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Elementary School Gym teachers telling kids to restrict calories!
Replies
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As for the rising obesity rates, that is squarely on the adults in the kids life. By middle school they already have observed years of adult behavior and if the adults in their lives eat in an unhealthy manner, the kids will too. It is not the teacher's job to correct bad habits learned at home.
I can certainly see how ensuring absolutely nothing that might provide a counterpoint to the bad habits that are impressed upon them at home should be occurring at school. We'll just accept that type 2 diabetes has now become common enough in children that it can no longer be called adult onset diabetes, that pediatricians have to have bariatric scales in their offices, and that teenagers are getting gastric sleeves.
Let's employ that same strategy with sex ed while we're at it. We'd hate to arm kids with factual information that could potentially prevent them from ever having to face the serious medical consequences of uninformed choices.2 -
heiliskrimsli wrote: »As for the rising obesity rates, that is squarely on the adults in the kids life. By middle school they already have observed years of adult behavior and if the adults in their lives eat in an unhealthy manner, the kids will too. It is not the teacher's job to correct bad habits learned at home.
I can certainly see how ensuring absolutely nothing that might provide a counterpoint to the bad habits that are impressed upon them at home should be occurring at school. We'll just accept that type 2 diabetes has now become common enough in children that it can no longer be called adult onset diabetes, that pediatricians have to have bariatric scales in their offices, and that teenagers are getting gastric sleeves.
Let's employ that same strategy with sex ed while we're at it. We'd hate to arm kids with factual information that could potentially prevent them from ever having to face the serious medical consequences of uninformed choices.
You are being selective, you have deliberately cropped out the rest of the response which clearly stated teaching children about nutrition should absolutely be done but that healthy behaviours start in the home. Kids don't get obese at school, they get obese from what their parents allow them to eat.10 -
heiliskrimsli wrote: »As for the rising obesity rates, that is squarely on the adults in the kids life. By middle school they already have observed years of adult behavior and if the adults in their lives eat in an unhealthy manner, the kids will too. It is not the teacher's job to correct bad habits learned at home.
I can certainly see how ensuring absolutely nothing that might provide a counterpoint to the bad habits that are impressed upon them at home should be occurring at school. We'll just accept that type 2 diabetes has now become common enough in children that it can no longer be called adult onset diabetes, that pediatricians have to have bariatric scales in their offices, and that teenagers are getting gastric sleeves.
Let's employ that same strategy with sex ed while we're at it. We'd hate to arm kids with factual information that could potentially prevent them from ever having to face the serious medical consequences of uninformed choices.
I feel like you're either willfully misconstruing what people are saying, or ignoring many of the salient points. Can you point to where someone said that we should mention absolutely nothing or ignore health and nutrition for and the concept of calories and energy balance for children? What I, and I think @earlnabby and others are saying is that it is a stepwise progression based on what the children are ready to understand - from both a conceptual and a practical perspective. Introduce the concept and the basics when they are in elementary school. Talk about how some foods are more nutritious than others, and that nutrition is important for fueling their growing bodies and minds. At that point, they aren't choosing the foods, their parents are. As they grow older, talk about choices that they may be starting to make, and introduce more of the mathematical piece so they understand what impact their choices will have. Eventually you can have them start counting calories, but it may never even be necessary for children, if the foundation is built properly.
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coreyreichle wrote: »
You do understand that caloric intake is the foundation upon which nutrition lies, right? Maco and micro ratios are ratios dependent on the whole caloric total. Hard to figure those out, if you don't know what you're taking in...
The bigger question is, do you understand age appropriateness when it comes to calorie counting and nutrition? 11 year olds are too young to be counting calories. They are NOT too young to learn about what makes a high calorie or low calorie food and what makes up good nutrition and a balanced diet. They are at the age where they are beginning to learn about fat, protein, and carbohydrates. Pushing them to actually COUNT the macros and calories is not something they are ready for. High School kids, sure. Elementary and Middle School kids, no.
Who says 11 is too young? You? Because I disagree. Please explain to me how it is possible for an 11-year-old to "learn about what makes a high calorie or low calorie food" without actually discussing calories and what is high vs low? HIgh and low have no meaning unless you also consider total calories you should be eating.
It makes no sense to me that they are old enough to talk about carbohydrates vs protein...but too young to discuss appropriate calorie ranges.
We have waaaaaay too many obese children. The sooner they learn about what actually causes obesity (eating too many calories), the more equipped they are to make appropriate choices.1 -
Alatariel75 wrote: »coreyreichle wrote: »Alatariel75 wrote: »coreyreichle wrote: »Alatariel75 wrote: »coreyreichle wrote: »Alatariel75 wrote: »For all the people saying she was doing the right thing - question. If you felt that your kid had had enough to eat for the day, would you give them a handful of nuts instead of dinner? Seeing as how your cool with them being taught that's a reasonable thing to do?
This might shock you, but my kids sometimes skip dinner if they are not hungry.
Crazy, right?
smh.
Read the question.
smh.
Ok, if they had a big lunch, and only wanted a handful of nuts, why not?
