Why I left Weight Watchers new "Freestyle" Program
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I'm a lifetime WW member (since 2000). I initially lost 30 lbs and I maintained for a time. Went back to WW in 2013 and lost a few pounds but stalled out and couldn't figure out why. WW had no answers for me. I now know I wasn't losing because I was eating at maintenance.
I accidentally found MFP in 2014. I began counting calories, read all the stickies about how weight loss works, lurked on the forum and learned more about nutrition/calories in-calories out, energy expenditure, etc. thanks to all the "mean people" who knew what they were talking about. So, 4 years later I've dropped 50lbs and have been in maintenance for about 3 years now (128ish pounds, 5'2.5" and 68 years old). For me, calorie counting is the only way to maintain my weight.
I think of it as balancing my checkbook. If I spend too much I have to cut back somewhere. Just like my checkbook my balance changes constantly so I keep track of the changes by using a Fitbit and MFP to track my calorie allowance against my calories expended through exercise and daily living. Is it totally accurate? No, but it's pretty close. I check my fluctuations against my allowance and over time it all balances out. I eat anything I want within reason (portion control). I don't restrict any foods because my goal is to eat as much food as I can and still maintain my weight.
WW is a good program but I learned the most from MFP. I'll be here tracking forever and I don't mind considering the alternative (obesity and ill health). After all, I have to balance my checkbook forever too.
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I'm think I'm over WW. I realized this the other night after a hypoglycemia attack when I went way over points but came out to 1500 calories for the day eating cereal to recover from a 6 mile run. Before this I had only had about 900 calories of low and zero point for the day. Then there was thinking about why is 90 calories of plain yogurt free but 90 calories of flavored yogurt have points? Pretty dumb. What sealed it was a Half Sized Me podcast where a gentleman said he felt he was forcing himself to stay on a program he was no longer being genuine to, and it made him feel he was no longer being genuine with himself. I've been feeling the same way for a while. That and I haven't lost or maintained weight consistently since Smart Points. I was free Lifetime but now I'm over. I'm not paying for nothing anymore.9
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I’ve been on WW off and on for years. With the new program, yes there are over 200 Free Foods, but those free foods still have calories.... and calories do add up. I’m finding the new program sometimes frustrating because, if you want something on the sweet side....you can have it, but your point total for the day is going to take a big hit.. but you also have “weeklies” that you can use to have those extras. I think WW is trying to steer you towards a healthier style of eating, which isn’t a bad thing at all, but when you have something that is “0”points, but is also 200 calories, and you think “Hmm, this is “0” points, so I’ll have 2 servings, you might find your weight loss will stall at some point, and then you start wondering why...... but with counting calories, you know what your intake is for the day, and you go from there1
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Aren't WW just thrashing around in a panic because people are leaving them in droves? In the days before we could go on line to count calories a get sensible advice, WW were coining in money. Now we have a wonderful choice and don't need their 'experts' or the sugar filled junk they sell at the meetings.2
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newheavensearth wrote: »I'm think I'm over WW. I realized this the other night after a hypoglycemia attack when I went way over points but came out to 1500 calories for the day eating cereal to recover from a 6 mile run. Before this I had only had about 900 calories of low and zero point for the day. Then there was thinking about why is 90 calories of plain yogurt free but 90 calories of flavored yogurt have points? Pretty dumb. What sealed it was a Half Sized Me podcast where a gentleman said he felt he was forcing himself to stay on a program he was no longer being genuine to, and it made him feel he was no longer being genuine with himself. I've been feeling the same way for a while. That and I haven't lost or maintained weight consistently since Smart Points. I was free Lifetime but now I'm over. I'm not paying for nothing anymore.newheavensearth wrote: »I'm think I'm over WW. I realized this the other night after a hypoglycemia attack when I went way over points but came out to 1500 calories for the day eating cereal to recover from a 6 mile run. Before this I had only had about 900 calories of low and zero point for the day. Then there was thinking about why is 90 calories of plain yogurt free but 90 calories of flavored yogurt have points? Pretty dumb. What sealed it was a Half Sized Me podcast where a gentleman said he felt he was forcing himself to stay on a program he was no longer being genuine to, and it made him feel he was no longer being genuine with himself. I've been feeling the same way for a while. That and I haven't lost or maintained weight consistently since Smart Points. I was free Lifetime but now I'm over. I'm not paying for nothing anymore.
