Price Gouging?
Replies
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fluffygoodas wrote: »Happening in Canada too. Very sneakily too. Normal sale prices higher, or no sales at all, yesterday a high end supermarket got dragged on the news for selling lysol wipes for $29.99. Rationed grocery too. 2 items each for food, 1 paper product. For a large family like mine, i have never spent more money on essentials. Very frustrating given what we are facing.
This store is like 4 blocks from my house. The mark up there is amazing so some on out community Facebook group were just like what's new? I suspect if its name is dragged through the media much more it will have another "accidental" fire. It's a beautiful store and has some neat stuff but it's really not worth it. Can get the same at No Frills for and eighth of the price2 -
AliNouveau wrote: »fluffygoodas wrote: »Happening in Canada too. Very sneakily too. Normal sale prices higher, or no sales at all, yesterday a high end supermarket got dragged on the news for selling lysol wipes for $29.99. Rationed grocery too. 2 items each for food, 1 paper product. For a large family like mine, i have never spent more money on essentials. Very frustrating given what we are facing.
This store is like 4 blocks from my house. The mark up there is amazing so some on out community Facebook group were just like what's new? I suspect if its name is dragged through the media much more it will have another "accidental" fire. It's a beautiful store and has some neat stuff but it's really not worth it. Can get the same at No Frills for and eighth of the price
Yup, I can't believe some people actually bought the wipes for $30!!!1 -
I had the opposite issue -- I normally buy more expensive peanut butter (peanuts and salt only) and for my delivery order they had to substitute Jif for it (if I'd noticed I would have rejected it and just made some nut butter from the nuts I have on hand as I don't really care for regular peanut butter, but oh well). Also, when I checked about 10 days ago to see if 7-11 still had toilet paper (they had been fully stocked the week before, when the grocery stores first started having trouble keeping it on the shelves), they were out of all the namebrand stuff and only had their 7-11 brand, which is cheaper. I'm not saying this is the case across the board here, as I haven't been to the grocery store for a while.
Make peanut butter cookies. The difference won't be as noticeable.
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Ok, well obviously this isn't as bad as the toilet paper for 89.99 but doing my weekly shopping trip today, using their new ad as a guide, some of their stuff was on sale as listed and some not. I'm not sure what the deal with that is and not one sign anywhere telling us anything But I also noticed many prices on things such as bottled water(?) seem to be taking off like a rocket. I am not pleased.
Our area is not what you'd call a high income area; in fact our whole state, except for a couple city or ski areas, is a bit of a financially depressed state.
There are workers in grocery stores, 20 minutes away, who have become sick with Covid-19 so there has to be some in my town as well. Some stores have increased their workers' pay by $2.00 an hour during all of this, as a thank you. Other stores have increased wages 1.00 an hour and yet other stores are trying to get more employees by offering a bonus of $150-300., depending on FT or PT. But I've seen nothing about my grocery store; hopefully I'm wrong about them. The employees of another grocery store have been told they cannot wear masks/gloves because they're to be used for other people. I can't understand that at all.
This whole virus has either brought out the kindness of others, the stupid in others or the greed in others.
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lynn_glenmont wrote: »I had the opposite issue -- I normally buy more expensive peanut butter (peanuts and salt only) and for my delivery order they had to substitute Jif for it (if I'd noticed I would have rejected it and just made some nut butter from the nuts I have on hand as I don't really care for regular peanut butter, but oh well). Also, when I checked about 10 days ago to see if 7-11 still had toilet paper (they had been fully stocked the week before, when the grocery stores first started having trouble keeping it on the shelves), they were out of all the namebrand stuff and only had their 7-11 brand, which is cheaper. I'm not saying this is the case across the board here, as I haven't been to the grocery store for a while.
Make peanut butter cookies. The difference won't be as noticeable.
Good idea!0 -
You can't put out a sale flyer advertising a product for $0.99 and then sell it for $2.49.
@ReenieHJ did they have big signs all over the store disclaiming "Sale prices not in effect?"
My supermarkets had big signs on the doors and all over the place saying "No rain checks will be issued" and "No returns allowed."
I’m afraid they can. There’s no law that guarantees advertised prices that are printed, posted, etc. typos occur all the time, especially when circulars go to press. Some stores choose to honor prices that might be mislabeled but they aren’t legally required to do so.
Depends on where you live. I'm not going to go into all the details, but the law here (Michigan) is generally that they have to honor the price on the shelf/sign. Misprints in flyers require posted corrections (usually not all that prominent, may just be signage at customer service, but it's there.)
