Question for others who also have issues with moderation

135

Replies

  • try2again
    try2again Posts: 3,562 Member
    I can really relate to this and agree it's incredibly frustrating to always be looking ahead to the *next* one.

    Reminds me of a comedy routine I heard once:
    http://www.cc.com/video-clips/cz271v/stand-up-jacqueline-novak--the-problem-with-pizza
  • hesn92
    hesn92 Posts: 5,966 Member
    I had the same problem when I wasnt logging my food... Now that I'm using mfp again I log these things before I eat them. then I can see how effects my calorie "budget" and make a better decision. I eat 2 pieces of chocolate every night. I just take two out and put the bag away.
  • Amys712
    Amys712 Posts: 86 Member
    Francl27 wrote: »
    I'm still working on it myself but I've noticed that very often, I'll be eating a cookie... and WHILE I'm eating the cookie I'm already thinking about eating more.

    How do you get to the mindset of just enjoying what you're eating without thinking about getting more? I mean, the second cookie will not taste different than the one I'm already eating, so why can't I just enjoy that one as if it was the second one?

    Does anyone else do that, and have you managed to overcome it? I mean, I lost 80 lbs... gained back 5 in the last 3 years, still want to lose 10, but it would be so much easier if I stopped overeating on bread, chocolate, and cookies..

    Hide any extra portions from yourself! Take one and put the package away before you start eating the first one. Sometimes just the walk to the pantry will allow enough time for some guilt to settle in and win.
  • monstar4kc
    monstar4kc Posts: 30 Member
    ceiswyn wrote: »
    Mostly, by knowing I'm not going to be eating more. It's just not an option. No 'maybe if'; this is my one and only cookie, and the rest have already gone into the airtight box in the cupboard.

    THIS! I just get one cookie, put up the rest (out of sight out of mind) and tell myself to enjoy it because I'm not having another one.
  • xchocolategirl
    xchocolategirl Posts: 186 Member
    I love to buy snacks that are already portion sized for me when it comes to cookies, pretzels, etc because if I don't I'll just finish a huge bag.

    Good luck!!
  • nowine4me
    nowine4me Posts: 3,985 Member
    I can moderate broccoli, cookies not so much. Even crappy ones. For me it's sugar, eating a little makes we want a lot more. I only eat cookies, ice cream, or other sweets out as a treat. You can't really order seconds or thirds on dessert without looking like a glutton. I keeps lots of fruit at home to satisfy my sweet tooth.
  • ndj1979
    ndj1979 Posts: 29,136 Member
    nowine4me wrote: »
    I can moderate broccoli, cookies not so much. Even crappy ones. For me it's sugar, eating a little makes we want a lot more. I only eat cookies, ice cream, or other sweets out as a treat. You can't really order seconds or thirds on dessert without looking like a glutton. I keeps lots of fruit at home to satisfy my sweet tooth.

    But fruit has sugar in it...
  • tomteboda
    tomteboda Posts: 2,171 Member
    Broccoli has a high concentration of compounds that trigger the bitter taste, as bitterness is highly associated with VERY toxic compounds. We are programmed for survival to avoid broccoli. Your brain, unconsciously, is likely telling you "this stuff is dangerous if I eat too much", making moderation quite simple.



    sugar / 100 g (per USDA)

    strawberries... 5 g
    peaches... 8 g
    bananas... 12 g

    Kemp's French Vanilla Ice Cream ... 20 g

    So suppose you make "banana ice cream" by slicing, freezing, then blending a banana. You think it's oh so much less sugar than regular ice cream, and you're sort of right.. but instead of eating half a cup, you eat a cup of the stuff because it's just a banana, after all.

