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Do you think obese/overweight people should pay more for health insurance?
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Replies
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janejellyroll wrote: »For the 2nd time. Insurance also starts at the statistical norm. For Americans this is ALREADY guessing that you're fat, sedentary, and eat poorly. Because 'murica. If you're not these things, almost every insurance company will give you discounts.
I don't get any discounts for my weight, activity level, and diet (that I'm aware of).
you should check in to that. You might have to dig a little deeper. I had the same insurer for 5 years before I found out how to get discounts and rebates for making healthier lifestyle choices.0 -
how is it remotely controversial that fat people are less healthy than fit people? Have we really gone that far down the "acceptance" and "healthy at any weight" "big boned" *kitten* rabbit hole that people actually believe this?
personal responsibility is not a thing anymore...
everyone has an excuse, so we should all get on the excuse train to political correctness-ville..
people are not over weight they are just "waist challenged"...1 -
If you take a group of 1000 people at a healthy weight, and group of 1000 people who are overweight, over a equal periods the fitter group will incur LESS health care expenses than the fatter group. Therefore the fitter people should pay lower premiums.
Anecdotes about individuals in either group are pointless. You can't know WHICH of those people will get sick and need money. But you CAN know that SOMEBODY in that group will need money. This is the fundamental basis of the entire institution of insurance, and has been since the first insurance schemes were established at Lloyd's Coffee Shop in London in the 1600s to insure merchant ships.
I would argue against this - the fatter group may incur more diseases/chronic conditions, but statistically speaking, the fitter group is far more likely to incur injuries which often times offset any medical cost savings from the lack of chronic issues. Just my N=1 experience on this - my daughter broke her wrist and the costs incurred with that single injury out-weighed several YEARS of my maintenance medications.
Doubt it. Take a look at the costs of the broken wrist vs the medicine without factoring insurance payments for either. Most maintenance medicines for heart issues diabetes, and other chronic issues are very expensive.
We're shielded in many cases since often we just see a $25 co-pay.
The wrist was a one time only event. The medicine will most likely be lifelong and unless you take steps to improve the situation, the treatment will most likely get more expensive.2 -
how is it remotely controversial that fat people are less healthy than fit people? Have we really gone that far down the "acceptance" and "healthy at any weight" "big boned" *kitten* rabbit hole that people actually believe this?
personal responsibility is not a thing anymore...
everyone has an excuse, so we should all get on the excuse train to political correctness-ville..
people are not over weight they are just "waist challenged"...
oh please. It has nothing to do with political correctness. Have you seen a right-wing rally recently? not exactly a cross section of the fittest and healthiest Americans.
It goes well beyond just not wanting to "offend" fat people by calling them fat. It starts with parents being blind to how unhealthy their own children are and extends into adulthood when fat people want to validate their own unhealthy lifestyle by accepting it in others.
It cuts across ALL political and ideological stripes.
Hell. When I was in the military, not exactly the most "politically correct" place, obesity was still rampant. And for MANY it was justified because they "felt" manly, or macho. Or celebrated feats of eating and drinking. Especially feats of drinking. Fat guys were "tanks" and "beasts." They weren't just fat. Skinny guys "needed a sandwich." etc. It was pervasive.3 -
Should smokers, or pregnant women, or addicts, or people who work in a profession that could pose health hazards like doctors or nurses, should those with kids or those who have less means pay more for health insurance?0
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Mr_Healthy_Habits wrote: »Should smokers, or pregnant women, or addicts, or people who work in a profession that could pose health hazards like doctors or nurses, should those with kids or those who have less means pay more for health insurance?
wow, one of these things is not like the other.2 -
Mr_Healthy_Habits wrote: »Should smokers, or pregnant women, or addicts, or people who work in a profession that could pose health hazards like doctors or nurses, should those with kids or those who have less means pay more for health insurance?
wow, one of these things is not like the other.
