Where is the science!
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The only reason that dieting is hard is that people think there is such a thing as an end to their diet. You have to maintain your goal weight for the rest of your life or be overweight and suffer the dread diseases which are associated with it. It also takes time to count calories, but MFP sure helps. Especially if you create meals with your favorite combinations.
The other reason is people give up foods they love forever, and can't do it. They don't learn how to eat at parties, blow it, and give up. They binge because they haven't had something in a long time.
Some people may find it hard because their nutrition is poor and their carbs, fats, and proteins aren't even close to the RDA. Their diet is not nutritious, and they probably don't feel right. You're right, our bodies are pretty much the same. Although there are a few out there who have deficiencies. . . sometimes created by their total avoidance of foods in a certain category that they don't like . . . . such as salad, fruits, vegetables, liver, seafood. Eating a balanced diet is important to maintaining homeostasis, without which, our body ages faster because it is not supported by food choices.0 -
The only appropriate answer I could post in the forums is that the actual answer has so many factors and considerations that it would not possibly fit into a forum post.
The reason for that is something you have previously addressed but chose to dismiss as arbitrary: Everyone is different.
http://www.bodyrecomposition.com/fat-loss/you-are-not-different.html
^ Great article for anyone on the fence about cutting and pasting this into your browser. Do it. Lyle has good things to say.0 -
Dragonwolf, for the win!!Except it's a science with many, many variables and potential combinations of factors. If we were all exactly the same, an authority could tell us all that eating vegan is the best thing for us and we could all eat vegan and be healthy.
But it doesn't work that way. In fact, a quick search will pull up people who did everything "right" by vegan eating and were woefully unhealthy. The same goes for the Primal/Paleo eating, and yes, even just the simple "eat less, exercise more" base.
Why is that? Because people have different levels of various hormones, and react differently to different substances. For example, people with the various syndromes that are associated with insulin resistance often respond well to "low-carb" (or "no-bad-carb") diets, such as Atkins, Primal, or Paleo, and very likely won't thrive on a veg*n diet due to its relatively high-carb nature. Conversely, someone with intolerances to certain compounds in meats, or eggs, probably would do far better on a veg*n diet than on a Primal or Paleo diet.
It's also why only some people are lactose intolerant, or have Celiac, or have Diabetes, and why not every single pack-a-day-for-40-years smoker gets lung cancer. It's also why a friend of mine is allergic to Tylenol, while it isn't effective at all for me.
There are general guidelines that can be followed to form a foundation from which to start:
1. Excercise regularly, including strength training
2. Eat an amount to fuel your body, but not too much that you gain weight (this exact number will differ depending on the individual's size and activity level)
3. Eat whole, unprocessed foods as much as possible
From there, you may have to experiment to get what works for you. For example, there are a number of people on here that simply "eat less", without worrying at all about their macros and have successfully lost weight. However, I did that for six months to no avail (I ate what MFP calculated for me, plus 4-6 days of rather intense exercise), but when I started working on cutting out grains and started even loosely following the Primal guidelines, I dropped nearly 10lbs within the first two weeks.
Science, especially when it comes to biological beings (and especially when it comes to humans), isn't as clean-cut as grade school makes it out to be. Experiments/studies that involve humans are highly regulated, so scientists' hands are tied when it comes to what they can do and what they can control. This also makes them quite expensive to conduct, so they need backed by someone with money. And who usually has the money? Drug companies, large corporations, usually, sometimes governments (or individuals within a government). Most of the studies they fund are aligned with the agendas of these agencies, which nearly always calls the studies' motives into question, even if the studies are unbiased. I've no doubt that several people scoffed when they saw you mention various government agencies as examples of unbiased sources.0 -
We've become lazy (cars, office working) and fat (supersizing our meals). Generations are gonna get bigger and bigger if they don't understand real portion sizes and that you actually need to move your body to keep it healthy and working right!
Your body needs anything up to 600 calories a day just to keep your organs working, heart pumping etc when you aren't even doing anything! Add a whole world of rich, sugary food with little/no movement of the body and the results are obvious.
I think we're looking in the wrong places for answers! We're asking pointless questions when deep down you know that YOU'RE I'M EATING TOO MUCH OF THE WRONG THING AND THEREFORE YOU ARE/WILL GET FAT/OVERWEIGHT/OBESE.
