Just be nice
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Tacklewasher wrote: »Running_and_Coffee wrote: »TavistockToad wrote: »Running_and_Coffee wrote: »I think it's important to consider how effective a cold bucket of reality is really going to be when the dynamic isn't you and your BFF, but a bunch of strangers, many of whom might be feeling sensitive or vulnerable. I'm sure everyone IS intending to be helpful and honest, but what I typically see is:
OP: I want to do <insert popular diet/unrealistic weight loss goal/scam/green tea supplements>
MFP: That won't work. You're overcomplicating this. Eat less. (Sometimes accompanied by flow chart.)
That cold bucket feels...cold. It also could feel discouraging. The OP could interpret it as, "They think I'm stupid."
I mean these are people who are going out on a limb, talking to strangers. They might be frustrated with their bodies, which is no fun And now they feel ostracized for their brains as well, or at least their judgment.
I'm not saying that we should LIE, but there's probably something in between being blunt and maybe a wee bit judgmental and patting them on the head condescendingly.
How would you answer that post, just out of interest? Or would you just scroll on past?
If I thought I could answer in a way that would be helpful and would actually be well-received, I'd answer. If not, I'd scroll. If I have to think too hard to answer "nicely," scrolling works.
How does that help the next new person who comes along and is curious and might be swayed by the OP?
I don't think that's necessarily my job to discredit random people I don't know.20 -
Iv noticed alot of newbies getting offended when asking a question and being told the answer. Iv been literally muted for nicely answering and the OP didnt like my answer. That particular mute was totaly unearned, Id say iv earned my fair share but not that one. Point being, People post on a public forum, They get answers. They dont always like the answers and sometimes things go south, But for the most part iv never seen people purposely fighting about answering questions. Many many many people here answer the same questions daily but yet i dont see them being mean at all.
This community is very nice and wish eachother well, We just dont let woo and false information slide that doesnt make us mean it makes us helpful. If its mean to let people spin their wheels and always wonder why they arent getting anywhere or to allow them to do something truely harmful without even possibly realizing it, And to let that information and mindset carry on to any other newbies reading the thread....Ill be mean.
edit: for what its worth id of never succeeded without the bluntness i recieved in my first year here. I remember thinking a few people were mean and they probably were i was kind of dumb... But it made me think and pay attention to the nicer ones information. So even if some people are mean, So what. Theres way more nice ones. This thread is a bit of an insulting umbrella thread.11 -
Running_and_Coffee wrote: »Tacklewasher wrote: »Running_and_Coffee wrote: »TavistockToad wrote: »Running_and_Coffee wrote: »I think it's important to consider how effective a cold bucket of reality is really going to be when the dynamic isn't you and your BFF, but a bunch of strangers, many of whom might be feeling sensitive or vulnerable. I'm sure everyone IS intending to be helpful and honest, but what I typically see is:
OP: I want to do <insert popular diet/unrealistic weight loss goal/scam/green tea supplements>
MFP: That won't work. You're overcomplicating this. Eat less. (Sometimes accompanied by flow chart.)
That cold bucket feels...cold. It also could feel discouraging. The OP could interpret it as, "They think I'm stupid."
I mean these are people who are going out on a limb, talking to strangers. They might be frustrated with their bodies, which is no fun And now they feel ostracized for their brains as well, or at least their judgment.
I'm not saying that we should LIE, but there's probably something in between being blunt and maybe a wee bit judgmental and patting them on the head condescendingly.
How would you answer that post, just out of interest? Or would you just scroll on past?
If I thought I could answer in a way that would be helpful and would actually be well-received, I'd answer. If not, I'd scroll. If I have to think too hard to answer "nicely," scrolling works.
How does that help the next new person who comes along and is curious and might be swayed by the OP?
I don't think that's necessarily my job to discredit random people I don't know.
