What's the deal with the obsession of sweets?
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Your reply "of course it's sustainable because it's the only way to lose weight" does not answer my question. I have worked for Weight Watchers over the years and have seen countless number of people lose massive amounts of weight but were unable to maintain their weight loss. Calories in, calories out certainly works but they could never sustain it so I believe there are far more factors at work. So in light, of my experience, my question makes perfect sense.0
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mamapeach910 wrote: »Mamapeach, it doesn't mean you are weak, it means you are human.
Sorry, but I'm taking responsibility for my own behavior here, something I didn't do for far too long when it came to food, and something I realize that naturally slim people can do. My late mother in law ADORED sweets, but when she felt like her pants were getting too tight for her? She had no trouble avoiding them and just drinking coffee while everyone else had dessert. Normally, she'd be leading the charge for seconds and thirds at it. That woman never wore anything larger than a size 10.
Mamapeach, You also said "Just because I'm weak-willed when it comes to one sweet, does not mean that particular food is addictive for me. It means I'm weak."
Something about these comments worried me and then then the reason occurred to me. All the overweight people I know are not weak or weak willed or weak minded. In fact, they are the most incredible, gifted and amazing people I know. They have confidence, courage, commitment, control and purpose. All characteristics of a strong minded person. So something else is happening here that they have no control over.
I have seen some of these people put themselves through the most difficult of diets using pure determination and achieved their goal only to slowly but surely regain the weight.
Now your mother in law was probably one of the naturally thin people of this world, their commitment to losing was easier and not a constant battle. I was one of them and being thin was not evidence that I was strong minded because I ate my way through life. I was blessed - simple as that. Three events changed that. Cancer scare and surgery, Ross River Virus and menopause. Life slowed for me when I was ill for nearly two years and later on, hormonal changes effected me as well. Thus my ability to lose weight is now different.
Will power, calories in, calories out and exercise will certainly get you results but is it sustainable? I believe there are far more factors at play and will power is only a minor one.
I'm sorry, but... what????
I'm quite happy with the way I'm eating now. I eat the same things I did before, I really only needed to cut small quantities of food to start losing weight. I'm short, it was only a small amount to make a difference for me.
CICO is the way a body works... plain and simple. There's no magic that will bypass it. I've tried all that woo before. IT DIDN'T WORK. I'd lose the water weight on low carb or paleo and then stall at the point that my calorie consumption equaled maintenance for a certain weight. You can't find an eating plan that will outsmart thermogenics. Ain't gonna happen.
I've learned a lot more about my body, my appetite and food tolerance has changed since then.
Thanks for your concern trolling, though.
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Your reply "of course it's sustainable because it's the only way to lose weight" does not answer my question. I have worked for Weight Watchers over the years and have seen countless number of people lose massive amounts of weight but were unable to maintain their weight loss. Calories in, calories out certainly works but they could never sustain it so I believe there are far more factors at work. So in light, of my experience, my question makes perfect sense.
What factors?
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Measure your food @kyta32, measure your food.
I don't wanna. When I started weighing my yogurt, I found out I wasn't eating enough. So then I put in more, and the bowl was too full, and stuff would spill out when I tried to mix in my protein powder. It's easier just to eyeball. And besides, I'm losing 3-4 pounds a week. I heard measuring food leads to faster weight loss, and I don't think that would be safe....
Why don't you use a bigger bowl then? You could always buy a blender & mix some yogurt, milk, frozen banana, a few tablespoons of peanut butter, & whatever else you want to mix & make a breakfast smoothie/shake (after you measure the ingredients).
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Okay, so I've noticed that a lot of people with binge-eating problems really go after sweets. I am definitely a love of sweets but it's hot and cold for me. I don't really eat many sweets unless it's the holidays or I've bought a pack of cookies or a candy bar or something. I do really like cake and icing but it doesn't have the same urgency for me as for a lot of people. Why do you think other people (or yourself) can basically eat thousands of calories in mostly sugar and carbs and not get tired of it? Basically, I know a lot of younger girls who get most of their calories from sugary drinks, milkshakes, and desserts and don't even eat regular food. This baffles me because eating a proper meal seems much better to me. Is it because the lack of fiber and nutrients in sweet food, or maybe it's because of the presentation of sweet food? Most desserts look a certain way, gooey or colorful, presented as very tempting. Is the society's emphasis on sweet foods to represent celebration and love (Christmas, Halloween, birthdays, etc?)