You are an athlete. So am I. As athletes we do need to make sure we fuel ourselves for our body and our excercise level. I think you will find MFP is a great program to help you actually see how much and what you are eating. I am a swimmer and after upping my swim workouts I was getting hypoglycemic.
So I now carry a good protein or other kind of energy bar, or even a bit of candy for severe hypoglycemia attacks. I keep my refuel foods in my gym bag. But if you are doing outdoor runs you may want to keep something on your person. Hope you find MFP helpful to your fitness efforts.2 -
Ha! And I thought it was just me!
Interesting thread.
I think what bothered me the most with the new WW program was last week when I was buying the expensive 1% unsweetened yoghurt that I didn't like at all and needed to put the chemical laden no sugar maple syrup on it to make it palatable. All to make it 0 points.
But the low sugar probiotics yoghurt that I liked that came in a convenient fourpack for work was too expensive at 4 SP, so I couldn't budget my points for it.
It simply didn't make sense.
And that was the end for me.
Back to MFP
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A while ago I was looking for interesting sandwiches and found this
http://www.emilybites.com/2015/05/grilled-brie-and-pear-sandwiches.html
I remembered it having WW points so I checked back, and it's been updates with Freestyle points. Turns out that it's basically nearly half the daily points of the budgets I've seen and it's not even 300 calories. Doesn't make sense. That would mean severely undereating for those with certain preferences, and as I mentioned earlier it would mean overeating for me.
This one is about the same calories but only 1 point:
http://www.emilybites.com/2017/12/white-chicken-chili.html
I guess a person could use a bunch of low point recipes to offset the high point ones, but that ignores food preference which is an important part of any long term diet and doesn't give a clear idea if one is overeating or undereating because the calories don't make sense unless you count both points and calories which defeats the purpose when counting calories is easier and cheaper. I don't get it.6 -
Like a lot of you, I have been dancing with Weight Watchers for a long time (my first membership experience was meetings in 2004; the past three times I did online only). I could lose the weight, but maintenance was a struggle. I lost almost 50 pounds on it in the fall of 2016, but have promptly gained it all back in a year's time. With all of the hype around Freestyle, I seriously considered giving it another go, but changed my mind. The idea that foods can be zero points is nonsensical to me. I like chicken thighs better, but if I go for the breast it "won't count?" So, I am back to MFP (which I did briefly eons ago) and hope to have a better outcome and make this last.8
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I left WW this week because the new "Freestyle" program just will not work for me. I have lost over 20 pounds on their smartpoints program.
WW used to be about flexibility and being able to eat foods you like as long as it fit into your point range. With this latest change, they added 200 food items that are zero points, but by doing this, they took away 7 points a day for everyone. So I went from 30 points a day to 23 points a day. I am a picky eater (and I know they are trying to get people to eat healthier) and most of the foods on the list I wouldn't eat anyway. So I got 7 points taken away for no reason really.
What really got me was yesterday a member posted on the message board (called connect) about how she wasn't enjoying connect anymore because she was "so tired of reading negativity about the new program and this should only be a positive place." Over 5,000+ members "liked" her post and commented things like "preach girl" or "I agree!" So those of us who are struggling with the new change were basically told to not look to connect for support cause they didn't want to hear it. That is was did it for me. I left a post and said "I hear all 5,000+ members loud and clear and you are right this program is not for me. I don't want to belong to a community where so many people can gang up on the few of us that are struggling." It was a really horrible feeling....to be honest. Talk about not feeling part of a community anymore.
So here I am, back to MFP, and I am excited to be able to eat what I want within my calorie range and try to make healthier choices along the way! If there is anyone who would like to start a group to support each other please let me know!
I just left WW two days ago because I didn’t lose as much weight on the problem. It stressed me out more than it needed to and the meetings didn’t help me. MFP is something I keep coming back to2 -
This zero points food list is amusing-- some of these can be quite caloric (like beans and fatty fish like certain types of salmon.) Even salsa can add up, if you're the kind of person who heaps it on. I've eaten about 1,000 calories of shrimp in a day before (200 grams of protein!) and even that would count as "zero points," because zero times anything is zero.2
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ztaylor205 wrote: »This zero points food list is amusing-- some of these can be quite caloric (like beans and fatty fish like certain types of salmon.) Even salsa can add up, if you're the kind of person who heaps it on. I've eaten about 1,000 calories of shrimp in a day before (200 grams of protein!) and even that would count as "zero points," because zero times anything is zero.