IIFYM.
"if they are not hungry."
" only wanted a handful of nuts"
The question has nothing to do with their hunger levels, or what they want - I asked if you decided the kid had had enough calories for the day, would you give them a handful of nuts instead of dinner.
The teacher wasn't teaching "Don't eat if you are not hungry" she was teaching that if you're out of calories, don't eat dinner.
Yes. I've cut my kids off of food when I know they've exceeded what they should be eating for a day. How is this odd?
Oh wait, I get it! In the US, food equals love, rather than just nutrition.
What makes you think I'm in the US? And you've not fed your kids dinner, when they're hungry, because you figure they've had enough fr the day? for real?
If they have had enough, they won't be hungry. They may want to eat a lot out of habit or because they like the taste of the food being served, but they should not actually be hungry.
Even if the kids are a bit hungry at bedtime once in a while, that isn't a bad thing either. IMO Just yesterday my middle son was procrastianting snacking in the evening. Bedtime rolled around and he hadnt eaten for about 5 hours. He went to bed anyways because it was time to go to bed. He may have been hungry but he can eat in the morning. He's 12.
Or they pull the "I'm not hungry" at dinner, but then want chips/cookies a half hour later. Yeah, not happening.
No kidding.0 -
MoiAussi93 wrote: »coreyreichle wrote: »
You do understand that caloric intake is the foundation upon which nutrition lies, right? Maco and micro ratios are ratios dependent on the whole caloric total. Hard to figure those out, if you don't know what you're taking in...
The bigger question is, do you understand age appropriateness when it comes to calorie counting and nutrition? 11 year olds are too young to be counting calories. They are NOT too young to learn about what makes a high calorie or low calorie food and what makes up good nutrition and a balanced diet. They are at the age where they are beginning to learn about fat, protein, and carbohydrates. Pushing them to actually COUNT the macros and calories is not something they are ready for. High School kids, sure. Elementary and Middle School kids, no.
Who says 11 is too young? You? Because I disagree. Please explain to me how it is possible for an 11-year-old to "learn about what makes a high calorie or low calorie food" without actually discussing calories and what is high vs low? HIgh and low have no meaning unless you also consider total calories you should be eating.
It makes no sense to me that they are old enough to talk about carbohydrates vs protein...but too young to discuss appropriate calorie ranges.
We have waaaaaay too many obese children. The sooner they learn about what actually causes obesity (eating too many calories), the more equipped they are to make appropriate choices.
I've discussed calorie content in foods with my kids who are 9, 12, and 14. I eat LCHF so the volume of food I eat is often quite a bit smaller than what they eat. They could understand that my food had just as many calories as their did due to fat content. They know about macros. They know protein is very important for them because they are growing. Fat too, to a lesser degree. They know carbs are not essential but some contain good nutrition, and it isn't the french fries.
And they often see me skip a meal. They get it. I'm not hungry so I don't eat. There aren't many people who are actually hungry once they pass their maintenance caloric goals, unless they are eating foods that drive their appetite. We've also discussed which foods (pseudo-foods) those are and why they should be limited.
Kids can get it.
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I taught 4th and 5th grade. What we taught children was about healthy eating habits - such as drinking water instead of pop. In my opinion, there's nothing wrong with teaching children about different choices, but we still know they aren't the ones buying groceries or cooking meals. We need to talk to the parents because they need to be educated as well.
While bringing up the concept of calories is fine, you have to be careful when you start talking about counting calories. As children grow, they are conscious of themselves compared to their peers. I've seen many who might be a little bigger framed or put on a little weight before a growth spurt be terrified that they are fat. Kids will often pick on their classmates for the same reasons - and I'm not even talking about the ones who are overweight but also the ones who may be a different size.
The sad thing is that while there are obese children, it's not really because of their choices. It's because of their parents' choices. While they can say they want better food options in their house, not all parents listen. Some will, but many won't. Hopefully, we can educated the parents through the children, but sometimes it doesn't happen.4 -
MoiAussi93 wrote: »coreyreichle wrote: »
You do understand that caloric intake is the foundation upon which nutrition lies, right? Maco and micro ratios are ratios dependent on the whole caloric total. Hard to figure those out, if you don't know what you're taking in...
The bigger question is, do you understand age appropriateness when it comes to calorie counting and nutrition? 11 year olds are too young to be counting calories. They are NOT too young to learn about what makes a high calorie or low calorie food and what makes up good nutrition and a balanced diet. They are at the age where they are beginning to learn about fat, protein, and carbohydrates. Pushing them to actually COUNT the macros and calories is not something they are ready for. High School kids, sure. Elementary and Middle School kids, no.
Who says 11 is too young? You? Because I disagree. Please explain to me how it is possible for an 11-year-old to "learn about what makes a high calorie or low calorie food" without actually discussing calories and what is high vs low? HIgh and low have no meaning unless you also consider total calories you should be eating.
It makes no sense to me that they are old enough to talk about carbohydrates vs protein...but too young to discuss appropriate calorie ranges.
We have waaaaaay too many obese children. The sooner they learn about what actually causes obesity (eating too many calories), the more equipped they are to make appropriate choices.
