My insights on drinking a acv drink
Replies
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suzielawrence wrote: »Everyone's so quick to flash their skeptic badges every time someone mentions something other than CICO. ACV actually has some peer-reviewed, published research that suggests it might be beneficial, if not for weight loss per se, but at least for preventing weight gain in the context of overeating, decreasing blood sugar spikes after meals, and for improving metabolic profiles (esp. lipids):
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/27595296
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/27209492
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/24894721
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/16015276
Don't play Captain Science without checking out the science.
The first 2 were rat studies, the 3rd was a mouse study. The last only had 12 subjects. So unless you are a rodent, I don't see where any of these are truly valid studies supporting ACV.7 -
moosmum1972 wrote: »suzielawrence wrote: »Everyone's so quick to flash their skeptic badges every time someone mentions something other than CICO. ACV actually has some peer-reviewed, published research that suggests it might be beneficial, if not for weight loss per se, but at least for preventing weight gain in the context of overeating, decreasing blood sugar spikes after meals, and for improving metabolic profiles (esp. lipids):
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/27595296
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/27209492
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/24894721
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/16015276
Don't play Captain Science without checking out the science.
ON RATS......
Why do you think experiments are done on rats?
P.S. the last one is on humans.8 -
suzielawrence wrote: »Everyone's so quick to flash their skeptic badges every time someone mentions something other than CICO. ACV actually has some peer-reviewed, published research that suggests it might be beneficial, if not for weight loss per se, but at least for preventing weight gain in the context of overeating, decreasing blood sugar spikes after meals, and for improving metabolic profiles (esp. lipids):
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/27595296
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/27209492
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/24894721
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/16015276
Don't play Captain Science without checking out the science.
So when the OP tells us that she reduced her calorie intake and increased her activity, we should believe that the ACV is responsible for her loss and not the less food/more exercise?13 -
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Poisonedpawn78 wrote: »its too bad you dont want to take the credit for the work you are doing by actually creating a deficit and losing weight, instead you want to assign it to some magic and potions.
To each their own i guess.
This. All of this.4 -
suzielawrence wrote: »Everyone's so quick to flash their skeptic badges every time someone mentions something other than CICO. ACV actually has some peer-reviewed, published research that suggests it might be beneficial, if not for weight loss per se, but at least for preventing weight gain in the context of overeating, decreasing blood sugar spikes after meals, and for improving metabolic profiles (esp. lipids):
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/27595296
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/27209492
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/24894721
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/16015276
Don't play Captain Science without checking out the science.
The first one found slight improvements based on a high-fat diet only.
The second one showed that there was a lower food intake. So, yeah - less food = less weight.
The third one the mice were fed high-cholesterol diets.
The fourth one dealt with meals of just bread.
So, sure - if you do something completely stupid with your diet, ACV may be worthwhile. That's all these said.
eta: The only one that dealt with humans was the fourth. Additionally, all this said was that by adding another component to the "meal," GI response was lower. Well, yeah - that's what one would expect with pretty much anything added to a meal of only bread.
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Here's a systematic review of ACV studies, showing a beneficial effect on postprandial glucose and insulin response.
https://www.scopus.com/record/display.uri?origin=citedby&eid=2-s2.0-85014828549&noHighlight=false&relpos=2
Look, I'm not here to say that there's definitive proof that vinegar is a magic weight loss potion, what I'm saying is if someone believes something is helping them, don't be so fast to jump in and discredit them, because there's a solid chance you're wrong.
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suzielawrence wrote: »Here's a systematic review of ACV studies, showing a beneficial effect on postprandial glucose and insulin response.
https://www.scopus.com/record/display.uri?origin=citedby&eid=2-s2.0-85014828549&noHighlight=false&relpos=2
Look, I'm not here to say that there's definitive proof that vinegar is a magic weight loss potion, what I'm saying is if someone believes something is helping them, don't be so fast to jump in and discredit them, because there's a solid chance you're wrong.
