What Was Your Work Out Today?

nossmf wrote: »

Another session on the elliptical, 1 hour hills. HR definitely got above 150 today, so perhaps I just was concentrating on pushing through the other day and missed seeing it on the display (the post-workout readout shows only the average HR, not max).

Speaking as a dyed in the wool (angora? ) cardio bunny , and one who's done a fair amount of well-metered cardio (rowing machine with watts, pace, spm, time, distance) HR can differ kind of weirdly on different days with very close to the same stimulus, IME. Rest, hydration, other stress, fueling, ambient temperature, . . . who knows? So, maybe you missed it on the display, maybe you just had a different day?

Spent an hour on the treadmill doing steep incline hills.

Started thinking about how much and what type of cardio I'll do when I can resume lifting next month. I'll still want to keep my workouts to an hour tops each day, and lifting days range from 45 minutes to an hour by themselves, meaning I'll likely only do cardio twice per week on their own day (plus 4 days of lifting plus one day off). The simple answer is to do the same hour-long sessions I've worked up towards for treadmill and elliptical, once each per week. But I wonder if I'll need to back off in intensity somewhat if I'm doing them less often, or if I'll be able to keep on trucking on account of being "well rested" from the last cardio day.

Another day of rehab lifting for my elbow, still no pain, so still on schedule. Which is a good thing, as my knee is starting to be grumpy. Before I started lifting years ago I had severe pain in my knee, but when I began lifting the pain disappeared completely. Whenever I took a break of more than a couple weeks between leg days the pain would start to creep back, reminding me I cannot ignore leg day. It's now been 3+ months since my last leg day and the pain is only now starting to return, probably on account of my legs remaining quite active from all the cardio, but it's not the same as lifting and my knee is starting to become aware of this. I know one or more people on here will likely recommend trying rowing (at least one already has) citing the similar motion for legs to squats, but I'm leery. I've tried rowing machines before as warmups before lifting sessions, and was totally spent after just a few minutes, well short of long enough to get any significant calorie burn. Maybe I was just pushing too hard out the gate.

nossmf wrote: »

Spent an hour on the treadmill doing steep incline hills.

Started thinking about how much and what type of cardio I'll do when I can resume lifting next month. I'll still want to keep my workouts to an hour tops each day, and lifting days range from 45 minutes to an hour by themselves, meaning I'll likely only do cardio twice per week on their own day (plus 4 days of lifting plus one day off). The simple answer is to do the same hour-long sessions I've worked up towards for treadmill and elliptical, once each per week. But I wonder if I'll need to back off in intensity somewhat if I'm doing them less often, or if I'll be able to keep on trucking on account of being "well rested" from the last cardio day.

Another day of rehab lifting for my elbow, still no pain, so still on schedule. Which is a good thing, as my knee is starting to be grumpy. Before I started lifting years ago I had severe pain in my knee, but when I began lifting the pain disappeared completely. Whenever I took a break of more than a couple weeks between leg days the pain would start to creep back, reminding me I cannot ignore leg day. It's now been 3+ months since my last leg day and the pain is only now starting to return, probably on account of my legs remaining quite active from all the cardio, but it's not the same as lifting and my knee is starting to become aware of this. I know one or more people on here will likely recommend trying rowing (at least one already has) citing the similar motion for legs to squats, but I'm leery. I've tried rowing machines before as warmups before lifting sessions, and was totally spent after just a few minutes, well short of long enough to get any significant calorie burn. Maybe I was just pushing too hard out the gate.

If it were me, I'd consider mixing up the cardio, some more slow and steady, some more intense - different stimuli, maybe better-rounded results. (No, I don't follow my own advice, especially in Winter. I under-do intensity especially during off-season, go for more base.)

What level of rowing coaching and instruction have you had? TBH, I don't much encourage people to start rowing if they don't have good coaching unless it really, really appeals to them, because it's harder to learn on one's own, even though a few people like Mike seem to do OK with that in the long run. It's a little more technical than some other forms of cardio (and yes, can be more intense than some).

I'm hopeful that your rowing warm-ups (if using Concept 2 type rowers) don't involve setting the damper on 10 and going for 30+ spm. That's exhausting, but doesn't maximize fitness benefits or calorie burn. I always advise people to start at low spm, teens even, mid-20s at most, and focus on good technique. That's an investment in being able to get arbitrarily intense workouts in the long run, if you want them.

