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Great bodies and attractiveness or Money and success catch our eye?
ninerbuff
Posts: 49,024 Member
So I had this discussion with a friend on FB messenger about why someone may catch your eye. I stated it was due to human instinct and that a fit body and attractiveness does because instinctively having a mate that looks healthy and is good looking enough to attract, gives higher percentage of having offspring that can do the same and carry the genes on down the line.
He stated that it may have been that way, but today it's more about status (money and success) than what I stated. He said someone could be butt ugly, but if they are rich, they can get surgery to fix that and same with the body.
Had a good point, but NOT everyone gets to hook up with a rich person and that the average person still sticks to what I stated above.
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He stated that it may have been that way, but today it's more about status (money and success) than what I stated. He said someone could be butt ugly, but if they are rich, they can get surgery to fix that and same with the body.
Had a good point, but NOT everyone gets to hook up with a rich person and that the average person still sticks to what I stated above.
A.C.E. Certified Personal and Group Fitness Trainer
IDEA Fitness member
Kickboxing Certified Instructor
Been in fitness for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition
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Replies
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I think different people value different things. That is, I think most people value attractiveness, but different things can make us feel that someone is attractive/appealing.
I think we all know at least one couple where one of them seems much more objectively attractive than the other, yet they're both really into each other. The stereotypical case of the funny guy who is able to attract more attractive mates than his appearance would indicate is a good example. For some women, personality seems to go a really long way in making someone more attractive (and I'm sure for some men too).
And it sure doesn't seem like billionaires and powerful men lack for attractive company, although I question whether or not that is an actual physical response from these women or something more . . .pragmatic.
I'm probably a bit biased here because I married for personality, chemistry, and attraction (my husband is a freelance artist and musician who was living with his mom when I met him
). I don't think power and money could make up for the pleasures of marrying for other things . . . but then if I was a person who was attracted to money and power, I'd likely be happy with the end result there too, because I'd be a different person and I'd feel attraction and chemistry when he made millions on shorting stock or assuring passage of major legislation or won an Oscar.
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I’m attracted to looks, intelligence, and personality.
I couldnt care less about money.
I think most men value looks above all else.7 -
Treating this as a binary proposition overlooks how the two criteria are linked. There are studies that prove that more attractive people are generally more materially successful while being more materially successful allows one to enhance their appearance due to their means.14
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I agree, attractiveness is definitely what catches your eye and it's instinct. However, Success and money catch your attention, it's more cerebral and our reaction may even be negative3
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I'm biased as well. To me health and attractiveness are my first attention getters. And I will usually always take the person who is concerned about health over someone more attractive or financially stable. I've really never been a material person and don't need a big house or even a house. I could easily live in a motorhome and not blink twice. But I've always believed that a healthy person always had more to offer with me than someone with great looks or money.janejellyroll wrote: »I think different people value different things. That is, I think most people value attractiveness, but different things can make us feel that someone is attractive/appealing.
I think we all know at least one couple where one of them seems much more objectively attractive than the other, yet they're both really into each other. The stereotypical case of the funny guy who is able to attract more attractive mates than his appearance would indicate is a good example. For some women, personality seems to go a really long way in making someone more attractive (and I'm sure for some men too).
And it sure doesn't seem like billionaires and powerful men lack for attractive company, although I question whether or not that is an actual physical response from these women or something more . . .pragmatic.
I'm probably a bit biased here because I married for personality, chemistry, and attraction (my husband is a freelance artist and musician who was living with his mom when I met him ). I don't think power and money could make up for the pleasures of marrying for other things . . . but then if I was a person who was attracted to money and power, I'd likely be happy with the end result there too, because I'd be a different person and I'd feel attraction and chemistry when he made millions on shorting stock or assuring passage of major legislation or won an Oscar.
A.C.E. Certified Personal and Group Fitness Trainer
IDEA Fitness member
Kickboxing Certified Instructor
Been in fitness for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition
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Well, if you put 2 people side by side dressed in the same outfit, you'd have no idea which one was rich and successful and which one wasn't. However, you'd know right away which one you found more physically attractive/fit. I think our first instinct is to find someone attractive based on physical appearance alone, but that doesn't mean we'd continue to find them attractive after we get to know more about them.
I'm not one into finding power, money and success as attractive, but rather someone who is intelligent and driven (which may very well lead to money and success). Someone who is a freeloader, "lazy" and has no real goals in life is a turn-off, even if he is physically "hot." It really is a combination of traits after finding someone initially attractive that determines whether or not I'd continue to be attracted to him. Conversely, I may not find someone so physically fit/attractive initially, but after getting to know him, his qualities and values may make him more attractive to me.7 -
A happy disposition/bright outlook, to me, makes a person much more attractive than any other physical attribute.