    Now, there's lots of lovely things about bananas and strawberries and peaches, like their delicious flavors and the fiber and mineral content, but let's face it, ice cream also has nutrients in it as well (not just calories), and you're getting real sugar from both.
  • lemurcat12
    lemurcat12 Posts: 30,886 Member
    ndj1979 wrote: »
    nowine4me wrote: »
    I can moderate broccoli, cookies not so much. Even crappy ones. For me it's sugar, eating a little makes we want a lot more. I only eat cookies, ice cream, or other sweets out as a treat. You can't really order seconds or thirds on dessert without looking like a glutton. I keeps lots of fruit at home to satisfy my sweet tooth.

    But fruit has sugar in it...

    Which suggests that the difficulty in moderating is not specifically sugar.

    What most people seem to have trouble moderating (because so tasty) is combinations: sugar/fat (cookies, ice cream, and other common treats are wrongly called carbs, as they are half fat too), and carbs/fat/salt (french fries, chips, mashed potato with butter, fried chicken, naan dipped in curry, pizza, burgers, etc. -- obviously some of these have protein too). Even fat/salt is tough for some of us, as I could overeat cheese and olives, and find those harder to moderate than many sweets (I can also overeat creamed spinach, easily). And contrary to popular claims, I see people eat immoderate amounts of steak quite often (protein + fat + salt, maybe), and I bet people exist who will overeat bacon.
  • lemurcat12
    lemurcat12 Posts: 30,886 Member
    Anyway, back to OP's question and thinking about my own issues, structure is important to me (I know I'm more likely to overeat under certain conditions -- not logging, not eating in an organized fashion, not saving "treats" for special times, not having internal rules like "only a serving" or "only one"). However, like she said, that was really easy for me when I was actively losing weight and it's mostly not now. I think what changed was that when I was focused on losing a bunch of weight and felt my current weight was absolutely unacceptable it was easy to give myself a reason to choose moderating vs. eating more -- it was really the one thing that allowed me to keep whatever it was in my diet and I was not going to sacrifice the goals that were so important to me.

    Now, it's way harder since I'd like to lose more, but does it matter than much to me if I don't lose anything this week and put it off until next week? No. So I have a harder time giving myself a reason. Switching to a low carb experiment stopped that, but because I now have a reason again (not for moderating, but for not wanting certain things) -- it would ruin the experiment that is interesting to me right now. Will this work long-term? No, probably not, so I need to find other reasons. I really think that's what makes losing the last little bit so hard for many of us.
  • cmriverside
    cmriverside Posts: 34,454 Member
    lemurcat12 wrote: »
    ndj1979 wrote: »
    nowine4me wrote: »
    I can moderate broccoli, cookies not so much. Even crappy ones. For me it's sugar, eating a little makes we want a lot more. I only eat cookies, ice cream, or other sweets out as a treat. You can't really order seconds or thirds on dessert without looking like a glutton. I keeps lots of fruit at home to satisfy my sweet tooth.

    But fruit has sugar in it...

    Which suggests that the difficulty in moderating is not specifically sugar.

    What most people seem to have trouble moderating (because so tasty) is combinations: sugar/fat (cookies, ice cream, and other common treats are wrongly called carbs, as they are half fat too), and carbs/fat/salt (french fries, chips, mashed potato with butter, fried chicken, naan dipped in curry, pizza, burgers, etc. -- obviously some of these have protein too). Even fat/salt is tough for some of us, as I could overeat cheese and olives, and find those harder to moderate than many sweets (I can also overeat creamed spinach, easily). And contrary to popular claims, I see people eat immoderate amounts of steak quite often (protein + fat + salt, maybe), and I bet people exist who will overeat bacon.
    I know you really believe this, you say it frequently.

    I would argue. I can and have eaten sugar directly from the bowl - and not just a little bit. I can and have eaten pounds of fruit in one sitting, too. I have also eaten ten servings of popcorn, or a half gallon of ice cream, or a box of popsicles or a block of cheese with Triscuits or a whole bag of trail mix. I don't think it's as simple as you make it, and sometimes it's just plain compulsion.
  • everher
    everher Posts: 909 Member
    I think this is issue is different for different people, but personally, I find I have an issue moderating certain foods. I'm not going to binge eat veggies or fruit for instance.

