"Clean" or Flexible Eating - food for thought?
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EvgeniZyntx
Posts: 24,208 Member
This was posted a while back in a group - with all the discussion on eliminating X from the plate, I thought it might be useful to reflect on it.
Yes, it is a biased set of observations to support a view point but it is also and interesting set of research points.
Happy eating.
All-or-Nothing Dieting & Eating Disorder Risk
In 1997, a general physician named Steven Bratman coined the term orthorexia nervosa [21], which he defines as, “an unhealthy obsession with eating healthy food.” It reminds me of the counterproductive dietary perfectionism I’ve seen among many athletes, trainers, and coaches. One of the fundamental pitfalls of dichotomizing foods as good or bad, or clean or dirty, is that it can form a destructive relationship with food. This isn’t just an empty claim; it’s been seen in research. Smith and colleagues found that flexible dieting was associated with the absence of overeating, lower bodyweight, and the absence of depression and anxiety [22]. They also found that a strict all-or-nothing approach to dieting was associated with overeating and increased bodyweight. Similarly, Stewart and colleagues found that rigid dieting was associated with symptoms of an eating disorder, mood disturbances, and anxiety [23]. Flexible dieting was not highly correlated with these qualities.
Although these are observational study designs with self-reported data, anyone who spends enough time among fitness buffs knows that these findings are not off the mark.
Yes, it is a biased set of observations to support a view point but it is also and interesting set of research points.
Happy eating.
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Good stuff0
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Correlation, not causation on the depression and anxiety. I have anxiety and I've noticed some foods make me incredibly depressed and others happy. I came into this with those traits I didn't develop those traits around food.0
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I would tend to think lack of flexibility leads to binge behaviors. Control snaps, the binge and overeating happens because you swear you'll get back on track and never eat the offending substance again. BUT... while you're eating the forbidden fruit, you shove as much as you can into your face because you're never ever having it. Lather, rinse, repeat.
As for food and mood? I used to think they were connected, now I disagree. My moods are entirely separate from my food. Food can't make me anything except not hungry. I enjoy something that's tasty, I get satisfaction from having cooked something delicious, but food has no control over how I feel.
I spent a while trying to untangle wanting to eat to soothe myself. I guess I'm finally there. I think the idea of a restrictive diet is appealing to people who like control, who feel that if they can just do xyz, everything will fall into place. That sort of thinking does go hand in hand with anxiety. It's not related to the eating, but it's typical thinking of someone with anxiety. The peace of surrender and the surety of their own strength hasn't settled into their bones yet.0 -
mamapeach910 wrote: »I would tend to think lack of flexibility leads to binge behaviors. Control snaps, the binge and overeating happens because you swear you'll get back on track and never eat the offending substance again. BUT... while you're eating the forbidden fruit, you shove as much as you can into your face because you're never ever having it. Lather, rinse, repeat.
As for food and mood? I used to think they were connected, now I disagree. My moods are entirely separate from my food. Food can't make me anything except not hungry. I enjoy something that's tasty, I get satisfaction from having cooked something delicious, but food has no control over how I feel.
I spent a while trying to untangle wanting to eat to soothe myself. I guess I'm finally there.
I should get tested for food allergies, then. I know my food affects my moods. Or maybe it's not that simple? Maybe it's my food affects my energy levels, and whether I have a lot of energy or I'm lethargic affects my moods.
Edit for Abstract:
Anxiety and depression: a common feature of health care seeking patients with irritable bowel syndrome and food allergy.
CONCLUSIONS: A higher prevalence of state anxiety found in patients complaining of bowel symptoms could be linked to the presence of chronic ill status. The higher presence of trait anxiety and depression in IBS and FA patients could be responsible for an increase in the activity of the autonomic nervous system and could provoke motility alterations through mast cell mediator release as well as enhancing release due to allergen crosslinking with IgE at the mast cell surface. However, it is debatable whether psychological findings are characteristic of all IBS or FA patients, or just represent the subset that see physicians.
http://europepmc.org/abstract/med/9840105
So which came first, the anxious chicken or the egg allergy?0 -
mamapeach910 wrote: »I would tend to think lack of flexibility leads to binge behaviors. Control snaps, the binge and overeating happens because you swear you'll get back on track and never eat the offending substance again. BUT... while you're eating the forbidden fruit, you shove as much as you can into your face because you're never ever having it. Lather, rinse, repeat.
