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I've come to conclusion cutting is not the answer for me for skinny fat
Replies
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TavistockToad wrote: »
Go for it! What programme are you going to use?
Give it a year to see proper results, good luck!
I don't know, any recommendations? I am thinking a 6 day PPL which is a bit of a b*tch as I think it needs a lot of calories to be consistent with or a 3 day full body.0 -
dave_in_ni wrote: »
I don't know, any recommendations? I am thinking a 6 day PPL which is a bit of a b*tch as I think it needs a lot of calories to be consistent with or a 3 day full body.
My .02 - Lyle McDonald's Generic Bulking Routine. It can be run in a cut, recomp or bulk, is very simple and straightforward, and is a well-designed program with progression and deloads built in.1 -
Let me spell out the three options:
1. Cut. You keep losing weight to get down to a low body fat, which will likely put you near underweight and take you 6ish months. You will have lost even more muscle and will spend at least 12 months working to gain back the lost muscle as well as an additional 5 pounds. Then you cut and lose those 5 pounds of lean mass leaving you back to square one. (total time spent: 2 years)
2. Bulk. You gain 1 pound of muscle per month for 12 months then cut for 6. You end up back at your current weight with around 4-5 pounds of added muscle. (total time spent: 1.5 years)
3. Recomp. You focus on eating adequate protein and really put effort into lifting for the next 12 months. You manage to lose 12 pounds of fat and add 8 pounds of muscle. (total time spent: 1 year)
Great post thanks. Well cutting can take a run and jump as I am sick of it. Recomp I think it is.0 -
Let me spell out the three options:
1. Cut. You keep losing weight to get down to a low body fat, which will likely put you near underweight and take you 6ish months. You will have lost even more muscle and will spend at least 12 months working to gain back the lost muscle as well as an additional 5 pounds. Then you cut and lose those 5 pounds of lean mass leaving you back to square one. (total time spent: 2 years)
2. Bulk. You gain 1 pound of muscle per month for 12 months then cut for 6. You end up back at your current weight with around 4-5 pounds of added muscle. (total time spent: 1.5 years)
3. Recomp. You focus on eating adequate protein and really put effort into lifting for the next 12 months. You manage to lose 12 pounds of fat and add 8 pounds of muscle. (total time spent: 1 year)
Lord. I never realized it took that much time to gain muscle! I will definitely be adding more protein now... lol not later.0 -
dave_in_ni wrote: »
I don't know, any recommendations? I am thinking a 6 day PPL which is a bit of a b*tch as I think it needs a lot of calories to be consistent with or a 3 day full body.
There's a thread somewhere about lifting programmes... I think it's a stickie....3 -
TavistockToad wrote: »
There's a thread somewhere about lifting programmes... I think it's a stickie....
http://community.myfitnesspal.com/en/discussion/10332083/which-lifting-program-is-the-best-for-you/p14 -
TavistockToad wrote: »
There's a thread somewhere about lifting programmes... I think it's a stickie....
http://community.myfitnesspal.com/en/discussion/10332083/which-lifting-program-is-the-best-for-you/p12 -
Verity1111 wrote: »
Lord. I never realized it took that much time to gain muscle! I will definitely be adding more protein now... lol not later.
Agreed. I think that's why then invented tren.1 -
From what you wrote it looks like you are kind of a light build, with a fear of getting fat. Its hard trending to impossible to build muscle in deficit for some, esp for low bf percentages, and harder for lighter builds to build and rebuild muscle anyways, so you aren't going to go anywhere productive by cutting if your goal is to increase upper body strength and reduce fat. You may never really reduce much upper body fat depending on your body, but increasing muscle will help you, and "stretch out" that adipose cover more proportionally. I'd do a "recomp" only, and not mess with either "bulks" or "cuts" in your case. If you really care about upper body fat and the way it looks more than anything, focus on "bodybuilder" volume of exercises to increase the muscle (fat and skin has to stretch over more volume). Its going to probably take you a long time to make much of a difference without extra calories, but my general advice would be weightlifting exercise volume should be your focus, with high protein at maintaining weight caloric levels and limiting aerobic exercise. Maybe climbing close to vertical dam walls since you're a goat
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Verity1111 wrote: »
Lord. I never realized it took that much time to gain muscle! I will definitely be adding more protein now... lol not later.