There is a difference between understanding what a calorie is and how it impacts health and actually counting calories. Middle school kids are old enough to understand the concept but too young to understand how to apply it appropriately. It is a progression based on how mature their brains are.6 -
MoiAussi93 wrote: »coreyreichle wrote: »
You do understand that caloric intake is the foundation upon which nutrition lies, right? Maco and micro ratios are ratios dependent on the whole caloric total. Hard to figure those out, if you don't know what you're taking in...
The bigger question is, do you understand age appropriateness when it comes to calorie counting and nutrition? 11 year olds are too young to be counting calories. They are NOT too young to learn about what makes a high calorie or low calorie food and what makes up good nutrition and a balanced diet. They are at the age where they are beginning to learn about fat, protein, and carbohydrates. Pushing them to actually COUNT the macros and calories is not something they are ready for. High School kids, sure. Elementary and Middle School kids, no.
Who says 11 is too young? You? Because I disagree. Please explain to me how it is possible for an 11-year-old to "learn about what makes a high calorie or low calorie food" without actually discussing calories and what is high vs low? HIgh and low have no meaning unless you also consider total calories you should be eating.
It makes no sense to me that they are old enough to talk about carbohydrates vs protein...but too young to discuss appropriate calorie ranges.
We have waaaaaay too many obese children. The sooner they learn about what actually causes obesity (eating too many calories), the more equipped they are to make appropriate choices.
There is a difference between understanding what a calorie is and how it impacts health and actually counting calories. Middle school kids are old enough to understand the concept but too young to understand how to apply it appropriately. It is a progression based on how mature their brains are.
I suppose we just disagree then.0 -
VintageFeline wrote: »You are being selective, you have deliberately cropped out the rest of the response which clearly stated teaching children about nutrition should absolutely be done but that healthy behaviours start in the home. Kids don't get obese at school, they get obese from what their parents allow them to eat.
I think you're being selective by deliberately ignoring that controlling the quantity of intake is a vital and fundamental part of proper nutrition.WinoGelato wrote: »I feel like you're either willfully misconstruing what people are saying, or ignoring many of the salient points.
You mean like ignoring that the number of calories one consumes is a vital and inextricable part of that person's diet and nutrition, which is what you're doing when you argue that nutrition should be taught without discussing calories.At that point, they aren't choosing the foods, their parents are. As they grow older, talk about choices that they may be starting to make, and introduce more of the mathematical piece so they understand what impact their choices will have. Eventually you can have them start counting calories, but it may never even be necessary for children, if the foundation is built properly.
They can learn what a portion size is, what calories are, what the recommended intake for their age is, and what happens when you consistently exceed that.1 -
I generally keep this story to myself, but screw it.
I actually took an active interest, of my own volition, at about age ten to try and measure and control my caloric intake. I knew something was wrong with me. What did I hear in response? The same stuff being slung around in this thread about kids not needing to worry about that kind of stuff, "growing boy", etc.
I was obese. My whole family was, and is obese (excepting me now). I stayed obese until I finally figured out that I had been lied to for my entire life about "genetics" and "meant to be big" and "strong country boy" and blahblahblah (insert fat people excuse of choice here).
So yeah, expecting parents to be useful in this scenario isn't always (or often, judging by obesity rates) going to happen.7 -
Gallowmere1984 wrote: »I generally keep this story to myself, but screw it.
I actually took an active interest, of my own volition, at about age ten to try and measure and control my caloric intake. I knew something was wrong with me. What did I hear in response? The same stuff being slung around in this thread about kids not needing to worry about that kind of stuff, "growing boy", etc.
I was obese. My whole family was, and is obese (excepting me now). I stayed obese until I finally figured out that I had been lied to for my entire life about "genetics" and "meant to be big" and "strong country boy" and blahblahblah (insert fat people excuse of choice here).
So yeah, expecting parents to be useful in this scenario isn't always (or often, judging by obesity rates) going to happen.
I agree. Parents do their best and have good intentions, but a lot of them think of fat kids as "healthy". I am tall, and as a child I grew early and was several inches taller than ALL other kids (even the boys) in third and fourth grade. But I was still fat, and when I said something about being fat all I heard back...from parents and other adults...was something to the effect of "you're a tall girl with a large frame...that's all."3 -
coreyreichle wrote: »
You do understand that caloric intake is the foundation upon which nutrition lies, right? Maco and micro ratios are ratios dependent on the whole caloric total. Hard to figure those out, if you don't know what you're taking in...
The bigger question is, do you understand age appropriateness when it comes to calorie counting and nutrition? 11 year olds are too young to be counting calories. They are NOT too young to learn about what makes a high calorie or low calorie food and what makes up good nutrition and a balanced diet. They are at the age where they are beginning to learn about fat, protein, and carbohydrates. Pushing them to actually COUNT the macros and calories is not something they are ready for. High School kids, sure. Elementary and Middle School kids, no.
Why are 11 year olds too young to learn about CICO, and caloric content of food, but yet not too young to do things like play football?