    When I start to have a problem moderating something I cut it out temporarily.

    Lately, I've been having trouble moderating sweets (cookies, cake, etc.) so I made myself go 7 days without them. I'm still heavily moderating them (once a week for now) and might completely cut them out for a while again because I've found if I stop eating the thing I'm binging on for a while when I start eating it again I don't feel the compulsion to overeat. I guess it's like losing the taste for it. I'll start eating them again whenever I want when I can eat a serving and not care about eating more.
  • lemurcat12
    lemurcat12 Posts: 30,886 Member
    lemurcat12 wrote: »
    ndj1979 wrote: »
    nowine4me wrote: »
    I can moderate broccoli, cookies not so much. Even crappy ones. For me it's sugar, eating a little makes we want a lot more. I only eat cookies, ice cream, or other sweets out as a treat. You can't really order seconds or thirds on dessert without looking like a glutton. I keeps lots of fruit at home to satisfy my sweet tooth.

    But fruit has sugar in it...

    Which suggests that the difficulty in moderating is not specifically sugar.

    What most people seem to have trouble moderating (because so tasty) is combinations: sugar/fat (cookies, ice cream, and other common treats are wrongly called carbs, as they are half fat too), and carbs/fat/salt (french fries, chips, mashed potato with butter, fried chicken, naan dipped in curry, pizza, burgers, etc. -- obviously some of these have protein too). Even fat/salt is tough for some of us, as I could overeat cheese and olives, and find those harder to moderate than many sweets (I can also overeat creamed spinach, easily). And contrary to popular claims, I see people eat immoderate amounts of steak quite often (protein + fat + salt, maybe), and I bet people exist who will overeat bacon.
    I know you really believe this, you say it frequently.

    I would argue. I can and have eaten sugar directly from the bowl - and not just a little bit. I can and have eaten pounds of fruit in one sitting, too. I have also eaten ten servings of popcorn, or a half gallon of ice cream, or a box of popsicles or a block of cheese with Triscuits or a whole bag of trail mix. I don't think it's as simple as you make it, and sometimes it's just plain compulsion.

    But I didn't say it wasn't sugar for ANYONE. But so often people say "I can't moderate sugar" but are (like most of us) people who never would eat sugar plain, who have no issues moderating fruit, and mean by "sugar" specifically things like cookies, brownies, donuts, ice cream, pie, whatever (and not all of those, but certain ones). To say the issue then is SUGAR is what seems to me way too simplistic.

    I'm not sure exactly what you are disagreeing with here, as popcorn, which you mention, is also not sugary, and I neither are cheese and Triscuits, many trail mixes (and sugar is hardly the only significant ingredient even if there is some). Is it that it need not be about deliciousness? That it can be compulsive? I don't disagree with that at all.

    To elaborate, and I hope we can have a conversation here, I think of course some people have difficulties specifically with compulsive or binge eating (not necessarily the same thing). Sometimes this is habitual, sometimes it is mindless eating (similar), sometimes it is comfort or emotional eating, probably other things too. Me too, I've struggled with some of this. I wrote earlier in the thread about having to cut out snacking or grazing since I've found, despite all my work, that now that my reasons aren't as pressing especially if I start grazing on something I like at all (even if it is not something I'd have a problem moderating as an after dinner dessert item) I will sometimes/often just eat and eat. Not because I love the food itself. Certainly not because its sugary -- it could be nuts. It is compulsive in a way (although I won't do it with something I dislike). But it's about things other than the food itself, I think (and it's specific to me in that I don't think that I have an issue that is cured by not snacking means that others should not snack).
  • WilliamAndersonLMHC
    WilliamAndersonLMHC Posts: 117 Member
    I am a recovered food addict, was overweight, unable to create moderation and tormented by it for 25 years. By approaching it as an addiction problem and creating abstinence of compulsive overeating between planned meals, among other strategies, I lost 140 pounds and have kept it off for 30 years. It has been a blessing being free of that compulsion, now addicted to healthy behaviors. Planning ahead and fasting between meals are behavioral and cognitive behavioral strategies that utilize the way we know our minds work from behavioral science, rather than the way we wished they work. Reprogramming is another way to look at it.
  • Francl27
    Francl27 Posts: 26,371 Member
    everher wrote: »
    I think this is issue is different for different people, but personally, I find I have an issue moderating certain foods. I'm not going to binge eat veggies or fruit for instance.