Nobody has a "job" here, but some of us do like to try to help people. Sometimes that can include challenging misinformation. So even if you choose not to do it personally, some of us do think about how to respond to posts that might delay the success of others or even hurt their chances of achieving their goals.14 -
Running_and_Coffee wrote: »I think it's important to consider how effective a cold bucket of reality is really going to be when the dynamic isn't you and your BFF, but a bunch of strangers, many of whom might be feeling sensitive or vulnerable. I'm sure everyone IS intending to be helpful and honest, but what I typically see is:
OP: I want to do <insert popular diet/unrealistic weight loss goal/scam/green tea supplements>
MFP: That won't work. You're overcomplicating this. Eat less. (Sometimes accompanied by flow chart.)
That cold bucket feels...cold. It also could feel discouraging. The OP could interpret it as, "They think I'm stupid."
I mean these are people who are going out on a limb, talking to strangers. They might be frustrated with their bodies, which is no fun And now they feel ostracized for their brains as well, or at least their judgment.
I'm not saying that we should LIE, but there's probably something in between being blunt and maybe a wee bit judgmental and patting them on the head condescendingly.
This forum does nothing to push back against the laziness of people who can't be bothered to look for 10 minutes for an answer to their question before starting another new thread. Sometimes that answer is still on the first page. The natural result of this is that people who are trying to be helpful who have typed the same response a few thousand times keep getting more and more concise and it comes across as blunt.
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cmriverside wrote: »janejellyroll wrote: »TavistockToad wrote: »'Pure hatred'? Really? Care to link to some 'hatred'?
Yes there's straight talking and a lack of sugar coating (who's got the spare cals for that?!) But I have never seen hatred, and I've been here a loooooooong time.
Pure hatred is starting this thread on a Thursday and making me think for a minute that it's actually Friday.
No, but it IS rage-quit Thursday.
I don't believe in rage-quitting. Once I have worn out my welcome I stay for maybe 4 or 5 more years and then I just disappear.
Do you disappear or are you disappeared?
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One way to avoid getting 'mean' responses to your questions is to spend an hour or 12 browsing around the forum to get a feel for the culture of the place before posting. There's a very good chance that your question has already been answered quite a few times.
That way, you can refine your question based on your new knowledge, instead of starting out all, 'Hi, my name is BunnieHunnie and Imma do a 21 day cleanse to jumpstart my metabolism out of starvation mode, then do clean vegan keto while toning up by standing on my left foot all day. Imma lose 50 pounds by the end of the summer. Who's with me guys??!! WE CAN DO THIS!' And you can avoid being sad when the advice you get does not agree with your expectations.27 -
janejellyroll wrote: »kommodevaran wrote: »Yes, but HOW can someone be told that their plan is stupid, without feeling stupid? Is it even possible? The stupider the plan, the harder the attachment to it. And should other people care? I think that people who want change, change, and people who want to talk, talk. 98% percent of new threads are just chit-chat and looking for new friends.
A really long time ago I made an online post asking how to execute a plan that was clearly dumber than hell. (That is, it was immediately clear to everyone BUT me).
I had no idea this plan was dumb. I didn't know hardly anything about the subject and I hadn't spent much time thinking about it in the context of what I did know.
Immediately, people pointed out how dumb it was. Responses poured in. Some responses were obviously from people trying to be kind while still conveying how dumb this idea was. Others were less concerned with their tone and more concerned that I not do this dumb thing (which could potentially wind up impacting others negatively). A couple of people concluded it was so dumb that it couldn't be real and I was just trying to rile people up.
The thing was: it was stupid. As soon as I saw the objections -- delicately phrased or not -- the pieces all came together for me. I'm grateful for those people taking time out of their day to set me straight. People who are somewhat clever in some areas of life (as I fancy myself) can come to dumb conclusions in other areas of their life. Saying "This idea is dumb" isn't the same thing as saying "You are dumb." Even the people who concluded that I was trolling them, I don't blame them -- it's the internet and you can't blame people for being wary of being trolled when trolling happens all the time here.
I didn't need support for my dumbness and I didn't need someone to hold my hand. I needed accurate information on the subject. I got it, in a variety of styles.
I'm not saying that everyone needs what I need. People are different. But in the instances where I am more blunt, I'm thinking of what helped me in the past.
I think this is the crux of it.
If at any time I have a problem I don't know how to solve, I'll start asking other people. I don't know how to fix my car, but someone does. I might get ten different suggestions. If most of them are saying the same thing, I don't really give a rip "how" they said it.