The best advice I have ever been given is "IF YOU DON'T BUY IT, YOU CAN'T EAT IT"
Purely and simply give YOURSELF the reality check YOU need because only YOU can lose the weight.
There is NO SCIENCE - eat well, live well and you'll be fine!0 -
Lol this post coming from someone who believes sat fats and refined sugars are bad without taking into consideration dosage and context
Well that completely backs up my entire argument! I am led to believe that as resfined sugars and sat fats are of no nutricianal value then they are not a beneficial element to a diet - hence bad in any dosage, on an escalating scale
If I am wrong then it is because there is no definitive, unbiased piece of information telling me so and I have reached that conclusion bases on rumour, heresay, downright lies or misinformation! - hence my original post!
Have fun as a male avoiding sat fats. And don't eat fruit or anything like that since it also contains sugar, eek!
Educate me then rather than try to ridicule. As a male is it not wise to TRY and avoid sat fats? And sugar in fruit - excellent, but is that 'refined' sugar because I thought the process of refining was removing the sugar from the plant?0 -
Does breakfast kick start your metabolism?
Does spreading your meals out through the day keep your metabolism high?
The old favourite - what is starvation/survival mode? We need to know when or if it kicks in?
Another favourite - are artificial sweetners bad for you?
Is it as simple as calories in = calories out?
Do meal times matter? Is it ok to eat late at night?
To lose weight, Is it better to exercise in the 'fat buring zone'?
Are low carb diets bad for you?
Many many more!
All those answers are out there at reputable sites, like WebMD, etc. I love MFP for what it is, a place to track goals and meet people with similar goals, but do NOT take medical advice from fellow members. That's like getting the info for your research paper from Wikipedia. Everyone on here means well, but I'm sure very few of them are dieticians or doctors. The forum is a place to discuss "opinions" and what has worked for others...not a place to go for legitimate dietary/medical advice.0 -
There is actually lots of good science about breakfast--and other foods--boosting your metabolism. Your metabolism fires every time you eat.
Here's the thing--IT FIRES IN PROPORTION TO HOW MUCH YOU EAT.
Therefore, eating breakfast fires your metabolism, but if you have a small breakfast, it fires enough to burn your breakfast. If you have a huge breakfast, it fires more! ...but then you've eaten a pound of bacon, five eggs, some pancakes with syrup....
Same thing for eating small meals throughout the day. It's not any better for you, it's just a snacking style. it fires up and burns low for a little while with each meal, as opposed to firing higher and burning longer with a big meal three times a day. It all sort of evens out, in the end.
I'll see if I can find TEH SCIENCE on this one, I just read about this very-well-understood very-often-misrepresented and mis-used phenomenon.0 -
The one thing I often hear is "Everyone is different", well no, we're all almost exactly the same chemically and biologically. Scientists didn't stop searching for a cure for leprosy because "we're all different'!
We shouldn't be working to anecdotal evidence...... "Drinking chicken soup worked for me" "I've lost 50lbs by not eating after 3pm" "I've started eating breakfast and now I'm losing the lbs!"
This kind of thinking I don't understand. We are all different, and different things will not work the same for everyone due to differences in our lifestyles, preferences, and even physiology. Healthy living is not one size fits all.
And I so often see when someone will say here "Xyz worked for me," - whether xyz is going vegan, doing paleo, cutting out red meat, not eating after 4 p.m., standing on their head for 30 minutes a day, whatever - others will get bent out of shape and cry for studies and science. Why? If something is working for a person, they're happy, healthy, and not pushing their agenda on others, why do we insist they show us "proof"?
*eta - Not that I'm discounting real research and good information. I've just noticed that someone's individual experience is often met with "BS! Show me the data!"0 -
HAHAHA hilarious! I love this post! Good stuff.0
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poppy seeds?0
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Lol this post coming from someone who believes sat fats and refined sugars are bad without taking into consideration dosage and context
Well that completely backs up my entire argument! I am led to believe that as resfined sugars and sat fats are of no nutricianal value then they are not a beneficial element to a diet - hence bad in any dosage, on an escalating scale
If I am wrong then it is because there is no definitive, unbiased piece of information telling me so and I have reached that conclusion bases on rumour, heresay, downright lies or misinformation! - hence my original post!
