it is probably not "muscle"
Options
Replies
-
newbie gains - when on obese beginner (or just a person that is new to lifting) begins a lifting regimen, is eating in a deficit, and gains some new muscle while eating in a deficit.0
-
So, in your opinion, while eating at a calorie deficit, regardless of the nutrient percentages, a non-beginner cannot gain muscle....
I'll be working with a powerlifting trainer later this week, perhaps I should not eat a deficit that day.0 -
Anyone else want to join me in partaking of the popcorn?-1 -
So, in your opinion, while eating at a calorie deficit, regardless of the nutrient percentages, a non-beginner cannot gain muscle....
I'll be working with a powerlifting trainer later this week, perhaps I should not eat a deficit that day.
Not opinion. Science. You can still cut on a power lifting program. You won't gain new muscle in a deficit.0 -
PrizePopple wrote: »
Anyone else want to join me in partaking of the popcorn?
I am partaking in unrealistic expectations-1 -
PrizePopple wrote: »
Anyone else want to join me in partaking of the popcorn?
I am partaking in unrealistic expectations
Can you pour melted butter over that?-1 -
So, in your opinion, while eating at a calorie deficit, regardless of the nutrient percentages, a non-beginner cannot gain muscle....
I'll be working with a powerlifting trainer later this week, perhaps I should not eat a deficit that day.
its not my opinion ..its backed up by studies as well and lyle mcdonald breaks it down pretty well here:
http://www.bodyrecomposition.com/fat-loss/adding-muscle-while-losing-fat-qa.html/
dont understand your point in the bolded part…
or is there one?0 -
Can you tell me more about the performance athlete who can gain muscle in a deficit? What the performance levels may be, do you mean like athletes that compete like sprinters who workout for hours per day?0
-
-
I would guess that when one has a significant amount of body fat, this can supply a large amount of calories to the body even when "eating" is at a deficit, thus supplying enough energy for muscle building to take place under the right circumstances. This is all speculation, of course. But in these cases I think that the use of "caloric deficit" may require more context than it is typically given.0
-
Can you tell me more about the performance athlete who can gain muscle in a deficit? What the performance levels may be, do you mean like athletes that compete like sprinters who workout for hours per day?
I believe they are referring to Olympic Athletes, NFL players etc.
I have not see anything on sprinters…..0 -
I would like you to expand your theory on that please.LiftAllThePizzas wrote: »I would guess that when one has a significant amount of body fat, this can supply a large amount of calories to the body even when "eating" is at a deficit, thus supplying enough energy for muscle building to take place under the right circumstances. This is all speculation, of course. But in these cases I think that the use of "caloric deficit" may require more context than it is typically given.
Tell me if this is what you mean:
(A)An obese individual would require a specific amount of calories to maintain basic life function plus sufficient energy to ward off muscle tissue catabolism, (B)the number of calories that person would need to maintain an obese weight can be very high, (C)they knock off sufficient calories to be in a nice deficit but at the same time the difference between A and C would provide enough extra nutrition to provide a positive nitrogen balance as well as glycogen, GH1, insulin etc to promote hypertrophy?
Not in that amount of detail, but yeah pretty much. Like I said it's pure speculation. What I was thinking was 1: what controls how much fat (energy) is released from fat cells when it is needed? And B: is this mechanism lock-stepped with actual energy needs, or can it be overridden/out of tune? (I'm fairly certain it can be out of tune, because IIRC nicotine causes fat cells to do this.)
So if more fat is being released from the cells than is needed for basic functions, where would the excess go? Would it free up dietary protein (and energy, etc) to be used for muscle building?
Also, I would think "deficit" and "surplus" are not a single system-wide thing because some cells might see the situation differently than others. (Isn't that pretty much what happens when newbie gains occur?)0 -
1. The obese beginner that starts out and is doing weight training where they lift progressively heavier things.
2. High performance athletes.
Can I ask why it's different for the obese beginner?
Are they more likely to build muscle in a deficit than a non-obese beginner?
(BTW not questioning because I don't believe it or anything, I am just interested!
) 0 -
People who are very overweight are usually insulin resistant to some degree. Insulin resistance tends to develop as you gain fat. It appears to represent an attempt by your body to stop you gaining more, or to help you lose fat once the excess calories are removed from your diet.SilverRose89 wrote: »1. The obese beginner that starts out and is doing weight training where they lift progressively heavier things.
