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How do I get 4000+ calories?

2

Replies

  • adpschoon
    adpschoon Posts: 20 Member
    So there's no way of gaining without adding fat? Seems kind of depressing
  • adpschoon
    adpschoon Posts: 20 Member
    erickirb wrote: »
    Do you do cardio? If so, one option is to drop the cardio, then you won't have to aim for 4,000, 3,500 or less may be enough to gain in that case

    I do abs exercise, only run in the beginning when warming up
  • J_NY_Z
    J_NY_Z Posts: 2,387 Member
  • adpschoon
    adpschoon Posts: 20 Member
    cwolfman13 wrote: »
    adpschoon wrote: »
    SabAteNine wrote: »
    That's odd, I punched your numbers in a TDEE calculator and I'm not getting anywhere near your reported maintenance number of 3,800 - even with the „very active / athlete” selection for activity.

    Since increasing lean mass with minimal fat gain to go along usually means going for a low to moderate surplus, you might not have this problem of needing to reach 4k in the first place. If you are getting the cal burn reading off a wearable or gym machines, be aware that they're notorious for overestimating.

    Protein looks good. But what is too many fats in your book? I would also argue on the topic of bad fats but that gets into technicalities. :smile:

    that just means he's not in a standard deviation - most calculators tell me i need to eat like 1600 to maintian weight and yet i eat 24-2800 cal a day and weight stable (with normal fluctations) - i lose 1-2lbs a week on 1600...

    I too think you should aim for much higher than what you burn per day if you really want to gain! :)

    Large calorie surplus equals faster gains, but also more fat gains. You can only build so much muscle in a given time.

    You aren't going to stay at 13% BF with a large calorie surplus...you're going to put on a lot of fat. You will also put on fat with a smaller calorie surplus, but not as much and it will be slower.

    I do a lot of abs exercises though, every day after the other workout. This burns fat, right? What if I stay at large calorie surplus and burn the fat by doing abs exercises and running in general? Would that work?
  • TavistockToad
    TavistockToad Posts: 35,741 Member
    adpschoon wrote: »
    So there's no way of gaining without adding fat? Seems kind of depressing

    Recomp, but you said you want to gain quickly, so....
  • erickirb
    erickirb Posts: 12,273 Member
    edited April 2019
    adpschoon wrote: »
    cwolfman13 wrote: »
    adpschoon wrote: »
    SabAteNine wrote: »
    That's odd, I punched your numbers in a TDEE calculator and I'm not getting anywhere near your reported maintenance number of 3,800 - even with the „very active / athlete” selection for activity.

    Since increasing lean mass with minimal fat gain to go along usually means going for a low to moderate surplus, you might not have this problem of needing to reach 4k in the first place. If you are getting the cal burn reading off a wearable or gym machines, be aware that they're notorious for overestimating.

    Protein looks good. But what is too many fats in your book? I would also argue on the topic of bad fats but that gets into technicalities. :smile:

    that just means he's not in a standard deviation - most calculators tell me i need to eat like 1600 to maintian weight and yet i eat 24-2800 cal a day and weight stable (with normal fluctations) - i lose 1-2lbs a week on 1600...

    I too think you should aim for much higher than what you burn per day if you really want to gain! :)

    Large calorie surplus equals faster gains, but also more fat gains. You can only build so much muscle in a given time.

    You aren't going to stay at 13% BF with a large calorie surplus...you're going to put on a lot of fat. You will also put on fat with a smaller calorie surplus, but not as much and it will be slower.

    I do a lot of abs exercises though, every day after the other workout. This burns fat, right? What if I stay at large calorie surplus and burn the fat by doing abs exercises and running in general? Would that work?

    Nope. working your abs strengthen your core, but are generally not the most efficient use of time. your core can get enough work by doing heavy squats, deadlifts, standing overhead presses, etc. You can't spot reduce fat, or spot avoid gaining fat. And ab workouts don't burn many cals, but since you are looking to gain, a smaller caloric burn is a good thing

    Where you gain fat is genetically determined, you can thank or blame your parents for that one.
  • Panini911
    Panini911 Posts: 2,325 Member
    edited April 2019
    I would eat so many PB and J sandwiches. WITH a banana. and a bit of honey. mmmm

    oh and the BEST desserts

    (the rest would all be super healthy and hit nutritional needs).

    sorry the title just got me daydreaming of all the foods...
  • adpschoon
    adpschoon Posts: 20 Member
    adpschoon wrote: »
    So there's no way of gaining without adding fat? Seems kind of depressing

    Recomp, but you said you want to gain quickly, so....