Not to mention that shrimp (and beans) is a boatload of sodium!!3 -
I too am contemplating leaving WW. I have tried Freestyle and failed miserably. Up until that points I had been going strong since June 2017 and have lost 43 lbs! I tried speaking to my leader at the meeting and to customer service through the online service. They do not seem to care that I am struggling and literally refuse to even send me the points list so I can go back to the pre-Freestyle era. I am going to try this for a couple of weeks again (used to do MFP in the past) but I think that I am done with WW. I am just so angry and disappointed with them. I can tell some of you are feeling the same way.10
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I’m about ready to quit WW. Had huge success with Points Plus, but Freestyle is awful (I’m up one week, down another...stressful!). I don’t understand why WW can’t/won’t run two platforms and let people choose between Freestyle and Points Plus. The zero point proteins should only be zero points up until a certain point, then points should start kicking in. How can eating 6 eggs, 12 oz of chicken breast, and a can of chickpeas over the course of one day possibly allow for weight loss, especially when coupled with unlimited fruits and veggies?6
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I have been thinking about this on my walk.
For me, I needed to think about how much I ate, of the healthy foods I did eat. All about quantity.
WW was assuming I ate terribly so therefore I needed educating on what to eat. Hence railroading me into chicken and eggs and dreadful yoghurt as protein sources (and if I was eating takeaways every night I guess that made sense).
So for me, telling me not to count half the food I ate was not rewarding me for making better choices around how *much* I ate - it was enabling me to eat more and more. And messing up my brain in the process.
A diet program that enables disordered thinking around food doesn't sound good to me.15 -
The point is, the longer a member takes to get to goal, the more money WW are coining in - simple arithmetic!10
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I also left Weight Watchers recently after the new program was introduced. I tried it for a few weeks but hated the restrictions, as in being told what to eat instead of just being given a number of points per day and eating what you wish. I had already lost a reasonable amount of weight with calorie counting, initially on paper then using MFP (with an older account I deleted). I tried Weight Watchers for a while, and liked the old system, especially having the weekly points and how it encouraged you to eat healthier. But now it's more restrictive to me, and I'm back to calorie counting. I struggle with eating too much with calorie counting, but at least I know it works and it's not a 'program' which can be changed without warning. I've got 16kg left to lose (I've lost about 28kg already) so I hope I reach my goal.1
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This almost sounds like their 20 20 plan...you didn't have to track much...just have 20g fiber minimum and 20g fat max in a day. Needless to say, you could work the system just like people have been doing with smart points and now freestyle. There is even a new colab on YouTube for WW freestyle trader Joe favorites. Most are 0 point items...and most are fake sugar sweetened or high sodium and all of it prepackaged and $$$.3
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Many years ago I did WW meetings and the old (really old) program worked and I learned alot. After falling off the wagon for a few years I did WW online for probably 10 years or more. At least I paid for it. I did not lose weight. Finally in 2016 I quit WW online and came to MFP. I have lost 89 pounds with MFP just counting my calories and walking daily. I am now at maintenance and feel I can live this lifestyle indefinately. I hate to think of how much money I paid for nothing. This site rocks and the support is better than what I found on WW online. And it's free!!!!14
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TL;DR I also left WW. I feel like it threw a lot of people out of the boat without instructions on how to swim. I liked the structure of the previous plans and this one feels too loose with no structure. I know that WW tried for a long time to "go beyond the scale", but let's face it...I missed the meetings that talked about what we could have/should have instead of "let's talk about feelings".
I'm not really being eloquent on my response, but in short, I too got frustrated with this new program. I wish those who are succeeding the best, but I'm afraid it has made the program worse, not better.6 -
I left WW as well! I just can't do it! I have been fighting the same 2 lbs for 3 weeks!!! Idk if I overeat the zero points, I just can't get the hang of the lower points or what!! I have been on WW off and on for 15 years and NEVER had this problem!! To not lose weight is frustrating, I chose this because logging calories kinda reminds me of how WW used to be when you logged EVERYTHING and it worked! And besides the recipe import option is pretty darn awesome!10
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I'm glad I found this post.
