Do you view your old eating habits as a personal failing?
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AlabasterVerve wrote: »Do you work on changing yourself and the way you think about food to make your weight loss successful or do you opt for workarounds and compromises you can be happy with? Perhaps a little bit of both?
What's the practical difference between the two?
Anytime you really want something, you'll have to make compromises. That's the nature of wanting.
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Unlike most people, I DO see it as a personal failure. Mostly because I knew I was wrong, and that I should not be eating like that, yet I did it anyways. Sometimes by choice, sometimes because I couldn't help it. But yes, I see it as a failure.0
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herrspoons wrote: »LiftAllThePizzas wrote: »
Let's say I commute to work every day for 5 years. It takes me 30 minutes each way. And then one day I decide that I want to get there in 25 minutes and take steps to shorten my commute.herrspoons wrote: »If someone becomes fat then they have failed to eat at a maintenance level of calories. This may be intentional or through ignorance.
Yes or no?
Does that make all my past commutes failures, or my past behavior a failing?
I think the "failure" thing requires someone to actually be getting a result they specifically do not want or were trying to avoid. I think a lot of people simply don't care whether or not they are as healthy as they can be and/or think the trade-off of eating how they like to be the better side of the bargain.
Not unless there were negative consequences for arriving after 25 minutes. Eating more calories than you need makes you fat. That's quite clearly an example of a negative consequence.
I get what you're saying and I tend to agree. But....the world has changed, and being a 300 pounder doesn't carry nearly the negative consequences that it did, say, 100 years ago. There's a certain level of obesity our Mod Con culture allows us to get away with it - which is no doubt a big part of why we have so much of it.
So...while I viewed my weight gain as a personal failing, I don't know that it's right for everyone to do the same.
If you end up on My 600 Pound Life, that's a different story again, of course, because those people are genuinely helpless.
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herrspoons wrote: »I find it interesting that people are afraid of failure. Sometimes it's unavoidable and really just a learning opportunity.
For example, no one gets on a bike or in a car and rides or drives it away properly first time. You have to fail to do so, learn, and eventually succeed.
Failures generally allow you to learn from them (unless it's something like a failure to pack your parachute properly
:drinker:
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A failing, by definition, means you try to do something and fail at it.
Trying to stick to an eating pattern but being unable to do so is a failing.
Pigging out because you don't care is neither a failure nor a success, it just is.
Pigging out because you want to is a flawless victory (supposing what you ate was yum).
I've done all three at various times in my life.0 -
AlabasterVerve wrote: »Do you work on changing yourself and the way you think about food to make your weight loss successful or do you opt for workarounds and compromises you can be happy with? Perhaps a little bit of both?
What's the difference between the two?
Anytime you really want something, you'll have to make compromises. That's the nature of wanting.
I think the example we're using here is believing one brownie is the correct way (based on the assumption that's how the naturally not fat eat) and conditioning yourself to conform. Versus accepting you like lots of brownies but realize it's not compatible with your goals and working around that.
In the first scenario you're correcting a flaw in your person. In the second scenario, while it might work to control your weight, you're ignoring the root of the problem instead of fixing your perceived defect. Or at least that's how I interpret the discussion.
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I was just willfully ignorant. Did I "fail" myself? That's a word with very strong, negative connotation. Perhaps I did.
I do know that I sure "cheated" myself out of years of fitness and vitality, and compromised my health during that time (high BP and cholesterol and depression, due to extreme sedentary lifestyle, too much food and smoking, etc.).
However, failure only occurs if I choose to continue on that path and do nothing to reverse the damage I did to my body. I changed "everything" for the better (well, I still eat McD's and Taco Bell, etc.--just far less often, and in appropriate quantity, LOL). And by doing so, I did not fail. I simply lost my way for a while.0 -
AlabasterVerve wrote: »AlabasterVerve wrote: »Do you work on changing yourself and the way you think about food to make your weight loss successful or do you opt for workarounds and compromises you can be happy with? Perhaps a little bit of both?
What's the difference between the two?
Anytime you really want something, you'll have to make compromises. That's the nature of wanting.
I think the example we're using here is believing one brownie is the correct way (based on the assumption that's how the naturally not fat eat) and conditioning yourself to conform. Versus accepting you like lots of brownies but realize it's not compatible with your goals and working around that.
In the first scenario you're correcting a flaw in your person. In the second scenario, while it might work to control your weight, you're ignoring the root of the problem instead of working on your perceived defect. Or at least that's how I interpret the discussion.
Well I for one don't accept that wanting more than one brownie is a "flaw". If someone wants to make that assumption, they're welcome to, but it's not one I share.