    Very true, although I was hoping for gaining while staying relatively lean. I heard a very good argument from my housemate who does a lot of exercising. He said that I could first gain fast and then get that fat by doing a lot of calories surplus, and then when I have reached the desired weight I should train to get rid of the fat, so then obtaining less calories than that I burn on a day. Does that sound like a solid plan to you guys, or do you advice against it?
    Thanks btw for all the responses thus far, I really appreciate it. :)
  • Morgaath
    Morgaath Posts: 679 Member
    Eat like a normal person and GOMAD (Gallon of milk a day)
    1 gal of whole milk is ~2300 cals, 128g protein (512cals), 180g carbs (720cals), 128g fat (1152cals).

    Basically, replace whatever you are currently drinking with milk.
    If you want to drink less milk, drink chocolate milk, which will up carbs and fat intake.
    If you want less fat, drink something other than whole milk.
  • adpschoon
    adpschoon Posts: 20 Member
    Morgaath wrote: »
    Eat like a normal person and GOMAD (Gallon of milk a day)
    1 gal of whole milk is ~2300 cals, 128g protein (512cals), 180g carbs (720cals), 128g fat (1152cals).

    Basically, replace whatever you are currently drinking with milk.
    If you want to drink less milk, drink chocolate milk, which will up carbs and fat intake.
    If you want less fat, drink something other than whole milk.

    Havent even considered milk yet, will check that out tomorrow in the supermarket. Thank you!
  • erickirb
    erickirb Posts: 12,273 Member
    adpschoon wrote: »
    adpschoon wrote: »
    So there's no way of gaining without adding fat? Seems kind of depressing

    Recomp, but you said you want to gain quickly, so....

    Very true, although I was hoping for gaining while staying relatively lean. I heard a very good argument from my housemate who does a lot of exercising. He said that I could first gain fast and then get that fat by doing a lot of calories surplus, and then when I have reached the desired weight I should train to get rid of the fat, so then obtaining less calories than that I burn on a day. Does that sound like a solid plan to you guys, or do you advice against it?
    Thanks btw for all the responses thus far, I really appreciate it. :)

    That is what most do, but over and over again, bulk and cut cycles
  • Morgaath
    Morgaath Posts: 679 Member
    Bodybuilders bulk up in the off season, adding a bunch of fat on, but also a bunch of muscle.
    Then they spend 6-10 weeks dieting to lose all the fat, while trying to keep the muscle.
    Friend of mine is 2 weeks out from his first contest of the year, and really sick of a steady diet of chicken breast and white rice, but the fat is coming off.
  • cwolfman13
    cwolfman13 Posts: 39,842 Member
    edited April 2019
    adpschoon wrote: »
    cwolfman13 wrote: »
    adpschoon wrote: »
    SabAteNine wrote: »
    That's odd, I punched your numbers in a TDEE calculator and I'm not getting anywhere near your reported maintenance number of 3,800 - even with the „very active / athlete” selection for activity.

    Since increasing lean mass with minimal fat gain to go along usually means going for a low to moderate surplus, you might not have this problem of needing to reach 4k in the first place. If you are getting the cal burn reading off a wearable or gym machines, be aware that they're notorious for overestimating.

    Protein looks good. But what is too many fats in your book? I would also argue on the topic of bad fats but that gets into technicalities. :smile:

    that just means he's not in a standard deviation - most calculators tell me i need to eat like 1600 to maintian weight and yet i eat 24-2800 cal a day and weight stable (with normal fluctations) - i lose 1-2lbs a week on 1600...

    I too think you should aim for much higher than what you burn per day if you really want to gain! :)

    Large calorie surplus equals faster gains, but also more fat gains. You can only build so much muscle in a given time.

    You aren't going to stay at 13% BF with a large calorie surplus...you're going to put on a lot of fat. You will also put on fat with a smaller calorie surplus, but not as much and it will be slower.

    I do a lot of abs exercises though, every day after the other workout. This burns fat, right? What if I stay at large calorie surplus and burn the fat by doing abs exercises and running in general? Would that work?

    You don't have any net fat loss in a calorie surplus. If you're in a calorie surplus, you are anabolic, not catabolic regardless of ab exercises or whatever.

    Like I said, this is why bodybuilders do bulking and cutting cycles. They put on muscle mass and also fat mass in a bulk, and when they end their bulk, they cut to get rid of the fat they have accumulated during their bulk. And like I said, the higher your calorie surplus is, the more fat mass you will accumulate during your bulk and the more rapidly you'll accumulate it which will not maximize your bulking phase. You will build muscle slower with a smaller calorie surplus, but you will also accumulate fat slower and stay leaner and extend the length of your bulking cycle.

