Crazy hungry- how to stop

LyndaBSS wrote: »

If you're hungry, you're either not eating enough or you're eating foods that aren't satiating.

What's a typical day of eating look like?

psychod787 wrote: »

Well... actually there are several ways to measure hunger. Researchers have done multiple studies that gauged subjective levels of hunger on the same meal before, during, and after weight loss. They all show an increase in hunger and a decrease in satiety. You can give someone an oral glucose load before weight loss and get a base line of satiety. Then cause weight loss and judge. Objective data is response to food ques in an FMRI before and after weightloss. You can also check hormone levels for hormones connected with hunger before and after weight loss. The thing about hunger, is it IS VERY SUBJECTIVE. that's why I asked OP what kind of hunger they were having.😉

psychod787 wrote: »

cmriverside wrote: »

psychod787 wrote: »

Well... actually there are several ways to measure hunger. Researchers have done multiple studies that gauged subjective levels of hunger on the same meal before, during, and after weight loss. They all show an increase in hunger and a decrease in satiety. You can give someone an oral glucose load before weight loss and get a base line of satiety. Then cause weight loss and judge. Objective data is response to food ques in an FMRI before and after weightloss. You can also check hormone levels for hormones connected with hunger before and after weight loss. The thing about hunger, is it IS VERY SUBJECTIVE. that's why I asked OP what kind of hunger they were having.😉

She's not reporting having taken any of those tests, so let's not go down that path.

I was hungier when I was losing weight. I'm still hungry now at maintenance and it is a struggle for me to stay under calories consistently and I'm 12 years into Maintenance. So while I kind of agree with Kimney, I also agree that difficult to bear hunger can be part of this.

I've done enough reading to believe that some people are genetically predisposed to have differing reactions to food and hunger.

Kimney, you are not one of the people who are coming at this from a place of having been obese or morbidly obese, nor did you have any huge issues with controlling your appetite. I don't think you can really understand this, nor can anyone who has not lived it.

I sent you a message @cmriverside . Hope you respond!

cmriverside wrote: »

psychod787 wrote: »

cmriverside wrote: »

psychod787 wrote: »

Well... actually there are several ways to measure hunger. Researchers have done multiple studies that gauged subjective levels of hunger on the same meal before, during, and after weight loss. They all show an increase in hunger and a decrease in satiety. You can give someone an oral glucose load before weight loss and get a base line of satiety. Then cause weight loss and judge. Objective data is response to food ques in an FMRI before and after weightloss. You can also check hormone levels for hormones connected with hunger before and after weight loss. The thing about hunger, is it IS VERY SUBJECTIVE. that's why I asked OP what kind of hunger they were having.😉

She's not reporting having taken any of those tests, so let's not go down that path.

I was hungier when I was losing weight. I'm still hungry now at maintenance and it is a struggle for me to stay under calories consistently and I'm 12 years into Maintenance. So while I kind of agree with Kimney, I also agree that difficult to bear hunger can be part of this.

I've done enough reading to believe that some people are genetically predisposed to have differing reactions to food and hunger.

Kimney, you are not one of the people who are coming at this from a place of having been obese or morbidly obese, nor did you have any huge issues with controlling your appetite. I don't think you can really understand this, nor can anyone who has not lived it.

I sent you a message @cmriverside . Hope you respond!

I sent YOU a FriendRequest, I think that's the only way I get mail...

kimny72 wrote: »

cmriverside wrote: »

psychod787 wrote: »

Well... actually there are several ways to measure hunger. Researchers have done multiple studies that gauged subjective levels of hunger on the same meal before, during, and after weight loss. They all show an increase in hunger and a decrease in satiety. You can give someone an oral glucose load before weight loss and get a base line of satiety. Then cause weight loss and judge. Objective data is response to food ques in an FMRI before and after weightloss. You can also check hormone levels for hormones connected with hunger before and after weight loss. The thing about hunger, is it IS VERY SUBJECTIVE. that's why I asked OP what kind of hunger they were having.😉

She's not reporting having taken any of those tests, so let's not go down that path.

I was hungier when I was losing weight. I'm still hungry now at maintenance and it is a struggle for me to stay under calories consistently and I'm 12 years into Maintenance. So while I kind of agree with Kimney, I also agree that difficult to bear hunger can be part of this.

I've done enough reading to believe that some people are genetically predisposed to have differing reactions to food and hunger.

Kimney, you are not one of the people who are coming at this from a place of having been obese or morbidly obese, nor did you have any huge issues with controlling your appetite. I don't think you can really understand this, nor can anyone who has not lived it.