I did WW back in 2006 when I believe it was using the Flex Points system. This was before smart phones and I only did it online. I lost 15 lb in about 9 months but I felt like complete crap. I did not learn a lot about protein, fats, macros, etc. - basically their moto was if it fit in your Points, you could eat it.
That was the year I gave up regular pop and started my addiction to diet pop. I've tried giving up diet pop several times now only to always go back to it because you know, 0 calories. Back then I had a freezer full of frozen meals and there were many days I ate ice cream for dinner because it fit into my points. I may have lost weight but I was getting migraines, probably from the ton of processed food I was eating, and I didn't know much about portion control.
I thought about joining again but I too was puzzled by the number of Zero Point foods. Like so many of you, those foods account for many of the things I eat. I need to be more accountable with my portions and my sugar intake so I don't think the Freestyle plan will work for me.
And $35 a month online? That's pretty steep. I want to say it was around $16 a month when I did it, and I thought that was high back then!
I just need be more accountable and stick with MFP.5 -
The point is, the longer a member takes to get to goal, the more money WW are coining in - simple arithmetic!
It’s funny, because I reached my goal in November, and was willing to continue on WW for maintenance because the smart points was really easy for me to follow. Paying the monthly fee was worth it because the program was easy to follow and I felt good. When they switched, I complained openly on Consumer Alerts. WW reached out and offered me a free month, which I felt was reasonable. I’m holding out a bit longer in the hopes that they’ll realize that they need to bring back smart points. Lol.
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I'm considering leaving weight watchers for a lot of the reasons posted. Since new program i now post calories here. On Connect many people have switched there app setting to maintenance to get back their original Smart points. Many people are unhappy with this new program, new posts daily.5
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Wow! I would get myself in SOOOO much trouble trying to follow the 200 food list! Some of those are really not as low in calories as you’d think, so I can’t imagine anyone just grazing alllll day on these “zero point” foods and still being successful. There has to be some kind of guideline, not just a free-for-all. Glad you’re here on MFP and I hope this is the community you’re looking for!1
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I have done both, tracked points and tracked in MFP and MFP is more "real life" for me. It wasn't until I tracked in MFP that I really learned about calories. Just having a rough estimate in my head of what foods are what calories, I can make informed decisions on the fly and still be within my daily calorie goal. I could never do that with points. Welcome back and I wish you nothing but great success here!3
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I wouldn't do well on freestyle..I joined in Oct. 2017- didn't lose a pound, in 3 weeks. Probably thanks to the 0 point foods!. So i cancelled..and decided to stick with myfitnesspal . Down 2 pounds in 2 weeks. Some of us have eating disorders..and do overeat..therfore eating way too many calories, and not losing weight. I'm glad you posted this.
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I'm with all of you...just re-joined here because I cant eat enough on 23 points without cooking a huge slab of fish or bowls of veg for dinner and I don't always want to cook! Lost 30 pounds last year on Smart Points but can't handle this Freestyle thing. Previously I had a sandwich for lunch and the same for dinner and lost all that weight. Not enough points now to do the same method. I'm out.3
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I also just cancelled my membership! When I rejoined in November I was signing up for the Smart Points program which I have done successfully in the past and is doable for me,,,,then they changed to the Freestyle without warning or giving us options to continue as before or choice to try the new program (which is wrong for a paying customer) I gave the Freestyle a chance and NO WAY, it is NOT for me!!!5
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Thank you so much for your fantastic post. I left WW yesterday and am feeling sad and disappointed in myself. Did I make the right decision? Am I giving up on myself? BUT, I can't continue to pay for a program that I'm gaining weight on. I was eating so much every day because it was free, and it was counterproductive for me. I'm so glad that some of us have had the courage to take control back and come here. I'm hoping for success and sending you positive vibes!!!2
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Thank you so much for your fantastic post. I left WW yesterday and am feeling sad and disappointed in myself. Did I make the right decision? Am I giving up on myself? BUT, I can't continue to pay for a program that I'm gaining weight on. I was eating so much every day because it was free, and it was counterproductive for me. I'm so glad that some of us have had the courage to take control back and come here. I'm hoping for success and sending you positive vibes!!!
If you are switching to another program like mfp from ww, I don't see it as giving up on yourself. If the program was not a good fit for you and did not work for you, it is a rational choice to try something else. Good luck on your mfp journey.4
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