As for food and mood? I used to think they were connected, now I disagree. My moods are entirely separate from my food. Food can't make me anything except not hungry. I enjoy something that's tasty, I get satisfaction from having cooked something delicious, but food has no control over how I feel.
I spent a while trying to untangle wanting to eat to soothe myself. I guess I'm finally there.
I should get tested for food allergies, then. I know my food affects my moods. Or maybe it's not that simple? Maybe it's my food affects my energy levels, and whether I have a lot of energy or I'm lethargic affects my moods.
Eh, some of it might just be hormones and time. I'm older and past menopause. Life evens out a lot once that happens.
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mamapeach910 wrote: »mamapeach910 wrote: »I would tend to think lack of flexibility leads to binge behaviors. Control snaps, the binge and overeating happens because you swear you'll get back on track and never eat the offending substance again. BUT... while you're eating the forbidden fruit, you shove as much as you can into your face because you're never ever having it. Lather, rinse, repeat.
As for food and mood? I used to think they were connected, now I disagree. My moods are entirely separate from my food. Food can't make me anything except not hungry. I enjoy something that's tasty, I get satisfaction from having cooked something delicious, but food has no control over how I feel.
I spent a while trying to untangle wanting to eat to soothe myself. I guess I'm finally there.
I should get tested for food allergies, then. I know my food affects my moods. Or maybe it's not that simple? Maybe it's my food affects my energy levels, and whether I have a lot of energy or I'm lethargic affects my moods.
Eh, some of it might just be hormones and time. I'm older and past menopause. Life evens out a lot once that happens.
You beat my clever science edit! Drat. Also, insulin is a hormone, too.0 -
mamapeach910 wrote: »I would tend to think lack of flexibility leads to binge behaviors. Control snaps, the binge and overeating happens because you swear you'll get back on track and never eat the offending substance again. BUT... while you're eating the forbidden fruit, you shove as much as you can into your face because you're never ever having it. Lather, rinse, repeat.
As for food and mood? I used to think they were connected, now I disagree. My moods are entirely separate from my food. Food can't make me anything except not hungry. I enjoy something that's tasty, I get satisfaction from having cooked something delicious, but food has no control over how I feel.
I spent a while trying to untangle wanting to eat to soothe myself. I guess I'm finally there.
I should get tested for food allergies, then. I know my food affects my moods. Or maybe it's not that simple? Maybe it's my food affects my energy levels, and whether I have a lot of energy or I'm lethargic affects my moods.
Edit for Abstract:
Anxiety and depression: a common feature of health care seeking patients with irritable bowel syndrome and food allergy.
CONCLUSIONS: A higher prevalence of state anxiety found in patients complaining of bowel symptoms could be linked to the presence of chronic ill status. The higher presence of trait anxiety and depression in IBS and FA patients could be responsible for an increase in the activity of the autonomic nervous system and could provoke motility alterations through mast cell mediator release as well as enhancing release due to allergen crosslinking with IgE at the mast cell surface. However, it is debatable whether psychological findings are characteristic of all IBS or FA patients, or just represent the subset that see physicians.
http://europepmc.org/abstract/med/9840105
So which came first, the anxious chicken or the egg allergy?
I can tell you from my wife's experience, that when she ate gluten, she was consistently tired and exhausted. In fact, as soon as she came off of gluten, and respectively limiting carbs, she started to not take naps. But she also has a medical condition.
Personally, I found labeling foods as bad or good a cause for binge. When I restricted foods I loved, I failed at maintaining a deficit. So for me, I try to fit all foods I love into my diary and still maintain good nutrition.
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mamapeach910 wrote: »I would tend to think lack of flexibility leads to binge behaviors. Control snaps, the binge and overeating happens because you swear you'll get back on track and never eat the offending substance again. BUT... while you're eating the forbidden fruit, you shove as much as you can into your face because you're never ever having it. Lather, rinse, repeat.
As for food and mood? I used to think they were connected, now I disagree. My moods are entirely separate from my food. Food can't make me anything except not hungry. I enjoy something that's tasty, I get satisfaction from having cooked something delicious, but food has no control over how I feel.
I spent a while trying to untangle wanting to eat to soothe myself. I guess I'm finally there.