Why not you choose to smoke you chose to have kids, you chose your profession0 -
janejellyroll wrote: »For the 2nd time. Insurance also starts at the statistical norm. For Americans this is ALREADY guessing that you're fat, sedentary, and eat poorly. Because 'murica. If you're not these things, almost every insurance company will give you discounts.
I don't get any discounts for my weight, activity level, and diet (that I'm aware of).
you should check in to that. You might have to dig a little deeper. I had the same insurer for 5 years before I found out how to get discounts and rebates for making healthier lifestyle choices.
My insurance never gave discounts for anything, not even for being a non-smoker (and I worked for a BAC). They did have some benefits ($250.00/year so not much incentive) to participate in a "healthy life" type program, and hotlines/online resources for things like weight loss, mental health, smoking cessation etc. but no actual discounts.
I always wondered about the smoking discount incentives - smoking is self-reported, so what's to prevent people from reporting as non-smokers and getting the discount as long as they don't file a claim for smoking-related expenses? And I think (just my observation) that a big chunk of smoking-related expenses are likely to incur after a person is retired, or no longer working.
Just something I always wondered about...0 -
The thing I hate most about these type of threads is there full of people that want to pretend like they are in shape versus someone who's not in shape because they have some kind of virtue or quote-unquote personal responsibility that those who aren't in shape don't possess...
The fact is there are many out there who are in less shape than I am who are much more responsible than I am as well. The difference here is I'm not going to claim some kind of moral High Ground over somebody who's in less shape because I happen to be in better shape.
So no I don't believe they should have to pay more for health insurance that's just ridiculous that is the insurance company is trying to divide us so that they can make a better profit before you know it they'll find a reason to start charging you more for your health insurance
2 -
how is it remotely controversial that fat people are less healthy than fit people? Have we really gone that far down the "acceptance" and "healthy at any weight" "big boned" *kitten* rabbit hole that people actually believe this?
personal responsibility is not a thing anymore...
everyone has an excuse, so we should all get on the excuse train to political correctness-ville..
people are not over weight they are just "waist challenged"...
oh please. It has nothing to do with political correctness. Have you seen a right-wing rally recently? not exactly a cross section of the fittest and healthiest Americans.
It goes well beyond just not wanting to "offend" fat people by calling them fat. It starts with parents being blind to how unhealthy their own children are and extends into adulthood when fat people want to validate their own unhealthy lifestyle by accepting it in others.
It cuts across ALL political and ideological stripes.
Hell. When I was in the military, not exactly the most "politically correct" place, obesity was still rampant. And for MANY it was justified because they "felt" manly, or macho. Or celebrated feats of eating and drinking. Especially feats of drinking. Fat guys were "tanks" and "beasts." They weren't just fat. Skinny guys "needed a sandwich." etc. It was pervasive.
i didn't say anything about left vs right.. I said personal responsibility is not a thing anymore...
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Mr_Healthy_Habits wrote: »Mr_Healthy_Habits wrote: »Should smokers, or pregnant women, or addicts, or people who work in a profession that could pose health hazards like doctors or nurses, should those with kids or those who have less means pay more for health insurance?
wow, one of these things is not like the other.
Why not you choose to smoke you chose to have kids, you chose your profession
I disagree with this - a huge chunk of the population does the work they have to do to get by, not the work they would choose to do if they had their druthers.
eta; sorry, this is a just a side note to the this conversation, not trying to derail.
1 -
Mr_Healthy_Habits wrote: »The thing I hate most about these type of threads is there full of people that want to pretend like they are in shape versus someone who's not in shape because they have some kind of virtue or quote-unquote personal responsibility that those who aren't in shape don't possess...
The fact is there are many out there who are in less shape than I am who are much more responsible than I am as well. The difference here is I'm not going to claim some kind of moral High Ground over somebody who's in less shape because I happen to be in better shape.
