, intermediate or elite.
Are you suggesting "general training" cannot be gauged by performance and that performance is only restrictive to "elites"?
Tad confused. What is the difference between an 'elite' athlete running for 4 hours and being exhausted and my fat *kitten* running around the block for 20 minutes and being exhausted? Not trying to be snippy, honest question.
Well, it's like this...an elite athlete is going to need every possible edge he/she can get to compete with and defeat another elite athlete...so for an elite athlete timing of meals and whatnot may give them that tiny little edge...that tiny little edge is more or less irrelevant for the vast majority...it's kind of like getting on a golf course for the first time and you have $10K worth of clubs and thinking they're going to make you a better golfer at that skill level.
All that aside, I do believe recovery is important at any level when you've done a long endurance event...but typically it's carbs and some protein...but mostly carbs to replenish glycogen to prevent the body from breaking down protein and muscle.0 -
Both are opinions and offer no scientific clinical evidence that taking protein immediately after a workout SIGNIFICANTLY helps with recovery or rebuilding.scorpio516 wrote: »
Great for ELITE ORIENTEERING RUNNERS. For others, not so much.
Done over a 4 hour period and in 30 minute intervals. Mentions nothing of just taking in one supplementation and measuring from there.
The truth is this is more hype than reality. The supplementation companies want you to believe you NEED supplementation after training. Not saying it's a bad thing, just saying that if one is trying to lose weight, adding these extra calories for no real benefit may not be worth it. One doesn't NEED to do it.
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That's the OPTIMAL time stated, but again if one isn't an elite athlete, you'd likely get the same results from doing it 2 hours later.Packerjohn wrote: »Why do you need protein after a long run?
A.C.E. Certified Personal and Group Fitness Trainer
IDEA Fitness member
Kickboxing Certified Instructor
Been in fitness for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition
1) Because microtears happen in your leg muscles, and tendons. And it's a good idea to help them repair. Some reason lifters use protein after the lift.I will agree for the average Joe Runner running in a 5K/10K it's not that big of a deal, but it's still nice to keep your body up and working properly.
2) Because some Whey Proteins do contain Potassium which will help with some joint pains. Yea I agree you can get potassium from Bananas and/or Kiwis as well. And yes I know that most sanctioned events do give out bananas post run.
3) If you're drinking a protein shake the liquid from the shake will help hydrate you.
So if you do a Recovery Protein shake you can knock three of those out with one drink.....
I would agree all the above is important for someone who exercises. However the timing is pretty inconsequential. Does not have to be done right after a run.
Within a 30-45 min window is what I've always been told, and I have read. I'm not by any stretch implying it has to be done as soon as you're done taking your last running step.
A.C.E. Certified Personal and Group Fitness Trainer
IDEA Fitness member
Kickboxing Certified Instructor
Been in fitness for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition 0 -
You could do the same with a Gatorade sans protein for a cheaper price.
*picking fly crap out of pepper ......
Depends on how much your paying for your Protein. I'm paying roughly 50 cents per serving on my Whey. I've been getting mine from MyProtein here recently. Also has to do with how much your paying for Gatorade or PowerAde.
But all in all. I do agree with you. They is more than one to skin a cat.
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Angelfire365 wrote: »I'm noticing about half the comments are taking the perspective the question is about lifting, and timing for meals/snacks there.
Just to be clear this about a long run - aerobic endurance. Which is different.
Though I'd wager the question with idea that protein is main thing to think about was taken from lifting advice that was read.
Then again as many pointed out and applies no matter which sport - if general training isn't at elite level (must you hit elite performance to be doing daily strenuous elite level though?) - then it doesn't matter to performance.
I'm not sure if I'm understanding you correctly but why would a performance not matter for training irrespective of beginner, intermediate or elite.
Are you suggesting "general training" cannot be gauged by performance and that performance is only restrictive to "elites"?