Don't forget, this is assuming a progressive lifting routine/program.7 -
DancingMoosie wrote: »
Don't forget, this is assuming a progressive lifting routine/program.
A well-designed progressive lifting routine, at that. Executed consistently. With adequate protein and calorie intake. Not some homemade mish-mosh routine randomly cobbled together.5 -
So, OP, you've been quite heavy and now you're not, and you've got some flab you can't lose. Same here.
You can build bigger muscles, but that will not rid you of the flab. It's in the genes, man.
Only expensive unnecessary surgery would do that, but, before you run off and blow your life savings on that, I ask: does it really matter that much?
There are so many ways to spend that money. Maybe you need to get out and see the world. Maybe you need to learn something. Use your imagination. There are so many ways to improve yourself that don't involve your appearance.
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Jthanmyfitnesspal wrote: »So, OP, you've been quite heavy and now you're not, and you've got some flab you can't lose. Same here.
You can build bigger muscles, but that will not rid you of the flab. It's in the genes, man.
I certainly wouldn't give up that easily. I've reduced a lot of the extra flab that I thought I couldn't lose. At 54, I'm leaner than I've been since I was 16 or 17 years old. Putting it on genetics is a cop-out, IMO. Not everybody can look like a bodybuilder, but anybody can certainly get reasonably lean if they put forth the effort.6 -
Jthanmyfitnesspal wrote: »So, OP, you've been quite heavy and now you're not, and you've got some flab you can't lose. Same here.
You can build bigger muscles, but that will not rid you of the flab. It's in the genes, man.
Only expensive unnecessary surgery would do that, but, before you run off and blow your life savings on that, I ask: does it really matter that much?
There are so many ways to spend that money. Maybe you need to get out and see the world. Maybe you need to learn something. Use your imagination. There are so many ways to improve yourself that don't involve your appearance.
Yes I think that's part of the issue As well. Crappy genes. Odd as it sounds I enjoy this though. Hell I'll never be Arnold but I'm enjoying learning all this.2 -
Verity1111 wrote: »
Lord. I never realized it took that much time to gain muscle! I will definitely be adding more protein now... lol not later.
You don't gain muscle just eating protein. You need to strength train too, in a structured way. And whilst cutting you'll be lucky to add any muscle. Add in being female and adding muscle is a lot harder.5 -
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DancingMoosie wrote: »
Don't forget, this is assuming a progressive lifting routine/program.VintageFeline wrote: »
You don't gain muscle just eating protein. You need to strength train too, in a structured way. And whilst cutting you'll be lucky to add any muscle. Add in being female and adding muscle is a lot harder.
I'm not sure what qualifies and progressive, but I use weight machines at the gym as of now as well as a 20lb kettlebell. I'll get a bigger one when I'm ready. I'm still obese (180lbs 5'4") with 50lbs or more to go... and recovering from an injury less than a year (haven't been walking a year yet) so I'm not rushing *too* much. I have moved up a little in the last few weeks since I started - for leg presses, for example, I did 100lbs then 120 then 150. I start with sets of 6 if it's a bit too heavy and then as I get used to it sets of 12 then I up the weight. Is that what you mean? slowly use more weights? I know - barbells. Im not ready, but when I do I will be sure to up it when I am able lol. I don't necessarily want or need to add too much muscle (and I know this comes AFTER dieting) but I want to try to keep what I have.
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dave_in_ni wrote: »
Yes I think that's part of the issue As well. Crappy genes. Odd as it sounds I enjoy this though. Hell I'll never be Arnold but I'm enjoying learning all this.
I am going to disagree. Genes play a part in how we are naturally inclined to be, but you can change your body and you can tone (so to speak) if that's what you want. It just seems it takes more effort than I knew before results haha. I have faith in you OP! Work it out.0 -
I certainly wouldn't give up that easily. I've reduced a lot of the extra flab that I thought I couldn't lose. At 54, I'm leaner than I've been since I was 16 or 17 years old. Putting it on genetics is a cop-out, IMO. Not everybody can look like a bodybuilder, but anybody can certainly get reasonably lean if they put forth the effort.
Well, we're close in age I am pretty active and I'm at a weight I haven't seen since I was 30, yet the flab persists! If you find a solution, let me know!
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dave_in_ni wrote: »
Great post thanks. Well cutting can take a run and jump as I am sick of it. Recomp I think it is.