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I think @mamapeach910's use of "personal failing" as defined in the OP could be changed to "habit" and this is where some of the confusion is coming in.
But I also find the desire to label nothing we do as failure to be interesting. I am terrified of failure, so much so that I'd rather not try than fail. This is a problem that I'm trying to work on, and I have a feeling I'm not the only one who is afraid of it.
My eating habits absolutely had to be corrected. I went from being a very active 14-15 year old to a less active 16-17 year old due to my priorities shifting, to a hypothyroid 18-19 year old. What I was doing at 14 clearly needed to change for my 19 year old self as evidenced by the 50lbs I had gained.
I wouldn't define it as a failure, though, because I don't want to feel the other emotions that goes with failure for me. But do I think it? Yup.
I think there's a difference between not defining anything as failure and reserving the word for where it belongs. If I decide I'm going to lose weight, watch Fat Sick & Nearly Dead, drink liquid kale for 3 days, then eat a pan of brownies, I have failed at the "buy my branded line of juicers" diet. If I am not paying attention to diet and just living normal life, then eat a pan of brownies, I haven't failed at living normal life, just made a questionable decision while living it. Trying to describe everything one has done in the past as "failure" in relation to what one is doing today sounds more like someone trying to convince themselves they're doing the right thing now than any realistic assessment of the past.0 -
A failing, by definition, means you try to do something and fail at it.
Trying to stick to an eating pattern but being unable to do so is a failing.
Pigging out because you don't care is neither a failure nor a success, it just is.
Pigging out because you want to is a flawless victory (supposing what you ate was yum).
I've done all three at various times in my life.
I like this. I don't consider my overeating years a failure because I wasn't even trying to get healthy or lose weight.0 -
I think @mamapeach910's use of "personal failing" as defined in the OP could be changed to "habit" and this is where some of the confusion is coming in.
But I also find the desire to label nothing we do as failure to be interesting. I am terrified of failure, so much so that I'd rather not try than fail. This is a problem that I'm trying to work on, and I have a feeling I'm not the only one who is afraid of it.
My eating habits absolutely had to be corrected. I went from being a very active 14-15 year old to a less active 16-17 year old due to my priorities shifting, to a hypothyroid 18-19 year old. What I was doing at 14 clearly needed to change for my 19 year old self as evidenced by the 50lbs I had gained.
I wouldn't define it as a failure, though, because I don't want to feel the other emotions that goes with failure for me. But do I think it? Yup.
I think there's a difference between not defining anything as failure and reserving the word for where it belongs. If I decide I'm going to lose weight, watch Fat Sick & Nearly Dead, drink liquid kale for 3 days, then eat a pan of brownies, I have failed at the "buy my branded line of juicers" diet. If I am not paying attention to diet and just living normal life, then eat a pan of brownies, I haven't failed at living normal life, just made a questionable decision while living it. Trying to describe everything one has done in the past as "failure" in relation to what one is doing today sounds more like someone trying to convince themselves they're doing the right thing now than any realistic assessment of the past.
That sounds like a heft dose of projection and avoidance of the past, sorry.
Having failed at controlling your eating isn't failing at life and no one ever said it was. It was just making a mistake, and this was clarified earlier.
If you can't acknowledge and own responsibility for your own mistakes to the point that OTHERS doing so causes you to twist what's being said like this, I have to wonder .... why are you so afraid of being ever having been wrong?
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AlabasterVerve wrote: »AlabasterVerve wrote: »Do you work on changing yourself and the way you think about food to make your weight loss successful or do you opt for workarounds and compromises you can be happy with? Perhaps a little bit of both?
What's the difference between the two?
Anytime you really want something, you'll have to make compromises. That's the nature of wanting.
I think the example we're using here is believing one brownie is the correct way (based on the assumption that's how the naturally not fat eat) and conditioning yourself to conform. Versus accepting you like lots of brownies but realize it's not compatible with your goals and working around that.
In the first scenario you're correcting a flaw in your person. In the second scenario, while it might work to control your weight, you're ignoring the root of the problem instead of working on your perceived defect. Or at least that's how I interpret the discussion.
Well I for one don't accept that wanting more than one brownie is a "flaw". If someone wants to make that assumption, they're welcome to, but it's not one I share.
Well, there's somewhere between wanting more than one brownie and not being able to stop yourself until the whole pan is gone that it stops being with the range of normative behavior and starts being a problem.
I agree that it's perfectly okay to want more than one brownie. I was giving the example of one brownie because, short old lady that I am, that's all that will fit in my particular calorie limit. Someone else's mileage may vary.