The latter has a serious risk of injury. The former has a serious risk of enabling them to maintain a healthy body weight.3 -
heiliskrimsli wrote: »heiliskrimsli wrote: »WinoGelato wrote: »I think that just like any math concept, it should be included in the curriculum at the appropriate age.
And like every other concept in mathematics, there's a reason that we start kids out with counting and arithmetic rather than algebra, discrete mathematics or calculus.
Adding and subtracting four digit numbers is something my school taught in third grade. When I was 8. No reason those four digit numbers couldn't be calories.
Right, but the concept of CICO is much more like an algebraic equation (or sets of equations) than simple addition/subtraction. In fact, I'd say - for growing kids - it's more like a differential equation.
There are quite a few (some unknown) variables in the CICO model - algebra. Additionally, as the kids grow, those variables change based on their individual rates of growth, among other things - DiffEQs. While we can teach kids what Calories are, and about energy balance, I'm doubtful that kids of the age in question are going to be able to successfully apply these concepts until they understand more and are able to identify most of the variables.
And unless you're putting your future Olympic athlete kid through some pretty serious testing to determine their exact BMR and caloric expenditure at particular levels of exercise activity to maximize their performance, or conducting a NASA study on the effect of laying down for six months without a measurable change in weight, the algebra and differential equations that you're talking about are completely irrelevant overkill.
There are guidelines, based on age, for the appropriate number of calories for kids to consume on a daily basis. Those guidelines are applicable to all but the very ends of the bell curve of people, and let's face it, if a kid really is at the extreme end they probably have some kind of medical supervision because they're either immobile or a prodigious athlete.
It is not that hard to start them out by learning what that guideline is each year of school (as it corresponds to their age) and how much of those calories are taken up by a chocolate bar, or a potato, or a chicken drumstick. Using extremes to try to invalidate a reasonable approach to nutrition is not helpful.
Even crazier, you don't need crazy tests or alegrab (Calculus, really) to figure out your TDEE. You need to track caloric intake, and weight, and compare the results. That's all!0 -
WinoGelato wrote: »coreyreichle wrote: »
You do understand that caloric intake is the foundation upon which nutrition lies, right? Maco and micro ratios are ratios dependent on the whole caloric total. Hard to figure those out, if you don't know what you're taking in...
The bigger question is, do you understand age appropriateness when it comes to calorie counting and nutrition? 11 year olds are too young to be counting calories. They are NOT too young to learn about what makes a high calorie or low calorie food and what makes up good nutrition and a balanced diet. They are at the age where they are beginning to learn about fat, protein, and carbohydrates. Pushing them to actually COUNT the macros and calories is not something they are ready for. High School kids, sure. Elementary and Middle School kids, no.
Exactly. They don't need to learn to do the math yet, they need to learn that there is an important concept coming down the road. It's laying a foundation so that when they are age appropriate, they can learn to count calories, or not even count them - just that calories are what drive the overall energy balance equation.
Why don't they need to learn the math yet? My kids, at age 11, were already learning algebra and biology...0 -
coreyreichle wrote: »WinoGelato wrote: »coreyreichle wrote: »
You do understand that caloric intake is the foundation upon which nutrition lies, right? Maco and micro ratios are ratios dependent on the whole caloric total. Hard to figure those out, if you don't know what you're taking in...
The bigger question is, do you understand age appropriateness when it comes to calorie counting and nutrition? 11 year olds are too young to be counting calories. They are NOT too young to learn about what makes a high calorie or low calorie food and what makes up good nutrition and a balanced diet. They are at the age where they are beginning to learn about fat, protein, and carbohydrates. Pushing them to actually COUNT the macros and calories is not something they are ready for. High School kids, sure. Elementary and Middle School kids, no.
Exactly. They don't need to learn to do the math yet, they need to learn that there is an important concept coming down the road. It's laying a foundation so that when they are age appropriate, they can learn to count calories, or not even count them - just that calories are what drive the overall energy balance equation.
Why don't they need to learn the math yet? My kids, at age 11, were already learning algebra and biology...
It has nothing to do with the math. It has to do with not perpetuating body image issues with children who are still growing and maturing.
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WinoGelato wrote: »coreyreichle wrote: »WinoGelato wrote: »coreyreichle wrote: »
You do understand that caloric intake is the foundation upon which nutrition lies, right? Maco and micro ratios are ratios dependent on the whole caloric total. Hard to figure those out, if you don't know what you're taking in...
The bigger question is, do you understand age appropriateness when it comes to calorie counting and nutrition? 11 year olds are too young to be counting calories. They are NOT too young to learn about what makes a high calorie or low calorie food and what makes up good nutrition and a balanced diet. They are at the age where they are beginning to learn about fat, protein, and carbohydrates. Pushing them to actually COUNT the macros and calories is not something they are ready for. High School kids, sure. Elementary and Middle School kids, no.
Exactly. They don't need to learn to do the math yet, they need to learn that there is an important concept coming down the road. It's laying a foundation so that when they are age appropriate, they can learn to count calories, or not even count them - just that calories are what drive the overall energy balance equation.