Here in Massachusetts signs about typos are displayed prominently on the door so people can see them before they start shopping.
Also, if something rings up at a price higher than the advertised price or the price on the shelf you get it for free or for $10 off if it costs more than $10. They are required to post these signs by the cash registers.
https://blog.mass.gov/consumer/massconsumer/the-price-is-right-the-massachusetts-item-pricing-law/
If there is a discrepancy between the price listed on the shelf or item and the price that it rings up at, the consumer must be offered one of two corrections:- If the item costs more than $10 and rings up higher than the advertised price, $10 must be deducted from the lowest advertised price.
- If the item costs less than $10 and rings up higher than the advertised price the item should be given as free.
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Ok, well obviously this isn't as bad as the toilet paper for 89.99 but doing my weekly shopping trip today, using their new ad as a guide, some of their stuff was on sale as listed and some not. I'm not sure what the deal with that is and not one sign anywhere telling us anything But I also noticed many prices on things such as bottled water(?) seem to be taking off like a rocket. I am not pleased. Our area is not what you'd call a high income area; in fact our whole state, except for a couple city or ski areas, is a bit of a financially depressed state.
There are workers in grocery stores, 20 minutes away, who have become sick with Covid-19 so there has to be some in my town as well. Some stores have increased their workers' pay by $2.00 an hour during all of this, as a thank you. Other stores have increased wages 1.00 an hour and yet other stores are trying to get more employees by offering a bonus of $150-300., depending on FT or PT. But I've seen nothing about my grocery store; hopefully I'm wrong about them. The employees of another grocery store have been told they cannot wear masks/gloves because they're to be used for other people. I can't understand that at all.
This whole virus has either brought out the kindness of others, the stupid in others or the greed in others.
Because there is a huge shortage and medical personnel need them and can't get them. According to the CDC, they shouldn't be worn by gen pop anyway as they provide little more than a false sense of security. They don't really do much for the general population in regards to protection as it is not an airborne virus.2 -
spiriteagle99 wrote: »I noticed a small sign at the entrance of our small local grocery that said that advertised prices in the sales flyer would not be honored. Those flyers are made up months in advance, so I can understand that the sales items might not be available now, but I agree they should honor the prices if the flyers were mailed out to customers or if the price is on the shelf. I haven't checked our usual grocery store (a big chain) to see if they are honoring their sales prices.
This is making me mad, I usually choose which store to shop at based on sales. If there's ever a time money is tight it's now.1 -
In thinking about grocery stores' current pricing policies, I think it's reasonable to consider their business model.
Their usual way of making money is to make very small amounts of money on each item, but have very high volume via turnover rates. The sale flyers are partly "loss leaders", i.e., things that are being sold at/below cost to pull people into the store. In normal times, grocery stores' profit margin (percentage markup on full cost of each item) is often in the 1%-3% range. (Note that product cost to them includes not only the money they pay the supplier, but also an allocated portion of the costs of staff, store lease, facility maintenance, etc., so this is 1%-3% on that total cost.)
In the current situation, they certainly are still selling at volume. In fact, it's so much volume that many of them have been adding staff (increasing the base of costs that must be allocated across pricing of items), and the decent, responsible ones are increasing hourly wages for their staffs in recognition of those staffs' health risks and stress (also increasing the costs that must be allocated across the products).
Perhaps we might want them to cut profits further, even to zero, but we don't want them to go out of business . . . right?
None of this justifies price gouging - big increases in costs that the grocery store might apply, even though their per-unit acquisition cost or staff/facilities cost has not increased that much.
Store chains are very, very good at tracking costs and prices and making adjustments. It's automated, on pretty massive scales, because there are literally tens of thousands of products in a typical store. It's not normally some dude in a back room cynically deciding to lay on big markups "just because they can".
I'm not saying that's never happening, not at all. But I think it's rational to expect some price increases, both because stores may be paying distributors incrementally more for certain high-demand products**, and because the stores' increasing staffing costs (including the extra cleaning crews and such) need to be recouped, too.
** Manufacturing costs for certain high-demand products will have increased as manufacturers may have put workers on overtime, may have to reduce number of manufacturing employees in the facility at the same time to maintain social distancing, maybe bought more machines, may have to pay more for their materials inputs in some cases for demand or transport reasons, etc.
