Recomposition: Maintaining weight while losing fat
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ForecasterJason wrote: »ForecasterJason wrote: »Can a recomp be effective for a beginner who has not gained much muscle but is still pretty lean (10-12% body fat for a male) with a low BMI overall? I know a bulk would be most beneficial in this case, but I was curious if a recomp could also work or if it's just to little body fat (12-14 lbs in this case).
I have seen very few examples of people who recomped in this situation.
Nvm, I think from what I've seen I would suspect it would not work well.
Agree with @ForecasterJason. If you're actually at 10-12% body fat you're in the correct range to bulk pretty optimally (10-15%) is recommended. If you're concerned about gaining too much excess fat just make the bulks short in length or only on a slight caloric surplus (<250/day). Long term, I think you'll find more success doing that than you would just trying to recomp.0 -
I will chime in....
Assuming that I am reading the post correctly....you are asking about training at a very high percentage of your 1RM?
I can tell you from experience - and we are all different when it comes to intensity, volume and recovery - that I trained in powerlifting lifts (bench, squat, deadlift) for several months at 85%+ EVERY TIME (which was four or five times a week) and ended up hurting myself. Not once, but three times within 18 months.
Sub-optimal is really preferred - generally speaking. So, doing most of your work in the 60% - 75% of your 1RM is likely the way to go. Clearly, you would have a phase in the cycle when you lift closer to the 85% - 95% range for a "shorter period" but you would likely follow that with a de-load. Simply to mitigate fatigue.
Does that help?0 -
ForecasterJason wrote: »Can a recomp be effective for a beginner who has not gained much muscle but is still pretty lean (10-12% body fat for a male) with a low BMI overall? I know a bulk would be most beneficial in this case, but I was curious if a recomp could also work or if it's just to little body fat (12-14 lbs in this case).
I have seen very few examples of people who recomped in this situation.
What are your goals? If its to lean out with a little muscle gain, sure it can work. If your goal is largely muscle driven, than its not very optimal.1 -
I do want to add some muscle, but wasn't looking to gain a substantial amount. I have been on the fence between trying to go with that or do a slight bulk.ForecasterJason wrote: »Can a recomp be effective for a beginner who has not gained much muscle but is still pretty lean (10-12% body fat for a male) with a low BMI overall? I know a bulk would be most beneficial in this case, but I was curious if a recomp could also work or if it's just to little body fat (12-14 lbs in this case).
I have seen very few examples of people who recomped in this situation.
What are your goals? If its to lean out with a little muscle gain, sure it can work. If your goal is largely muscle driven, than its not very optimal.1 -
ForecasterJason wrote: »
I do want to add some muscle, but wasn't looking to gain a substantial amount. I have been on the fence between trying to go with that or do a slight bulk.ForecasterJason wrote: »Can a recomp be effective for a beginner who has not gained much muscle but is still pretty lean (10-12% body fat for a male) with a low BMI overall? I know a bulk would be most beneficial in this case, but I was curious if a recomp could also work or if it's just to little body fat (12-14 lbs in this case).
I have seen very few examples of people who recomped in this situation.
What are your goals? If its to lean out with a little muscle gain, sure it can work. If your goal is largely muscle driven, than its not very optimal.
Do you actually want to get leaner? Would you be happy trying to maintain sub 10%?
Or would you be happy at the same BF range but heavier?
Whatever you choice s a young, male, beginner you are primed to gain muscle easily.
(To answer your question - yes some people do recomp to very lean levels, the Bret Contreras article was linked early on in this thread and @Hornsby as examples.)0 -
Ok thanks, that gives me some things to think about.ForecasterJason wrote: »
I do want to add some muscle, but wasn't looking to gain a substantial amount. I have been on the fence between trying to go with that or do a slight bulk.ForecasterJason wrote: »Can a recomp be effective for a beginner who has not gained much muscle but is still pretty lean (10-12% body fat for a male) with a low BMI overall? I know a bulk would be most beneficial in this case, but I was curious if a recomp could also work or if it's just to little body fat (12-14 lbs in this case).
I have seen very few examples of people who recomped in this situation.
What are your goals? If its to lean out with a little muscle gain, sure it can work. If your goal is largely muscle driven, than its not very optimal.
Do you actually want to get leaner? Would you be happy trying to maintain sub 10%?