Why don't they need to learn the math yet? My kids, at age 11, were already learning algebra and biology...
It has nothing to do with the math. It has to do with not perpetuating body image issues with children who are still growing and maturing.
You mean perpetuating the notion that obesity is in fact, not OK? If so, I'm cool with that.5 -
My children at 10-11 made the decision they no longer wanted McDonalds, soda or diet soda due to stuff they heard at school. I was pretty pissed, McDonalds saved time from my busy life of cooking & washing up (or so I thought as a young working mother) but I couldn't force them especially if they felt it wasn't "healthy".
As adults in their 30s they are still health conscious and are teaching "healthy" eating habits to their children.
I am on the fence about teaching children counting calories. On one hand I wish I had learned about TDEE at a young age it would have saved me from so many fad dangerous diets that ultimately led me to being obese and not just overweight. On the other I would never want my kids to be body conscious even though they became "health" conscious at a very young age.
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I think kids ARE body conscious once they get past the preschool years. I was VERY aware of the fact that I was too tall, wore glasses, and had crooked teeth as a kid - elementary school. Kids know how they look compared to others. Teaching what calories are will not cause them to become body conscious. IMO.1
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leanjogreen18 wrote: »My children at 10-11 made the decision they no longer wanted McDonalds, soda or diet soda due to stuff they heard at school. I was pretty pissed, McDonalds saved time from my busy life of cooking & washing up (or so I thought as a young working mother) but I couldn't force them especially if they felt it wasn't "healthy".
As adults in their 30s they are still health conscious and are teaching "healthy" eating habits to their children.
I am on the fence about teaching children counting calories. On one hand I wish I had learned about TDEE at a young age it would have saved me from so many fad dangerous diets that ultimately led me to being obese and not just overweight. On the other I would never want my kids to be body conscious even though they became "health" conscious at a very young age.
Body conscious vs health conscious. I like that. Great way of putting it.
For the record, I think kids should be health conscious and as a vocal proponent of education people about CICO as an energy balance on these boards, I do think that children should be taught this, and that at different points in their educational maturity, it would become more detailed and more specific for their own situation. I think at the elementary level, conceptual is better for the SCHOOL to teach. If parents want to go further in their own home, fine. Kids grow and their calorie needs change as they grow and I think that's also fine to conceptually teach. But having kids calculate their calorie needs at age 9 and starting to track calories at that age, I think is overkill. I think the childhood obesity epidemic can be positively impacted by improved awareness of the basic concepts of the CICO model and overall nutrition and wellness.4 -
coreyreichle wrote: »WinoGelato wrote: »coreyreichle wrote: »WinoGelato wrote: »coreyreichle wrote: »
You do understand that caloric intake is the foundation upon which nutrition lies, right? Maco and micro ratios are ratios dependent on the whole caloric total. Hard to figure those out, if you don't know what you're taking in...
The bigger question is, do you understand age appropriateness when it comes to calorie counting and nutrition? 11 year olds are too young to be counting calories. They are NOT too young to learn about what makes a high calorie or low calorie food and what makes up good nutrition and a balanced diet. They are at the age where they are beginning to learn about fat, protein, and carbohydrates. Pushing them to actually COUNT the macros and calories is not something they are ready for. High School kids, sure. Elementary and Middle School kids, no.
Exactly. They don't need to learn to do the math yet, they need to learn that there is an important concept coming down the road. It's laying a foundation so that when they are age appropriate, they can learn to count calories, or not even count them - just that calories are what drive the overall energy balance equation.
Why don't they need to learn the math yet? My kids, at age 11, were already learning algebra and biology...
It has nothing to do with the math. It has to do with not perpetuating body image issues with children who are still growing and maturing.
You mean perpetuating the notion that obesity is in fact, not OK? If so, I'm cool with that.
Then you should teach your kids to start counting calories at age 11. Not the school.
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I think kids ARE body conscious once they get past the preschool years. I was VERY aware of the fact that I was too tall, wore glasses, and had crooked teeth as a kid - elementary school. Kids know how they look compared to others. Teaching what calories are will not cause them to become body conscious. IMO.
Perhaps a lot of kids are.
Mine were very self confident, nor was I body conscious until after having my first child (20's) did I notice my hips were a little bigger, my feet grew 1/2 size. It was the first time in my life that I'd even thought about weight.
Prior to that it was "is my make up on dark enough", "do i need more eyeliner", "are my bell bottoms big enough" or "oh crap super straight legs are in now what did I miss over the summer":)
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leanjogreen18 wrote: »I think kids ARE body conscious once they get past the preschool years. I was VERY aware of the fact that I was too tall, wore glasses, and had crooked teeth as a kid - elementary school. Kids know how they look compared to others. Teaching what calories are will not cause them to become body conscious. IMO.
Perhaps a lot of kids are.
Mine were very self confident, nor was I body conscious until after having my first child (20's) did I notice my hips were a little bigger, my feet grew 1/2 size. It was the first time in my life that I'd even thought about weight.