It's possible to get a reasonably intense workout in the teens spm at mid-range damper settings (3-5 for women, maybe 4-6 for men). If a person can't find any intensity at that slow pace, there's a technique issue, or multiples of them.

Most of rowing's power comes from legs (like 60%), but it's not unusual for people with strong legs to fire all of the body parts at once (instead of the legs, body, arms sequence on the drive; the reverse - arms, body, legs - on the recovery). If hands and knees are competing for the same space at the same time on the drive or recovery, that's one sign. (Legs should be close to flat before hands arrive in the knee zone, drive or recovery - no hands hopping up vertically to miss knees.) Spine stays straight, arms are cables at start of drive, connecting handle to feet through lats and other parts of core/back.

Also common among people with strong upper body is over-using the upper body, and using arms too soon. Body swing, then arms, and more about engaging between the shoulder blades and accelerating the arms, i.e., not raising the shoulders, more like relaxing them. There's a little bit of a (gentle) snap to the arms part of the drive, to get that acceleration.

Another common thing among strength folks' rowing is choppiness. The back end is called "the finish", but that was a term one of my on-water coaches hated. The stroke doesn't finish there - no mini-vacation. Some strong people do sort of push-yank-pause-recover. That lets the flywheel slow down, which costs pace but also lowers the effective resistance at the start of the next stroke. The arms away, body over sequence of the recovery should be a smooth continuation, around and away after the drive, happening at the same speed outward as the body/arms came in during the drive - quick. Then relax and let the slant of the slide and the tension in the system bring the next catch (start of drive) to you, no pulling on the foot-straps.

Strong people sometimes feel like the rowing machine moving across the floor - because their strokes are so strong - is a good sign. It's not. Some of that may be unavoidable, but it's power that didn't go into the flywheel - wasted. Any of the above can contribute to that, but probably the lack of smoothness around the ends is a biggie, i.e., not getting the smooth, quick transition from arms-in to arms-out, and/or slamming/jamming the start of legs on the drive rather than smooth power application.

Ugh, don't get me started. 🤣

First time back to the gym after being released to do strength training. I had gone back a few times to swim after being away after a couple years after COVID restrictions, then I couldn't do much for a few months. Felt good. I might go swim tomorrow.

swimmom_1 wrote: »

Elliptical HIIT setting 150 minutes for 10.06 miles. Mainly zone 2-4 but I had a maximum heart rate of 176!? Never had exceeded low zone 5 before and I felt fine today.

Now my heart rates are from the elliptical grips, which I know can be inaccurate, but 176? Thats like the max for a 45 yo not a 65 yo. I should probably invest in a chest monitor. It would be nice if it could plug into my elliptical. Does anyone know if there is one that plugs into a PreCor? As getting this used I have no manual. The place I got in from has a online manual available that I accessed early on to see how to use the different programs & how to program workouts.

@swimmom_1, as long as you felt OK - not faint, fluttery, weak, or anything like that - it can be OK, but of course check with your doctor if you're concerned.

The age formulas for HRmax are pretty approximate, can be surprisingly far off for a good-sized minority of the population. It's not so much fitness-influenced, but genetic . . . though I've read that people who are active as they age tend to retain a higher HRmax longer, vs. consistently inactive people experiencing more age-related decline from whatever their younger genetic baseline was.

I haven't retested lately, but when mine was sports-tested a few years back, HRmax was around 180-181 when it should've been lower (maybe 170ish). As far as I can tell now from rate of perceived exertion at various intensities and heart rates, I suspect it's still at least something near that.

At age 67, my HRmax "should be" 153, by 220-age, or 158-160 by a couple of other age-based estimating methods. I can get above 153 bpm and still talk, can even sustain intensity with HR>153 for several minutes, but it's getting into the "shorter phrases, can't sing" stage, which would be consistent with approaching the lower end of anaerobic threshold, about what I'd expect if HRmax is still around 180ish.

How do you feel as you get into your estimated Z4? IMO, Z4 should be getting toward the 7/8 kind of level on an 1-10 RPE scale, as an approximation in someone with some base fitness/endurance. (Below is an arbitrary pick of an RPE chart, one I think has decent descriptions, but I don't know much about the source site beyond thinking this is a decent chart.)



A chest belt is a nice thing to have, but even they will give a wonky reading now and then, especially likely if the batteries are getting old.