2. High performance athletes.
Can I ask why it's different for the obese beginner?
Are they more likely to build muscle in a deficit than a non-obese beginner?
(BTW not questioning because I don't believe it or anything, I am just interested! )
Insulin is primarily a storage hormone. It helps to drive nutrients, such as glucose, from your blood into the cells of your body. High levels of insulin also inhibit the rate at which stored fat is mobilized (i.e. broken down and prepared to be burned off).
But when fat cells are insulin resistant, insulin doesn’t have the same effect. Which means that even in the presence of high insulin levels, fat can still be mobilized for fuel. The overall effect is as though fat cells are “full up” and resisting further fat storage.
When an overweight beginner starts exercising and dieting, nutrients are diverted away from fat cells (which are still insulin resistant) and towards muscle, which has become more insulin sensitive as a result of the training. The uptake of glucose in insulin resistant muscle is also reduced. Because there’s less glucose available, muscle cells will burn more fat.
From:http://muscleevo.net/calorie-deficit/0 -
Liftng4Lis wrote: »
People who are very overweight are usually insulin resistant to some degree. Insulin resistance tends to develop as you gain fat. It appears to represent an attempt by your body to stop you gaining more, or to help you lose fat once the excess calories are removed from your diet.SilverRose89 wrote: »1. The obese beginner that starts out and is doing weight training where they lift progressively heavier things.
2. High performance athletes.
Can I ask why it's different for the obese beginner?
Are they more likely to build muscle in a deficit than a non-obese beginner?
(BTW not questioning because I don't believe it or anything, I am just interested! )
Insulin is primarily a storage hormone. It helps to drive nutrients, such as glucose, from your blood into the cells of your body. High levels of insulin also inhibit the rate at which stored fat is mobilized (i.e. broken down and prepared to be burned off).
But when fat cells are insulin resistant, insulin doesn’t have the same effect. Which means that even in the presence of high insulin levels, fat can still be mobilized for fuel. The overall effect is as though fat cells are “full up” and resisting further fat storage.
When an overweight beginner starts exercising and dieting, nutrients are diverted away from fat cells (which are still insulin resistant) and towards muscle, which has become more insulin sensitive as a result of the training. The uptake of glucose in insulin resistant muscle is also reduced. Because there’s less glucose available, muscle cells will burn more fat.
From:http://muscleevo.net/calorie-deficit/
Brilliant explanation, thanks :flowerforyou:0 -
I know there was a study conducted a few years back and reviewed obese and or overweight folks in 3 separate groups of exercise. Aerobic, resistance, and a combo of the two. The group losing the greatest amount of fat was the aerobic group; the one which gained the most muscle(and/or lost the least amount of weight) was the resistance group. Stanford? Cleveland Clinic? Vanderbilt? Duke? one of these entities conducted the study. Where I read it, how long ago. . . .got me.
I'm digging for it. . . .0 -
So, in your opinion, while eating at a calorie deficit, regardless of the nutrient percentages, a non-beginner cannot gain muscle....
I'll be working with a powerlifting trainer later this week, perhaps I should not eat a deficit that day.
its not my opinion ..its backed up by studies as well and lyle mcdonald breaks it down pretty well here:
http://www.bodyrecomposition.com/fat-loss/adding-muscle-while-losing-fat-qa.html/
dont understand your point in the bolded part…
or is there one?
I think they're wanting to isolate the specific workout day and not eat at a deficit on that day in hopes of [continuing to] build muscle. Some people have expressed thoughts that you can build muscle in one day, cut the next...
Of course this is just my speculation
0
Categories
- All Categories
- 1.4M Health, Wellness and Goals
- 392.1K Introduce Yourself
- 43.6K Getting Started
- 259.9K Health and Weight Loss
- 175.7K Food and Nutrition
- 47.4K Recipes
- 232.4K Fitness and Exercise
- 403 Sleep, Mindfulness and Overall Wellness
- 6.4K Goal: Maintaining Weight
- 8.5K Goal: Gaining Weight and Body Building
- 152.8K Motivation and Support
- 7.9K Challenges
- 1.3K Debate Club
- 96.3K Chit-Chat
- 2.5K Fun and Games
- 3.4K MyFitnessPal Information
- 23 News and Announcements
- 982 Feature Suggestions and Ideas
- 2.4K MyFitnessPal Tech Support Questions