call it what you want "starvation mode" is REAL

thanks for sharing

One last question. How do gastric bypass patients lose hundreds of pounds on only 500-1500 calories? Shouldn't starvation mode kick in a day or two after eating so few calories?

We do it by taking in 100-175 grams of protein through supplements. I take in 1000 calories 180 grams protein a day, 60% liquid calories from supplements. I burn 500 calories a day with excersing. I don't eat my calories back, I have more energy then I know what to do with !

I call it systematic starvation ,it also help's I'm never hungry ,

And I welcome any post, don't hate on someone for sharing there research. Don't like just move on!

Prositive thoughts only!

if you were consuming 1000 calories without that fantastic amount of protein, do you think you would lose muscle along with the fat?

I really believe the protein helps the fat loss and limits the lean mass loss, but many low cal people purely concentrate on calories and not nutrition.

Starvation mode is a weird weird topic for me.

I had gastric surgery. For 5 weeks I literally didn't consume more than 500 calories a day, while drinking only protein shakes. I have to keep my protein to more than 70g/day. I worked my super physical job (wearing a pedometer, I never was below 8k-10k steps), going to the gym for aqua classes and doing cardio..EVERY day! If I'd read someone saying this, I'd accuse them of lying or cheating, but I did NOT

I lost not one lb. Not one. For those who think it's amusing, yes, I did actually consider trying to sell my metabolism to a 3rd world country. HOW could I exist on that? the deficit was clearly in excess of what I was consuming, yet there was ZERO weight loss.

I went to another forum, where I was advised to stop working out so much and eat more. I stopped going to the gym, and upped my calories to around 750. The first week, I lost 6 lbs.

Now, it seems extremely counterintuitive that to LOSE weight I had to MOVE less and EAT more, yet that's exactly what happened.

don't mock it unless you've been there.

I had lap-band surgery and did my homework. A lot of people have that problem. I had a BMI of over 53 when I had my surgery. They put me on a liquid diet to shrink my fatty liver for 6 weeks prior to surgery. Believe me I lost! 50 pounds before surgery. I then discovered that the lap-band and other surgeries like that still take a lot of effort to loose weight. It only makes you less hungry when you put the effort into dieting.

PS I have lost over 120 in 2 years. gained back 20 and now I'm am back to giving it my all again. You can cheat by eating high calorie slider type foods that are mostly dairy and carbs and not loose anything with weight loss surgery. It is not the easy way out of never having to watch what you eat again.

Personally, I am so sick and tired of this debate I could puke all my calories! If people want to starve themselves, LET THEM! Who the crap cares what others eat anyway??!! Just log your own caloric intake and energy output and let others be! Praise your friends, and let the rest go!

If everyone did that, this would be quite crap as an advice forum, wouldn't it?

if starvation mode is real. explain to me why a proper "PSMF" diet is extremely effective???

How about quoting some studies that show the effectiveness, without metabolic slowdown, of a long term PSMF diet in the non-obese?
[/quote]

i am extremely bored so i will bite.

Why would you run a "long term" PSMF diet if your non-obese that doesn't make any sense... did you c the part where i said proper? Yes, your metabolic rate is going to slowdown.. the same way it slows down on all diets.. your body is dropping weight causing your metabolic to slowdown. i don't need a study to show that... On top of that on when you eat to lose weight your hormones are going to go out of wack.. causing that "starvation" feeling causing binges.. Then comes massive weight gain putting you where you started or further back then before... that is one of the reasons "PSMF" diets are designed... to drop weight as fast as possible.. less time.. less chance to fall off the bandwagon.... As human's its pretty clear.. if we don't c results we get depressed and usually give up..

Can a non obese person run it.. sure.

Yes, its designed around obese people... but what is the number now 30? 40? 50? % of the world is obese that applies to most individuals anyways.. People who aren't obese do not need to run a crash diet for LONG periods of time do they???? I've personally ran a few 11 day PSMF cycles. Am i obese??.. no far from it... Have i experience metabolism problems on this type of diet.. nope... my maintenance has never dropped below 2500 calories... my BMR has actually increased.. hmmm

metabolic slowdown?????????
short term crash diets will cause a drop yes... you cant stop that.. the sympathetic nervous system output will drop , causing your metabolic to lower...

but???? can you increase your metabolic rate on a crash diet ? yes you can.... there is many methods.. ephedrine and caffeine... refeeds ... breaks ... etc .. any proper "PSMF" for non obese individuals will have correct timings on re-feeds and breaks

now i don't recommend anything i said... because without knowing 100% of what your are doing to your body... then well its not safe and shouldn't be used to better your self... if used correctly........ yea its effective... if not.. its extremely harmful..