My point is OP literally joined the day she posted. We know absolutely nothing about her. There is just as much chance that she is trying to lose vanity lbs quickly as there is she is obese. If she is trying to lose vanity lbs, telling her with zero context that studies show its normal for her to be constantly hungry to lose weight is not helpful, especially if she is starving herself to lose a little weight fast.

I tend to stay out of threads where the OP is losing or has lost a lot of weight and is struggling with something I probably don't understand. All I was suggesting was not to project a complication that happens to some folks in a specific situation onto an unknown poster.

The post made it sound like we all know it is scientifically proven that everyone will be hungry when losing weight and probably for some time afterward. That is what I was responding to. I disagree with that. If that is true specifically for those that started out obese, it should've said that. But it still would be out of place, since OP did not provide her stats.

When I have a moderate calorie deficit and focus on foods that satiate me, I'm only hungry right before meals.

AnnPT77 wrote: »

OP, I think there are four potential categories of things to think about, that might help you. First I'll list them, then say a little more about each.

1. Adjustment
2. Over-restricting
3. Eating timing and composition
4. Non-food causes of perceived hunger

1. Adjustment

I gather you're new to the forums here, but I'm not sure how long you've been working at weight loss (on this round). It's not universal, but many of us have a couple weeks at the start of the process where we feel hungrier than usual, and hungrier than we will in a few short weeks (like 2-3 weeks, anecdotally, in cases I've read here, and for me). When we first change our habits to eat less, we feel hungrier: Pretty normal. If you're lucky, your hormones/body/brain will eventually act like "OK, this is the new reality" and the hunger will reduce or even go away. (It's unclear to me whether this happens without changing things, or because people tend to discover a few quite-effective strategies rather soon.)

2. Over-restricting

Others have already mentioned this, but I'll expand a bit (sorry! ). There are two general forms: Cutting calories too far, or cutting out specific foods that one especially needs or desires in order to be satisfied.

Many of us think that the average person is best off trying to lose no more than 1% of their current bodyweight per week, as an absolute maximum (absent special circumstances like obesity so advanced it's a major and acute health risk in itself, plus close medical supervision for nutritional adequacy). Slower may be better (some would suggest more like 0.5%, for example). Within 50 pounds of goal weight, it can be helpful to slow things down even further.

Too-slow weight loss can be frustrating, but too-fast weight loss can be a health risk . . . and leave you very hungry (plus potentially weak, fatigued, and worse).

If calorie restriction may be an issue for you, you might consider starting out just calorie counting and eating at a level that targets very slow weight loss, like half a pound a week or even slower. Then, as that becomes manageable, you can cut calories further, gradually, if you still have enough weight left to lose that a faster rate is a reasonable risk.

Cutting out specific foods that are personally satisfying for you is another potential form of over-restriction. People get the idea (from silly instagrammers, bro-trainers, clickbait websites selling stuff, etc.) that we have to completely stop eating certain "bad" foods in order to lose weight or get good nutrition. We don't. Unless someone has an allergy or medical condition that limits food choices, finds that there are specific foods that they personally and individually can't moderate without going overboard, or (heaven forbid) has been eating poisonous things, there are no inherently off-limits foods.

You can restrict specific trigger foods if it helps you, or use some specialized way of eating ("clean", paleo, keto, intermittent fasting, plant-based whatever) if it helps you manage your calorie intake, but for the average person, there's ample research suggesting that no special eating regimen is objectively universally required for weight loss. Overall nutrition is important (for health, satiation, energy level and more, though not really for weight loss), so good nutrition is worth working toward, but there are many ways to get there. You can eat foods you enjoy and find filling, in managed portions, and not only lose weight, but also get decent nutrition.

3. Eating timing and composition

When it comes to hunger, some people find it matters how many meals/snacks they eat, which are largest at which times, what the relative nutritional contribution of each is, etc. Other people can suggest eating schedules for you to try, but the question is very, very individual. You'll see people here reporting success on everything from one meal a day (OMAD) in which they get all their calories and nutrients, to 6-8 small meals/snacks or all-day grazing. There are breakfast-skippers and breakfast eaters; people who don't eat after 7PM (or some other time); people who never snack; and more. By experimenting with variations (for a couple of days at a time), you can figure out what works best for you.

Composition of eating is the other hunger-related variable. It appears you've heard that protein is satiating. For some people, it is. But others find fat more satiating. Some people find carbs necessary in order to avoid hunger (often it's complex carbs like potatoes, bread, grains - but not always); other people find that carbs make them crave more carbs. Volume is another thing that satiates some; usually this means large amounts of low-calorie high-fiber veggies but can also take other forms like "protein fluff", shirataki noodles, etc. Some people find they need a combination of these, or different combinations at different times of day.

