Going Keto from from Monday. Anyone want to join me?

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  • mmapags
    mmapags Posts: 8,934 Member
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    onemanpeloton wrote: »
    mmapags wrote: »
    mattrus1989 wrote: »
    Silentpadna wrote: »
    nvmomketo wrote: »
    I'm one of the people who finds their appetite is reduced, and cravings are lower, when I cut carbs. It makes weight loss easier for people like me.

    As one who absolutely supports others doing keto, while not doing it myself - if there is "magic" to it, this part is it. Of course it's not really magic, it's a personal preference suitable for some and not others.

    I never lost cravings when going into ketosis, so it's not magic for everyone. For those that this applies, keto is great.

    I tend to echo a lot of the caution that posters here say when it's important to know what you're getting into - especially with the sheer volume of new posters (and likely lurkers) who are looking for a quick fix. Keto is not that if done right, but many grab onto it like it is.

    I totally agree. Satiety is a revelation to me (5 weeks in to ketogenic diet) and to many others who've shared their experiences.

    Caution is definitely advised but not too much caution. At some point you have to stop reading all the articles and speculation and just give it a try for yourself!

    Playing devil's advocate for a minute, sometimes it seems to be the case that people with bad experiences of a diet didnt implement it sufficiently, or for long enough, for changes and improvements to be developed. How long did you try ketosis for and what were your ketone levels like?

    Re: The bolded. Sometimes that is true and other times it's just not the right diet for that person. There is not inherent metabolic advantage to keto as the research definitively shows.
    https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5568065/
    TL/DNR version: Meta-analysis of 35 broad based studies controlled for protein and calories. Conclusion: keto is not better, or no worse than any other diet.

    That being said, there are some situations for which that keto is very helpful. I think the most broadly applicable one is that some recent research indicates that keto and low carb diets may help to blunt hunger signalling and help prevent cravings. Also, IR seems to improve and it can help with elevated blood glucose.

    For some, possibly many, keto is too restrictive. That is true for me. I eat low carb, between 100 and 150gr per day. That's seems to be low enough to control hunger signalling and cravings while giving me plenty of dietary flexibility. It has worked to the tune of 33 lbs lost and within 5 lbs or so of my goal weight. I believe that is why calorie counting and flexible dieting works for many people.

    Damn, I hate it when a paper doesn't have a summary at the end. It makes skim reading a lot harder :smile:

    It would be interesting to know more about the variability between people and what it is that causes the diet to not suit them. It would also be interesting to find out how many people "try" it and dont implement it properly.

    I totally understand the dietary flexibility issue. Congrats on your achievements, thats awesome!

    What about your time in ketosis? How long did you try it for and what were your ketone levels like?

    I tried it for a few months. I didn't have a way other than ketostix to measure levels but they seemed good. I just found it too restrictive and the way I've evolved into eating is totally sustainable for me. It's actually my prefered way to eat. I think that is important is dietary choices. That a large dose of prefered and a small dose of restriction is part of it. If one feels restricted, they won't stay with it over time.
  • Diatonic12
    Diatonic12 Posts: 32,344 Member
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    There are only choices and consequences. I've ridden this merry-go-round with weight loss protocols. One at a time and by combining them. In the end, we all have to face the question, is this sustainable for the rest of your life.
    When all of the weight releasing is done can you follow through with this to keep it off?

    It's human nature to think once the weight is gone we are suddenly fixed. Falling back into old eating patterns with favorite foods can happen in the blink of an eye. It can all come undone so fast.
    Fast weight loss is like cramming for the test. You'll pass but you won't learn anything from it.

    We see returning repeat customers every day. Do they have regrets. Ayup, they sure do. They regret that they didn't see the forest for the trees. They let the thrill of quick weight loss or imaginary thinking that they were fixed with all weight woes behind them allow them to slide right back off the goose.
  • Running_and_Coffee
    Running_and_Coffee Posts: 811 Member
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    onemanpeloton wrote: »
    I'll have to take some more time to read that paper before commenting.

    One benefit I've found from ketosis, which has been scientifically proven (I'll dig out the paper(s) ) is an increased amount of time I can spend exercising before "hitting the wall". In other words, using fat as a fuel when cycling has allowed me to ride longer without the need for carbs and without the risk of running out of energy.