Have fun as a male avoiding sat fats. And don't eat fruit or anything like that since it also contains sugar, eek!
Educate me then rather than try to ridicule. As a male is it not wise to TRY and avoid sat fats? And sugar in fruit - excellent, but is that 'refined' sugar because I thought the process of refining was removing the sugar from the plant?
You said you did research, so if you did a half decent job you'd already know these things.
Sugar is sugar, tell me metabolically how sucrose in fruit is different from sucrose from a a sugar packet?0 -
Do the research, draw your own conclusions, self experiment to determine if the conclusions are valid for you.
I have, I'm fit and at a healthy weight
But there are hundreds of millions who are not and I think they could be helped without having to self experiment0 -
hormones. play. a. huge. role.
i'm pretty sure.
just sayin'0 -
I think we all want to over complicate things thinking we will find the big solution that will make it all easier. Eat more fruits/vegetables, have a calorie deficite, and move more.0
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We need an indisputable list - not from Jenny Craig, not from Jillian Michaels, not from Shaun T, not from Tony Horton - they all have their own agenda!
who do think should provide you with this list? I really dont understand your point unless maybe you've had a few pints
It was a long post so I understand why you didn't read it all
"we need to be told these things once and for all by an impartial, unbiased organisation with the sole agenda of telling the facts!"
Governments, World Health Organisation, United Nations, Universities, National Health Service ....
All of the mentioned organizations have their own agendas and financial backers.0 -
the key is reading reading reading0
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hormones. play. a. huge. role.
i'm pretty sure.
just sayin'
I do believe they can! I gained weight Much easier after I had a hystarectomy. That's when my real battle of the bulge began...Mostly, I think the hormone imbalance made me more sluggish so I stopped moving as much, so the weight piled on. But, that was just my experiance.0 -
Sugar is sugar, tell me metabolically how sucrose in fruit is different from sucrose from a a sugar packet?
The benefits in eating fruit far outway any disadvantages of the sugar content - hence good for you. Nutritionally beneficial
There are no benefits to eating refined sugar so you get only disadvantages - hence bad for you. Empty calories0 -
But scientists can't even agree. They're like religious scholars arguing the bible...lol
There is no one science we should all embrace while abandoning the myths science debunks.
And science changes year after year.
Science says this, and people get all hot and bothered, then science comes along and says, "OOPS, we might have been wrong. But maybe not." - :bigsmile:
Anyway, this is why I advocate the simple truth we know.
Eat Right - Exercise
Good for you
Get to it - No Excuses
All Is Possible!0 -
Sugar is sugar, tell me metabolically how sucrose in fruit is different from sucrose from a a sugar packet?
The benefits in eating fruit far outway any disadvantages of the sugar content - hence good for you. Nutritionally beneficial
There are no benefits to eating refined sugar so you get only disadvantages - hence bad for you. Empty calories
Way to avoid the question there champ0 -
We need an indisputable list - not from Jenny Craig, not from Jillian Michaels, not from Shaun T, not from Tony Horton - they all have their own agenda!
who do think should provide you with this list? I really dont understand your point unless maybe you've had a few pints
It was a long post so I understand why you didn't read it all
"we need to be told these things once and for all by an impartial, unbiased organisation with the sole agenda of telling the facts!"
Governments, World Health Organisation, United Nations, Universities, National Health Service ....
All those organizations have mass agendas too.
I would believe someone who is in shape, trying to help others get healthy. Many of your questions do not even need an answer...artifcial sweeteners? It's artificial, of course they are not good for you.
Getting healthy and in shape is not as difficult as so many people believe. It's just that people do not want to do the things that will help them reach their goals...it's easy to do, and easy NOT to do.0 -
I am a sport and exercise scientist so regardless of what some of you may think I do know what I'm talking about! However, don't take my word for it, go and use academic search engines like sciencedirect.com and pubmed.gov and educate yourselves!! All these debates are merely lazy, all the research is there for you to read, just read it!!0
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Science?
You want one stop, definitive weight loss info from the very people that said saccharin and a bunch of other chemicals were the safe and healthy- a great alternative to sugar... only to find out a few years later that they were a cause of cancers That's only the tip of the iceberg. I'd prefer that big government work on things like their budget and not so much with what I eat.