Again, none of this justifies price-gouging, cynical profiteering ($89 toilet paper or whatever). But I think it's important to think of this as a system, one that's under stress in various ways. Pricing will unavoidably reflect that, to some extent, even where companies are behaving decently and responsibly.6 -
spiriteagle99 wrote: »I noticed a small sign at the entrance of our small local grocery that said that advertised prices in the sales flyer would not be honored. Those flyers are made up months in advance, so I can understand that the sales items might not be available now, but I agree they should honor the prices if the flyers were mailed out to customers or if the price is on the shelf. I haven't checked our usual grocery store (a big chain) to see if they are honoring their sales prices.
This is making me mad, I usually choose which store to shop at based on sales. If there's ever a time money is tight it's now.
EXactly my thinking. It'd be different if their website mentioned it, or FB or signs in the store, but no mention of not honoring the sales flyer whatsoever. I did notice they had pulled all flyers out of the store though. *sigh*0 -
I was in a Mex mkt today which was the 1st place I've seen w/tp and bleach since this crisis started and they were definitely price gouging by asking $1 25/roll of tp and $3.29/qt of bleach.
I have a lot of both and didn't buy any there butcwould have it I needed some because it's so hard to find any elsewhere.0 -
spiriteagle99 wrote: »I noticed a small sign at the entrance of our small local grocery that said that advertised prices in the sales flyer would not be honored. Those flyers are made up months in advance, so I can understand that the sales items might not be available now, but I agree they should honor the prices if the flyers were mailed out to customers or if the price is on the shelf. I haven't checked our usual grocery store (a big chain) to see if they are honoring their sales prices.
This is making me mad, I usually choose which store to shop at based on sales. If there's ever a time money is tight it's now.
Yes, I always decide whether to go to Shaw's or Stop & Shop based on their flyers. Market Basket is further away but has great prices, selection, and leadership so I get staples there.0 -
fluffygoodas wrote: »AliNouveau wrote: »fluffygoodas wrote: »Happening in Canada too. Very sneakily too. Normal sale prices higher, or no sales at all, yesterday a high end supermarket got dragged on the news for selling lysol wipes for $29.99. Rationed grocery too. 2 items each for food, 1 paper product. For a large family like mine, i have never spent more money on essentials. Very frustrating given what we are facing.
This store is like 4 blocks from my house. The mark up there is amazing so some on out community Facebook group were just like what's new? I suspect if its name is dragged through the media much more it will have another "accidental" fire. It's a beautiful store and has some neat stuff but it's really not worth it. Can get the same at No Frills for and eighth of the price
Yup, I can't believe some people actually bought the wipes for $30!!!
At that store it's not a surprise. They typically aren't comparison shoppers. It's a lively store to go wander in0 -
I imagine some stores are paying workers overtime so they have to make up for this somewhere. I haven’t noticed drastically higher prices on anything around here. I see nothing wrong with stores eliminating sales or charging a bit more. Price gouging is what we see with hand sanitizer where they are selling a $3 bottle for $50 online.2
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I've paid WAY more than MSRP for certain things (mostly non-food) just 2 get them in case I couldn't find them elsewhere which, in certain cases, is what happened.
Just bought 12# of popcorn kernals online at a fair price because it wasa bulk purchase because I couldn"t find any 1# bags of popcorn that I usually buy in any of the stores or at a reasonable price online.
I also paid more than normal for some dried apricots, hummus mix and crystalized ginger that I bought online, which I usually buy in bulk for cheap out of open bins in my local mkt but all mkts w/such bins have roped them off because of the Covid-19 crisis.
Then there were the N95 masks, gallon jugs of 70 & 99% alcohol, vacuum sealer rolls and plastic wrap that I overpaid for because you can't find masks or alcohol anywhere and because Costco, where I normally buy the vacuum sealer rolls and plastic wrap, because their stores are so mobbed that it was worth the extra $ paid just to avoid the time/hassle trying to get them there
So, was this price gouging? Perhaps but no one twisted my arm to pay the prices asked and I needed what I got and I got what I paid for. So, like it or not, I just call it capitslism.
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I've paid WAY more than MSRP for certain things (mostly non-food) just 2 get them in case I couldn't find them elsewhere which, in certain cases, is what happened.
Just bought 12# of popcorn kernals online at a fair price because it wasa bulk purchase because I couldn"t find any 1# bags of popcorn that I usually buy in any of the stores or at a reasonable price online.
I also paid more than normal for some dried apricots, hummus mix and crystalized ginger that I bought online, which I usually buy in bulk for cheap out of open bins in my local mkt but all mkts w/such bins have roped them off because of the Covid-19 crisis.