This sort of obsession is definitely reinforced my social media and dieters, to an extent. People love posting desserts even if it's only to sigh "I wish I could eat that" or plan to have an indulges after doing well for a little while. I think part of it comes down to the moral implications of certain foods. Meat, grease, and condiments like mayo are sort of are like stereotypical of fat people. If you don't want to "look like a fatty" in front of your friends, you aren't going to order a burger, even if the latte or dessert your ordered has just as many calories. Cakes and chocolate are sort of universally adored. I mean, are people going to judge you more if you are sipping a milkshake or digging into some mayo-laden fat monstrosity?
We call it "defensive eating" in this house, lol.
It is simply poor menu planning in a nutshell.
And FWIW, you can binge eat sweets and not be fat if you stay within your calorie goals.
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Mamapeach, your comment "Thanks for your concern trolling, though" was unnecessary and untrue. I suggest very strongly that you do not voice this to me again and that you take this matter direct to a moderator if that is how you feel.
If you took the time to read my post properly and in context you will see that it was written without malice, and that I was in no way critising you or trying to offend you. Eat what you like as it makes no difference to me. If you want to call yourself "weak" that is your business but I simply do not see people who have trouble losing weight as weak minded.0 -
They go out and do WW, they get info a caloric deficit and they lose weight. They fall of WW and gain the weight back because they are no longer in a deficit. Sounds like CICO works exactly the way it's supposed to. It's not CICO that isn't sustainable, it's the plan they chose that isn't.
The plan they choose is CICO.0 -
Mamapeach, your comment "Thanks for your concern trolling, though" was unnecessary and untrue. I suggest very strongly that you do not voice this to me again and that you take this matter direct to a moderator if that is how you feel.
If you took the time to read my post properly and in context you will see that it was written without malice, and that I was in no way critising you or trying to offend you. Eat what you like as it makes no difference to me. If you want to call yourself "weak" that is your business but I simply do not see people who have trouble losing weight as weak minded.
Good grief, do you even know what concern trolling means?
Secondly, you didn't even read my initial post properly. I made no claims about OTHER people. I was talking about myself.
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Ndj you said "really, you are going to run and tattle tail to the mods….???? come on man!"
Nah, notice I never even flagged her. Read what I said "I suggest very strongly that you do not voice this to me again and that you take this matter direct to a moderator if that is how you feel."0 -
Ndj you said "really, you are going to run and tattle tail to the mods….???? come on man!"
Nah, notice I never even flagged her. Read what I said "I suggest very strongly that you do not voice this to me again and that you take this matter direct to a moderator if that is how you feel."
the fake indignation crew is getting tiresome….
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mamapeach910 wrote: »
Good grief, do you even know what concern trolling means?
Secondly, you didn't even read my initial post properly. I made no claims about OTHER people. I was talking about myself.
More to the point, do you know what concern troll is?
Concern troll - A person who posts on a blog thread, in the guise of "concern," to disrupt dialogue or undermine morale by pointing out that posters and/or the site may be getting themselves in trouble, usually with an authority or power. They point out problems that don't really exist. The intent is to derail, stifle, control, the dialogue. It is viewed as insincere and condescending.
A concern troll on a progressive blog might write, "I don't think it's wise to say things like that because you might get in trouble with the government." Or, "This controversy is making your side look disorganized."
and where does my post fit into that description?
And secondly, I knew you were talking about yourself and never stated anything different.
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Get what? I know calories in, calories out works.