    I'm not sure whether you class that as a metabolic advantage or not but it must be somewhere close

    I am a runner and can attest this is one of the nice advantages of keto. Although it took me several months to get there--at first, I felt like I hit the wall after 20-30 minutes! Now I am faster and have better endurance than ever. Particularly at things like sprinting. My "fat adaption" phase seems like it took longer than most, though. No magic pill here for me.

    I am a skeptic and tend to doubt there is anything special about any diet--it absolutely matters how many calories I intake if I want to lose weight, whether I get those calories from nuts and avocado or Twinkies. But I agree with the satiety factor being a critical part of any diet you hope to be on for more than five minutes, and I definitely feel satisfied with the food combinations I am having.
  • mmapags
    mmapags Posts: 8,934 Member
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    onemanpeloton wrote: »
    I'll have to take some more time to read that paper before commenting.

    One benefit I've found from ketosis, which has been scientifically proven (I'll dig out the paper(s) ) is an increased amount of time I can spend exercising before "hitting the wall". In other words, using fat as a fuel when cycling has allowed me to ride longer without the need for carbs and without the risk of running out of energy.

    I'm not sure whether you class that as a metabolic advantage or not but it must be somewhere close

    Well my reference to metabolic advantage is specifically in regard to fat loss as is the study. Training for endurance athletes can realize some benefit as you describe. A slower rate of depleting glycogen reserves due to more fat utilization. Some elite cyclists like Chis Froome train for this but compete while carb loading. Gives them the best of both worlds.
  • bpetrosky
    bpetrosky Posts: 3,911 Member
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    New2ket0 wrote: »
    JFahm123 wrote: »
    I’ve been on keto for around 2-3 weeks now, one of the biggest things that helped me was drinking BONE broth, chicken bone broth tastes better than beef bone broth in my opinion

    I’ve seen that a lot , it’s sold as tuns if us t it? What is it?

    Bone broth is beef or chicken stock sold at a significant markup.
  • nvmomketo
    nvmomketo Posts: 12,019 Member
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    yirara wrote: »
    LiftHeavyThings27105 wrote: »
    yurita87 wrote: »
    Hi all.
    I have decided I am going Keto starting on Monday. I have around 40 lbs to lose. I have been preparing for it, reading a lot, planning my shopping, etc...

    I have been following Keto since February, 2018. So, a good five months. I avoided the Keto Flu because I researched this for a couple of months before jumping. I increased electrolytes (effectively, sodium....and not table salt...pink himalayan salt is better for that). Bone brooth is a good thing for that as well.

    There are a few phases of this process.

    Your body is effectively moving from using Carbs | Glucose | Glycogen for fuel to using Fats | Ketones (basic statement....give me some latitude there).

    At first you will likely loose several pounds and your mid-section will tighten up. That is mostly 'water weight'. You will be glycogen depleted at this point....or, well on the way. This takes - and everyone is different - four or five days.

    This is when the Keto Flu will hit - if you are not prepared. Seems that most people are not and when this hits them they quit. Don't be one of them.

    So, you have entered a state called Ketosis. Your body is mostly using ketones now for energy. Carbs are effectively no longer in the picture (again, general statement) so glycogen is pretty much no longer in the picture.

    Eventually you will become Keto-adapted. This takes several weeks to reach! Whatever that might be. Three to five weeks, generally speaking. Also, keep in mind that I am 6'0" 205lbs 51yo dude.....

    As you likely know, there are four types of Keto. Most follow the Standard Keto. That is where you get roughly 75% of your calories from Fats, 20% of your calories from Protein and 5% of your calories from Carbs. It will be rough - potentially - at first. It takes effort. Carbs are everywhere! :-)

    Does that help?

    Why is pink himalayan salt better than table salt? It's NaCl with a few traces of other elements, which basically do nothing. If they were this product would not be on the market as it also includes at least 3 radioactive elements in similar concentrations.

    I tend to just use table salt. I eat a half teaspoon of it most mornings or I don't get enough sodium (I have low BP). It has a bit of iodine that I find helpful for thyroid health.

    I do like the taste of pink Himalayan salt. I use in in cooking frequently.
  • kshama2001
    kshama2001 Posts: 27,982 Member
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    bpetrosky wrote: »
    New2ket0 wrote: »
    JFahm123 wrote: »
    I’ve been on keto for around 2-3 weeks now, one of the biggest things that helped me was drinking BONE broth, chicken bone broth tastes better than beef bone broth in my opinion

    I’ve seen that a lot , it’s sold as tuns if us t it? What is it?