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I think @mamapeach910's use of "personal failing" as defined in the OP could be changed to "habit" and this is where some of the confusion is coming in.
But I also find the desire to label nothing we do as failure to be interesting. I am terrified of failure, so much so that I'd rather not try than fail. This is a problem that I'm trying to work on, and I have a feeling I'm not the only one who is afraid of it.
My eating habits absolutely had to be corrected. I went from being a very active 14-15 year old to a less active 16-17 year old due to my priorities shifting, to a hypothyroid 18-19 year old. What I was doing at 14 clearly needed to change for my 19 year old self as evidenced by the 50lbs I had gained.
I wouldn't define it as a failure, though, because I don't want to feel the other emotions that goes with failure for me. But do I think it? Yup.
I think there's a difference between not defining anything as failure and reserving the word for where it belongs. If I decide I'm going to lose weight, watch Fat Sick & Nearly Dead, drink liquid kale for 3 days, then eat a pan of brownies, I have failed at the "buy my branded line of juicers" diet. If I am not paying attention to diet and just living normal life, then eat a pan of brownies, I haven't failed at living normal life, just made a questionable decision while living it. Trying to describe everything one has done in the past as "failure" in relation to what one is doing today sounds more like someone trying to convince themselves they're doing the right thing now than any realistic assessment of the past.
I'm going to have to disagree with you there. I think the power of the word "failure" as seen in some of these responses, including my own, comes from the fact that we give it that much power - we only use it where it "belongs." I can only speak for myself but I know for me, I only want to reserve the word for circumstances that end in such absolute, without a doubt, being unable to succeed; I see this in a lot of the other posts as well.
I can admit, though, that choosing to not try than failure is just another form of failure, in the long run.
ETA: I am trying to get at that I think the word "failure" belongs in a lot more places than we're comfortable with it being, but that's on us, not on the word.
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mamapeach910 wrote: »I think @mamapeach910's use of "personal failing" as defined in the OP could be changed to "habit" and this is where some of the confusion is coming in.
But I also find the desire to label nothing we do as failure to be interesting. I am terrified of failure, so much so that I'd rather not try than fail. This is a problem that I'm trying to work on, and I have a feeling I'm not the only one who is afraid of it.
My eating habits absolutely had to be corrected. I went from being a very active 14-15 year old to a less active 16-17 year old due to my priorities shifting, to a hypothyroid 18-19 year old. What I was doing at 14 clearly needed to change for my 19 year old self as evidenced by the 50lbs I had gained.
I wouldn't define it as a failure, though, because I don't want to feel the other emotions that goes with failure for me. But do I think it? Yup.
I think there's a difference between not defining anything as failure and reserving the word for where it belongs. If I decide I'm going to lose weight, watch Fat Sick & Nearly Dead, drink liquid kale for 3 days, then eat a pan of brownies, I have failed at the "buy my branded line of juicers" diet. If I am not paying attention to diet and just living normal life, then eat a pan of brownies, I haven't failed at living normal life, just made a questionable decision while living it. Trying to describe everything one has done in the past as "failure" in relation to what one is doing today sounds more like someone trying to convince themselves they're doing the right thing now than any realistic assessment of the past.
That sounds like a heft dose of projection and avoidance of the past, sorry.
Having failed at controlling your eating isn't failing at life and no one ever said it was. It was just making a mistake, and this was clarified earlier.
If you can't acknowledge and own responsibility for your own mistakes to the point that OTHERS doing so causes you to twist what's being said like this, I have to wonder .... why are you so afraid of being ever having been wrong?
I find that ironic, because from my POV, it is you who constantly adds emotional baggage to what other people have said or done. If they refuse to call something a failure, they must be disordered. If they cut something out, it must be disordered. If they use the word "addiction" instead of "habit" it must be disordered. You seem to project a lot of denial onto what other people mean, which leads to threads like this, where everyone spends 3 days debating semantics.
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herrspoons wrote: »I find it interesting that people are afraid of failure. Sometimes it's unavoidable and really just a learning opportunity.
For example, no one gets on a bike or in a car and rides or drives it away properly first time. You have to fail to do so, learn, and eventually succeed.
Failures generally allow you to learn from them (unless it's something like a failure to pack your parachute properly).
Yup. It's what I tell everyone but myself about failure, so I know it's a me issue and not an anything else issue. People look at me like I'm crazy, and I think it's because many of us don't look at failure as an opportunity to learn but as something you're unable to recover from.
Which, of course, is silly, but I'm also not saying that it's rational.