And money was never a deciding factor for me unless the person was a freeloader.5 -
Technically speaking he's saying wealth -> physical attractiveness -> attraction rather than wealth -> attraction, so he agrees with you that attraction is primarily physical just that it can be influenced by wealth.(...) He stated that it may have been that way, but today it's more about status (money and success) than what I stated. He said someone could be butt ugly, but if they are rich, they can get surgery to fix that and same with the body. Had a good point, but NOT everyone gets to hook up with a rich person and that the average person still sticks to what I stated above.
IIRC, there is correlation between wealth and physical attractiveness. Not sure about causation. Personally, I can't say that health is what I'm attracted to in a woman but it's definitely not wealth either. Let's say vibe.2 -
In earlier centuries and in various cultures, being plump was considered attractive. It was also a sign of wealth because you could afford a plentiful amount of food, and it was somewhat indicative of health because you weren't at risk of dying from starvation. Of course, things that certainly aren't "healthy" or "natural" have also been considered attractive over human history - think foot-binding in China, the extremes corsets were taken to, risky aesthetic plastic surgery in the 19th century. These things were primarily accessible to and done by people with money. The two have very much been tied together throughout human history. Certain physical appearances can indicate wealth, and wealth can help a person attain a desirable physical appearance.
From a first glance, I know if I find a person aesthetically pleasing, but I also acknowledge that it's deeply rooted in the media I see around me everywhere. Currently, women being fit with a bit of muscle definition is desirable, but would you have found a muscular (or Serena kind of thicc) woman as attractive back in the 90s when the Kate Moss heroin chic trend was plastering the covers of magazines? If a woman with a great body showed up in full 80s hair, makeup, and clothing, would you take as much interest as if she were styled in today's fashion? For men, more and more muscle has been on trend; today's idolized stars look nothing like the skinny long-haired rockers of the 80s or the trim, suited Rat Pack of the 60s. And this is without getting into different cultures; what's widely considered attractive in America is not the same as Argentina, Zimbabwe, or Thailand.
Idk, I personally am attracted to people that I admire for their personality and enjoy the company of, and if there happens to be abs or a sizeable bank account involved, that's nice I guess.4 -
I'm pretty atypical in a lot of ways.
I'm interested in people who are:
Kind/Caring
Honest
Funny/Easy going
Responsible
Hard working
Hold similar views to me
Looks are not a big criteria, although it certainly isn't a negative. Having lots of money doesn't often mesh with the above characteristics, so they would start off at a disadvantage in my eyes.4 -
Neither, really, personally.
Back when the topic used to interest me - I'm now a conscientious objector to the whole scene - there was a certain look that I found superficially attractive physically, but it wasn't really culturally mainstream "good looking" at the time, I think. Even then, what mattered more, for wanting to spend time with someone, was what kind of thinking revealed itself when they started talking. For example, I was attracted physically to my late husband right there at first (partly look, partly manner), but it wouldn't have lasted for weeks, let alone decades, if he hadn't been intelligent, curious, kind, high-integrity, and some other things along those lines.
Intelligence and character are the biggies, for me. It could override looks, if I got to know the person for some other reason than physical attraction initially.
If I were shopping now, I don't see why that would've changed, and that tendency might even have increased since my youth. Probably it would be more important to me now that someone be at least reasonably active and healthy, but in my demographic (I'm 65), anything other than that is heading somewhere worse at a pretty good rate, soon, commonly. I think it's cheesy to break up with someone, in an established relationship, if their health goes South . . . but at my age, knowingly starting down that road is a different matter, and I don't think it's cheesy to consider it at the outset.
I've pretty much always wanted to be in a position financially by myself (not wealth, but adequacy), so that I didn't need to let economic considerations overweigh more important things in friendships or partnerships. I've seen waaay too many cases of women who couldn't figure a route to leave someone who treated them poorly because of economic impact: I didn't want to be looking for the classic "good provider" as a key criterion; I'd rather be able to provide for myself.