Or would you be happy at the same BF range but heavier?
Whatever you choice s a young, male, beginner you are primed to gain muscle easily.
(To answer your question - yes some people do recomp to very lean levels, the Bret Contreras article was linked early on in this thread and @Hornsby as examples.)
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Following
great job amazing pics and progress congrats 0 -
Bumping to follow, I’m a 5’10” male at 155 pounds, somewhere between 15-18% body fat (approximation?), who wants to lean out yet maintain weight. I was in a severe calorie deficit by accident in my unguided attempt to cut body fat, started out the year much heavier set at 175 lbs and it worked until my metabolism couldn’t take what I didn’t realize was such a low amount of calories. Trying get back up to eating a healthy amount, but finding it difficult to do so (feeling very full) Any tips are appreciated. From calculators I’ve been pointed towards, with my body fat my maintenance calories are around 2700, but I’m not sure if that’s correct. Work out 6 days a week w/ HIIT cardio most days, a couple of days of longer distance cardio0
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josiahmace76 wrote: »Bumping to follow, I’m a 5’10” male at 155 pounds, somewhere between 15-18% body fat (approximation?), who wants to lean out yet maintain weight. I was in a severe calorie deficit by accident in my unguided attempt to cut body fat, started out the year much heavier set at 175 lbs and it worked until my metabolism couldn’t take what I didn’t realize was such a low amount of calories. Trying get back up to eating a healthy amount, but finding it difficult to do so (feeling very full) Any tips are appreciated. From calculators I’ve been pointed towards, with my body fat my maintenance calories are around 2700, but I’m not sure if that’s correct. Work out 6 days a week w/ HIIT cardio most days, a couple of days of longer distance cardio
So those workouts aren't going to change your BF% while weight stays at that healthy level.
Actually, that was my 20's race weight, and I know that was at lower end of BF% and weight, since tri's I at least had some upper body muscle.
You'll need to do some actual resistance training, lifting progressively (a good program), for your body to feel the need to build muscle, and use up the extra fat you are carrying around.
(skinny fat is term BTW for what you did and ended up with - people do it all the time, still perhaps unhealthy levels of fat, but good weight range - why BMI doesn't tell the whole story)
You'll want to figure out that maintenance level if workouts can be pretty regular. As a guy with no monthly changing hormone levels - you can get some 2 week running averages going to figure out results.
Measure stomach too, because as water weight changes from workouts, waist shouldn't really be increasing even if weight does go up.
Weigh only on valid days to minimize known water weight fluctuations (or use trend weight for daily).
Morning after rest day eating normal sodium levels, not sore from last workout.2 -
Delighted to find this rich resource of recomping info and experience. Very grateful. I wish I had time to read all the posts- I’ll keep coming back. Meanwhile, if there’s anyone else in a similar position I’d love to hear from you.
I’m a 5’3 olympic weightlifter in the UK. I have a coach who writes my programme (three sessions a week) and I compete. My competition bodyweight category is 71kg, so at weigh-in, I have to be anywhere between 64.1kg and 71kg on the nose. Obviously the ideal is to have as much useful weight within your bodyweight category limits as possible (really glad I was at the back of the queue when the boobs were handed out!!). I think I’m about 30% body fat but having tried various methods I’ve still no “true” figure. I have come to realise it’s very hard to get an “exact” measurement. The tools available to the average person are generally unreliable unless you use the same tool consistently, log the numbers whatever they are, and watch progress. I even took part in some research at Sheffield Hallam University, UK, where they’re trying to develop better body scanning tools, and my percentage came out at 33%. A callipers trial resulted in a much lower figure. I understand this field is ongoing in development and unless you have lots of cash to use clever air displacement technology etc, it’s all a bit wishy-washy.
So anyway, I’m trying to lose a bit of fat while maintaining strength via the lifting training, and I’ve very, very recently started a little bit of cardio, would you believe! I’m doing short runs once or twice a week- bit of running up hills, sprinting, bursts on the skillsmill, the occasional timed 5k with friends... I don’t want it to have a detrimental impact on my sport as a weightlifter, but I need to do something to be leaner and meaner within my bodyweight category.
I usually eat 2500-3000 cals a day with 1g of protein per lb of bodyweight (so I aim for around 152g protein if I’m looking at being 69kg, but it often goes over), and fat at 0.4g per lb (so 61g). Along with the bits of cardio, I’m reducing my intake to around 2300 cals while maintaining protein.