So no I don't believe they should have to pay more for health insurance that's just ridiculous that is the insurance company is trying to divide us so that they can make a better profit before you know it they'll find a reason to start charging you more for your health insurance
life is about choices..
if someone wants to smoke every day and sit around eating hostess cupcakes that is fine, just don't expect me to have to subsidize their healthcare..1 -
Mr_Healthy_Habits wrote: »Mr_Healthy_Habits wrote: »Should smokers, or pregnant women, or addicts, or people who work in a profession that could pose health hazards like doctors or nurses, should those with kids or those who have less means pay more for health insurance?
wow, one of these things is not like the other.
Why not you choose to smoke you chose to have kids, you chose your profession
I disagree with this - a huge chunk of the population does the work they have to do to get by, not the work they would choose to do if they had their druthers.
You know what I happen to totally agree with you but the fact is there are many on here who will say you decided where you went to school and you decided what classes you took and you decided to apply for that job or not and you ultimately decided to end up where you ended up I mean personally I again agree with you and call BS but that's the kind of argument that people who would say things like heavy people should be charged more for health insurance are trying to make0 -
Mr_Healthy_Habits wrote: »Mr_Healthy_Habits wrote: »Should smokers, or pregnant women, or addicts, or people who work in a profession that could pose health hazards like doctors or nurses, should those with kids or those who have less means pay more for health insurance?
wow, one of these things is not like the other.
Why not you choose to smoke you chose to have kids, you chose your profession
I disagree with this - a huge chunk of the population does the work they have to do to get by, not the work they would choose to do if they had their druthers.
workplace incidents are also covered by the employers insurance. I used to a firefighter, and when somebody would get hurt on the job they didn't touch their personal insurance. Everything was billed to the department. Employers have to carry occupational health coverage for this reason.0 -
Mr_Healthy_Habits wrote: »Mr_Healthy_Habits wrote: »Should smokers, or pregnant women, or addicts, or people who work in a profession that could pose health hazards like doctors or nurses, should those with kids or those who have less means pay more for health insurance?
wow, one of these things is not like the other.
Why not you choose to smoke you chose to have kids, you chose your profession
I disagree with this - a huge chunk of the population does the work they have to do to get by, not the work they would choose to do if they had their druthers.
Largely because a similarly sized although not 1:1 overlapping would do no work if they had their druthers.3 -
janejellyroll wrote: »For the 2nd time. Insurance also starts at the statistical norm. For Americans this is ALREADY guessing that you're fat, sedentary, and eat poorly. Because 'murica. If you're not these things, almost every insurance company will give you discounts.
I don't get any discounts for my weight, activity level, and diet (that I'm aware of).
you should check in to that. You might have to dig a little deeper. I had the same insurer for 5 years before I found out how to get discounts and rebates for making healthier lifestyle choices.
My insurance never gave discounts for anything, not even for being a non-smoker (and I worked for a BAC). They did have some benefits ($250.00/year so not much incentive) to participate in a "healthy life" type program, and hotlines/online resources for things like weight loss, mental health, smoking cessation etc. but no actual discounts.
I always wondered about the smoking discount incentives - smoking is self-reported, so what's to prevent people from reporting as non-smokers and getting the discount as long as they don't file a claim for smoking-related expenses? And I think (just my observation) that a big chunk of smoking-related expenses are likely to incur after a person is retired, or no longer working.
Just something I always wondered about...
smoking is an easy one. If you report you don't smoke, and you get sick and it's noted as being related to smoking, they just don't pay. Net benefit for the insurer.0 -
how is it remotely controversial that fat people are less healthy than fit people? Have we really gone that far down the "acceptance" and "healthy at any weight" "big boned" *kitten* rabbit hole that people actually believe this?
personal responsibility is not a thing anymore...
everyone has an excuse, so we should all get on the excuse train to political correctness-ville..
people are not over weight they are just "waist challenged"...
oh please. It has nothing to do with political correctness. Have you seen a right-wing rally recently? not exactly a cross section of the fittest and healthiest Americans.