    When I start to have a problem moderating something I cut it out temporarily.

    Lately, I've been having trouble moderating sweets (cookies, cake, etc.) so I made myself go 7 days without them. I'm still heavily moderating them (once a week for now) and might completely cut them out for a while again because I've found if I stop eating the thing I'm binging on for a while when I start eating it again I don't feel the compulsion to overeat. I guess it's like losing the taste for it. I'll start eating them again whenever I want when I can eat a serving and not care about eating more.

    I tried that too and ended up binging anyway. Sigh.

    I've had binges on fruit, lol! Usually ripe plums or peaches, but honestly not since I moved to the US because they're just typically not binge-worthy here.
  • Christine_72
    Christine_72 Posts: 16,049 Member
    nowine4me wrote: »
    I can moderate broccoli, cookies not so much. Even crappy ones. For me it's sugar, eating a little makes we want a lot more. I only eat cookies, ice cream, or other sweets out as a treat. You can't really order seconds or thirds on dessert without looking like a glutton. I keeps lots of fruit at home to satisfy my sweet tooth.

    I wish fruit satisfied my sweet tooth. Yes it is sweet, but it's not bulky or dense enough, or something...

    My favourite dessert is chocolate/peanut butter protein powder mixed with unsweetened vanilla almond milk to make a sludge/pudding and topped with plain Greek yogurt. It's filling and satisfying.

    Calories - 337

    Protein - 61g
    Carbs - 16g
    Fat - 3g
    sugar - 4g
  • cmriverside
    cmriverside Posts: 34,454 Member
    Bing cherries, though. :wink:
  • cmriverside
    cmriverside Posts: 34,454 Member
    lemurcat12 wrote: »
    lemurcat12 wrote: »
    ndj1979 wrote: »
    nowine4me wrote: »
    I can moderate broccoli, cookies not so much. Even crappy ones. For me it's sugar, eating a little makes we want a lot more. I only eat cookies, ice cream, or other sweets out as a treat. You can't really order seconds or thirds on dessert without looking like a glutton. I keeps lots of fruit at home to satisfy my sweet tooth.

    But fruit has sugar in it...

    Which suggests that the difficulty in moderating is not specifically sugar.

    What most people seem to have trouble moderating (because so tasty) is combinations: sugar/fat (cookies, ice cream, and other common treats are wrongly called carbs, as they are half fat too), and carbs/fat/salt (french fries, chips, mashed potato with butter, fried chicken, naan dipped in curry, pizza, burgers, etc. -- obviously some of these have protein too). Even fat/salt is tough for some of us, as I could overeat cheese and olives, and find those harder to moderate than many sweets (I can also overeat creamed spinach, easily). And contrary to popular claims, I see people eat immoderate amounts of steak quite often (protein + fat + salt, maybe), and I bet people exist who will overeat bacon.
    I know you really believe this, you say it frequently.

    I would argue. I can and have eaten sugar directly from the bowl - and not just a little bit. I can and have eaten pounds of fruit in one sitting, too. I have also eaten ten servings of popcorn, or a half gallon of ice cream, or a box of popsicles or a block of cheese with Triscuits or a whole bag of trail mix. I don't think it's as simple as you make it, and sometimes it's just plain compulsion.