Tad confused. What is the difference between an 'elite' athlete running for 4 hours and being exhausted and my fat *kitten* running around the block for 20 minutes and being exhausted? Not trying to be snippy, honest question.
Well, from a micro-tear/muscle damage/recovery perspective, an elite athlete will probably have covered about 35 miles in that time and that's a lot of running impact on the body!
Even a non-elite (properly trained first-time marathoner) will have run close to a marathon in that time.
That was a response to someone asking if they are tired after 20 min would it be the same... easy answer there is no, not the same at all.
In addition our bodies are be able to use the food you ate earlier in the day, or that you will eat within the next 24 hours and performance wouldn't be any different than if they ate/drank right after their run. Other than for long distance events, meal timing is overrated and you would be more apt to focus on overall nutrition, once you hit that and are getting close to your genetic limits, then it may be time to start focusing on meal timing to see if it will give you that extra 1% edge you need at competitive levels.
Yes, I realize - I was simply adding that elite, non-elite, it would hardly matter. 4 hrs of running is vastly different than 20 min of running.0 -
What do most people consider a "long run?"
Since it's a term mostly used in training programs, it's relative to your current distance capability. It's common to do one long run per week.
For me, that'd be 6+mi right now. I took some time off and am just starting back. I have to work back up to half-marathon distances. Before my break, a long run would typically be 12+mi.0 -
I'm noticing about half the comments are taking the perspective the question is about lifting, and timing for meals/snacks there.
Just to be clear this about a long run - aerobic endurance. Which is different.
Though I'd wager the question with idea that protein is main thing to think about was taken from lifting advice that was read.
Then again as many pointed out and applies no matter which sport - if general training isn't at elite level (must you hit elite performance to be doing daily strenuous elite level though?) - then it doesn't matter to performance.
I'm not sure if I'm understanding you correctly but why would a performance not matter for training irrespective of beginner, intermediate or elite.
Are you suggesting "general training" cannot be gauged by performance and that performance is only restrictive to "elites"?
Because a non-elite beginner pushing themselves to the same 85% of VO2max or HRmax for the same amount of time as an elite advanced athlete is pushing their body just as hard.
Just because their pace or speed doesn't match the elite - if the time and level of effort does - they are doing elite level training.
A few of the comments seemed to be leaning that performance needed to match what an elite athlete would be doing.
And that's just not true either. Many people are doing workouts with a slower pace/speed, but just as long and hard as someone "elite".
Even the comment above about the faster pace would lead to more pounding. Huh - if weight were equal.
Add 20 lbs and slow them down - is impact still that significantly more (if even) by the faster pace doing more miles?
But of course individual performance matters - to your own level, perhaps compared to someone at same level also.
But don't do it by pace or speed for good comparison. If 2 people have an LT that is 85% of their HRmax, and their workout is getting to avg 95% of LT - then they are having very equal workouts, never mind if one is pulling 8 min miles, and the other 10 min miles because of a weight difference.
And if the 10 min miler did 90 min today, and is doing another 60-90 min tomorrow - they could benefit just as much from a well timed post workout snack as much as the "elite" person doing say 7 min miles of same time.
Performance in comparison to an "elite" athlete is not indicative of the level of effort put into a workout.0 -
The faster pace would lead to more pounding in my example above because the question was comparing a heavier person running for 20 minutes to an elite running for 4 hours!!!0
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Angelfire365 wrote: »I'm noticing about half the comments are taking the perspective the question is about lifting, and timing for meals/snacks there.
Just to be clear this about a long run - aerobic endurance. Which is different.
Though I'd wager the question with idea that protein is main thing to think about was taken from lifting advice that was read.
Then again as many pointed out and applies no matter which sport - if general training isn't at elite level (must you hit elite performance to be doing daily strenuous elite level though?) - then it doesn't matter to performance.
I'm not sure if I'm understanding you correctly but why would a performance not matter for training irrespective of beginner, intermediate or elite.
Are you suggesting "general training" cannot be gauged by performance and that performance is only restrictive to "elites"?