It goes well beyond just not wanting to "offend" fat people by calling them fat. It starts with parents being blind to how unhealthy their own children are and extends into adulthood when fat people want to validate their own unhealthy lifestyle by accepting it in others.
It cuts across ALL political and ideological stripes.
Hell. When I was in the military, not exactly the most "politically correct" place, obesity was still rampant. And for MANY it was justified because they "felt" manly, or macho. Or celebrated feats of eating and drinking. Especially feats of drinking. Fat guys were "tanks" and "beasts." They weren't just fat. Skinny guys "needed a sandwich." etc. It was pervasive.
i didn't say anything about left vs right.. I said personal responsibility is not a thing anymore...
please. You deliberately included not 1, but 2 right wing buzzwords. You're not fooling anyone.3 -
how is it remotely controversial that fat people are less healthy than fit people? Have we really gone that far down the "acceptance" and "healthy at any weight" "big boned" *kitten* rabbit hole that people actually believe this?
personal responsibility is not a thing anymore...
everyone has an excuse, so we should all get on the excuse train to political correctness-ville..
people are not over weight they are just "waist challenged"...
oh please. It has nothing to do with political correctness. Have you seen a right-wing rally recently? not exactly a cross section of the fittest and healthiest Americans.
It goes well beyond just not wanting to "offend" fat people by calling them fat. It starts with parents being blind to how unhealthy their own children are and extends into adulthood when fat people want to validate their own unhealthy lifestyle by accepting it in others.
It cuts across ALL political and ideological stripes.
Hell. When I was in the military, not exactly the most "politically correct" place, obesity was still rampant. And for MANY it was justified because they "felt" manly, or macho. Or celebrated feats of eating and drinking. Especially feats of drinking. Fat guys were "tanks" and "beasts." They weren't just fat. Skinny guys "needed a sandwich." etc. It was pervasive.
i didn't say anything about left vs right.. I said personal responsibility is not a thing anymore...
please. You deliberately included not 1, but 2 right wing buzzwords. You're not fooling anyone.
your the one that assumed that..
I did not know that political correctness is only a creature of the left.
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Mr_Healthy_Habits wrote: »Mr_Healthy_Habits wrote: »Mr_Healthy_Habits wrote: »Should smokers, or pregnant women, or addicts, or people who work in a profession that could pose health hazards like doctors or nurses, should those with kids or those who have less means pay more for health insurance?
wow, one of these things is not like the other.
Why not you choose to smoke you chose to have kids, you chose your profession
I disagree with this - a huge chunk of the population does the work they have to do to get by, not the work they would choose to do if they had their druthers.
You know what I happen to totally agree with you but the fact is there are many on here who will say you decided where you went to school and you decided what classes you took and you decided to apply for that job or not and you ultimately decided to end up where you ended up I mean personally I again agree with you and call BS but that's the kind of argument that people who would say things like heavy people should be charged more for health insurance are trying to make
Yes, in total agreement.0 -
Mr_Healthy_Habits wrote: »Mr_Healthy_Habits wrote: »Mr_Healthy_Habits wrote: »Should smokers, or pregnant women, or addicts, or people who work in a profession that could pose health hazards like doctors or nurses, should those with kids or those who have less means pay more for health insurance?
wow, one of these things is not like the other.
Why not you choose to smoke you chose to have kids, you chose your profession
I disagree with this - a huge chunk of the population does the work they have to do to get by, not the work they would choose to do if they had their druthers.
You know what I happen to totally agree with you but the fact is there are many on here who will say you decided where you went to school and you decided what classes you took and you decided to apply for that job or not and you ultimately decided to end up where you ended up I mean personally I again agree with you and call BS but that's the kind of argument that people who would say things like heavy people should be charged more for health insurance are trying to make
Yes, in total agreement.
Originally I was playing Devil's Advocate to prove a point2
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