So, I'd avoid someone who seemed to be a catfisher/leech looking for support, but don't have any particular attraction to wealth. To the extent that there can be a statistical correlation with various flavors of things like arrogance, wealth might even be a caution flag. 🤷♀️
I'd rather be happy than normal. 😉
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I'm in the neither/both boat. Obviously initial attraction is based purely on looks, but this is attraction only - doesn't mean I want to forge a relationship with you, just that my chemicals are reacting. If I were then to speak to them and find they were completely unambitious, unintelligent and (likely to remain) unsuccessful, I would have zero interest and my attraction would fade. Alternately, if I wasn't overly interested in someone, but spoke to them and found they were successful and ambitious in a way that would suit me and the life I want to live, it would peak my interest.
That said, while I spoke in the present tense, I have been happily married for many years to a man blessed with great looks AND a fabulous personality AND reasonable levels of success/ambition, and am excessively lucky.0 -
bold_rabbit wrote: »I'm pretty atypical in a lot of ways.
I'm interested in people who are:
Kind/Caring
Honest
Funny/Easy going
Responsible
Hard working
Hold similar views to me
I think this is how most people really feel when you get down to brass racks.1 -
bold_rabbit wrote: »I'm pretty atypical in a lot of ways.
I'm interested in people who are:
Kind/Caring
Honest
Funny/Easy going
Responsible
Hard working
Hold similar views to me
Looks are not a big criteria, although it certainly isn't a negative. Having lots of money doesn't often mesh with the above characteristics, so they would start off at a disadvantage in my eyes.
I am not convinced this is atypical.
Sure, most of us get our heads turned by a pretty/handsome face, but when it comes to deciding who to build a life with, many of have expectations beyond "good looking" and/or "successful."
We're looking at how they treat us, how they treat other people, whether their goals are the same as ours, how we enjoy time together, what we think it will be like to share domestic space and financials with them, etc.
If mating was simply a matter of finding the most beautiful and/or successful person who was willing to be with us, it would probably be a lot more straight forward.
Assuming you could somehow access someone's internal scale of attractiveness, I'm guessing that we'd find that many of us didn't "settle down" with the most attractive person we've ever dated. Why? Well, sometimes things didn't work out with that "most attractive" person and they were the one to break it off. But I'm guessing we'd find other people who moved on because they realized that attractiveness (whether that is measured physically or through money/success) isn't enough, there have to be other qualities to truly sustain a relationship.
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It’s not a question of whether women want this and men want that, as it’s completely unique for each individual person. I think attraction leans more towards trends and personal experiences more so than biology. It’s still an interesting topic though!
At one point I wasn’t as intrigued by appearance as I was by attitude so I dated someone who had the room laughing. As I changed over time appearance became more important for awhile until it became boring. Later, it was someone who made life feel effortless and brought out the positive aspects of life no matter what. Some people stick to 1 type, others don’t have a type and change as they grow. I think who we choose is as diverse as our food preferences. Little MFP relevance for ya 😊1 -
To me, it's a matter of degrees. Healthy is attractive. But a man who obsessively spends hours upon hours in the gym and spends a good portion of that time gazing at his perfect-form reps in a mirror? Not interested. Conversely, not interested in a guy who weighs 22 stone and spends his days in front of the TV eating take-away. Same goes for money. A man with drive is definitely admirable. However, if money and status are his life obsessions, pass. Lack of money after a certain age is also very unattractive.
I can't say that either money or looks is the first thing that attracts me to a man. Those things are 'oh-by-the-way' considerations after I take a liking to his personality.1 -
I don't even know how to tell if a person is rich or not at first glance! I have dated or been attracted to men who weren't considered attractive by society's standards...simply because of their sense of humor. Someone with an awesome sense of witty and goofy humor will always be attractive to me regardless of their money or looks🙃2
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What happened to personal compatibility, intelligence, values, and communication? Those far outweigh Prince Charming looks and back when my friends and I got married, none of us had any money!3
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I'm inclined to say neither unless "catch your eye" is being taken very literal, and we're talking about people we have no information on other than a single glance, in which case it would be attractiveness and their facial expression. I generally find smiling people more attractive, but there are obviously situations in which that would be off-putting, and I might find a thoughtful expression or even a frown/anger attractive, depending on what's going on around us. Someone laughing at bullying isn't going to attract me.2
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On OP's original point of what "catches our eye" and if money/status may be it - I notice yoy referred to yor friend as "he". Funnily enough, I have only ever heard the theory that "people" are attracted to the rich, espoused by men, and by people they tend to mean women. Does your friend think men nowadays are attracted to women with power and status vs looks? If not, then there seems to be a lot of internalised mysoginy behind his view (not saying he himself is a mysoginist person per se - not enough data).