    Bone broth is beef or chicken stock sold at a significant markup.

    Has anyone found store bought bone broth to come anywhere close to as good as what they've made at home?

    I save all the bones in the freezer until I need stock and then cook it in the crockpot either on Low overnight or if I am in a hurry on High for 5 hours or so. (Slow cooker temps vary greatly - older ones tend to cook lower.)

    Right now I have a big steak bone, a small chicken carcass, and some extra chicken wing bones going with a tablespoon of soy sauce for sodium and umami.

    (I'm not keto, I just love really good stock.)
  • kshama2001
    kshama2001 Posts: 27,982 Member
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    yurita87 wrote: »
    mattrus1989 wrote: »
    I used perfectketo.com for a lot of advice. Try there for more specific help :smile:
    mattrus1989 wrote: »
    I used perfectketo.com for a lot of advice. Try there for more specific help :smile:

    Thanks!
    I know Keto is trendy nd whatever now but ages ago I did Atkins and I remember feeling a bit dizzy but nothing more than that.
    Thanks for the advice.
    Basically I used to eat very low carb back home but that changed after I got married which us why i put all the weight on.

    Ah yes, I gain weight with new relationships - I have a very predictable pattern of less time at the gym, more time watching TV, and more calorie dense foods :(

    If low carb/keto helps you maintain a calorie deficit and you like this WOE, go for it!

    I decided to reduce bread, wine, and TV time.
  • nvmomketo
    nvmomketo Posts: 12,019 Member
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    Running_and_Coffee wrote: »
    kommodevaran wrote: »
    Caralarma wrote: »
    Why do Keto when you can lose weight eating anything you want?
    It could be that Keto is exactly what the OP wants to eat - but yes, usually it's not knowing about/considering any other options, or somehow thinking keto means you can eat more food and lose faster than with other methods.
    It honestly baffles me why people want to make weight loss so complicated
    People like to feel, and show the world, that they're really making an effort. You don't do that on "the eat your normal food, but less"-diet.

    Weight loss isn't complicated, but the reason why people weigh more than they want to IS complicated.

    If I ate my "normal food," I would want a lot more of it than what I can eat to lose weight. My "normal food" isn't as filling as foods that are high in protein and fat. And in the past 6+ months that I have been on keto, I have been under tremendous stress and yet did not even ONCE stress eat. Because if I've outlawed for myself the kinds of foods that taste so good when you're stressed, that leaves chicken, avocado and other foods I can't imagine mindlessly shoving into my mouth while worried about my job.

    I can't speak for everyone who follows keto, but I'm not trying to be fancy or trendy. I found something that works for me, and that IS the uncomplicated truth.

    I'm reading the book, Hungry Brain, and I'm currently on a chapter on stress eating. They done studies where people and animals will over eat hyper palatable foods (often a refined carb and fat mix) when stressed, but tended to eat less when those foods were not a dietary option. I wonder if that partially explains your experience.
  • psuLemon
    psuLemon Posts: 38,401 MFP Moderator
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    yurita87 wrote: »
    mattrus1989 wrote: »
    good luck, I hope it goes well for you. I'm 4 weeks in and starting to see some benefits now. Make sure you stock up on salt or electrolyte supplements in preparation for "keto flu"
    Any electrolytes recommendation?

    Add salt to your foods, aim to get dark leafy greens, and you can either drink keto aid, broth or pickle juice if you need more. Essentially, aiming for 3500mg or more of sodium is ideal. I a for 6000mg on my keto days and that is often low.
  • Azdak
    Azdak Posts: 8,281 Member
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    Send me all your leftover carbs.
  • onemanpeloton
    onemanpeloton Posts: 58 Member
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    Caralarma wrote: »
    kgeyser wrote: »
    Caralarma wrote: »
    Why do Keto when you can lose weight eating anything you want? It honestly baffles me why people want to make weight loss so complicated

    Why wouldn't a keto diet be considered eating anything you want? People don't come with a default setting where we all have to like the same things and want to eat them. If you are eating foods you like and enjoy, then you're eating anything you want, regardless if it's keto, low carb, paleo, clean, vegetarian, vegan, IIFYM, flexible dieting, etc. I don't understand why people seem to think that others are making their lives more difficult by eating in a way that works for them.