Back to working out your body fat %, I’ve found the images posted here of males and females across the range useful- I hadn’t seen those before- thanks for that. But I find it hard to SEE which one actually ‘matches’ my current %. Do people on here ask others to look at their pics for the objective view? Apologies if this has already been addressed earlier in the thread. I haven’t had time to look properly yet.
Thanks again for all the info on here. Please also pick me up on anything I’ve said that’s off- I’m always learning. I do know that if you log your weight and calories, that’s the only way you can really work out your TDEE. I’ve no idea what I burn during and in between lifting sessions, but I can trust my own data.3 -
Alendralouise wrote: »Delighted to find this rich resource of recomping info and experience. Very grateful. I wish I had time to read all the posts- I’ll keep coming back. Meanwhile, if there’s anyone else in a similar position I’d love to hear from you.
I’m a 5’3 olympic weightlifter in the UK. I have a coach who writes my programme (three sessions a week) and I compete. My competition bodyweight category is 71kg, so at weigh-in, I have to be anywhere between 64.1kg and 71kg on the nose. Obviously the ideal is to have as much useful weight within your bodyweight category limits as possible (really glad I was at the back of the queue when the boobs were handed out!!). I think I’m about 30% body fat but having tried various methods I’ve still no “true” figure. I have come to realise it’s very hard to get an “exact” measurement. The tools available to the average person are generally unreliable unless you use the same tool consistently, log the numbers whatever they are, and watch progress. I even took part in some research at Sheffield Hallam University, UK, where they’re trying to develop better body scanning tools, and my percentage came out at 33%. A callipers trial resulted in a much lower figure. I understand this field is ongoing in development and unless you have lots of cash to use clever air displacement technology etc, it’s all a bit wishy-washy.
So anyway, I’m trying to lose a bit of fat while maintaining strength via the lifting training, and I’ve very, very recently started a little bit of cardio, would you believe! I’m doing short runs once or twice a week- bit of running up hills, sprinting, bursts on the skillsmill, the occasional timed 5k with friends... I don’t want it to have a detrimental impact on my sport as a weightlifter, but I need to do something to be leaner and meaner within my bodyweight category.
I usually eat 2500-3000 cals a day with 1g of protein per lb of bodyweight (so I aim for around 152g protein if I’m looking at being 69kg, but it often goes over), and fat at 0.4g per lb (so 61g). Along with the bits of cardio, I’m reducing my intake to around 2300 cals while maintaining protein.
Back to working out your body fat %, I’ve found the images posted here of males and females across the range useful- I hadn’t seen those before- thanks for that. But I find it hard to SEE which one actually ‘matches’ my current %. Do people on here ask others to look at their pics for the objective view? Apologies if this has already been addressed earlier in the thread. I haven’t had time to look properly yet.
Thanks again for all the info on here. Please also pick me up on anything I’ve said that’s off- I’m always learning. I do know that if you log your weight and calories, that’s the only way you can really work out your TDEE. I’ve no idea what I burn during and in between lifting sessions, but I can trust my own data.
Yes, post your pic in the bodybuilding forum. Relaxed front/side and flexed. There are several really knowledgeable people there that can help you guesstimate.2 -
@Alendralouise
It is harder here in the UK where the gold standards for BF% testing (DEXA and hydrostatic) aren't so readily available. (I've got some personal reservations about hydrostatic testing as I'm someone who isn't lean but can sit quite comfortably on the bottom of a swimming pool.
)
I did the air displacement testing (BodPod) at 6 monthly intervals and wouldn't really recommend it. It isn't many data points and although mostly the numbers given seemed about right I had one clearly rubbish reading which contradicted obvious muscle growth (tape) measurements and visible improvement in leanness.
As you are an outlier in terms of strength and muscle mass (well done you!) I don't think the sample pictures online will be very helpful to you. The text on Builtlean that accompanies the pictures may be more helpful?
Although BIA devices have (quite rightly) a poor reputation a lot of that is based on simple two sensor models (just feet or just handheld) and poor usage (inconsistent conditions) or simply over-confidence or misundertanding of the info they give.