For everyone saying that one can't see at a glance who is wealthy vs who is not if they are dressed the same - I used to think so but I noticed with time that poverty ages badly as a whole
Later in life, there seems to often be a difference - not universal but the wealthier tend to have better skin, teeth, bodies, posture etc. as they age. I think that's partly because of the money they can spend to care for themselves but also because of all the negative factors like stress which they have much less of. It makes me sad because it's just one more sign of how inequality breeds inequality
That still does not make them more attractive in itself. I hink attractiveness is a combination of looks and attitude, i.e. does the persone look like they would behave a certain way? Make us feel a certain way? Whatever that looks like for each of us.3 -
Cost of taking care of oneself is big business. Not only in the fitness industry but plastic surgery and other products themselves, especially for women. Which is a good point you brought up about how inequality of this may be a sign of people who may earn much less.Wiseandcurious wrote: »For everyone saying that one can't see at a glance who is wealthy vs who is not if they are dressed the same - I used to think so but I noticed with time that poverty ages badly as a whole Later in life, there seems to often be a difference - not universal but the wealthier tend to have better skin, teeth, bodies, posture etc. as they age. I think that's partly because of the money they can spend to care for themselves but also because of all the negative factors like stress which they have much less of. It makes me sad because it's just one more sign of how inequality breeds inequality
And this may bring up the point of the inequality of how genders are looked at in this too. In Hollywood, female actors over a certain age (I believe it's 45) tend to lose roles to younger ones. I don't think the same criteria is applied to males as much.
Now for me female actors like Salma Hayek, Marissa Tomei, and Jennifer Connelly still catch my eye.
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Wiseandcurious wrote: »On OP's original point of what "catches our eye" and if money/status may be it - I notice yoy referred to yor friend as "he". Funnily enough, I have only ever heard the theory that "people" are attracted to the rich, espoused by men, and by people they tend to mean women. Does your friend think men nowadays are attracted to women with power and status vs looks? If not, then there seems to be a lot of internalised mysoginy behind his view (not saying he himself is a mysoginist person per se - not enough data).
I have noticed an anecdotal correlation between people who insist that women specifically are mainly attracted to power and money and people who have some, let's say, vivid views on women in general.7 -
But that could be from what they are experiencing? And I know of guys (gym dudes) who want a "sugar momma" with no intention of staying monogamous. But then that's not a compatible relationship.janejellyroll wrote: »Wiseandcurious wrote: »On OP's original point of what "catches our eye" and if money/status may be it - I notice yoy referred to yor friend as "he". Funnily enough, I have only ever heard the theory that "people" are attracted to the rich, espoused by men, and by people they tend to mean women. Does your friend think men nowadays are attracted to women with power and status vs looks? If not, then there seems to be a lot of internalised mysoginy behind his view (not saying he himself is a mysoginist person per se - not enough data).
I have noticed an anecdotal correlation between people who insist that women specifically are mainly attracted to power and money and people who have some, let's say, vivid views on women in general.
A.C.E. Certified Personal and Group Fitness Trainer
IDEA Fitness member
Kickboxing Certified Instructor
Been in fitness for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition
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Honestly, if they look like money I'm going to avoid them...the ones that have money and don't feel compelled to flaunt it are typically better human beings...looks are ok for catching the eye initially, but for holding it, brains and the ability to be articulate are at the top of the list...life is too short to waste on people who can't hold a good conversation, the topic is somewhat irrelevant if you can communicate clearly and effectively.3
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But that could be from what they are experiencing? And I know of guys (gym dudes) who want a "sugar momma" with no intention of staying monogamous. But then that's not a compatible relationship.janejellyroll wrote: »Wiseandcurious wrote: »On OP's original point of what "catches our eye" and if money/status may be it - I notice yoy referred to yor friend as "he". Funnily enough, I have only ever heard the theory that "people" are attracted to the rich, espoused by men, and by people they tend to mean women. Does your friend think men nowadays are attracted to women with power and status vs looks? If not, then there seems to be a lot of internalised mysoginy behind his view (not saying he himself is a mysoginist person per se - not enough data).
I have noticed an anecdotal correlation between people who insist that women specifically are mainly attracted to power and money and people who have some, let's say, vivid views on women in general.
A.C.E. Certified Personal and Group Fitness Trainer
IDEA Fitness member
Kickboxing Certified Instructor
Been in fitness for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition
It reminds me of the “nice guys finish last” attitude that some guys use to cover up the fact that maybe it’s just them and they’re probably not as nice as they think they are.
Perspective and experience can be one in the same if you’re not careful.7 -
bold_rabbit wrote: »I'm pretty atypical in a lot of ways.