Prior to that it was "is my make up on dark enough", "do i need more eyeliner", "are my bell bottoms big enough" or "oh crap super straight legs are in now what did I miss over the summer":)
Body conscious and confidence are separate issues in my mind. I knew I was tall and wore glasses but no one bugged or bullied me about it because I didn't care what they thought... Or maybe they were just afraid to pick on the 5'8", 130 lb 12 year old in grade 6. LOL
... I hated that post pregnancy foot growth. I went from an 8.5 to a 10.5 by my last one. Had to buy all new shoes.2 -
leanjogreen18 wrote: »I think kids ARE body conscious once they get past the preschool years. I was VERY aware of the fact that I was too tall, wore glasses, and had crooked teeth as a kid - elementary school. Kids know how they look compared to others. Teaching what calories are will not cause them to become body conscious. IMO.
Perhaps a lot of kids are.
Mine were very self confident, nor was I body conscious until after having my first child (20's) did I notice my hips were a little bigger, my feet grew 1/2 size. It was the first time in my life that I'd even thought about weight.
Prior to that it was "is my make up on dark enough", "do i need more eyeliner", "are my bell bottoms big enough" or "oh crap super straight legs are in now what did I miss over the summer":)
Body conscious and confidence are separate issues in my mind. I knew I was tall and wore glasses but no one bugged or bullied me about it because I didn't care what they thought... Or maybe they were just afraid to pick on the 5'8", 130 lb 12 year old in grade 6. LOL
... I hated that post pregnancy foot growth. I went from an 8.5 to a 10.5 by my last one. Had to buy all new shoes.
Ah, I see body conscious as negative and not confident in ones appearance or looking to improve it or having an issue with. Different again of self awareness or confidence where one says ok I have big feet but who the heck cares confident that big feet are a sign of greatness (total exaggeration I'm sure you get what I'm saying:)).
Its good to understand ones definitions:)
Whoa thats a big leap from 8.5 to 10.5. I only went up 7 1/2 to 8 but as I get older I'm back down to 7 1/2. Whats up with that weirdness?
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WinoGelato wrote: »coreyreichle wrote: »WinoGelato wrote: »coreyreichle wrote: »WinoGelato wrote: »coreyreichle wrote: »
You do understand that caloric intake is the foundation upon which nutrition lies, right? Maco and micro ratios are ratios dependent on the whole caloric total. Hard to figure those out, if you don't know what you're taking in...
The bigger question is, do you understand age appropriateness when it comes to calorie counting and nutrition? 11 year olds are too young to be counting calories. They are NOT too young to learn about what makes a high calorie or low calorie food and what makes up good nutrition and a balanced diet. They are at the age where they are beginning to learn about fat, protein, and carbohydrates. Pushing them to actually COUNT the macros and calories is not something they are ready for. High School kids, sure. Elementary and Middle School kids, no.
Exactly. They don't need to learn to do the math yet, they need to learn that there is an important concept coming down the road. It's laying a foundation so that when they are age appropriate, they can learn to count calories, or not even count them - just that calories are what drive the overall energy balance equation.
Why don't they need to learn the math yet? My kids, at age 11, were already learning algebra and biology...
It has nothing to do with the math. It has to do with not perpetuating body image issues with children who are still growing and maturing.
You mean perpetuating the notion that obesity is in fact, not OK? If so, I'm cool with that.
Then you should teach your kids to start counting calories at age 11. Not the school.
And, again, if we just relinquish that as "Well, teach it at home!" we'll continue down the path of ever-increasing obesity rates among children and adult; and Type II diabetes in children will continue to rise.
Because, as a whole, parents are failing at this, and failing hard. To the point where the US cannot meet recruiting quotas, not due to unwillingness to enlist, but medically unable to do so due to obesity.0 -
coreyreichle wrote: »WinoGelato wrote: »coreyreichle wrote: »WinoGelato wrote: »coreyreichle wrote: »WinoGelato wrote: »coreyreichle wrote: »
You do understand that caloric intake is the foundation upon which nutrition lies, right? Maco and micro ratios are ratios dependent on the whole caloric total. Hard to figure those out, if you don't know what you're taking in...
The bigger question is, do you understand age appropriateness when it comes to calorie counting and nutrition? 11 year olds are too young to be counting calories. They are NOT too young to learn about what makes a high calorie or low calorie food and what makes up good nutrition and a balanced diet. They are at the age where they are beginning to learn about fat, protein, and carbohydrates. Pushing them to actually COUNT the macros and calories is not something they are ready for. High School kids, sure. Elementary and Middle School kids, no.
Exactly. They don't need to learn to do the math yet, they need to learn that there is an important concept coming down the road. It's laying a foundation so that when they are age appropriate, they can learn to count calories, or not even count them - just that calories are what drive the overall energy balance equation.
Why don't they need to learn the math yet? My kids, at age 11, were already learning algebra and biology...
It has nothing to do with the math. It has to do with not perpetuating body image issues with children who are still growing and maturing.
You mean perpetuating the notion that obesity is in fact, not OK? If so, I'm cool with that.
Then you should teach your kids to start counting calories at age 11. Not the school.