Personally I've found both a domestic 4 sensor (hand and feet) unit and a commercial unit (Boditrax) to be perfectly good for a trend over time. Like your bathroom scales the trend is more important than individual data points or empirical accuracy of a single reading. When you get leaner changes are far easier to spot (that's where progress photos help to see the subtle changes).
At your weight you are burning about 300 net cals for your 5k - that's not going to make a big impact on losing weight. Sadly it's reducing your food intake that's the key rather than cardio (unless you are a potty cyclist perhaps...
.).
For someone like you who trains rather than just exercises it's worth really considering when/where to cut some calories rather than an everyday deficit which might hamper your performance or recovery.5 -
@sijomial
I am always so, so grateful for your insight, wisdom, advice and information. You’re always spot on! I could do with you on my team!
Thank you so much. You’re right! I think not troughing like a ravenous leopard (as I did yesterday) might help...! Do you think intake could make a difference at non-pro level?
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Just a comment for more average build people like myself looking to build up a little more muscle and see some decrease in fat in places where it is still obvious even at a lower weight and decent BF%. My primary exercises are walking, paddling SUP/kayak and kettlebell swings/rows. I also do a little resistance band upper body work with a fairly light band I keep in my office drawer, standing up and doing a few light curls every now and then. Anyway, there has a been a significant changeover the course of about 4 months. My upper body looks athletic and the love handles shrunk. There is no guarantee about where the fat will reduce, but down in normal BMI range with a reasonable BF%, there usually aren't a lot of places with too much excess. I should note that I often walk in excess of 20 miles a week and paddle about 15 miles a week. I use the kettlebell and band almost every day. So it did require some effort, but you can get results without becoming a gym rat.4
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Hello all! I am 5’3’’ and fluctuate between 121-123 pounds. It took me 6 months to lose my last 5 pounds! Yikes! I am wondering if that is normal for everyone here or am I just really bad at fat loss? My progress chart is below.
I am not at the body composition I want, but I am working on trying to motivate myself to lift some weights (it’s just such darn slow progress and I love sweating on cardio equipment!). I think my bf is around 24% and I try to consume 1400-1500 calories a day, focusing on protein.
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Hello all! I am 5’3’’ and fluctuate between 121-123 pounds. It took me 6 months to lose my last 5 pounds! Yikes! I am wondering if that is normal for everyone here or am I just really bad at fat loss? My progress chart is below.
I am not at the body composition I want, but I am working on trying to motivate myself to lift some weights (it’s just such darn slow progress and I love sweating on cardio equipment!). I think my bf is around 24% and I try to consume 1400-1500 calories a day, focusing on protein.
Ps I have, the BELLY POUCH, which is why I’m trying to get myself to do more weight training.
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ILiftHeavyAcrylics wrote: »I don't have any research, but I'll post my results here. I've been recomping for about 2 years. I have chronic illness and eating at a deficit can be too much stress on my system.
On the left I was 125 lbs, 24% body fat according to the Eat, Train, Progress body fat estimation thread. On the right I'm still 125 lbs but 2 sizes smaller.
I have read lots of the posts on here, but at 106 pages, haven't been able to read them all. This post I'm quoting is a few years old, now.
Is ILiftHeavyAcrylics still around? I won't ask what your chronic illness is, but I was wondering if you don't mind my asking, how long can/do your flare ups last for? I ask, because I also have a chronic illness, and I'm slowly coming out of a flare that has been almost a month, at this point.
I really struggle with weights, these days. I used to love weights and thrived on it, and this illness makes me quite weak. A lot of what you wrote about needing to eat more calories for your illness and needing to lift less during flares, really set off a light bulb for me. Thank you for sharing your story, it's really helping me to make up my mind about a few things.
I definitely want to recomp. I'm 5'2 (in the past, I've said I was 5'1, but I've since found out I'm actually 5'2 ). Today, I weigh 58.6kg. I'm currently in the weight loss phase of things, and I'm happy with how it's going, despite being skinny fat, now, particularly in the abs.
I have (Aussie sizes) size 10 bust, size 12 waist, and size 8 hips. My goal is to get these three measurements to size 8. I used an online body fat percentage calculator and it said my body fat percentage is 24.2%.
If I had to sit at this size for quite some time because recomp is slow, I'm fine with that. Of course, I'm curious as to how my results would be! I think what's holding me back from starting now, is I only just reached a healthy BMI at 62kg, and mentally, I feel like I want more 'distance' in numbers between my weight and 62kg. It really freaked me out when I became overweight, and I think I'm just afraid of drifting back there, if that makes sense?