Tad confused. What is the difference between an 'elite' athlete running for 4 hours and being exhausted and my fat *kitten* running around the block for 20 minutes and being exhausted? Not trying to be snippy, honest question.
Some good responses from others on this already. I'll add another one,
Priorities
If someone is exhausted from hauling their fat *kitten* around the block for 20 minutes they most likely need a good bit of work with conditioning and diet in general. Nutrient timing is getting into the trivial many of sports performance and nutrition. A person in that situation needs to be concerned with the significant few i.e., the Pareto principal.0 -
BasicGreatGuy wrote: »What do most people consider a "long run?"
I consider 20+ miles a long run, as I usually run anywhere from 13 - 15 miles a day during the weekday, with my long run on Saturday. I did run 26.3 miles yesterday though, and will do another 25 miles on Saturday.
A new person would consider 5 - 7 miles a long run.
It all depends on who you ask.
That is freaking Impressive 25 miles WOW!! Great job dude!!1 -
I'm noticing about half the comments are taking the perspective the question is about lifting, and timing for meals/snacks there.
Just to be clear this about a long run - aerobic endurance. Which is different.
Though I'd wager the question with idea that protein is main thing to think about was taken from lifting advice that was read.
Then again as many pointed out and applies no matter which sport - if general training isn't at elite level (must you hit elite performance to be doing daily strenuous elite level though?) - then it doesn't matter to performance.
I'm not sure if I'm understanding you correctly but why would a performance not matter for training irrespective of beginner, intermediate or elite.
Are you suggesting "general training" cannot be gauged by performance and that performance is only restrictive to "elites"?
Because a non-elite beginner pushing themselves to the same 85% of VO2max or HRmax for the same amount of time as an elite advanced athlete is pushing their body just as hard.
The chance that a non-elite beginner could push themselves that hard for the same length an elite athlete could, is not probable. By training an elite athlete would have increased their V02 Max, and their threshold for training at those levels, so your point is quite moot. Better to spend their energy on increasing V02Max, and training threshold, than meal timing (which would only increase times, if at all, a fraction of what they would get from proper training and overall nutrition)0 -
protein after a run can be great for muscle recovery. I use 4 to 1 carb to protein gels during long runs and I really notice a difference. You don't need it after easy runs necessarily, but depending on your protein intake overall, post-run could be a good time. Sometimes I just do BCAAs or a I highly recommend after hard runs and races. My favorite post long run/hard run/workout is Endurox by Pacific Health Labs. it has all the protein, carbs and electrolytes you need. there's plenty of stuff out there, but I love this the most.0
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During the week after my short to medium distance runs, I generally have a high protein breakfast of greek yogurt. I also like General Mill's high protein oatmeal if I'm in the mood for something else. I can add milk to that to get even more protein. Of course milk in my coffee after the run 8)
After my big weekend workouts then I generally have some chocolate milk. Cold, delicious, and high in protein. Yeah, sign me up. I'd drink it even if it didn't do anything for me!0 -
Packerjohn wrote: »Angelfire365 wrote: »I'm noticing about half the comments are taking the perspective the question is about lifting, and timing for meals/snacks there.
Just to be clear this about a long run - aerobic endurance. Which is different.
Though I'd wager the question with idea that protein is main thing to think about was taken from lifting advice that was read.
Then again as many pointed out and applies no matter which sport - if general training isn't at elite level (must you hit elite performance to be doing daily strenuous elite level though?) - then it doesn't matter to performance.
I'm not sure if I'm understanding you correctly but why would a performance not matter for training irrespective of beginner, intermediate or elite.
Are you suggesting "general training" cannot be gauged by performance and that performance is only restrictive to "elites"?
Tad confused. What is the difference between an 'elite' athlete running for 4 hours and being exhausted and my fat *kitten* running around the block for 20 minutes and being exhausted? Not trying to be snippy, honest question.
