Looking some insight about my marriage
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You are right - I don't hate him and I am not angry at him. I still love him in the way you love a friend, or sibling. I want what is best for him and I want him to be happy. I my thoughts of separating, I want to do it in a way that gives him the best chance to get off on the right foot for supporting himself. I don't want to take everything we have and leave him in the dust, I want to help him transition.cburke8909 wrote: »Focus on yourself and do what you need to do for you. A separation may force him to decide to make a change. Most importantly forgive yourself and take responsibility for what all this has done to you. He needs help and its likely in the form of breaking a bad habit of depending on you instead of taking action himself. That pain is all his to own. Your pain for what this has done to you is all on you, you have no right to hate him or be angry at him for this but you have every right to get out.
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lol - yesOutOfUserName wrote: »bossyblackdog wrote: »OutOfUserName wrote: »brentster42 wrote: »As a counselor i think It's a good idea that you are seeing one. Obviously this marriage isn't working, and you will need to decide if you are wanting it to work anymore. If you can get your husband to go to counseling that would help clarify things, but if he's resisting counseling that is also a big Red Flag that he's not really interested in saving it.
shi t id save it if im getting a free ride out of it
This is exactly what my sister said...
just to be clear she said it about him right?
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I think you already know the answer, and know what you need to do. Marriage Counseling might help, and if he won't go, go by yourself. Don't worry about losing your best friend; I'm sure she is very aware of her brother's behavior. Your husband needs to grow up, and become a partner in this marriage, if indeed, he wants to stay in it. . My best wishes to you. Only you know what you should do. Do what is best for you.1
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Guilt because he's made bad decisions is not a reason to stay. Ask yourself a few questions... Are you happy? If not, what will it take to make you happy? Is he willing to help you get there? If the answer is no to the first and last questions, there's nothing to save. If he's willing to make a big change after a serious sit down, you have something to work with. If he could care less and just considers you a free hand out, walk away and go be happy!1
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I know the guilt you feel. I felt it too. I tried to show him as much, as you have tried. I made excuse after excuse for his behaviour. I know its hard, I took two children with me. Marriage for life is what I believed, but not a life sentence. You are younger than I was when I walked after 15 years, its was not at all what I believed in. In the same way as I could not believe that was all 30 years ago, neither can I beieve, I now have a happy marriage, that I was not looking for or expected, of 18 years, we work things out together.1
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TeacupsAndToning wrote: »Relationships sometimes go through periods where one partner is working and the other isn't, so maybe the one who isn't does more around the house, etc. to compensate for their partner going in to work every day, but your husband hasn't and based on what you've said, that's not love and that's not normal in a good relationship.
He's been taking from you for years, don't feel guilty if you decide to leave him.
About his contributions around the house - he does cook. But he regularly tells me it is "easier for him" when I cook more often. This grates on my every nerve. I hire someone to clean.0 -
Thanks Fuzzipeg - this gives me some hope!I know the guilt you feel. I felt it too. I tried to show him as much, as you have tried. I made excuse after excuse for his behaviour. I know its hard, I took two children with me. Marriage for life is what I believed, but not a life sentence. You are younger than I was when I walked after 15 years, its was not at all what I believed in. In the same way as I could not believe that was all 30 years ago, neither can I beieve, I now have a happy marriage, that I was not looking for or expected, of 18 years, we work things out together.
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bossyblackdog wrote: »I'm sorting through some feelings about my marriage. I wouldn't mind hearing about other people's experiences if they can help.
I've been with my husband for 9 years, married for 5. We don't have any kids. He is my best friend's brother, a woman who I have been best friends with since kindergarten. When my husband and I first started seeing each other, I was having a great time with him. The problem is that I have never been 100% sure I loved him. I eventually got to the point where I knew I enjoyed spending time with him, and I wanted what was best for him, and I was afraid of losing my friend if I didn't give the relationship every possible chance, so I tried to convince myself that I loved him, it was many years of "this is what love feels like, this is normal".