And, again, if we just relinquish that as "Well, teach it at home!" we'll continue down the path of ever-increasing obesity rates among children and adult; and Type II diabetes in children will continue to rise.
Because, as a whole, parents are failing at this, and failing hard. To the point where the US cannot meet recruiting quotas, not due to unwillingness to enlist, but medically unable to do so due to obesity.
And again. I'm not saying the schools should not talk about this at all. I am just saying that the level of detail provided would change over time just as any concept taught in school changes as children age and mature. I support teaching about CICO and nutrition in schools. I feel like you are ignoring that.2 -
coreyreichle wrote: »WinoGelato wrote: »coreyreichle wrote: »WinoGelato wrote: »coreyreichle wrote: »
You do understand that caloric intake is the foundation upon which nutrition lies, right? Maco and micro ratios are ratios dependent on the whole caloric total. Hard to figure those out, if you don't know what you're taking in...
The bigger question is, do you understand age appropriateness when it comes to calorie counting and nutrition? 11 year olds are too young to be counting calories. They are NOT too young to learn about what makes a high calorie or low calorie food and what makes up good nutrition and a balanced diet. They are at the age where they are beginning to learn about fat, protein, and carbohydrates. Pushing them to actually COUNT the macros and calories is not something they are ready for. High School kids, sure. Elementary and Middle School kids, no.
Exactly. They don't need to learn to do the math yet, they need to learn that there is an important concept coming down the road. It's laying a foundation so that when they are age appropriate, they can learn to count calories, or not even count them - just that calories are what drive the overall energy balance equation.
Why don't they need to learn the math yet? My kids, at age 11, were already learning algebra and biology...
It has nothing to do with the math. It has to do with not perpetuating body image issues with children who are still growing and maturing.
You mean perpetuating the notion that obesity is in fact, not OK? If so, I'm cool with that.
I agree, although I'd also add "overweight" to that. Even being overweight has a negative impact upon health. Being body conscious is part of being health conscious.coreyreichle wrote: »WinoGelato wrote: »coreyreichle wrote: »WinoGelato wrote: »coreyreichle wrote: »WinoGelato wrote: »coreyreichle wrote: »
You do understand that caloric intake is the foundation upon which nutrition lies, right? Maco and micro ratios are ratios dependent on the whole caloric total. Hard to figure those out, if you don't know what you're taking in...
The bigger question is, do you understand age appropriateness when it comes to calorie counting and nutrition? 11 year olds are too young to be counting calories. They are NOT too young to learn about what makes a high calorie or low calorie food and what makes up good nutrition and a balanced diet. They are at the age where they are beginning to learn about fat, protein, and carbohydrates. Pushing them to actually COUNT the macros and calories is not something they are ready for. High School kids, sure. Elementary and Middle School kids, no.
Exactly. They don't need to learn to do the math yet, they need to learn that there is an important concept coming down the road. It's laying a foundation so that when they are age appropriate, they can learn to count calories, or not even count them - just that calories are what drive the overall energy balance equation.
Why don't they need to learn the math yet? My kids, at age 11, were already learning algebra and biology...
It has nothing to do with the math. It has to do with not perpetuating body image issues with children who are still growing and maturing.
You mean perpetuating the notion that obesity is in fact, not OK? If so, I'm cool with that.
Then you should teach your kids to start counting calories at age 11. Not the school.
And, again, if we just relinquish that as "Well, teach it at home!" we'll continue down the path of ever-increasing obesity rates among children and adult; and Type II diabetes in children will continue to rise.
Because, as a whole, parents are failing at this, and failing hard. To the point where the US cannot meet recruiting quotas, not due to unwillingness to enlist, but medically unable to do so due to obesity.
Many of the same arguments have been made regarding sex education being taught in schools, and we've seen that STDs and teenage pregnancy at higher levels are the consequence of leaving it up to the parents. I remember when Type II Diabetes was known as adult onset diabetes, which had to change because children are being diagnosed with it as a consequence of childhood obesity.
You're right that leaving the numbers "for home" is failing in an epic way.0 -
leanjogreen18 wrote: »leanjogreen18 wrote: »I think kids ARE body conscious once they get past the preschool years. I was VERY aware of the fact that I was too tall, wore glasses, and had crooked teeth as a kid - elementary school. Kids know how they look compared to others. Teaching what calories are will not cause them to become body conscious. IMO.
Perhaps a lot of kids are.
Mine were very self confident, nor was I body conscious until after having my first child (20's) did I notice my hips were a little bigger, my feet grew 1/2 size. It was the first time in my life that I'd even thought about weight.
Prior to that it was "is my make up on dark enough", "do i need more eyeliner", "are my bell bottoms big enough" or "oh crap super straight legs are in now what did I miss over the summer":)
Body conscious and confidence are separate issues in my mind. I knew I was tall and wore glasses but no one bugged or bullied me about it because I didn't care what they thought... Or maybe they were just afraid to pick on the 5'8", 130 lb 12 year old in grade 6. LOL
... I hated that post pregnancy foot growth. I went from an 8.5 to a 10.5 by my last one. Had to buy all new shoes.