So it helps with glucose spikes... that has zero to do with losing weight. The OP claimed that the ACV caused her to lose more weight and all of the studies on humans show there is no difference between groups that drank ACV and groups that didn't drink ACV when it comes to weight lose.12 -
suzielawrence wrote: »Here's a systematic review of ACV studies, showing a beneficial effect on postprandial glucose and insulin response.
https://www.scopus.com/record/display.uri?origin=citedby&eid=2-s2.0-85014828549&noHighlight=false&relpos=2
Look, I'm not here to say that there's definitive proof that vinegar is a magic weight loss potion, what I'm saying is if someone believes something is helping them, don't be so fast to jump in and discredit them, because there's a solid chance you're wrong.
We are actually trying to get the OP to give herself more credit, not discredit her, she is doing fantastic but it's not down to the ACV, it's down to her own hard work and the fact she's eating less and moving more. Why do you think most supplements and weight loss aids tell you in small print that they work only with a calorie controlled diet.
She still lost weight the week she wasn't taking the ACV - does that not tell you something?16 -
I've tried it. For reasons having nothing to do with weight loss, I drank ACV for weeks at a time during weight loss; and for other weeks at a time during weight loss, I didn't drink ACV. There was zero, zip, nada difference in weight loss rate when drinking it vs. not drinking it . . . and as a notorious data geek, I'm a meticulous logger.
OK gramma
@AnnPT77 
You're usually a level headed person, seldom taken by woo, or super woo!
So why were you desperately trying to pickle yourself
OK, but it's gonna be my usual essay-length ramble.
First, let me say this: I believe in doing n=1 experiments, if I'm pretty sure they won't hurt me. I'm also very, very skeptical about the results of n=1 experiments, because I understand that the human brain sees causation in every correlation, and that the placebo effect is stronger and operates differently than a lot of people think.
So, the ACV drinking specifically.
I would be much less likely to do it if I didn't actively enjoy vinegar. (I have at least a half dozen types of vinegar in the pantry at all times for cooking & eating - not different flavor-infused ones, but actual types: ACV, rice wine vinegar, sherry vinegar, regular and white balsamic vinegar, red and white wine vinegar, malt vinegar, beer vinegar, etc. One of my favorite alcoholic mixed drinks is made with "drinking vinegar" a.k.a. "shrub".) If I hated vinegar, and had to gag it down, as we see many here report, I for sure wouldn't drink it. Life is too short for yucky.
I had two reasons for the experiment.
First, I read someplace that drinking vinegar (any type) could be helpful to aging people who sometimes begin to have sub-optimal stomach acid production. While I don't know if I have that, I have had bouts of (medically diagnosed) IBS-C, to the point of having taken Rx meds for it in the distant past. So, I was curious whether regularly drinking vinegar would change anything. Results: Inconclusive.
Second, I have the vague notion, based on early returns from still very young, preliminary and so far non-definitive scientific research on the subject, that a diverse and happy gut microbiome (friendly bugs only, of course) is going to turn out to be a really good thing for people. I prefer to get dietary stuff when possible from foods humans have eaten for centuries or millennia, rather than from extracted/compounded supplements. Therefore, I make it a point to regularly eat a diverse range of traditional probiotic and prebiotic foods. Common probiotic foods include raw sauerkraut, yogurt, raw fermented pickles, miso, kefir, raw kim chi, and . . . raw vinegar (with the mother ). ACV is the most widely available raw vinegar.
Results: Completely un-evaluatable, but I never expected to be able to evaluate them.
I started experimenting with ACV before starting weight loss. Part way through weight loss, my gallbladder gave me severe heartburn. It was gallbladder adenomyomatosis, not stones or sludge, and not caused by weight loss (arguably, it was caused by obesity). The ACV seemed to make the heartburn worse, so I stopped drinking it until after the gallbladder came out. These circumstances created the "drinking ACV for weeks/not drinking ACV for weeks" situation.
None of it had anything to do with weight loss, and it had no observable effect on weight loss, appetite, satiation or anything related.
Is it woo? Possibly. Will it hurt me? Probably not (the tooth enamel thing is silly if you don't bathe your teeth in it, and we eat many other acidic foods anyway). Have I ever urged it on anyone else? Absolutely not, except for recipes and the alcoholic mixed drink thing, because that's delicious.
FWIW, I'm currently not drinking ACV, but I may decide to again sometime, for the second reason above.
That's it.
Thanks, That reminds me I need to pick up Yoghurt again now that I'm about done with my most recent downward trend.