In any situation I'll get some sweetness and some saltiness. That's how "advice" works. If you aren't prepared for varying personalities in life - well - life is gonna suck, because it makes everything much harder when I try to do it all myself when it would be much easier to get a collective wisdom approach.
I don't know when or how we became so super sensitive or so ego driven that anything anyone says is mean. That just isn't the case. It's just a personality type...or maybe it's the three thousandth time that question has been answered that day - in which case USE THE SEARCH FUNCTION.
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Running_and_Coffee wrote: »I think it's important to consider how effective a cold bucket of reality is really going to be when the dynamic isn't you and your BFF, but a bunch of strangers, many of whom might be feeling sensitive or vulnerable. I'm sure everyone IS intending to be helpful and honest, but what I typically see is:
OP: I want to do <insert popular diet/unrealistic weight loss goal/scam/green tea supplements>
MFP: That won't work. You're overcomplicating this. Eat less. (Sometimes accompanied by flow chart.)
That cold bucket feels...cold. It also could feel discouraging. The OP could interpret it as, "They think I'm stupid."
I mean these are people who are going out on a limb, talking to strangers. They might be frustrated with their bodies, which is no fun And now they feel ostracized for their brains as well, or at least their judgment.
I'm not saying that we should LIE, but there's probably something in between being blunt and maybe a wee bit judgmental and patting them on the head condescendingly.
This forum does nothing to push back against the laziness of people who can't be bothered to look for 10 minutes for an answer to their question before starting another new thread. Sometimes that answer is still on the first page. The natural result of this is that people who are trying to be helpful who have typed the same response a few thousand times keep getting more and more concise and it comes across as blunt.
OK, so they are "lazy" because they didn't Google first? And that means it's OK to be...grumpy to them?
Alternative theory: a human being who you don't know just a scale wake up call and is flustered, upset and is reaching out for some kind of human connection. On a website called My Fitness PAL.12 -
One way to avoid getting 'mean' responses to your questions is to spend an hour or 12 browsing around the forum to get a feel for the culture of the place before posting. There's a very good chance that your question has already been answered quite a few times.
That way, you can refine your question based on your new knowledge, instead of starting out all, 'Hi, my name is BunnieHunnie and Imma do a 21 day cleanse to jumpstart my metabolism out of starvation mode, then do clean vegan keto while toning up by standing on my left foot all day. Imma lose 50 pounds by the end of the summer. Who's with me guys??!! WE CAN DO THIS!' And you can avoid being sad when the advice you get does not agree with your expectations.
But we need more keto/cleanse/clean eating/'why can't I lose 5 pounds a week' threads! 25,479 just aren't enough.
Seriously, after you've seen a few hundred the temptation is to get a bit snippy. I think most of the time the tone is very restrained vs what it could be.7 -
Running_and_Coffee wrote: »Tacklewasher wrote: »Running_and_Coffee wrote: »TavistockToad wrote: »Running_and_Coffee wrote: »I think it's important to consider how effective a cold bucket of reality is really going to be when the dynamic isn't you and your BFF, but a bunch of strangers, many of whom might be feeling sensitive or vulnerable. I'm sure everyone IS intending to be helpful and honest, but what I typically see is:
OP: I want to do <insert popular diet/unrealistic weight loss goal/scam/green tea supplements>
MFP: That won't work. You're overcomplicating this. Eat less. (Sometimes accompanied by flow chart.)
That cold bucket feels...cold. It also could feel discouraging. The OP could interpret it as, "They think I'm stupid."
I mean these are people who are going out on a limb, talking to strangers. They might be frustrated with their bodies, which is no fun And now they feel ostracized for their brains as well, or at least their judgment.
I'm not saying that we should LIE, but there's probably something in between being blunt and maybe a wee bit judgmental and patting them on the head condescendingly.
How would you answer that post, just out of interest? Or would you just scroll on past?
If I thought I could answer in a way that would be helpful and would actually be well-received, I'd answer. If not, I'd scroll. If I have to think too hard to answer "nicely," scrolling works.
How does that help the next new person who comes along and is curious and might be swayed by the OP?