Some good responses from others on this already. I'll add another one,
Priorities
If someone is exhausted from hauling their fat *kitten* around the block for 20 minutes they most likely need a good bit of work with conditioning and diet in general. Nutrient timing is getting into the trivial many of sports performance and nutrition. A person in that situation needs to be concerned with the significant few i.e., the Pareto principal.
The 'significat few' being the conditioning and diet in general?
And thanks to everyone for their answers!! I was always told the 30 to 45 minute have-to-eat-protein. I can get away with my usual toast as long as I meet my protein goals for the day is what I'm picking up from this. You're all awesome!1 -
Usually a cup of milk, couple bites of leftover steak and handful of smokehouse almonds...0
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FORM (from Le-Vel) is the best post workout supplement that I've experienced, it gives you 15g of collagen protein and the best part is you aren't hungry after you take it!-1
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It depends on your training intensity. In the mornings I like to get 30g of carbs before training, and depending on what the workout will be I'll couple that with 30 grams of protein. I usually eat 25-35g of Carbs and 50g of protein within 30 minutes of my run. Depending on how I feel when I wake up I may just have the carbs and take 25g of protein before I hit the showers.0
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After a run and/or long work out I prefer a protein shake that has little to no sugar. The one that I drink I actually pair with water. It is 6oz's, 70 calories, with two sugars.0
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I'm noticing about half the comments are taking the perspective the question is about lifting, and timing for meals/snacks there.
Just to be clear this about a long run - aerobic endurance. Which is different.
Though I'd wager the question with idea that protein is main thing to think about was taken from lifting advice that was read.
Then again as many pointed out and applies no matter which sport - if general training isn't at elite level (must you hit elite performance to be doing daily strenuous elite level though?) - then it doesn't matter to performance.
I'm not sure if I'm understanding you correctly but why would a performance not matter for training irrespective of beginner, intermediate or elite.
Are you suggesting "general training" cannot be gauged by performance and that performance is only restrictive to "elites"?
Because a non-elite beginner pushing themselves to the same 85% of VO2max or HRmax for the same amount of time as an elite advanced athlete is pushing their body just as hard.
The chance that a non-elite beginner could push themselves that hard for the same length an elite athlete could, is not probable. By training an elite athlete would have increased their V02 Max, and their threshold for training at those levels, so your point is quite moot. Better to spend their energy on increasing V02Max, and training threshold, than meal timing (which would only increase times, if at all, a fraction of what they would get from proper training and overall nutrition)
By beginner we aren't talking couch potato last week, merely someone that doesn't have the time to workout as frequent and hard as elite to increase those fitness stats, and perhaps carries extra 20-30 lbs.
But a non-elite beginner is going to have a lower VO2max for exactly as you point out - not in same fitness shape, or heavier which would mask their potential VO2max. (mL / KG / min)
Elite is at say VO2max of 93% of HRmax, beginner is VO2max of 70% of HRmax.
So it is just as easy for beginner as the elite to hit that same 85% of VO2max, and likely for extended times.
Let's put some real numbers to it.
Elite at HRmax 190 bpm, VO2max at 177, endurance workout at 150.
Beginner at HRmax 185 bpm, VO2max at 130, endurance workout at 111. That ain't that high.
I know several that are in that boat, and they can do a bike ride for 2-4 hrs at that low HR when they have time for it, and during the summer have been daily almost.
One just told me how wasted he was after 4 days in a row of doing that. Really observed how tired and slow on ride by 3rd and especially 4th day.
He was putting his aerobic system and muscles through the same level of workout as someone in much better fitness shape doing the same length of workout at same intensity.
His is diet in tip/top shape - probably not.
Is it that hard to eat 400-600 calories of snack and/or meal after the workout to aid having a good one tomorrow - not exactly.
If that low-hanging fruit of a post workout snack helps to have more intense workout the next day - improvement will be faster overall. Could it be obtained purely from optimal diet/macros - that sounds harder actually, but perhaps.
And ya - how is steak left over till morning.0
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