Currently doing Kombucha daily, and it's just a little too much of a pain to fit yoghurt into my daily calories when I'm grinding down.1 -
lemurcat12 wrote: »
Start here:
https://www.mcclarybros.com/
https://www.mcclarybros.com/blogs/recipes -- craft cocktail recipes using vinegar
And I would 100% try them if I still drank alcohol.
That's the stuff: It's delicious! (Also relatively low cal - around 30 per serving IIRC - for lots of tasty flavor. Keep in mind that I did say I love vinegar in general. But I think some who are "meh" about vinegar might like it, as it has other flavors in the mix, with the ACV giving it a fruity/acidic zing . . . kind of like a citrus wedge or twist does in other beverages, even though most people wouldn't just eat a lemon or lime (at least absent a tequila shot ).)
@lemurcat12, think it would be plenty tasty/refreshing in plain sparkling water, maybe even still water. Alcohol is optional. Our ancestors used "shrub" (basically what this is) as a drink concentrate, made with fruits and possibly spices if available. Added to water, it made a refreshing summer beverage. I first encountered shrub around 40 years ago, when a reenactor type friend made it - huckleberry, I think it was.0 -
lemurcat12 wrote: »I've tried it. For reasons having nothing to do with weight loss, I drank ACV for weeks at a time during weight loss; and for other weeks at a time during weight loss, I didn't drink ACV. There was zero, zip, nada difference in weight loss rate when drinking it vs. not drinking it . . . and as a notorious data geek, I'm a meticulous logger.
OK gramma@AnnPT77
You're usually a level headed person, seldom taken by woo, or super woo!
So why were you desperately trying to pickle yourself
OK, but it's gonna be my usual essay-length ramble.
First, let me say this: I believe in doing n=1 experiments, if I'm pretty sure they won't hurt me. I'm also very, very skeptical about the results of n=1 experiments, because I understand that the human brain sees causation in every correlation, and that the placebo effect is stronger and operates differently than a lot of people think.
So, the ACV drinking specifically.
I would be much less likely to do it if I didn't actively enjoy vinegar. (I have at least a half dozen types of vinegar in the pantry at all times for cooking & eating - not different flavor-infused ones, but actual types: ACV, rice wine vinegar, sherry vinegar, regular and white balsamic vinegar, red and white wine vinegar, malt vinegar, beer vinegar, etc. One of my favorite alcoholic mixed drinks is made with "drinking vinegar" a.k.a. "shrub".) If I hated vinegar, and had to gag it down, as we see many here report, I for sure wouldn't drink it. Life is too short for yucky.
I had two reasons for the experiment.
First, I read someplace that drinking vinegar (any type) could be helpful to aging people who sometimes begin to have sub-optimal stomach acid production. While I don't know if I have that, I have had bouts of (medically diagnosed) IBS-C, to the point of having taken Rx meds for it in the distant past. So, I was curious whether regularly drinking vinegar would change anything. Results: Inconclusive.
Second, I have the vague notion, based on early returns from still very young, preliminary and so far non-definitive scientific research on the subject, that a diverse and happy gut microbiome (friendly bugs only, of course) is going to turn out to be a really good thing for people. I prefer to get dietary stuff when possible from foods humans have eaten for centuries or millennia, rather than from extracted/compounded supplements. Therefore, I make it a point to regularly eat a diverse range of traditional probiotic and prebiotic foods. Common probiotic foods include raw sauerkraut, yogurt, raw fermented pickles, miso, kefir, raw kim chi, and . . . raw vinegar (with the mother ). ACV is the most widely available raw vinegar.
Results: Completely un-evaluatable, but I never expected to be able to evaluate them.
I started experimenting with ACV before starting weight loss. Part way through weight loss, my gallbladder gave me severe heartburn. It was gallbladder adenomyomatosis, not stones or sludge, and not caused by weight loss (arguably, it was caused by obesity). The ACV seemed to make the heartburn worse, so I stopped drinking it until after the gallbladder came out. These circumstances created the "drinking ACV for weeks/not drinking ACV for weeks" situation.
None of it had anything to do with weight loss, and it had no observable effect on weight loss, appetite, satiation or anything related.