I don't think that's necessarily my job to discredit random people I don't know.
So you rather let pseudoscience rule the boards than try to be helpful and correct misinformation?14 -
Running_and_Coffee wrote: »Running_and_Coffee wrote: »I think it's important to consider how effective a cold bucket of reality is really going to be when the dynamic isn't you and your BFF, but a bunch of strangers, many of whom might be feeling sensitive or vulnerable. I'm sure everyone IS intending to be helpful and honest, but what I typically see is:
OP: I want to do <insert popular diet/unrealistic weight loss goal/scam/green tea supplements>
MFP: That won't work. You're overcomplicating this. Eat less. (Sometimes accompanied by flow chart.)
That cold bucket feels...cold. It also could feel discouraging. The OP could interpret it as, "They think I'm stupid."
I mean these are people who are going out on a limb, talking to strangers. They might be frustrated with their bodies, which is no fun And now they feel ostracized for their brains as well, or at least their judgment.
I'm not saying that we should LIE, but there's probably something in between being blunt and maybe a wee bit judgmental and patting them on the head condescendingly.
This forum does nothing to push back against the laziness of people who can't be bothered to look for 10 minutes for an answer to their question before starting another new thread. Sometimes that answer is still on the first page. The natural result of this is that people who are trying to be helpful who have typed the same response a few thousand times keep getting more and more concise and it comes across as blunt.
OK, so they are "lazy" because they didn't Google first? And that means it's OK to be...grumpy to them?
Alternative theory: a human being who you don't know just a scale wake up call and is flustered, upset and is reaching out for some kind of human connection. On a website called My Fitness PAL.
This wasn't a defense of people being "grumpy." It was an explanation of why some frequent users are *concise* (in a way that sometimes can be interpreted as blunt).
11 -
Running_and_Coffee wrote: »Running_and_Coffee wrote: »I think it's important to consider how effective a cold bucket of reality is really going to be when the dynamic isn't you and your BFF, but a bunch of strangers, many of whom might be feeling sensitive or vulnerable. I'm sure everyone IS intending to be helpful and honest, but what I typically see is:
OP: I want to do <insert popular diet/unrealistic weight loss goal/scam/green tea supplements>
MFP: That won't work. You're overcomplicating this. Eat less. (Sometimes accompanied by flow chart.)
That cold bucket feels...cold. It also could feel discouraging. The OP could interpret it as, "They think I'm stupid."
I mean these are people who are going out on a limb, talking to strangers. They might be frustrated with their bodies, which is no fun And now they feel ostracized for their brains as well, or at least their judgment.
I'm not saying that we should LIE, but there's probably something in between being blunt and maybe a wee bit judgmental and patting them on the head condescendingly.
This forum does nothing to push back against the laziness of people who can't be bothered to look for 10 minutes for an answer to their question before starting another new thread. Sometimes that answer is still on the first page. The natural result of this is that people who are trying to be helpful who have typed the same response a few thousand times keep getting more and more concise and it comes across as blunt.
OK, so they are "lazy" because they didn't Google first? And that means it's OK to be...grumpy to them?
Alternative theory: a human being who you don't know just a scale wake up call and is flustered, upset and is reaching out for some kind of human connection. On a website called My Fitness PAL.
I'd ague that the bigger problem is not people being mean, but looking for human connection online.8 -
Running_and_Coffee wrote: »OK, so they are "lazy" because they didn't Google first? And that means it's OK to be...grumpy to them?
Alternative theory: a human being who you don't know just a scale wake up call and is flustered, upset and is reaching out for some kind of human connection. On a website called My Fitness PAL.
I think the poster meant searching the forums for the topic they have a question about. Almost every question can be answered with just a bit of research in the forums.
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Tacklewasher wrote: »Running_and_Coffee wrote: »TavistockToad wrote: »Running_and_Coffee wrote: »I think it's important to consider how effective a cold bucket of reality is really going to be when the dynamic isn't you and your BFF, but a bunch of strangers, many of whom might be feeling sensitive or vulnerable. I'm sure everyone IS intending to be helpful and honest, but what I typically see is:
OP: I want to do <insert popular diet/unrealistic weight loss goal/scam/green tea supplements>
MFP: That won't work. You're overcomplicating this. Eat less. (Sometimes accompanied by flow chart.)