    Being in a hurry here is sub-optimal.
  • sardelsa
    sardelsa Posts: 9,826 Member
    adpschoon wrote: »
    So there's no way of gaining without adding fat? Seems kind of depressing

    You can reduce the amount of fat gain by starting off fairly lean, keeping your surplus smaller and training effectively. However if you are always chasing abs during a bulk it will really limit your progress. I find it best to embrace some loss of definition. Muscle gain is hard, for many fat loss after is the easy part.
  • adpschoon
    adpschoon Posts: 20 Member
    sardelsa wrote: »
    adpschoon wrote: »
    So there's no way of gaining without adding fat? Seems kind of depressing

    You can reduce the amount of fat gain by starting off fairly lean, keeping your surplus smaller and training effectively. However if you are always chasing abs during a bulk it will really limit your progress. I find it best to embrace some loss of definition. Muscle gain is hard, for many fat loss after is the easy part.

    Yeah I think the best way for me (and others in my position) is to add weight as fast as possible (large calories surplus and many unsaturated fats) and then after reaching desired weight: eat less calories that you burn on a day to lose the fat that came with the muscles. Correct me if I'm wrong, but having more fat increases your muscle growth as well, right?
    Is this the best way to go about it for me?
  • sardelsa
    sardelsa Posts: 9,826 Member
    adpschoon wrote: »
    sardelsa wrote: »
    adpschoon wrote: »
    So there's no way of gaining without adding fat? Seems kind of depressing

    You can reduce the amount of fat gain by starting off fairly lean, keeping your surplus smaller and training effectively. However if you are always chasing abs during a bulk it will really limit your progress. I find it best to embrace some loss of definition. Muscle gain is hard, for many fat loss after is the easy part.

    Yeah I think the best way for me (and others in my position) is to add weight as fast as possible (large calories surplus and many unsaturated fats) and then after reaching desired weight: eat less calories that you burn on a day to lose the fat that came with the muscles. Correct me if I'm wrong, but having more fat increases your muscle growth as well, right?
    Is this the best way to go about it for me?

    I wouldn't do that either. Too fast is a recipe for very little muscle gain and lots of fat gain which is not great or productive. And no the higher you are in bodyfat the less optimal muscle gain becomes. That is why people don't bulk indefinitely, they run cuts in between to lean out again.

    You want to find the sweet spot. Stay relatively lean but gain at a consistent and comfortable rate. I would say anywhere from 0.5-1lb per week.
  • erickirb
    erickirb Posts: 12,273 Member
    edited April 2019
    adpschoon wrote: »
    sardelsa wrote: »
    adpschoon wrote: »
    So there's no way of gaining without adding fat? Seems kind of depressing

    You can reduce the amount of fat gain by starting off fairly lean, keeping your surplus smaller and training effectively. However if you are always chasing abs during a bulk it will really limit your progress. I find it best to embrace some loss of definition. Muscle gain is hard, for many fat loss after is the easy part.

    Yeah I think the best way for me (and others in my position) is to add weight as fast as possible (large calories surplus and many unsaturated fats) and then after reaching desired weight: eat less calories that you burn on a day to lose the fat that came with the muscles. Correct me if I'm wrong, but having more fat increases your muscle growth as well, right?
    Is this the best way to go about it for me?

    If you are bulking fast and gain say 1.5 lbs/week you may gain 0.5lbs muscle and 1 lb fat, but if you have a surplus to gain 0.5lbs/week, 0.25 may be muscle and 0.25 fat, so a larger % of your gain will be muscle, but yes, less muscle overall, if doing it for a short period of time.
  • adpschoon
    adpschoon Posts: 20 Member
    sardelsa wrote: »
    adpschoon wrote: »
    sardelsa wrote: »
    adpschoon wrote: »
    So there's no way of gaining without adding fat? Seems kind of depressing

    You can reduce the amount of fat gain by starting off fairly lean, keeping your surplus smaller and training effectively. However if you are always chasing abs during a bulk it will really limit your progress. I find it best to embrace some loss of definition. Muscle gain is hard, for many fat loss after is the easy part.

    Yeah I think the best way for me (and others in my position) is to add weight as fast as possible (large calories surplus and many unsaturated fats) and then after reaching desired weight: eat less calories that you burn on a day to lose the fat that came with the muscles. Correct me if I'm wrong, but having more fat increases your muscle growth as well, right?
    Is this the best way to go about it for me?

    I wouldn't do that either. Too fast is a recipe for very little muscle gain and lots of fat gain which is not great or productive. And no the higher you are in bodyfat the less optimal muscle gain becomes. That is why people don't bulk indefinitely, they run cuts in between to lean out again.

    You want to find the sweet spot. Stay relatively lean but gain at a consistent and comfortable rate. I would say anywhere from 0.5-1lb per week.

    God, why is trying to gain weight while staying lean so goddamn vague :D
    I'll just ask a fitness instructor tomorrow what I should do, because I just need a solid plan of action