    You can still eat any keto foods without actually saying 'I'm doing keto'. By giving your diet a name it means that you are being restrictive and committing to never eating certain food groups which is a recipe for failure in my opinion.

    But aren't all diets and changes to lifestyle restrictive? That's kind of the point. For me, I find that I need a strong framework to work within, it keeps me disciplined. If I knew that certain "bad" foods were on the table as a possibility, I wouldn't have the self-control to avoid them.
  • kommodevaran
    kommodevaran Posts: 17,890 Member
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    onemanpeloton wrote: »
    Caralarma wrote: »
    kgeyser wrote: »
    Caralarma wrote: »
    Why do Keto when you can lose weight eating anything you want? It honestly baffles me why people want to make weight loss so complicated

    Why wouldn't a keto diet be considered eating anything you want? People don't come with a default setting where we all have to like the same things and want to eat them. If you are eating foods you like and enjoy, then you're eating anything you want, regardless if it's keto, low carb, paleo, clean, vegetarian, vegan, IIFYM, flexible dieting, etc. I don't understand why people seem to think that others are making their lives more difficult by eating in a way that works for them.

    You can still eat any keto foods without actually saying 'I'm doing keto'. By giving your diet a name it means that you are being restrictive and committing to never eating certain food groups which is a recipe for failure in my opinion.

    But aren't all diets and changes to lifestyle restrictive? That's kind of the point. For me, I find that I need a strong framework to work within, it keeps me disciplined. If I knew that certain "bad" foods were on the table as a possibility, I wouldn't have the self-control to avoid them.
    Most people need to make a conscious effort to limit food intake. The universal key to success is to find a set of boundaries that are strict enough, but not too strict. But exactly what boundaries, is going to be deeply personal, and how strict something feels, is going to be subjective. So the clue is to find something that restricts without feeling restrictive.
  • kgeyser
    kgeyser Posts: 22,505 Member
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    Caralarma wrote: »
    kgeyser wrote: »
    Caralarma wrote: »
    Why do Keto when you can lose weight eating anything you want? It honestly baffles me why people want to make weight loss so complicated

    Why wouldn't a keto diet be considered eating anything you want? People don't come with a default setting where we all have to like the same things and want to eat them. If you are eating foods you like and enjoy, then you're eating anything you want, regardless if it's keto, low carb, paleo, clean, vegetarian, vegan, IIFYM, flexible dieting, etc. I don't understand why people seem to think that others are making their lives more difficult by eating in a way that works for them.

    You can still eat any keto foods without actually saying 'I'm doing keto'. By giving your diet a name it means that you are being restrictive and committing to never eating certain food groups which is a recipe for failure in my opinion.

    I eat foods that are considered okay on a keto diet, but I am not "doing keto" because that particular way of eating involves getting into ketosis. Keto isn't about food groups, it's about macro counts, there is no rule saying you can't have a food from a particular food group - you can eat whatever foods you want which fit into those macros, much like with IIFYM, low carb, flexible dieting, calorie counting, etc.

    Does that mean that certain foods are going to be excluded? Possibly. Just like my daily calorie goal means that I can't fit in certain foods every day without blowing my calories or having a horrible nutrition profile. But for many of those foods, I haven't felt that I am missing out on anything by not having them. Are vegetarians and vegans failures waiting to happen as well because they don't eat certain foods?

    Also, what is this "committing to never eating certain food groups"? Just because you try out a certain way of eating doesn't mean that you are stuck with it forever. Many users here will stick to their calorie goals 11 months out of the year, but relax that during the holidays in response to holiday events. I know people who switch up their diets based on training needs for a sport over the course of the year. Figure competitors will do bulk and cut cycles, then go low carb before a competition- are they failures because they ate low carb a portion of the year?

    The biggest predictor of failure when it comes to weight loss is not choosing a method that is appropriate for the individual and their situation, and not having the tools to compensate when the situation changes. There are so many flexible dieters on these forums who have gained weight back because their life situation changed in some way - employment, moved to a new location, started a family, family issues, physical or mental health issues - that doesn't make flexible dieting a failed method.

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