I have a really good job, and two years into our relationship he was miserable in his job and wanted to back to school for a second degree, so I agreed to his quitting work and going back to school full time. This was in 2010. Since then he has worked a little bit here and there but not much, and has done a third degree. He is working on developing a business, but I am unsure how hard he is working at it. Since 2010 he has not paid a bill, bought a single order of groceries, paid his cell bill, anything. He is extremely into marathons, and kayaking, and the majority of his focus is there. He has a $70000 student loan which he is not paying down ($60000 from before we were together), and he isn't saving anything for retirement (he is 40!).
I am currently in an extremely demanding training program, which takes about 60 hours a week. He HATES it, and says he wants his wife back. He complains that he feels it is more important then him, all the while I feel like his adventurous lifestyle has been his primary focus for years. He has been taking several trips a year to go to marathons and is racking up debt in a manner that I can't keep up with. I feel like I am working my *kitten* off so he can play! I extremely value financial security which is why I work so hard, he values having fun.
To top it off, I have always felt that I was the one holding everything together to keep our life together, and because of his short temper I would walk on eggshells and smooth everything over so he didn't have to deal with it. Last year we had a rental building (luckily sold now), that I had to manage and keep running while working 60 hours a week because he hated it and didn't want to deal with it. I remember one particular embarrassing weekend when the went away to kayak and I had to get my bother in law and father to come help me finish some renos so tenants could move in the next week.
I feel overwhelmed, unsupported, and taken advantage of. I have finally come to accept that any love I did have for him is gone. Our sex life is non-existent and the thought of it repulses me. The problem is I feel so guilty leaving him because I know he relies on my 100% for financial support. I know he loves our home, but he can't afford it without me, even with spousal support, and I feel guilty taking it away from him.
Except for the friend's brother part, you described a large chunk of my relationship with my ex husband. I told him I wanted a divorce last July, finalized in March, best decision I ever made.1 -
OutOfUserName wrote: »a 40 year old man who is perfectly healthy cant support himself.... i feel emasculated for the dude
My thoughts exactly. If he can kayak and run marathons, he can work. He'd just rather not, and up to now you've enabled that. So un-enable it, and see what happens. I doubt he'll be terribly happy about it, which you seem to already realize. Counseling for yourself is a good call. It will help you get your thoughts in order for whatever needs to happen next.
ETA, this thread is moving fast! I see you're speaking to a lawyer. Good call!1 -
htimpaired wrote: »Except for the friend's brother part, you described a large chunk of my relationship with my ex husband. I told him I wanted a divorce last July, finalized in March, best decision I ever made.
How did he take it? How did he make out in the long run? Did you struggle with actually telling him you wanted to leave?0 -
I do think he actually loves me, which is part of where my guilt is. This has been a poison for any love I had for him though - which has led me to where I am today. I agree if there is only love on one side, nothing will make it work. I don't think I can get it back, especially where I was unsure how much I loved him to begin with. I was young and sooo stupid.0
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I stopped reading at 'I don't love him'
Run... life is too short6 -
bossyblackdog wrote: »htimpaired wrote: »Except for the friend's brother part, you described a large chunk of my relationship with my ex husband. I told him I wanted a divorce last July, finalized in March, best decision I ever made.
How did he take it? How did he make out in the long run? Did you struggle with actually telling him you wanted to leave?
I was very fortunate that after the initial blow, he took it well and we both agreed that we wanted this to go smoothly. We're still friends. We used a mediator to work through the legal stuff. He kept he house but the mortgage is in my name while he establishes his income so he can qualify for the mortgage. Per our agreement, he has two years to get the mortgage and buy the house from me, or I sell it. He's kept a job since the fall and is paying his bills on his own.