An awful lot of people are successful without it. I have never counted a calorie in my life up until a few weeks ago and have stayed within a few kilos of my ideal weight my entire life. Since I started counting calories I realise that I am eating way too much to lose weight but for some reason my weight is stable. With the CICO theory I should be as fat as a house but for some reason my body maintains a steady weight. It is only since menopause that I have had a slight increase in weight.0 -
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sugar can be an addictive substance for some people. it may cause a 'crash' afterwards in the way caffeine or a drug does, making you feel bad/depressed and thus wanting more sugar to make yourself feel better.
trust me, i know. ;s
god i hate having an eating disorder.0 -
Mouse, there are a lot of people on this site who have overcome eating disorders and you can as well . I must admit I find if hard to stop eating sugar once I start so I try very hard never to have them in the house and surround myself with fruit, nuts and other yummy things. 0
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I knew you were talking about yourself and never stated anything different.All the overweight people I know are not weak or weak willed or weak minded. In fact, they are the most incredible, gifted and amazing people I know. They have confidence, courage, commitment, control and purpose. All characteristics of a strong minded person. So something else is happening here that they have no control over.
You made this about other people.
And yes, I do know what concern trolling is. You're so sympathetic about CICO and us poor dears for whom something else just HAS to be our underlying problems.
I notice that you ignored the post where I asked what those problems were.
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Get what? I know calories in, calories out works.
An awful lot of people are successful without it. I have never counted a calorie in my life up until a few weeks ago and have stayed within a few kilos of my ideal weight my entire life. Since I started counting calories I realise that I am eating way too much to lose weight but for some reason my weight is stable. With the CICO theory I should be as fat as a house but for some reason my body maintains a steady weight. It is only since menopause that I have had a slight increase in weight.
Of course you're eating way too much to lose weight if you're eating enough to maintain a stable weight. A deficit of calories isn't the same as maintenance.
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Get what? I know calories in, calories out works.
An awful lot of people are successful without it. I have never counted a calorie in my life up until a few weeks ago and have stayed within a few kilos of my ideal weight my entire life. Since I started counting calories I realise that I am eating way too much to lose weight but for some reason my weight is stable. With the CICO theory I should be as fat as a house but for some reason my body maintains a steady weight. It is only since menopause that I have had a slight increase in weight.
Good Morning, Lena,
Calories in/calories out is science. Nobody is successful without it, unless that person is a special snowflake.
Literally counting calories is another ball game. Whether or not to keep track of intake and output is entirely up to the person. It's a tool only.
When you were maintaining weight it was because you were eating within your calorie goals.
You say you've had a slight gain since menopause. How much is slight? Not water retention? Any fat gained is due to eating over maintenance. That's easy to do, especially if you are feeling more tired (hot flashes drain me) and not moving as much or you are eating a bit more than you realize. Either way, weight gain means you are eating more calories than you realize.0 -
Leena, I hear you. The head doctor who runs the weight loss program in our province has said that "anyone can starve themselves to lose weight". The hard part is maintenance. I believe the answer is in habit change. People who find it hard to lose weight are not necessarily weak-willed or deficient in some way.
This continues to be a pet peeve of mine, as I am competent and successful in many areas of my life. A manager, a leader. Intelligent and articulate. And overweight. If it was easy I would have done it a long time ago.
Isn't it about time we redefined "failure"? A marriage that lasts ten years is not a "failure". It's practically a marathon! Who stays in the same job for ten years? Someone who loses forty pounds and puts it back on is not a "failure". This is someone who knows exactly what it takes to lose forty pounds!
That being said, let's not give sugar more power than it has. It's attractive and delicious. But it doesn't send out alien signals, "eat me". There's something more powerful at work; our own hedonistic unconscious. Me, I deal with my inner hedonist by feeding it. Judiciously.0 -
Calories in, Calories out is not COUNTING; it's just a formula.Get what? I know calories in, calories out works.
An awful lot of people are successful without it. I have never counted a calorie in my life up until a few weeks ago and have stayed within a few kilos of my ideal weight my entire life. Since I started counting calories I realise that I am eating way too much to lose weight but for some reason my weight is stable. With the CICO theory I should be as fat as a house but for some reason my body maintains a steady weight. It is only since menopause that I have had a slight increase in weight.