Ah, I see body conscious as negative and not confident in ones appearance or looking to improve it or having an issue with. Different again of self awareness or confidence where one says ok I have big feet but who the heck cares confident that big feet are a sign of greatness (total exaggeration I'm sure you get what I'm saying:)).
Its good to understand ones definitions:)
Whoa thats a big leap from 8.5 to 10.5. I only went up 7 1/2 to 8 but as I get older I'm back down to 7 1/2. Whats up with that weirdness?
I see what you are saying.
You're feet are shrinking? That is odd. Could it be weight loss helping with it?0 -
WinoGelato wrote: »coreyreichle wrote: »WinoGelato wrote: »coreyreichle wrote: »WinoGelato wrote: »coreyreichle wrote: »WinoGelato wrote: »coreyreichle wrote: »
You do understand that caloric intake is the foundation upon which nutrition lies, right? Maco and micro ratios are ratios dependent on the whole caloric total. Hard to figure those out, if you don't know what you're taking in...
The bigger question is, do you understand age appropriateness when it comes to calorie counting and nutrition? 11 year olds are too young to be counting calories. They are NOT too young to learn about what makes a high calorie or low calorie food and what makes up good nutrition and a balanced diet. They are at the age where they are beginning to learn about fat, protein, and carbohydrates. Pushing them to actually COUNT the macros and calories is not something they are ready for. High School kids, sure. Elementary and Middle School kids, no.
Exactly. They don't need to learn to do the math yet, they need to learn that there is an important concept coming down the road. It's laying a foundation so that when they are age appropriate, they can learn to count calories, or not even count them - just that calories are what drive the overall energy balance equation.
Why don't they need to learn the math yet? My kids, at age 11, were already learning algebra and biology...
It has nothing to do with the math. It has to do with not perpetuating body image issues with children who are still growing and maturing.
You mean perpetuating the notion that obesity is in fact, not OK? If so, I'm cool with that.
Then you should teach your kids to start counting calories at age 11. Not the school.
And, again, if we just relinquish that as "Well, teach it at home!" we'll continue down the path of ever-increasing obesity rates among children and adult; and Type II diabetes in children will continue to rise.
Because, as a whole, parents are failing at this, and failing hard. To the point where the US cannot meet recruiting quotas, not due to unwillingness to enlist, but medically unable to do so due to obesity.
And again. I'm not saying the schools should not talk about this at all. I am just saying that the level of detail provided would change over time just as any concept taught in school changes as children age and mature. I support teaching about CICO and nutrition in schools. I feel like you are ignoring that.
I get what you're saying. We were talking about 6th graders here, though. How is that too young? They're only a couple years away from high school at this point.0 -
coreyreichle wrote: »WinoGelato wrote: »coreyreichle wrote: »WinoGelato wrote: »coreyreichle wrote: »WinoGelato wrote: »coreyreichle wrote: »WinoGelato wrote: »coreyreichle wrote: »
You do understand that caloric intake is the foundation upon which nutrition lies, right? Maco and micro ratios are ratios dependent on the whole caloric total. Hard to figure those out, if you don't know what you're taking in...
The bigger question is, do you understand age appropriateness when it comes to calorie counting and nutrition? 11 year olds are too young to be counting calories. They are NOT too young to learn about what makes a high calorie or low calorie food and what makes up good nutrition and a balanced diet. They are at the age where they are beginning to learn about fat, protein, and carbohydrates. Pushing them to actually COUNT the macros and calories is not something they are ready for. High School kids, sure. Elementary and Middle School kids, no.
Exactly. They don't need to learn to do the math yet, they need to learn that there is an important concept coming down the road. It's laying a foundation so that when they are age appropriate, they can learn to count calories, or not even count them - just that calories are what drive the overall energy balance equation.
Why don't they need to learn the math yet? My kids, at age 11, were already learning algebra and biology...
It has nothing to do with the math. It has to do with not perpetuating body image issues with children who are still growing and maturing.
You mean perpetuating the notion that obesity is in fact, not OK? If so, I'm cool with that.
Then you should teach your kids to start counting calories at age 11. Not the school.
And, again, if we just relinquish that as "Well, teach it at home!" we'll continue down the path of ever-increasing obesity rates among children and adult; and Type II diabetes in children will continue to rise.
Because, as a whole, parents are failing at this, and failing hard. To the point where the US cannot meet recruiting quotas, not due to unwillingness to enlist, but medically unable to do so due to obesity.
And again. I'm not saying the schools should not talk about this at all. I am just saying that the level of detail provided would change over time just as any concept taught in school changes as children age and mature. I support teaching about CICO and nutrition in schools. I feel like you are ignoring that.
I get what you're saying. We were talking about 6th graders here, though. How is that too young? They're only a couple years away from high school at this point.
That is in the middle of pubescence. There's raging hormones, kids tend to develop issues with self-esteem and become very aware of (and often self-conscious about) their bodies and others' bodies. It's a high risk time period for developing eating disorders.
In a couple of years that dies down somewhat.2
This discussion has been closed.
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