.... this has nothing to do with my actual point anyways........... people believe you eat way blow 1200 calories you go into starvation mode and don't drop weight.. that is false.. and PSMF proves that... metabolic slowdown has nothing to do with it....

Personally, I am so sick and tired of this debate I could puke all my calories! If people want to starve themselves, LET THEM! Who the crap cares what others eat anyway??!! Just log your own caloric intake and energy output and let others be! Praise your friends, and let the rest go!

If everyone did that, this would be quite crap as an advice forum, wouldn't it?

Nope! But thats just my humble opinion. There's far too much argument in the forums. Again my opinion. But who cares about MY opinion? Well my scale and tape measure do! And all the crap in these forums didnt do a thang to cause those results. Just sayin........

Might not do a thing for your scale or tape measure but could well help others...if you do not like the thread - just don't read it - the title was pretty obvious as to what the topic is...just saying.......

if starvation mode is real. explain to me why a proper "PSMF" diet is extremely effective???

How about quoting some studies that show the effectiveness, without metabolic slowdown, of a long term PSMF diet in the non-obese?

i am extremely bored so i will bite.

Why would you run a "long term" PSMF diet if your non-obese that doesn't make any sense... did you c the part where i said proper? Yes, your metabolic rate is going to slowdown.. the same way it slows down on all diets.. your body is dropping weight causing your metabolic to slowdown. i don't need a study to show that... On top of that on when you eat to lose weight your hormones are going to go out of wack.. causing that "starvation" feeling causing binges.. Then comes massive weight gain putting you where you started or further back then before... that is one of the reasons "PSMF" diets are designed... to drop weight as fast as possible.. less time.. less chance to fall off the bandwagon.... As human's its pretty clear.. if we don't c results we get depressed and usually give up..

Can a non obese person run it.. sure.

Yes, its designed around obese people... but what is the number now 30? 40? 50? % of the world is obese that applies to most individuals anyways.. People who aren't obese do not need to run a crash diet for LONG periods of time do they???? I've personally ran a few 11 day PSMF cycles. Am i obese??.. no far from it... Have i experience metabolism problems on this type of diet.. nope... my maintenance has never dropped below 2500 calories... my BMR has actually increased.. hmmm

metabolic slowdown?????????
short term crash diets will cause a drop yes... you cant stop that.. the sympathetic nervous system output will drop , causing your metabolic to lower...

but???? can you increase your metabolic rate on a crash diet ? yes you can.... there is many methods.. ephedrine and caffeine... refeeds ... breaks ... etc .. any proper "PSMF" for non obese individuals will have correct timings on re-feeds and breaks

now i don't recommend anything i said... because without knowing 100% of what your are doing to your body... then well its not safe and shouldn't be used to better your self... if used correctly........ yea its effective... if not.. its extremely harmful..

.... this has nothing to do with my actual point anyways........... people believe you eat way blow 1200 calories you go into starvation mode and don't drop weight.. that is false.. and PSMF proves that... metabolic slowdown has nothing to do with it....
[/quote]

I did see the part where you said 'proper' and was wondering what you thought 'proper' was. These threads are very generic and do not necessarily address the differences with the obese or morbidly obese, or someone on IF etc etc. I actually agree with most, if not all of your points. However, the post you made will be read by many as refuting that 'starvation mode' exists. I do not like the term as it creates a lot of misunderstanding - but in the general sense people generally use it to explain a slow down of the metabolism (rightly or wrongly). You agree in your post that there will be a slow down in someone's metabolism (which can be mitigated as you note) on a VLCD.

i'm trying to get rid of my rolls. People need to have a sense of humor. I don't believe in starvation mode and I'm glad some people could benefit from some humor and some support .

Bored are you? :huh:

Yeti

Bored are you? :ohwell:

No, just wondered what your motivation was for such an unconstructive message, 4 days after the last post, other than causing more mischief.

Some people are really having problems with this and need help and advice, not ridicule.