I should get tested for food allergies, then. I know my food affects my moods. Or maybe it's not that simple? Maybe it's my food affects my energy levels, and whether I have a lot of energy or I'm lethargic affects my moods.
Edit for Abstract:
Anxiety and depression: a common feature of health care seeking patients with irritable bowel syndrome and food allergy.
CONCLUSIONS: A higher prevalence of state anxiety found in patients complaining of bowel symptoms could be linked to the presence of chronic ill status. The higher presence of trait anxiety and depression in IBS and FA patients could be responsible for an increase in the activity of the autonomic nervous system and could provoke motility alterations through mast cell mediator release as well as enhancing release due to allergen crosslinking with IgE at the mast cell surface. However, it is debatable whether psychological findings are characteristic of all IBS or FA patients, or just represent the subset that see physicians.
http://europepmc.org/abstract/med/9840105
So which came first, the anxious chicken or the egg allergy?
I can tell you from my wife's experience, that when she ate gluten, she was consistently tired and exhausted. In fact, as soon as she came off of gluten, and respectively limiting carbs, she started to not take naps. But she also has a medical condition.
Personally, I found labeling foods as bad or good a cause for binge. When I restricted foods I loved, I failed at maintaining a deficit. So for me, I try to fit all foods I love into my diary and still maintain good nutrition.
The last time I ate sugary food I was mean as a snake (sorry snakes aren't really mean, I apologize to all the snakes I just slandered) and then I had gluten too, the last two days of it, and I was a vicious and depressed little beast (I apologize to all the beasts I just slandered).0 -
mamapeach910 wrote: »As for food and mood? I used to think they were connected, now I disagree. My moods are entirely separate from my food. Food can't make me anything except not hungry. I enjoy something that's tasty, I get satisfaction from having cooked something delicious, but food has no control over how I feel.
^Bam!0 -
mamapeach910 wrote: »I would tend to think lack of flexibility leads to binge behaviors. Control snaps, the binge and overeating happens because you swear you'll get back on track and never eat the offending substance again. BUT... while you're eating the forbidden fruit, you shove as much as you can into your face because you're never ever having it. Lather, rinse, repeat.
As for food and mood? I used to think they were connected, now I disagree. My moods are entirely separate from my food. Food can't make me anything except not hungry. I enjoy something that's tasty, I get satisfaction from having cooked something delicious, but food has no control over how I feel.
I spent a while trying to untangle wanting to eat to soothe myself. I guess I'm finally there.
I should get tested for food allergies, then. I know my food affects my moods. Or maybe it's not that simple? Maybe it's my food affects my energy levels, and whether I have a lot of energy or I'm lethargic affects my moods.
Edit for Abstract:
Anxiety and depression: a common feature of health care seeking patients with irritable bowel syndrome and food allergy.
CONCLUSIONS: A higher prevalence of state anxiety found in patients complaining of bowel symptoms could be linked to the presence of chronic ill status. The higher presence of trait anxiety and depression in IBS and FA patients could be responsible for an increase in the activity of the autonomic nervous system and could provoke motility alterations through mast cell mediator release as well as enhancing release due to allergen crosslinking with IgE at the mast cell surface. However, it is debatable whether psychological findings are characteristic of all IBS or FA patients, or just represent the subset that see physicians.
http://europepmc.org/abstract/med/9840105
So which came first, the anxious chicken or the egg allergy?
I can tell you from my wife's experience, that when she ate gluten, she was consistently tired and exhausted. In fact, as soon as she came off of gluten, and respectively limiting carbs, she started to not take naps. But she also has a medical condition.
Personally, I found labeling foods as bad or good a cause for binge. When I restricted foods I loved, I failed at maintaining a deficit. So for me, I try to fit all foods I love into my diary and still maintain good nutrition.
The last time I ate sugary food I was mean as a snake (sorry snakes aren't really mean, I apologize to all the snakes I just slandered) and then I had gluten too, the last two days of it, and I was a vicious and depressed little beast (I apologize to all the beasts I just slandered).
Does fruit make you mean?
No, but smoothies make me hungry and I think I did get a bit cranky a few hours later. From what I understand, the fiber is the key. I thought a blender preserved the fiber, but maybe not. I don't know, all I know is, delicious and nutritious as they were, they don't work for me, and I definitely can't drink juice.