It's important nutritionally to get a certain minimum of protein and fats, and enough varied/colorful veggies and fruits to get micronutrients and beneficial phytochemicals, but beyond that, calories can be "spent" in any way that works for you, from "fat bombs" to protein shakes to a whole head of cabbage to candy.

Here again, we find this out by experimenting with variations.

4. Non-food causes of perceived hunger

This was also mentioned. I'm not talking about "imaginary hunger", necessarily, BTW. The hormones that trigger our feelings of appetite and hunger can be kicked up by non-food factors. It can feel real, because it is real, even in some cases where we're not actually short of food (in the sense of risking starvation or under-nutrition).

In brief, some things that people find can affect perceived hunger are: Sleep, hydration (adequate needed, crazy-high amounts not needed), exercise (including specific types having different effects), stress, emotions, boredom, habits of eating (particular things at particular times), social factors, and more.

Some self-insight is required to sort these out. It isn't necessarily clear or easy. The bottom line is that if the root cause isn't actual under-fueling or under-nutrition, the best solution isn't eating.

For all of the above, what can help is to begin logging your eating consistently (even if you just log without limiting calories at first, or only limit them a little), then observe how you feel in context of what you've eaten (and other relevant things you've done).

Are you hungry right after exercise, when under stress, when you had a smaller than usual (or less nutrient-rich) breakfast or lunch, after meals that are particularly high or low in some particular macronutrient (protein, fat, carbs, fiber), at times when you're accustomed to snack, when you've slept poorly, etc., etc. Some of these can even be related to something that happened the day before the hungry day (like undereating or undernutrition the day before, or doing certain types of exercise). Which specific foods or meals/snacks seem to keep you full longer? Are there times when inserting a small snack might nip hunger in the bud?

Experiment with variations, and note the results. If the triggers aren't food-related, find non-food strategies (sleep, stress reduction, new habits, new or revived hobbies, etc.). It's like a fun and productive science-fair project for grown-ups!

There is a lot of territory you can consider and work with before you just decide "we just have to be hungry when limiting calories". As some people above had said, that's where it ends up for some people. It doesn't end up there for everyone. And one's starting point isn't necessarily a determiner of some specific outcome, IMO, either: I started at an obese bodyweight, and wasn't annoyingly hungry during weight loss, after a couple weeks' adjustment period. (I wasn't even all that hungry when I accidentally over-restricted by cutting my calories too low for a short time, unfortunately!) "Just live with it" is not the required answer for everyone.

You have a lot of variables you can work with, to potentially reduce hunger. Hang in there!

P.S. Apologies for writing a book. I'm bad that way.

SarahAnne3958 wrote: »

OP- for me personally, I used to walk around with a regular feeling of hunger. It started when I began my weight loss phase and it followed me into maintenance, even after I had adjusted my calorie intake up. I'd wake up hungry, think about my next meal as I was eating, go to bed hungry etc. The nagging hunger was my second shadow and I thought I just had to live with it. It wasn't until I started my lower carb experiment this past spring, and subsequently started adding more protein and fat into my diet, that the nagging hunger lessened and then completely disappeared. I realized that it was the macros ratios I had been following (high carb, lower protein and low fat), that was causing the hunger issues.

Now I'm almost zero carb and high fat/higher protein and that works well for me, but macros ratios are going to be highly individualized and it really will just take some trial and error to figure out what works best for you.

SarahAnne3958 wrote: »

cmriverside wrote: »

SarahAnne3958 wrote: »

OP- for me personally, I used to walk around with a regular feeling of hunger. It started when I began my weight loss phase and it followed me into maintenance, even after I had adjusted my calorie intake up. I'd wake up hungry, think about my next meal as I was eating, go to bed hungry etc. The nagging hunger was my second shadow and I thought I just had to live with it. It wasn't until I started my lower carb experiment this past spring, and subsequently started adding more protein and fat into my diet, that the nagging hunger lessened and then completely disappeared. I realized that it was the macros ratios I had been following (high carb, lower protein and low fat), that was causing the hunger issues.

Now I'm almost zero carb and high fat/higher protein and that works well for me, but macros ratios are going to be highly individualized and it really will just take some trial and error to figure out what works best for you.

Aren't you on a carnivore diet?

I would rather have a little hunger than never have an English muffin or a peach.

Yes, a relaxed version, (I still drink coffee, uses spices etc). For me personally, it's worth the trade off of not being able to eat certain foods, to be able to finally maintain without struggling, which I did for years before I finally just couldn't do it anymore. There were a lot of issues going on way beyond the hunger, that led me to where I'm at now.