Unfortunately, thats the way he 'rolls'.

Humor and support are great - but in my opinion, your comments are neither.

Also, please stop with the semantics. When people are talking about starvation mode, they generally are talking about a metabolic slowdown - something that you agree happens on a VLCD.

i'm trying to get rid of my rolls Sarauk.

People need to have a sense of humor. I don't believe in starvation mode and I'm glad some people could benefit from some humor and some support . Some people can benefit from others being on there side like the many who don't believe in starvation mode. Sort of like everyone who believes in it benefit from the people who support it. Same coin two different sides.

Bored are you? :huh:

Yeti

Bored are you? :ohwell:

No, just wondered what your motivation was for such an unconstructive message, 4 days after the last post, other than causing more mischief.

Some people are really having problems with this and need help and advice, not ridicule.

Unfortunately, thats the way he 'rolls'.

[/quote]

Now you are just repeating yourself!!

bump

How do we explain people on 1200 calories who continue to have weightloss consistantly for over a year and reach their goal?

What I think is interesting is how many people who eat at 1200 suddenly find themselves struggling to eat more. I believe this is caused by the metabolism slowing down, which takes the appetite with it.

I believe we really can have a reasonable discussion about this without an all-out flame war. No need to get snippy, folks. Eat a sandwich. Be happy. :bigsmile:

:like button:

So little time

The thing is 1200 for some people 1200 is optimal.

No one is saying "You will stop losing weight." But that's not to say that their loss is OPTIMAL loss. It's making it more difficult than it needs to be.

Years ago, I struggled for a good 8 or more months to lose about 20 pounds when I wasn't eating enough. I thought the only way to keep losing would be to eat even less than I was. Average loss per week was about a half pound a week, many weeks less than that, even though I was aiming for 2 pounds or more per week.

But eating the RIGHT amount of calories for what I weighed and how much I wanted to lose, which is nearly twice as much as I was years ago, I easily and effortlessly lost 30 pounds in 7 months. Average loss per week over the entire duration was one pound a week, aiming for one pound a week then a half pound a week for the last 10 pounds.

That's all anyone is trying to say. Eat the RIGHT amount of calories for what you weigh and the amount you have to lose. There's no need to automatically go for the lowest possible number of calories.

[/quote]

If they are under 5' tall!

Starvation mode is a weird weird topic for me.

I had gastric surgery. For 5 weeks I literally didn't consume more than 500 calories a day, while drinking only protein shakes. I have to keep my protein to more than 70g/day. I worked my super physical job (wearing a pedometer, I never was below 8k-10k steps), going to the gym for aqua classes and doing cardio..EVERY day! If I'd read someone saying this, I'd accuse them of lying or cheating, but I did NOT

I lost not one lb. Not one. For those who think it's amusing, yes, I did actually consider trying to sell my metabolism to a 3rd world country. HOW could I exist on that? the deficit was clearly in excess of what I was consuming, yet there was ZERO weight loss.

I went to another forum, where I was advised to stop working out so much and eat more. I stopped going to the gym, and upped my calories to around 750. The first week, I lost 6 lbs.

Now, it seems extremely counterintuitive that to LOSE weight I had to MOVE less and EAT more, yet that's exactly what happened.

don't mock it unless you've been there.

Obviously you've found what works for you and that it required a change to more food and less exercise.
Is the calories consumed (under 500) just referring to solid food, and not including the protein shakes? Because from what I've seen those tend to have a lot. But at the same time, that wouldn't be to blame for no loss for that long. Just curious about that part.
I also assume you did this with close doctor supervision/advice post surgery- did they advise the change or did you deicde to try it for yourself?

No..that is total calories, including protein shakes. Eas makes one that is amazing, 110 cals and 17 grams. When that's ALL you're eating, it doesn't add up to much.

I asked my Dr. about it, telling her that I was eating that way, and she said it's normal to eat that way and not lose weight, that my body was 'readjusting'. Her solution was just to keep eating that way and I'd be fine.

I am a member of another forum, and it's not uncommon for MANY people to not lose for months eating so little, I truly think that for some people, their bodies just shut down. The difference between us, and the people in Africa who really ARE starving, is that theirs has probably always been that way, while ours is a sudden change.

Believe me, if I could have enrolled in a study, to PROVE this, I sure would have.