Edit: Come to think of it, even sweetened gluten free certified oatmeal gives me hunger and irritability issues, and it has fiber, too. So I don't know what the fruit difference is. I haven't tried savory oatmeal to see if I'll overeat that and get cranky yet. Going to experiment with it soon.
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mamapeach910 wrote: »I would tend to think lack of flexibility leads to binge behaviors. Control snaps, the binge and overeating happens because you swear you'll get back on track and never eat the offending substance again. BUT... while you're eating the forbidden fruit, you shove as much as you can into your face because you're never ever having it. Lather, rinse, repeat.
As for food and mood? I used to think they were connected, now I disagree. My moods are entirely separate from my food. Food can't make me anything except not hungry. I enjoy something that's tasty, I get satisfaction from having cooked something delicious, but food has no control over how I feel.
I spent a while trying to untangle wanting to eat to soothe myself. I guess I'm finally there.
I should get tested for food allergies, then. I know my food affects my moods. Or maybe it's not that simple? Maybe it's my food affects my energy levels, and whether I have a lot of energy or I'm lethargic affects my moods.
Edit for Abstract:
Anxiety and depression: a common feature of health care seeking patients with irritable bowel syndrome and food allergy.
CONCLUSIONS: A higher prevalence of state anxiety found in patients complaining of bowel symptoms could be linked to the presence of chronic ill status. The higher presence of trait anxiety and depression in IBS and FA patients could be responsible for an increase in the activity of the autonomic nervous system and could provoke motility alterations through mast cell mediator release as well as enhancing release due to allergen crosslinking with IgE at the mast cell surface. However, it is debatable whether psychological findings are characteristic of all IBS or FA patients, or just represent the subset that see physicians.
http://europepmc.org/abstract/med/9840105
So which came first, the anxious chicken or the egg allergy?
I can tell you from my wife's experience, that when she ate gluten, she was consistently tired and exhausted. In fact, as soon as she came off of gluten, and respectively limiting carbs, she started to not take naps. But she also has a medical condition.
Personally, I found labeling foods as bad or good a cause for binge. When I restricted foods I loved, I failed at maintaining a deficit. So for me, I try to fit all foods I love into my diary and still maintain good nutrition.
The last time I ate sugary food I was mean as a snake (sorry snakes aren't really mean, I apologize to all the snakes I just slandered) and then I had gluten too, the last two days of it, and I was a vicious and depressed little beast (I apologize to all the beasts I just slandered).
With apology, I have to ask this:
Is it possible that you felt that way because you weren't "supposed" to have that stuff since you're low-carbing?
I very well remember how cheating on low-carbing felt. I was convinced offending substances could do things to me. I was wrong.
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The last time I ate sugary food I was mean as a snake (sorry snakes aren't really mean, I apologize to all the snakes I just slandered) and then I had gluten too, the last two days of it, and I was a vicious and depressed little beast (I apologize to all the beasts I just slandered).
I guess the question is, how are you making this correlations that XX foods makes you mean. Because whether sugar is from fruit or a piece of chocolate, your body will process it similar. And if you associate the fiber as being keying, what happens when you have chocolate and veggies?
ps- these are serious questions. I am not trying to discredit your findings.
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The last time I ate sugary food I was mean as a snake (sorry snakes aren't really mean, I apologize to all the snakes I just slandered) and then I had gluten too, the last two days of it, and I was a vicious and depressed little beast (I apologize to all the beasts I just slandered).
I guess the question is, how are you making this correlations that XX foods makes you mean. Because whether sugar is from fruit or a piece of chocolate, your body will process it similar. And if you associate the fiber as being keying, what happens when you have chocolate and veggies?
Well maybe it isn't the sugar. Maybe it's a preservative or additive. Maybe it's the chocolate (since that is mostly what I go for) Maybe I should eat a tablespoon of pure sugar and see if that does anything to me.
I know what happens if I have chocolate and veggies, though. Nothing good comes of it. I will crave it and I will not feel well later.0 -
mamapeach910 wrote: »mamapeach910 wrote: »I would tend to think lack of flexibility leads to binge behaviors. Control snaps, the binge and overeating happens because you swear you'll get back on track and never eat the offending substance again. BUT... while you're eating the forbidden fruit, you shove as much as you can into your face because you're never ever having it. Lather, rinse, repeat.