I'm sorry, I don't know whether any of them link to Precor machines. Some of the wrist HRMs do a pretty good job in exercises where there's not so much arm flex that the watch loses contact. That happens to me while rowing, but wrist-only usually does fine while walking or biking. Not sure about elliptical. Wahoo used to have some armband ones, I think still does, and perhaps there are others. Some HRMs will record your whole workout and link into an app for later review, or display immediate readout on phone or tablet, as an alternative if the Precor doesn't link.

swimmom_1 wrote: »

Elliptical HIIT setting 150 minutes for 10.06 miles. Mainly zone 2-4 but I had a maximum heart rate of 176!? Never had exceeded low zone 5 before and I felt fine today.

Now my heart rates are from the elliptical grips, which I know can be inaccurate, but 176? Thats like the max for a 45 yo not a 65 yo. I should probably invest in a chest monitor. It would be nice if it could plug into my elliptical. Does anyone know if there is one that plugs into a PreCor? As getting this used I have no manual. The place I got in from has a online manual available that I accessed early on to see how to use the different programs & how to program workouts.

I have had crazy data from those things. Like if I believed it, I might be scared. I have also had my Garmin device give me data that seems weird. My Garmin may or may not be picking up footfalls as heartbeats when walking. But I had it spiked a few times when I knew I was actually dialing it back to slow things down. My breath was not even taxed. Other times it says I have a low pulse when I can tell my ticker is TICKING. I've even stopped and taken pulse manually. Of course stopping changes things too.... So take the data you're seeing with a bit of salt, although do consider it might be something to pay some attention to.

My Garmin device doesn't give good pulse information when swimming. But I can tell if I'm really huffing and need a break to catch my breath. I try to avoid that and get a good steady pace. I chest HRM would be groovy. I probably won't get one though.

nossmf wrote: »

Wow, my very own @Annpt77 novel response! I'm honored you'd take this much time you try to educate me. Yep, I can see within your list of "don't do this" several ways in which I set myself up for failure, lol. It's been years since I last tried, so I don't recall every specific (such as resistance and strokes per minute...that acronym took me a minute to figure out), but the part about the hands moving up and over the knees very much struck a cord in my memory.

You've been helpful to me on some strength training issues, which I appreciate, @nossmf.

But, give me the slightest excuse to talk about rowing, and it's hard to stop me, sadly. On top of that, it's Winter, and my frustrated coaching impulses/education have nowhere to go. In season, I can aim my random musings at our club's novices in learn-to-row and beyond, vent the impulse that way.

Back in the pool today.

I put on my mask & snorkel and zoomer fins and swam 1550 yards, then took off the mask and fins and put on goggles and did 550 yards of breast. Felt good to be back in the water.

Funny - I had looked into the pool before I got dressed. All the lanes were full. I almost went upstairs to run around for a while. Instead I just went on out to the pool. By the time I got there, only one lane had a person in it. Three minutes or so in the steam room, then I got started. In five minutes, there was nobody in the pool but me. When I stopped to change gear, there were people waiting for lanes. I offered to share because that's what you're supposed to do. People decided just to wait. Had I come down and the lanes were full, I would have asked to share. If the person said no, I'd just have hopped in because that's how our pool works. It is so much nicer not to share, but if there's more people than lanes....

Feeling a little fatigued, and need to be psychologically/socially "on" tomorrow (challenging for an introvert like me, maybe). So, super-easy steady state, very relaxed, the 63 minutes stationary bike entirely undifferentiated at an even 84W average, nothing above Z2, peak at 123bpm (around 64% max, 55% reserve, total nothing-burger).

Tonight's bike ride blew past 4x the default 150 Garmin "intensity minutes" this week - 633 so far - so I think I'm OK overall.

Planning some of the strength-y-er physical therapy exercises before bed, plus the every day stretchy/massage-y ones. (I don't count these for calories or intensity minutes.)

Tomorrow, another "rep your rowing club, sell learn to row, meet the public" event. I'm womaning two shifts, 11:30-2:30 and 2:30-5:30. This is really fun, but requires me to be socially outgoing IRL, not my natural mode. The event is great, love it every year it happens, a big exhibition focusing on non-motorized outdoor activities, traditionally mostly canoeing/kayaking, but expanding in recent years to broader biking, hiking, camping, etc. Lectures, vendors, non-profit organizations, and more. This is the first non-virtual one since the pandemic shut-downs. I'm excited.