Well yes!!! Usmcmp knows her stuff and reading her advice put this old lady on the road to recomp 2 yrs ago. The results are slow, but amazing. Try it and tell us how it goes.6 -
snowflake954 wrote: »
Well yes!!! Usmcmp knows her stuff and reading her advice put this old lady on the road to recomp 2 yrs ago. The results are slow, but amazing. Try it and tell us how it goes.
Yeah will do. Thanks all for the advice, I think I finally see a light at the end of the tunnel now.0 -
Pick a programme you like and stick with it.
Diet down for 8-12 weeks and assess your bodyfat. If you're under 12% then increase calories to maintenance. See how your body reacts to the increase in calories. If you aren't making any strength or physical progress then eat more. When your bodyfat gets too high, start again.0 -
dave_in_ni wrote: »
Yes I think that's part of the issue As well. Crappy genes. Odd as it sounds I enjoy this though. Hell I'll never be Arnold but I'm enjoying learning all this.
I'd just like to address your "crappy genes" comment. It's true that most people don't win the lottery--long legs, torso, well proportioned,--you get it. The list goes on. This can make alot of people unhappy. I think it's better to take a look at what you've got and try to do the best you can to improve on it. Make peace with yourself and be the best you can be. Good luck.4 -
I didn't see anyone mention progressive overload. The OP seems to have a handle on how to gain and lose body weight based on his weight going up and down, but no difference in body fat%.
What I want to know is how much strength did he gain while on these programs. What I think the OP should be focused on is increasing his powerlifting total - end of story. When he comes back and says his squat and deadlift went up 150 lbs, then he cut for 6 weeks then didn't see any change, then I'll wonder what the world has come to.
Increase power lifting total for 6 months (squat, deadlift, overhead press, bench press, chins, rows), then cut.1 -
@Rusty740dave_in_ni wrote: »
I have done the following
Bigger Leaner Stronger
5X5
Fierce 5
2 different versions of PPL
My lifts involving legs have been pretty decent and still going all be it slowly, Deadlift 1RM 315lbs, Squat 286lbs but upper body is rubbish. BP 132lbs OHP 103lbs
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TavistockToad wrote: »
Thanks for that, I still want to see where he started at. Seems like he's getting bored with the programs, not doing them properly and generally messing about.2 -
Thanks for that, I still want to see where he started at. Seems like he's getting bored with the programs, not doing them properly and generally messing about.
You're not wrong3 -
trigden1991 wrote: »Pick a programme you like and stick with it.
Diet down for 8-12 weeks and assess your bodyfat. If you're under 12% then increase calories to maintenance. See how your body reacts to the increase in calories. If you aren't making any strength or physical progress then eat more. When your bodyfat gets too high, start again.
he's already 6 feet and something like 140 pounds.
that's insanely tiny. why would he diet down for another 2-3 months? that's quiet frankly absurd.
Also- OP- seriously- it takes YEARS to rebuild your body. LONG term goals- 12 weeks is piddles compared to what you need.
you need a much longer approach to recomping- and you certainly don't need to lose more weight.5 -
OP this is my advice,
You gotta bulk.... you cannot cut anymore, you need to put some LEAN tissue on. You have no muscle to cut into so no matter you weigh, you will be skinny fat. Your entire body composition will be greatly improved when you add some lean tissue on your frame. Keep an eye on your surplus, maybe 250-300 over maintenance and raise slowly as you grow. Keep your food clean and do cardio. Follow a beginner routine like 5x5 stronglifts and build yourself a foundation of muscle and strength.
Get strong, get big, and enjoy food.2 -
therocpile wrote: »OP this is my advice,
You gotta bulk.... you cannot cut anymore, you need to put some LEAN tissue on. You have no muscle to cut into so no matter you weigh, you will be skinny fat. Your entire body composition will be greatly improved when you add some lean tissue on your frame. Keep an eye on your surplus, maybe 250-300 over maintenance and raise slowly as you grow. Keep your food clean and do cardio. Follow a beginner routine like 5x5 stronglifts and build yourself a foundation of muscle and strength.
Get strong, get big, and enjoy food.
What specifically does clean mean and why would clean matter if he's hitting appropriate macros? Why would he do cardio if he's in a surplus unless he wants to eat more since the cardio isn't going to make him leaner? His nutrient partitioning for a bulk will be horrible in just a few pounds.1
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