As for food and mood? I used to think they were connected, now I disagree. My moods are entirely separate from my food. Food can't make me anything except not hungry. I enjoy something that's tasty, I get satisfaction from having cooked something delicious, but food has no control over how I feel.
I spent a while trying to untangle wanting to eat to soothe myself. I guess I'm finally there.
I should get tested for food allergies, then. I know my food affects my moods. Or maybe it's not that simple? Maybe it's my food affects my energy levels, and whether I have a lot of energy or I'm lethargic affects my moods.
Edit for Abstract:
Anxiety and depression: a common feature of health care seeking patients with irritable bowel syndrome and food allergy.
CONCLUSIONS: A higher prevalence of state anxiety found in patients complaining of bowel symptoms could be linked to the presence of chronic ill status. The higher presence of trait anxiety and depression in IBS and FA patients could be responsible for an increase in the activity of the autonomic nervous system and could provoke motility alterations through mast cell mediator release as well as enhancing release due to allergen crosslinking with IgE at the mast cell surface. However, it is debatable whether psychological findings are characteristic of all IBS or FA patients, or just represent the subset that see physicians.
http://europepmc.org/abstract/med/9840105
So which came first, the anxious chicken or the egg allergy?
I can tell you from my wife's experience, that when she ate gluten, she was consistently tired and exhausted. In fact, as soon as she came off of gluten, and respectively limiting carbs, she started to not take naps. But she also has a medical condition.
Personally, I found labeling foods as bad or good a cause for binge. When I restricted foods I loved, I failed at maintaining a deficit. So for me, I try to fit all foods I love into my diary and still maintain good nutrition.
The last time I ate sugary food I was mean as a snake (sorry snakes aren't really mean, I apologize to all the snakes I just slandered) and then I had gluten too, the last two days of it, and I was a vicious and depressed little beast (I apologize to all the beasts I just slandered).
With apology, I have to ask this:
Is it possible that you felt that way because you weren't "supposed" to have that stuff since you're low-carbing?
I very well remember how cheating on low-carbing felt. I was convinced offending substances could do things to me. I was wrong.
This was before I went back to low carb, I was consciously attempting to work sweets into my diet, but I definitely start getting unhappy when my clothes start fitting tighter, too, and it doesn't take me long at all to gain enough weight for that to happen.
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Maybe it's just ad simple as you get cranky because you are hungry. Why look to a specific food to blame it on. You are not the only person that gets cranky when they are hungry.The last time I ate sugary food I was mean as a snake (sorry snakes aren't really mean, I apologize to all the snakes I just slandered) and then I had gluten too, the last two days of it, and I was a vicious and depressed little beast (I apologize to all the beasts I just slandered).
I guess the question is, how are you making this correlations that XX foods makes you mean. Because whether sugar is from fruit or a piece of chocolate, your body will process it similar. And if you associate the fiber as being keying, what happens when you have chocolate and veggies?
Well maybe it isn't the sugar. Maybe it's a preservative or additive. Maybe it's the chocolate (since that is mostly what I go for) Maybe I should eat a tablespoon of pure sugar and see if that does anything to me.
I know what happens if I have chocolate and veggies, though. Nothing good comes of it. I will crave it and I will not feel well later.
Well if I'm still hungry after 2000 calories of ice cream (and I always am) that pretty much negates CICO for me.0 -
I won't lie, I get irritated easy when I am hungry.
Maybe it's just ad simple as you get cranky because you are hungry. Why look to a specific food to blame it on. You are not the only person that gets cranky when they are hungry.The last time I ate sugary food I was mean as a snake (sorry snakes aren't really mean, I apologize to all the snakes I just slandered) and then I had gluten too, the last two days of it, and I was a vicious and depressed little beast (I apologize to all the beasts I just slandered).
I guess the question is, how are you making this correlations that XX foods makes you mean. Because whether sugar is from fruit or a piece of chocolate, your body will process it similar. And if you associate the fiber as being keying, what happens when you have chocolate and veggies?
Well maybe it isn't the sugar. Maybe it's a preservative or additive. Maybe it's the chocolate (since that is mostly what I go for) Maybe I should eat a tablespoon of pure sugar and see if that does anything to me.
I know what happens if I have chocolate and veggies, though. Nothing good comes of it. I will crave it and I will not feel well later.
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