I had TONS of that guilt-feeling like I enabled his bad behavior and to live off of me for all those years. I reached a point where I decided that guilt or not, I couldn't take ownership for his choices (to not get a job, to try to start a business from home). He was a grown man and is responsible for himself. I still have moments where I feel guilty, but overall we both agree it was best for both of us.1 -
bossyblackdog wrote: »I do think he actually loves me, which is part of where my guilt is. This has been a poison for any love I had for him though - which has led me to where I am today. I agree if there is only love on one side, nothing will make it work. I don't think I can get it back, especially where I was unsure how much I loved him to begin with. I was young and sooo stupid.
He loves what he's taking from you.
It would be interesting to hear his side of the conversation.1 -
htimpaired wrote: »
I like this idea. I would be happy to keep the house but if he really wants it, I would be willing to make an arrangement like this, but I would have to counter with forgoing spousal support for this. I was trying to think of a way to give him an option to keep the house, but I knew he couldn't get a mortgage.bossyblackdog wrote: »He kept he house but the mortgage is in my name while he establishes his income so he can qualify for the mortgage. Per our agreement, he has two years to get the mortgage and buy the house from me, or I sell it. He's kept a job since the fall and is paying his bills on his own.0 -
bossyblackdog wrote: »TeacupsAndToning wrote: »Relationships sometimes go through periods where one partner is working and the other isn't, so maybe the one who isn't does more around the house, etc. to compensate for their partner going in to work every day, but your husband hasn't and based on what you've said, that's not love and that's not normal in a good relationship.
He's been taking from you for years, don't feel guilty if you decide to leave him.
he regularly tells me it is "easier for him" when I cook more often.
you didn't mention you're married to captain obvious.
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There's always two sides.... Don't take advice from the internet is my advice.
I agree with this. And also, it sounds like you haven't really told him exactly how you feel and given him a chance to make things better because, as you said, you hate confrontations. I think people get divorced way too easily and you should at least get help to see if it is something that can be restored first.
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BedsideTableKangaroo wrote: »bossyblackdog wrote: »TeacupsAndToning wrote: »Relationships sometimes go through periods where one partner is working and the other isn't, so maybe the one who isn't does more around the house, etc. to compensate for their partner going in to work every day, but your husband hasn't and based on what you've said, that's not love and that's not normal in a good relationship.
He's been taking from you for years, don't feel guilty if you decide to leave him.
he regularly tells me it is "easier for him" when I cook more often.
you didn't mention you're married to captain obvious.
ha!0 -
Hire a good divorce attorney and get out now while you still have a chance.1
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There is another factor that I didn't mention that I think is the nail in the coffin. I don't know 100% if I want kids, but I can not picture a life raising kids with him. I would be the only parent. If I stayed, I would not have kids. Even though I don't know if I want them, I would never forgive myself if I made that decision based on the wrong reasons.4
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In all this you are showing yourself to be a much better person than most of us. Please think of your own future, please do not be overly fair to this person who is taking advantage of you.
edited to add.
The last factor you mentioned, it is key, you know you do not want/need children in this situation. Let the future take care of itself. I felt I had two children and a grumpy lodger.0 -
I see one word and that is codependency.. you have recognized all unhealthy behaviors yet you stay with him, also you keep supporting him the cost of your own mental, emotional well being..
This might take personal counseling, so the internet advice is worthless, but you already know in your heart of hearts what the right thing to do is.1 -
This is interesting RoxieDawn. I never really thought of it as a codependent relationship because I always thought I wasn't depending on him for anything. That being said, I really don't know much about the nature of relationships or what exactly codependency is. This would be a good question to ask the counselor about.I see one word and that is codependency.. you have recognized all unhealthy behaviors yet you stay with him, also you keep supporting him the cost of your own mental, emotional well being..
This might take personal counseling, so the internet advice is worthless, but you already know in your heart of hearts what the right thing to do is.
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bossyblackdog wrote: »There is another factor that I didn't mention that I think is the nail in the coffin. I don't know 100% if I want kids, but I can not picture a life raising kids with him. I would be the only parent. If I stayed, I would not have kids. Even though I don't know if I want them, I would never forgive myself if I made that decision based on the wrong reasons.