Also, you're maintaining because your calories in equals your calories out. Your slight increase in weight since menopause is a result of a slight reduction in calories out, likely due to factors associated with menopause.
This is science, not counting using MFP.
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For some people, CICO works without them being consious of it (they maintain healthy weight on an ad libitum diet). Others need skills in addition to CICO to lose weight and maintain that loss. These skills may include logging, better knowledge about food and nutrition, activity, having a job and income that allows them to eat healthy (being overweight is strongly associated with socio-economic status), increased personal awareness (how their bodies respond to different foods, dealing with cravings), non-CICO strategies like drinking water, eating fiber, and checking in with a health professional, and awareness of impact of hormones on hunger, saiety, water retention, metabolism, etc. If the answer was as simple as telling people "CICO = Weight loss", no-one would be over weight, instead of over 50% of people in my country higher than a healthy weight.Get what? I know calories in, calories out works.
An awful lot of people are successful without it. I have never counted a calorie in my life up until a few weeks ago and have stayed within a few kilos of my ideal weight my entire life.
So if you know it works, and you know successful people, how is CICO not sustainable?0 -
I'm sorry but that does not mean that sugar is a drug. I can go to eat a great 12 or 14 oz porterhouse and afterwards get very tired and need a nap, does that make the steak a drug?sugar can be an addictive substance for some people. it may cause a 'crash' afterwards in the way caffeine or a drug does, making you feel bad/depressed and thus wanting more sugar to make yourself feel better.
trust me, i know. ;s
god i hate having an eating disorder.
Both sugar and the steak have metabolic impacts on the body. A large meal can make people feel sluggish - it's not an excuse, it's a biological reality. Added sugars cause energy surges and crashes, impact reward pathways in the brain, and add calories without satisfying hunger or giving good nutritional value (unless someone is very active). It's not an excuse, it's a biological reality. Some people have diabetes, some people are prediabetic (many without knowing), and some are just sensitive to sugar. Learning how we respond individually to sugar (and other foods) and taking steps to manage that (like not planning to run a marathon right after eating a 14 oz steak) is taking peronal responsibility.
I have issues with sweets. I accept that many don't, or crave other things, and I know that I'm not in a position to advise them on how to manage their cravings - I don't have the knowledge or the experience. I do have experience with managing sweet cravings, and I find limiting added sugars, water, distraction, waiting it out, and managing health/hunger otherwise helps. I've never found that discounting experience to be particularly helpful, though...0 -
dunnodunno wrote: »Measure your food @kyta32, measure your food.
I don't wanna. When I started weighing my yogurt, I found out I wasn't eating enough. So then I put in more, and the bowl was too full, and stuff would spill out when I tried to mix in my protein powder. It's easier just to eyeball. And besides, I'm losing 3-4 pounds a week. I heard measuring food leads to faster weight loss, and I don't think that would be safe....
Why don't you use a bigger bowl then? You could always buy a blender & mix some yogurt, milk, frozen banana, a few tablespoons of peanut butter, & whatever else you want to mix & make a breakfast smoothie/shake (after you measure the ingredients).
I'm very, very lazy. My daughter begs me to make smoothies, but getting the blender cleaned afterwards just seems like such a chore. And, I don't have the discretionary calories to add in a banana and tablespoons of peanut butter. I don't want to use a big bowl, because I use them for other things, and then I might run out. I'm also cheap. If I use the full amount of greek yogurt that I'm logging, I'll run out sooner, and then I have to come up with the money to buy more sooner. I just weighed my chia seeds for the first time, and realized 15 g is close to 2 tablespoons, not one....It just costs so much, and takes so much time to eat healthier...And I haven't even had a weight loss stall yet. Weighing food is just too stressful to do before I have to.0 -
It is always funny to see the "debate" around sugar..0
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squirrelzzrule22 wrote: »
In! Send me some, please!
I've seen them at Target!0
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