Then there were the N95 masks, gallon jugs of 70 & 99% alcohol, vacuum sealer rolls and plastic wrap that I overpaid for because you can't find masks or alcohol anywhere and because Costco, where I normally buy the vacuum sealer rolls and plastic wrap, because their stores are so mobbed that it was worth the extra $ paid just to avoid the time/hassle trying to get them there
So, was this price gouging? Perhaps but no one twisted my arm to pay the prices asked and I needed what I got and I got what I paid for. So, like it or not, I just call it capitslism.
No, because people panic bought these items, many of us medical personnel are having trouble getting it for our jobs.... I'm out...8 -
psychod787 wrote: »[No, because people panic bought these items, many of us medical personnel are having trouble getting it for our jobs.... I'm out...
I bought these from online vendors who were not offering 2 give them to anyone.
I bought 10 masks at $15 each and the 99% alcohol for $80 and the 70% for $60. Few ppl would be willing to pay such prices but I felt that I had to because these have to last me for the duration of the crisis and because you can't buy these things anywhere now.
The early admonition to not wear masks is chging from you don't need them to @one should wear them all the time when out in public and/or caring for the ill .
While there are people hoarding them, I am not one of them. I need them for my own protection. What little I have is a drop in the bucket and will not help to fight this crisis but if I do not have them my health and the heslth of others could be jeapordized.
So, if you want to BLAME anyone for the lack of masks and other PPE blame the Fed & state govts who failed to heed/take proper action to prevent the spread of the virus and to properly mfg, stockpile and distribute PPE once it became apparent they would be needed.
EOM.
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Price gouging laws are the classic way to get shortages.2
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Price gouging laws are the classic way to get shortages.
Shortages occur when demand exceeds supply (regardless of the reason, hoarding or otherwise) .
"Price gouging' is a an "ethically" ladened term which implies that "greedy" people are overcharging for a product that people need in order to maximize their profit w/o sympathy or regard for the need of people who cannot afford the price asked
So,prrice gouging (which people consider despicable and which in certain cases is illegal) is not the cause of shortages but is, in fact, an undesireable consequence of serious product shortages, such as those that we are experiencing now.1 -
psychod787 wrote: »[No, because people panic bought these items, many of us medical personnel are having trouble getting it for our jobs.... I'm out...
I bought these from online vendors who were not offering 2 give them to anyone.
I bought 10 masks at $15 each and the 99% alcohol for $80 and the 70% for $60. Few ppl would be willing to pay such prices but I felt that I had to because these have to last me for the duration of the crisis and because you can't buy these things anywhere now.
The early admonition to not wear masks is chging from you don't need them to @one should wear them all the time when out in public and/or caring for the ill .
While there are people hoarding them, I am not one of them. I need them for my own protection. What little I have is a drop in the bucket and will not help to fight this crisis but if I do not have them my health and the heslth of others could be jeapordized.
So, if you want to BLAME anyone for the lack of masks and other PPE blame the Fed & state govts who failed to heed/take proper action to prevent the spread of the virus and to properly mfg, stockpile and distribute PPE once it became apparent they would be needed.
EOM.
I dont blame anyone in particular. PPE should only really be used on the outside by people who have comorbidities. If you dont, stay away from folks if you can, wash your damn hands, and try and ride this out. I have just had people freak out when I am having to use the same n95 for multiple patients. Let's be honest, not many people in government took this seriously and many companies did not either. Hoarding medical supplies helps no one....3 -
Price gouging laws are the classic way to get shortages.
Shortages occur when demand exceeds supply (regardless of the reason, hoarding or otherwise) .
"Price gouging' is a an "ethically" ladened term which implies that "greedy" people are overcharging for a product that people need in order to maximize their profit w/o sympathy or regard for the need of people who cannot afford the price asked
So,prrice gouging (which people consider despicable and which in certain cases is illegal) is not the cause of shortages but is, in fact, an undesireable consequence of serious product shortages, such as those that we are experiencing now.
"Price gouging" is not the cause of shortages. Price gouging laws often are. See also: rent control.
http://economics.fundamentalfinance.com/price-ceiling.php2 -
OP here and I feel better about my local store now.
They finally sent emails to all who are signed up with them, explaining their reasoning and the way it works regarding sales flyers, prices, etc., during this time. If they'd only done it earlier but then I'm sure they're overly swamped as everyone else is. Our other store, more of a chain store, still supports their sales flyers but it's different because of the size of their operations. My local store only has 3 family run places. 1
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