I'll probably do a few 500m pieces on the rowing machine, just to stay warm in the exhibition space and maybe generate conversation, but may not do any other workouts after (except PT) depending on how I feel. We're having a pretty big snow event today/tonight (6"+, maybe freezing rain?), so getting there could be interesting, too, even though it's close.

As predicted, simulating being outgoing - while in truth severely introverted - at the paddle/bike/camp/hike community event, and doing it on a poor night's sleep, was physically fatiguing, so no real workout today.

I did 5 x 500 meters on the rowing machine (widely time separated) during my 6-hour shift, fastest was for sure 2:11.9 pace, other around 2:13 plus or minus a second-ish, mostly around 28-30spm (faster spm than my usual workouts). That's a slow time objectively, but the fastest was above and the others right around the Concept 2 fifty percentile rankings for my demographic (F 60-69 lwt) at that distance, so I don't feel too bad. It was not max effort, for sure, but was challenging. HR maybe in the 120s, Z2 . . . very short duration, though. I could talk after, easily, and at least short sentences during.

The point of rowing there wasn't a workout per se, more about pulling people into the booth, and staying warm, since this was held in an indoor livestock event facility, pretty barn-esque, on a Winter day. Warmer in there than I expected, since quite sunny out and our booth was on the South wall.

More standing and walking than usual, by quite a bit, too.

Physical therapy exercises yet to do, scheduled the less muscularly intense ones today.

Bonus photos of cool stuff at the event in the spoiler, will mostly appeal to the on-water folks, maybe.

Every year it happens, I enjoy this event so much. This was the first time it happened again, after a pandemic hiatus.

Elliptical HIIT setting 150 minutes for 10.1 miles. Zone 2, 3 & a bit of 4 today.

I spent the week diving on the Isle of Mull in North West Scotland. It was lovely.

One expects terrible weather at this time of year. In fact, we had sunshine every day, very little wind, very little snow, and very little rain. Air temperature was typically 6 Celsius; water temperature 8 Celsius. 12 dives (2 a day); max depth 40 metres; max time just over an hour.

I will post a couple of photos later; it doesn't seem to work from my phone.

Just 2000 yard swim (80 lengths).

I will need to take a break from the pool or figure out how to get my fins to stop wearing a hole in the top of my feet.

nossmf wrote: »

Banged out an hour on the elliptical hills this morning. Come here to report it, and the post right before mine is swimmom banging out 2.5 hours of ellipticals. How quickly I can go from feeling like I did good to suddenly feeling inadequate, lol.

I don't mean to make anyone feel bad. I can only workout out on my off work days so I do longer times, since I only can do them 3 days/week. So 7.5 hours a week. On my old Elliptical I used to do 3-3.5 hour sessions. This new one with the converging ramp is a harder but better workout. I wish I could workout more like 6 days per week. But I can't motivate myself after work. I already have to get up at 5 and have no desire to get up any early. Being a nurse, I don't always get out on time. Sometimes I have just enough time to grab a bite and get to bed for the next work day.

You are doing a lot more than me in the long run with all the other exercises you do.

Been working hard, sorry not posting as much. Did an hour on the treadmill yesterday (easy stuff) and today was a harder lift in the AM followed by my monthly indoor rowing club's challenge.

It was 6 X 1000m with one minute recovery. I was dreading it and it was quite dreadful to be honest. Averaged right at around 2:10. One minute recoveries are brutal. Just enough time to get your HR under control and you have to go again for 4 plus minutes as hard as you can. I was literally counting strokes on the last few intervals just to get through it. I used to do hard rows after lifts all the time, but they are getting hard for me to do now. I've separated it on Thursday (my other hard interval day) and been doing my lifting on Friday, along with an easy cardio session.

@nossmf -- if you do decide to row, there's a website called Dark Horse Rowing that's fantastic on form. Also, Concept2 has some great videos. I know this sounds counterintuitive, but rowing unstrapped teaches you a LOT about sequencing. If you do it wrong, you'll fall backward off the rower. It seems so unnatural at first but it's one of the best ways to learn sequencing and driving with the legs. The form is very much like a clean done right. I also use a band around the rower rail (a trick I learned on Dark Horse Rowing) so that I don't overextend my knees over my feet. It does take a lot of time to learn correct form.