    But I didn't say it wasn't sugar for ANYONE. But so often people say "I can't moderate sugar" but are (like most of us) people who never would eat sugar plain, who have no issues moderating fruit, and mean by "sugar" specifically things like cookies, brownies, donuts, ice cream, pie, whatever (and not all of those, but certain ones). To say the issue then is SUGAR is what seems to me way too simplistic.

    I'm not sure exactly what you are disagreeing with here, as popcorn, which you mention, is also not sugary, and I neither are cheese and Triscuits, many trail mixes (and sugar is hardly the only significant ingredient even if there is some). Is it that it need not be about deliciousness? That it can be compulsive? I don't disagree with that at all.

    To elaborate, and I hope we can have a conversation here, I think of course some people have difficulties specifically with compulsive or binge eating (not necessarily the same thing). Sometimes this is habitual, sometimes it is mindless eating (similar), sometimes it is comfort or emotional eating, probably other things too. Me too, I've struggled with some of this. I wrote earlier in the thread about having to cut out snacking or grazing since I've found, despite all my work, that now that my reasons aren't as pressing especially if I start grazing on something I like at all (even if it is not something I'd have a problem moderating as an after dinner dessert item) I will sometimes/often just eat and eat. Not because I love the food itself. Certainly not because its sugary -- it could be nuts. It is compulsive in a way (although I won't do it with something I dislike). But it's about things other than the food itself, I think (and it's specific to me in that I don't think that I have an issue that is cured by not snacking means that others should not snack).

    This is what I take issue with:
    What most people seem to have trouble moderating (because so tasty) is combinations: sugar/fat

    It makes it seem that if we just don't pick up combination foods that it will somehow stop the behavior, and I'm of the belief that it is behavioral and not necessarily about the food itself. You say this a lot, and I am saying it is any number of foods, including things like popsicles (not a combo food) and Bing cherries (fruit) and Red Vines, AND trail mix, French bread, chocolate. So it is and isn't combination food - I just think that statement is misleading and incorrect.

    If I only had a problem with fat/sugar foods, then life would be simpler, but I had to address the list which made me realize it is me, not the food.

  • endlessfall16
    endlessfall16 Posts: 932 Member
    nowine4me wrote: »
    I can moderate broccoli, cookies not so much. Even crappy ones. For me it's sugar, eating a little makes we want a lot more. I only eat cookies, ice cream, or other sweets out as a treat. You can't really order seconds or thirds on dessert without looking like a glutton. I keeps lots of fruit at home to satisfy my sweet tooth.

    I wish fruit satisfied my sweet tooth. Yes it is sweet, but it's not bulky or dense enough, or something...

    My favourite dessert is chocolate/peanut butter protein powder mixed with unsweetened vanilla almond milk to make a sludge/pudding and topped with plain Greek yogurt. It's filling and satisfying.

    Calories - 337

    Protein - 61g
    Carbs - 16g
    Fat - 3g
    sugar - 4g

    I always believe that fruits and veggies in their original forms are too simplistic for our tastes. That's why not a lot of people crave them. Plant stuff is just too one dimensional. It's also more work (per reward) to consume fruits -- counter evolution -- than to consume cookies.

    My own resolution is to combine many many fruits and veggies into a dish! Blend a bunch of fruits and add in liquor. hehe



    On other hand, human's creations such as cookies, ice cream, pizza are far more advanced and hit more taste buds. Much less work. Our own sword can save as well as kill us :)





  • elias1609
    elias1609 Posts: 71 Member
    This is so me , to avoid doing this I drink a lot of water.....A lot a lot !! Then I'd be too full from the water I couldn't even think about food lol
  • KM0692
    KM0692 Posts: 178 Member
    I try to keep my triggers out of the house. My #1 trigger is ice cream. I recently discovered Halo Top though, and it has been a Godsend because #1, it's delicious...and #2, I won't overindulge because I am sensitive to sugar alcohols and if I eat too much, it's bad news.
  • Christine_72
    Christine_72 Posts: 16,049 Member
    Maybe it's clearer to say some of us have a propensity for sweet tasting foods, whether or not it's mostly made of sugar, fats or carbs.