The answer is the same as it was 10, 100, 1000 years ago... eat less, move more- what's changed is that WE all seem to want a magic bullet to drop weight instantly.0 -
Sugar is sugar, tell me metabolically how sucrose in fruit is different from sucrose from a a sugar packet?
The benefits in eating fruit far outway any disadvantages of the sugar content - hence good for you. Nutritionally beneficial
There are no benefits to eating refined sugar so you get only disadvantages - hence bad for you. Empty calories
Its fructose that's in fruit not sucrose!! That's the difference! They are metabolised differently and surplus of each is stored and utilised differently! Sucrose (which breaks down to glucose) is stored as fat!! Fructose remains in the blood stream and is used by mitochondria to form energy!!0 -
Sugar is sugar, tell me metabolically how sucrose in fruit is different from sucrose from a a sugar packet?
The benefits in eating fruit far outway any disadvantages of the sugar content - hence good for you. Nutritionally beneficial
There are no benefits to eating refined sugar so you get only disadvantages - hence bad for you. Empty calories
Way to avoid the question there champ
I thought it was rhetorical - It was clear by your stance that there is no difference. i'll state it if makes it easier for you "There is no difference"
I am puzzled though - why the confrontation? Why the patronising tone?
I'm making no claims to be an expert, just having a thirst for knowledge. Ive asked a number of times now for you to enlighten me. Take sat fats away for a moment as I'm aware that they are difficult to avoid in a balanced diet. So refined sugar - is there ANY advantages to eating it?0 -
It would be fantastic to have a definitive answer to "How to lose weight" given to us by a trusted source.
this answer is everywhere.........eat less calories than you need
that simple answer is always there but gets hidden with gimmicks and convoluted nonsense.
But the big question is how??? For me it's eating 3 meals and 3 snacks. I'm never hungry, well seldom. Because I never let myself get hungry and I try to eat leaner meats, whole grains, plenty of fibre and protein. Oh and I've apparently become a gym rat.0 -
Quote from the You Are Not Different article:
Invariably, when you get an honest assessment of the person’s food intake (just accept that it can be done right now), their estimates are way off from reality. Studies show that people may under (or overestimate) their true caloric intake by up to 50%. Basically, unless they’ve done it for a while, most people are simply horrible at estimating how much food they are actually eating. Same thing for exercise, people tend to vastly overestimate how many calories they’ve burned.
It is precisely because of this I'm a freak about weighing my food and not eating back all my calories. Sometimes MFP tells me to eat 1300 more than I end up eating, but I just can't. I'm full, and I think my exercise cals burned are WAY overestimated.
I still don't lose weight.
I'm not an idiot, I did factor in the stuff he talks about, and I'm not losing. So what -is- the reason? It's questions like this that cause the plethora of questions on forums.
No doubt I'm still massively under- and over-estimating in all directions. But without, as one poster put it, one of those Dr. McCoy tricorders, I won't know which.0 -
Its fructose that's in fruit not sucrose!! That's the difference! They are metabolised differently and surplus of each is stored and utilised differently! Sucrose (which breaks down to glucose) is stored as fat!! Fructose remains in the blood stream and is used by mitochondria to form energy!!
lolwut0 -
People that read this and believe it are dumb."I've lost 50lbs by not eating after 3pm"
People that read this and believe it are dumb.There was a post on here the other day that was along the lines of "I drink hot liquids to melt the fat away and I've lost 140lbs"
No matter how hard you try - you can't fix stupid.
Clearly you're smart enough to figure out something that works for you.... I'm fit and at a healthy weight
But there are hundreds of millions who are not and I think they could be helped without having to self experiment
Are hundreds of millions of people really that stupid or do they just not have the desire to put down the cookies and start exercising?
Agreed. The hundreds of millions that are in dire need of help need to take responsibility for themselves. No amount of government intervention or readily available information will help these people until they decide to help themselves.Ok so I want to take responsibilty for myself - I'm not a sheep.0 -
The one thing I often hear is "Everyone is different", well no, we're all almost exactly the same chemically and biologically. Scientists didn't stop searching for a cure for leprosy because "we're all different'!
Human beings are indeed very similar, but some populations have genetic variations or are exposed to environmental factors (including lifestyle) that cause them to develop diseases and conditions that other groups don't get.
In general, I agree with your skepticism, especially your questions about the need to eat breakfast and the ease of going into starvation mode.0
This discussion has been closed.
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