I can't decide if I wait until I'm around 55kg, or start now? I genuinely do think I'd benefit from the extra calories, because MFP puts me at 1,200 calories for weight loss. I do exercise and eat back calories when I'm well enough, but it feels like I'm now needing more. Especially when my iron levels get low.
Any advice from anyone is welcomed
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annaskiski wrote: »
She hasn't been online for about 5 months. A PM might work if she gets notifications to her email.2 -
@Candyspun I have a chronic illness too, and I'm similar to the other poster (recomping because my body can't handle a deficit). I'm about to head to work, but I'll respond or dm you later about my experience.4
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annaskiski wrote: »
Thanks so much!0 -
annaskiski wrote: »
She hasn't been online for about 5 months. A PM might work if she gets notifications to her email.@Candyspun I have a chronic illness too, and I'm similar to the other poster (recomping because my body can't handle a deficit). I'm about to head to work, but I'll respond or dm you later about my experience.
Thank you both so much 1 -
Warning - I am going to use a word that many (most?) gym rats hate because it is vague or describes a concept that doesn't really exist - toning. In context, I think you will get what I mean. I thought I was getting some recomp in, but I was still at more of a deficit than I realized. I think I was "toning and exposing". I don't think I have a lot of new muscle mass but it isn't hidden under as much fat and it has more definition. I feel stronger and have more endurance, but as my weight was creeping down, I don't think this is new muscle mass.
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CarvedTones wrote: »Warning - I am going to use a word that many (most?) gym rats hate because it is vague or describes a concept that doesn't really exist - toning. In context, I think you will get what I mean. I thought I was getting some recomp in, but I was still at more of a deficit than I realized. I think I was "toning and exposing". I don't think I have a lot of new muscle mass but it isn't hidden under as much fat and it has more definition. I feel stronger and have more endurance, but as my weight was creeping down, I don't think this is new muscle mass.
A great result nonetheless 0 -
I’ve been eating at maintenanceish for about two months, and I’m not sure if this would be considered body recomp. I’m still fairly around the same weight but I see some slight changes!4
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Glad I’m somewhat getting the hang of it!0
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@Candyspun I have a chronic illness too, and I'm similar to the other poster (recomping because my body can't handle a deficit). I'm about to head to work, but I'll respond or dm you later about my experience.
I too have noticed that my body doesnt like deficits.2 -
CharlieBeansmomTracey wrote: »@Candyspun I have a chronic illness too, and I'm similar to the other poster (recomping because my body can't handle a deficit). I'm about to head to work, but I'll respond or dm you later about my experience.
I too have noticed that my body doesnt like deficits.
It's funny; I've been in a deficit for over three months (maybe 4? I'm not sure). I was going along absolutely fine until I reached the 3 month mark. My wheels feel like they've been falling off, ever since. I didn't realise it until I read someone else saying it on here.0 -
CharlieBeansmomTracey wrote: »@Candyspun I have a chronic illness too, and I'm similar to the other poster (recomping because my body can't handle a deficit). I'm about to head to work, but I'll respond or dm you later about my experience.
I too have noticed that my body doesnt like deficits.
It's funny; I've been in a deficit for over three months (maybe 4? I'm not sure). I was going along absolutely fine until I reached the 3 month mark. My wheels feel like they've been falling off, ever since. I didn't realise it until I read someone else saying it on here.
I have been in a deficit off and on for the last 5 years. I take diet breaks often(sometimes a month at a time to make sure). since march I had only lost 1 lb.I need to lose close to 40. it wasnt coming off no matter how long I took a diet break or how low my calories were. I even tried not eating calories back. nothing was working at all. yet all my bloodwork was fine(its tested every 3 months). I finally said enough was enough because I was maintaining my weight on less calories that I should.
so I decided to stop with the deficit.eat at my maintenance level and just work out and go from there. Im feeling better, have more energy,my sleep is better and Im in less pain. now when I work out I dont get sore like I did. I was sore for days. now I can work out and its a slight soreness.so to me that was my body telling me to eat more. Im losing fat and the scale goes down slowly which could be water weight and fat, but losing the fat is all that matters. less stress for me too.7
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