    Others prefer salty tasting foods, it doesn't matter what the macro make up is. It's the flavour sensation we crave.
  • rheddmobile
    rheddmobile Posts: 6,840 Member
    Different people are different, but speaking for myself, the problem starts with refined sugars and highly salted fatty foods such as chips. One makes me crave the other and it's a cycle. If I cut out refined sugar completely, within two weeks most of my cravings magically fall away. I still have behaviorally triggered cravings, such as wanting a Coke icee when I drive by the corner, but even then, refined sugar just tastes bad after two weeks of not having it, which helps.

    These days I do crave fruit. It's nice!
  • Tropicoolblonde
    Tropicoolblonde Posts: 70 Member
    Maybe I'm a minority.. but if I want something I have it with reckless abandon. I will move calories and exercise extra to be able to get my fix. Say I want to eat half a tub of cookie dough one day? Then that will be my days worth of calories ( maybe more like half my daily calories after exercise) and after I have it I don't want it anymore and the craving is gone for good ( usually for weeks or more) and I go back to eating healthy and clean. Or some days I want pizza ( and not just one slice) so I will eat an entire small pizza with a liter of Diet Coke and then just eat a fruit for breakfast and frozen veggies for the other meal to make room in my calories for it. This has saved me so many times from going over calories. I'm lucky that I exercise for hours so I can eat gross 2800 calories a day on my long run days and still lose (1-2lb per week).. so I can fit those calories to begin with, but I give up on eating "healthy" that day as well to make it happen. Worth it. YOLO
  • rheddmobile
    rheddmobile Posts: 6,840 Member
    Maybe I'm a minority.. but if I want something I have it with reckless abandon. I will move calories and exercise extra to be able to get my fix. Say I want to eat half a tub of cookie dough one day? Then that will be my days worth of calories ( maybe more like half my daily calories after exercise) and after I have it I don't want it anymore and the craving is gone for good ( usually for weeks or more) and I go back to eating healthy and clean. Or some days I want pizza ( and not just one slice) so I will eat an entire small pizza with a liter of Diet Coke and then just eat a fruit for breakfast and frozen veggies for the other meal to make room in my calories for it. This has saved me so many times from going over calories. I'm lucky that I exercise for hours so I can eat gross 2800 calories a day on my long run days and still lose (1-2lb per week).. so I can fit those calories to begin with, but I give up on eating "healthy" that day as well to make it happen. Worth it. YOLO

    Can't do that as a diabetic, unfortunately. Blood glucose does not care how many calories you've saved.
  • Lourdesong
    Lourdesong Posts: 1,492 Member
    I don't really recall ever not being faced with the temptation to give in and have more than that which I've determined I 'should' have to stay on track. Is that not normal? I assumed it was normal.
  • Christine_72
    Christine_72 Posts: 16,049 Member
    Lourdesong wrote: »
    I don't really recall ever not being faced with the temptation to give in and have more than that which I've determined I 'should' have to stay on track. Is that not normal? I assumed it was normal.

    I thought this was normal too lol

  • tlanger251
    tlanger251 Posts: 86 Member
    I've been addicted to food my whole life until I started the Keto diet. Now I don't have cravings for food ever, unless I'm physically hungry. I don't need willpower, the cravings are gone. No bored eating, emotional eating, carb binges.
  • itsmyhealth
    itsmyhealth Posts: 11 Member
    tlanger251 wrote: »
    I've been addicted to food my whole life until I started the Keto diet. Now I don't have cravings for food ever, unless I'm physically hungry. I don't need willpower, the cravings are gone. No bored eating, emotional eating, carb binges.

    I actually tried it and found the exact same to be true. The reason it failed for me was more of a social thing (family doesn't eat or respect keto diet). I definitely didn't have cravings and it felt WEIRD [in a good way].
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