Oh hunny, leave. Please leave. Don't make yet another (potential) sacrifice that will only leave you with regrets. If kids are something you may want and are potentially giving up for him, that is too much.
It was actually too much before you added this info -- but now it is way to damn much.0 -
I was in a similar situation. I supported him in all what he tried to achieve and supported me in none. Only (major) difference he was working and sorta paying his way within the relationship.
I stayed for quite some time because I felt responsible for him and I knew he would not cope without me etc blah blah blah.
anyway at one point I sat him down and told his this is the bottom line and you've reached itThis is what is going to happen and if not I am out of here by christmas. In the end he was not willing to change a thing so I was out 6 weeks later. Guess what I lived, am now very happily married to an amazing man that supports me through anything. My ex? Well he survived without me. From what I hear he is now an ever more miserable person, but he lives and still seems to kinda manage. I do not feel guilty about leaving him at all. In the end he made it happen. I only feel sorry that I did not leave earlier1 -
I know it seems pathetic to look for insight here, but this really has helped. I was asking myself if I was being selfish in this feeling of wanting to leave. I know I can't present his side, all I can demonstrate is how I feel. Seeing other's input and feelings has helped me with some perspective. It hasn't changed my feeling of what I want, because I want to leave, but it has given me some confidence in it.2
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No 2 situations are ever the same. I was also married to a man child many years ago. However, like you, I am/was non confrontational. We married young, probably too young, had a child together, but I let things fester. There was a moment I remember crying to myself and he walked in wanting to talk. I told him I thought we were heading for divorce, and he said he would call his employee care line to set up counseling. I gave it another year, and he never called. At that point, things were too far gone. Neither of us were really talking much about our feelings, and his eyes (and hands)were wandering elsewhere. I left him. It came as a huge blindside to him. I pointed out that he had a year to set up counseling, and he never did. I guess I felt that if he was going to truly listen and take my fears and frustrations seriously, he would have made that step. Then again, I was 25 and knew nothing about life. In the end, I am glad things ended. Even though it was a hard blow to him, he quickly regained and eventually found a new wife. We co-parent well, only live a couple of blocks from each other, and even though we are on friendly terms, I am often reminded when he gets cocky as to why I am no longer with him. It was a really hard decision, but I am glad I made it. We are both better off not being together.
The good news on my end....fast forward to today, and I am with a man who sees that confrontation is hard for me. However, he has a way of helping me open up, even if it is painful. We talk through things openly, and end up figuring out what brought us to whatever point we may be at. It is a good balance for us both! I am learning confrontation is healthy and can indeed be handled in a mature manner.4 -
bossyblackdog wrote: »
I have told him many times he is spending too much money and I can't keep up with it. And I have tried to set an example by not spending money on frivolous things, even when he knows it was something I would like to have (greenhouse being the most recent example). Then a short two months later he informs me he will be headed to Arizona soon for the second time this year, we live in Canada and right now exchange is murder), the $400 race registration is paid with our joint credit card and the plan ticket has been booked. I'm not confrontational, and when he gets defensive I back off. I feel like I have tried to demonstrate that I am not happy, but I haven't been brave enough to outright tell him he has to get his *kitten* together. This is what I mean by feeling like some of this is my fault.MrStabbems wrote: »Yeah I'm usually an advocate of trying to fix things but that reads as a bye bye to me. The only bit you don't mention is what you've done to try rectify things e.g. have you told him all this? have to tried to communicate and get him to work on this stuff? if the answer is yes and it hasn't changed then leave.
I would've cut his credit cards off then and there! Or at least reduce the balance.
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A lot of what you said sounds like my friend's former husband. She felt bad about leaving too. Ultimately her husband became physically abusive and she left. He whined for a little while to try to get her to come back, but he didn't bother even showing up for the divorce hearing. She got stuck with a lot of the debt that her ex had racked up, but at least she got rid of him. I think you know what the best thing to do is. Sometimes it's just hard to actually do it, but I think you'll be better off without him.2
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