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But that's just an opinion. Missing out on something you want/like is also a negative consequence. Just because you put "not being fat" at a higher priority does not mean everyone else does or should.herrspoons wrote: »LiftAllThePizzas wrote: »
Let's say I commute to work every day for 5 years. It takes me 30 minutes each way. And then one day I decide that I want to get there in 25 minutes and take steps to shorten my commute.herrspoons wrote: »If someone becomes fat then they have failed to eat at a maintenance level of calories. This may be intentional or through ignorance.
Yes or no?
Does that make all my past commutes failures, or my past behavior a failing?
I think the "failure" thing requires someone to actually be getting a result they specifically do not want or were trying to avoid. I think a lot of people simply don't care whether or not they are as healthy as they can be and/or think the trade-off of eating how they like to be the better side of the bargain.
Not unless there were negative consequences for arriving after 25 minutes. Eating more calories than you need makes you fat. That's quite clearly an example of a negative consequence.0 -
mamapeach910 wrote: »I think @mamapeach910's use of "personal failing" as defined in the OP could be changed to "habit" and this is where some of the confusion is coming in.
But I also find the desire to label nothing we do as failure to be interesting. I am terrified of failure, so much so that I'd rather not try than fail. This is a problem that I'm trying to work on, and I have a feeling I'm not the only one who is afraid of it.
My eating habits absolutely had to be corrected. I went from being a very active 14-15 year old to a less active 16-17 year old due to my priorities shifting, to a hypothyroid 18-19 year old. What I was doing at 14 clearly needed to change for my 19 year old self as evidenced by the 50lbs I had gained.
I wouldn't define it as a failure, though, because I don't want to feel the other emotions that goes with failure for me. But do I think it? Yup.
I think there's a difference between not defining anything as failure and reserving the word for where it belongs. If I decide I'm going to lose weight, watch Fat Sick & Nearly Dead, drink liquid kale for 3 days, then eat a pan of brownies, I have failed at the "buy my branded line of juicers" diet. If I am not paying attention to diet and just living normal life, then eat a pan of brownies, I haven't failed at living normal life, just made a questionable decision while living it. Trying to describe everything one has done in the past as "failure" in relation to what one is doing today sounds more like someone trying to convince themselves they're doing the right thing now than any realistic assessment of the past.
That sounds like a heft dose of projection and avoidance of the past, sorry.
Having failed at controlling your eating isn't failing at life and no one ever said it was. It was just making a mistake, and this was clarified earlier.
If you can't acknowledge and own responsibility for your own mistakes to the point that OTHERS doing so causes you to twist what's being said like this, I have to wonder .... why are you so afraid of being ever having been wrong?
I find that ironic, because from my POV, it is you who constantly adds emotional baggage to what other people have said or done. If they refuse to call something a failure, they must be disordered. [
Nope. Try again. From my post earlier:I think a lot of people are balking at the words "personal failure" because the sound loaded.
Whatever. If you feel more comfortable calling it a bad choice or a poor prior behavior, that's cool too.If they cut something out, it must be disordered.
Find a post where I've said that. Please do. I, in fact, often recommend doing just that to people having trouble with overconsumption of sugar to reset their palates.If they use the word "addiction" instead of "habit" it must be disordered. You seem to project a lot of denial onto what other people mean, which leads to threads like this, where everyone spends 3 days debating semantics.
What? Because I don't believe in food addiction and argue against it you've constructed a scenario wherein I'm in denial... of WHAT exactly?
You do tend to see boogeymen in the bushes, don't you?
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herrspoons wrote: »I find it interesting that people are afraid of failure. Sometimes it's unavoidable and really just a learning opportunity.
For example, no one gets on a bike or in a car and rides or drives it away properly first time. You have to fail to do so, learn, and eventually succeed.
Failures generally allow you to learn from them (unless it's something like a failure to pack your parachute properly).
Learning to fail and not to find fear of it a deterrent against even trying is a major life skill that I think more people would be better off knowing. I used to have the sense that women were more likely to suffer from it than men and thought that was something that could (and would) change as more girls got involved in athletics, as that seemed to be a big source of this lesson for men.
Not sure what I think now, except that I still think it's important.0 -
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Agreed.herrspoons wrote: »I find it interesting that people are afraid of failure. Sometimes it's unavoidable and really just a learning opportunity.
For example, no one gets on a bike or in a car and rides or drives it away properly first time. You have to fail to do so, learn, and eventually succeed.
Failures generally allow you to learn from them (unless it's something like a failure to pack your parachute properly).
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