I'm interested in people who are:
Kind/Caring
Honest
Funny/Easy going
Responsible
Hard working
Hold similar views to me
Looks are not a big criteria, although it certainly isn't a negative. Having lots of money doesn't often mesh with the above characteristics, so they would start off at a disadvantage in my eyes.
All reasonable, but those are mostly traits that you have to discover over time about a person. The debate the OP brought up was more about initial impressions than longer term ones.0 -
But that could be from what they are experiencing? And I know of guys (gym dudes) who want a "sugar momma" with no intention of staying monogamous. But then that's not a compatible relationship.janejellyroll wrote: »Wiseandcurious wrote: »On OP's original point of what "catches our eye" and if money/status may be it - I notice yoy referred to yor friend as "he". Funnily enough, I have only ever heard the theory that "people" are attracted to the rich, espoused by men, and by people they tend to mean women. Does your friend think men nowadays are attracted to women with power and status vs looks? If not, then there seems to be a lot of internalised mysoginy behind his view (not saying he himself is a mysoginist person per se - not enough data).
I have noticed an anecdotal correlation between people who insist that women specifically are mainly attracted to power and money and people who have some, let's say, vivid views on women in general.
A.C.E. Certified Personal and Group Fitness Trainer
IDEA Fitness member
Kickboxing Certified Instructor
Been in fitness for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition
Well, that depends. It's conceivable that a financially successful woman might want a buff boy-toy/arm-candy type, and be fairly clear-eyed about what she's getting. I don't think that's a healthy relationship, but that's a value judgement. If the couple's goals align, it's "a compatible relationship", if you ask me.
It's not super unusual, IMO, for successful men to buy an equivalent thing in women (toy/arm-candy), though willingness to look the other way about non-monogamy might differ, in common cases.
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A happy disposition/bright outlook, to me, makes a person much more attractive than any other physical attribute.
And money was never a deciding factor for me unless the person was a freeloader.
My son takes after my wife and I take after my Dad, unfortunately, at times. I'm the natural dark and brooding type. I also can be hot tempered (though I control it well) and negative. My son is pleasant, even-keeled and never swears. And he's hysterical as well. My wife often kids me I need to be more like him.
I agree with you 100%. Even an average looking man, with the right disposition, sense of humor and demeanor, is something to stive for. Calm, even under pressure, is a very enviable trait to me.0 -
IMO, I think people who are pretty rich have a tendency to stray more because they may feel financially they don't have to worry if their relationship goes sour? I don't know. I've never been rich. However I've hung out with rich friends who took me to Asian massage parlors and those friends were married.
But that could be from what they are experiencing? And I know of guys (gym dudes) who want a "sugar momma" with no intention of staying monogamous. But then that's not a compatible relationship.janejellyroll wrote: »Wiseandcurious wrote: »On OP's original point of what "catches our eye" and if money/status may be it - I notice yoy referred to yor friend as "he". Funnily enough, I have only ever heard the theory that "people" are attracted to the rich, espoused by men, and by people they tend to mean women. Does your friend think men nowadays are attracted to women with power and status vs looks? If not, then there seems to be a lot of internalised mysoginy behind his view (not saying he himself is a mysoginist person per se - not enough data).
I have noticed an anecdotal correlation between people who insist that women specifically are mainly attracted to power and money and people who have some, let's say, vivid views on women in general.
A.C.E. Certified Personal and Group Fitness Trainer
IDEA Fitness member
Kickboxing Certified Instructor
Been in fitness for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition
Well, that depends. It's conceivable that a financially successful woman might want a buff boy-toy/arm-candy type, and be fairly clear-eyed about what she's getting. I don't think that's a healthy relationship, but that's a value judgement. If the couple's goals align, it's "a compatible relationship", if you ask me.
It's not super unusual, IMO, for successful men to buy an equivalent thing in women (toy/arm-candy), though willingness to look the other way about non-monogamy might differ, in common cases.
A.C.E. Certified Personal and Group Fitness Trainer
IDEA Fitness member
Kickboxing Certified Instructor
Been in fitness for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition
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I had that exact dilemma in my mid 20’s. A young hot guy and his wealthy boss were both hitting on me at an event. I danced with both of them. The boss was older too. I really liked the younger guy and had more in common with him because of age but also really attracted physically. I’m glad I picked him, we had a relationship for several years. I found out the boss was married! There was the added age difference though too. Now I’d probably pick money though, assuming he was single and had a good personality. Security is more important than looks as you get older. In both cases though, you have to be careful because both really good looking guys and super rich are usually players and not very loyal.0
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