Is it woo? Possibly. Will it hurt me? Probably not (the tooth enamel thing is silly if you don't bathe your teeth in it, and we eat many other acidic foods anyway). Have I ever urged it on anyone else? Absolutely not, except for recipes and the alcoholic mixed drink thing, because that's delicious.
FWIW, I'm currently not drinking ACV, but I may decide to again sometime, for the second reason above.
That's it.
I like malt and balsamic myself. And use it... on fish and chips and salads respectively, though I've also used balsamic (glaze) on... ICE CREAM!!!
Having said that... alcoholic drink?!?!?!?!?
Balsamic on strawberries is good.
Yes, and:
At rowing camp (yup, that's a thing), I had a wonderful salad whose key ingredients were watermelon chunks, thinly sliced onions, crumbled feta cheese and balsamic vinegar. So good!
I've made it on a "wing it" basis since, but I'm sure there recipes out there. Highly recommended!2 -
Don't knock it till you have tried it.
The ability to knock before trying is one of the key benefits of science.28 -
This is our local store (expanding nationwide) that offers the most amazing balsamic vinegar flavors. Chocolate espresso on strawberries is my favorite.
https://www.olivelle.com/3 -
suzielawrence wrote: »Here's a systematic review of ACV studies, showing a beneficial effect on postprandial glucose and insulin response.
https://www.scopus.com/record/display.uri?origin=citedby&eid=2-s2.0-85014828549&noHighlight=false&relpos=2
Look, I'm not here to say that there's definitive proof that vinegar is a magic weight loss potion, what I'm saying is if someone believes something is helping them, don't be so fast to jump in and discredit them, because there's a solid chance you're wrong.
Insulin response does not equal weight loss, and the glucose studies essentially add up to "looks promising, needs more study."
Since I am a diabetic I did my own mini study on the benefits of ACV on blood sugar to see if my blood glucose testing indicated that it benefitted me. My conclusion after about two weeks of testing was that if it did help, which it seemed to on some occasions, the effect is not large enough or consistent enough for me to be able to rely on it. Since I enjoy ACV in many foods anyway, I use it when I can, but don't go out of my way to.
9 -
lemurcat12 wrote: »
Start here:
https://www.mcclarybros.com/
https://www.mcclarybros.com/blogs/recipes -- craft cocktail recipes using vinegar
And I would 100% try them if I still drank alcohol.
That's the stuff: It's delicious! (Also relatively low cal - around 30 per serving IIRC - for lots of tasty flavor. Keep in mind that I did say I love vinegar in general. But I think some who are "meh" about vinegar might like it, as it has other flavors in the mix, with the ACV giving it a fruity/acidic zing . . . kind of like a citrus wedge or twist does in other beverages, even though most people wouldn't just eat a lemon or lime (at least absent a tequila shot ).)
@lemurcat12, think it would be plenty tasty/refreshing in plain sparkling water, maybe even still water. Alcohol is optional. Our ancestors used "shrub" (basically what this is) as a drink concentrate, made with fruits and possibly spices if available. Added to water, it made a refreshing summer beverage. I first encountered shrub around 40 years ago, when a reenactor type friend made it - huckleberry, I think it was.
Yeah, I've thought about trying it without alcohol (virgin vinegar drinks, heh). I saw something similar at WF, but I think the calories were higher. Like you, I really love vinegars, so could be my kind of thing, and I like some kind of special drink to sip in the evenings (I make different iced teas and this seems even better).1 -
I went on a very enthusiastic shrub experiment 2 summers ago. Every fruit we used, I made shrubs in varying proportions with parts that get composted. I had > a dozen in the fridge. Looked like a laboratory in there. I heard that when shrubs originated, they were used to make lemonade-like non-alcoholic drinks in winter months when lemons and fruits were harder to come by.
Conclusion: I didn't like any of them. Alcoholic or no. And I really tried. It's just one of those things where I love the idea but not the actual thing. Like mint juleps... the crushed ice, the condensation on the sterling silver cup, the fresh sprigs of mint... I just can't choke down the bourbon.1 -
Just to confirm, ACV = apple cider vinegar?2
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ACV = Armored Cannon Vehicle
lol5 -
Tiny_Dancer_in_Pink wrote: »ACV = Armored Cannon Vehicle
lol
I'll take 3!jbrown2339 wrote: »Just to confirm, ACV = apple cider vinegar?