That cold bucket feels...cold. It also could feel discouraging. The OP could interpret it as, "They think I'm stupid."
I mean these are people who are going out on a limb, talking to strangers. They might be frustrated with their bodies, which is no fun And now they feel ostracized for their brains as well, or at least their judgment.
I'm not saying that we should LIE, but there's probably something in between being blunt and maybe a wee bit judgmental and patting them on the head condescendingly.
How would you answer that post, just out of interest? Or would you just scroll on past?
If I thought I could answer in a way that would be helpful and would actually be well-received, I'd answer. If not, I'd scroll. If I have to think too hard to answer "nicely," scrolling works.
How does that help the next new person who comes along and is curious and might be swayed by the OP?
theres a lot of posts I don't respond to because my immediate response is ' you're a dumbass' and other members already have it covered.
this goes for other boards as well as MFP lololol16 -
One way to avoid getting 'mean' responses to your questions is to spend an hour or 12 browsing around the forum to get a feel for the culture of the place before posting. There's a very good chance that your question has already been answered quite a few times.
That way, you can refine your question based on your new knowledge, instead of starting out all, 'Hi, my name is BunnieHunnie and Imma do a 21 day cleanse to jumpstart my metabolism out of starvation mode, then do clean vegan keto while toning up by standing on my left foot all day. Imma lose 50 pounds by the end of the summer. Who's with me guys??!! WE CAN DO THIS!' And you can avoid being sad when the advice you get does not agree with your expectations.
But we need more keto/cleanse/clean eating/'why can't I lose 5 pounds a week' threads! 25,479 just aren't enough.
Seriously, after you've seen a few hundred the temptation is to get a bit snippy. I think most of the time the tone is very restrained vs what it could be.
I find it funny to see all the "does anyone do keto" threads some days especially when there are multiple keto threads on the front page. No need to google to find them.14 -
singingflutelady wrote: »One way to avoid getting 'mean' responses to your questions is to spend an hour or 12 browsing around the forum to get a feel for the culture of the place before posting. There's a very good chance that your question has already been answered quite a few times.
That way, you can refine your question based on your new knowledge, instead of starting out all, 'Hi, my name is BunnieHunnie and Imma do a 21 day cleanse to jumpstart my metabolism out of starvation mode, then do clean vegan keto while toning up by standing on my left foot all day. Imma lose 50 pounds by the end of the summer. Who's with me guys??!! WE CAN DO THIS!' And you can avoid being sad when the advice you get does not agree with your expectations.
But we need more keto/cleanse/clean eating/'why can't I lose 5 pounds a week' threads! 25,479 just aren't enough.
Seriously, after you've seen a few hundred the temptation is to get a bit snippy. I think most of the time the tone is very restrained vs what it could be.
I find it funny to see all the "does anyone do keto" threads some days especially when there are multiple keto threads on the front page. No need to google to find them.
And they say 'Well just scroll past them. Nobody is making you read and respond.' But then we're unhelpful and ignoring the new users. Damned if you do, and damned if you don't.
ETA not to mention leaving blatant misinformation just floating out there uncontested.9 -
singingflutelady wrote: »I find it funny to see all the "does anyone do keto" threads some days especially when there are multiple keto threads on the front page. No need to google to find them.
I saw four separate posts today about "anyone from TN" and they were all from different people. I sometimes wish there was a hard edit that required a first timer or someone who hasn't posted in X amount of time to read how to and acknowledge they understand how to do a search before posting a new topic.6 -
debrakgoogins wrote: »singingflutelady wrote: »I find it funny to see all the "does anyone do keto" threads some days especially when there are multiple keto threads on the front page. No need to google to find them.
I saw four separate posts today about "anyone from TN" and they were all from different people. I sometimes wish there was a hard edit that required a first timer or someone who hasn't posted in X amount of time to read how to and acknowledge they understand how to do a search before posting a new topic.
Were they new threads or old threads bumped by the same user? Occasionally someone does find the search function and goes to town unwittingly bumping zombie threads all on the same topic.2
This discussion has been closed.
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