Yes.
OP, I'm glad that you are having success and I know this is very exciting for you. Weight loss happens in fits and spurts, very rarely will someone have consistent losses as predicted. The ACV isn't doing the work, YOU are. I agree with those saying that you should give yourself the credit you deserve for doing the work. Great job!7 -
This is our local store (expanding nationwide) that offers the most amazing balsamic vinegar flavors. Chocolate espresso on strawberries is my favorite.
https://www.olivelle.com/
Damn you! I just had to click - now I'm going to be obsessed with this until I get a bottle and check it out!0 -
jbrown2339 wrote: »Just to confirm, ACV = apple cider vinegar?
Acute Chronic Vomiting for me, that stuff is nasty!
Chugging it straight put me off of vinegar forever!! 5 -
I heard that if you mix ACV with activated charcoal it works even better.
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HA HA.8 -
middlehaitch wrote: »Well I was going to throw this in earlier, but now we are mixing drinks, well.....
my mum drinks ACV in the winter mixed with honey, hot water and whisky.
She thinks it is good for her; I'm not going to argue, she just turned 91 and is still fully independent.
Keep drinking it @AnnPT77.
(I was going to be mortified if malt vinegar wasn't in your stash
)
Cheers, h.
I know the malt vinegar is something a lot of people use on fried foods (french fries/chips especially). While I have no dispute with that, it's absolutely indispensable to me for summer vinegar-dressed bean salads of many sorts.
Something about the flavor is perfect with beans. (Example: Small red beans, thin-sliced onions, diced or matchstick bell peppers, malt vinegar, salt, lots of fresh-ground black pepper, sliced-up smoked string cheese or diced smoked provolone, optional olive oil. The cheese goes in just before serving, unless you like it vinegar-softened.)3 -
chereenbruce850503 wrote: »I have been trying to lose weight for the past 5 weeks. Week 1 I cut out all sodas and sugar other than protein shakes and things that cannot be avoided. No sodas, tea,candy ect... walking everyday about 15,000 steps. The second week, still walking the same i started a drink from walmart called acv detox drink. It says that there are 2 servings each 8 oz. I do not drink it that way however. It is a mix of lemon, water, Apple cider vinegar, and cinnamon. I take 1 shot after lunch at about 2 and 1at about 8 after dinner. I lost 2# that week. Week 3 I didn't drink the acv detox and only lost 1#. Week 4 I started drinking it again as a shot and lost 2.5 #. I am currently on week 5 now. Weigh in is Friday. And drinking the acv detox this week. So far in total I have lost 11.2#. It may not work for everyone but it does for me. Don't knock it till you have tried it. ☺
What you're describing is what weight loss looks like with or without ACV...
Why not give credit where credit is due...YOU'RE doing this...not some drink...6 -
Congratulations on your weight loss, OP! You've done a great job making sensible, sustainable adjustments to your diet and exercise, and you're reaping the benefits. Keep it up!
It's not the vinegar.
I really am lost in admiration for whichever genius at Aspall's is running this ACV publicity machine. It's doing wonders for what used to be a reasonably popular but fairly mundane vinegar variety, always in the shadow of balsamic, red wine and rice wine.
Even if drinking vinegar has benefits, which I doubt, it's even more doubtful that the specific type of vinegar matters. Unless apples are magic.3 -
CattOfTheGarage wrote: »Congratulations on your weight loss, OP! You've done a great job making sensible, sustainable adjustments to your diet and exercise, and you're reaping the benefits. Keep it up!
It's not the vinegar.
I really am lost in admiration for whichever genius at Aspall's is running this ACV publicity machine. It's doing wonders for what used to be a reasonably popular but fairly mundane vinegar variety, always in the shadow of balsamic, red wine and rice wine.
Even if drinking vinegar has benefits, which I doubt, it's even more doubtful that the specific type of vinegar matters. Unless apples are magic.
4 -
We love vinegar in our house too! We clean with it, use it to remove odors, put a splash in apple juice to add some tartness, put it on salads with olive oil...about everything you can think of! I even keep some mixed with water in a spray bottle and lightly spray my dog with it in the summer- I might be crazy but it gets rid of that summer "dog" smell! It really is the ultimate multi-tasker!2
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