Losing Weight is NOT that simple..imo..
Replies
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kittywrangler wrote: »Good post. I see it all the time certain posters become parrots and even though their message isn't directed at ME, it bugs the stink out of me to see the same patronizing
"Eat at a caloric deficit, you'll lose weight" message.
Everyones journey is different.
Yes everyone's "journey" is different. However, the science of weight loss is the same.0 -
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kittywrangler wrote: »Good post. I see it all the time certain posters become parrots and even though their message isn't directed at ME, it bugs the stink out of me to see the same patronizing
"Eat at a caloric deficit, you'll lose weight" message.
Everyones journey is different.
@kittywrangler - so what should the message be?
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danieltsmoke wrote: »strong_curves wrote: »danieltsmoke wrote: »
But you didn't ask any questions in your original post. You claimed CICO doesn't work, too hard and filled with inaccuracies.
I literally didn't claim any of those things..did you read my first post? Literally the entire purpose was to express how pointless the advice of "just eat less calories than you burn" is..like someone else pointed out, it's like telling an alcoholic "hey..just don't drink anymore"...but what it does accomplish is furthering that persons frustration but making something they find very difficult and unknown, seem like a basic math problem.
So we should stop telling people to use CICO? And let them believe it's hard? Because CICO isn't hard, what IS hard is actually making the commitment to maintaining a deficit through the method of your choice, and following through. And it's also hard for people to accept that maybe there are things they are doing wrong, that need to be corrected. It's easier to blame the culprit of your choice (fats, carbs, metabolism, starvation mode, etc) than it is to accept that the difficulty is within.0 -
MoiAussi93 wrote: »MoiAussi93 wrote: »kimberlyjoy159 wrote: »But sometimes people need to see the second step in order to grasp the first step. Sometimes understanding CICO comes when they get help in that process. There is the truth or fact of CICO and there is how to apply it in my setting.
Agreed. Telling someone just that losing weight is all about CICO is about as helpful as telling someone that the proper way to prepare dinner is to cook the food. It's kind of self-evident, and it's definitely true, but it doesn't help at all in the process to achieve that end result. There are steps to cooking food, and there are steps to achieving CICO.
Agreed. Even if a person has no clue how many calories are in anything, most adults realize that the more you eat the more you will gain, and the way to lose is to eat less. Great. However if it was that simple, nobody would be overweight. What most people are really looking for is help with specific strategies to do that. Instead they get 17 people who will beat them over the head with the "it's all just CICO".
Simple doesn't mean easy. And simple is often overlooked in the multi-million dollar diet and weight loss industry. Simple is hard to make money off.
It is all CICO. Actually doing it is a lot harder. Accurately logging and weighing is not something most are accustomed. Following all these rules and diet plans that guarantee success is something that people are used to. I've fallen victim to that more times than I could count. I failed on most of them. That is why I was overweight, not because I couldn't count but because I was convinced it was more complicated than just counting.
So I will say CICO til the cows come home. If that grates, please feel free to ignore me. I will still say it for those who it might make a difference for...like it did for me.
It doesn't grate, I just don't think it is very helpful.
But we disagree, so that's just how it is.
And I think it is super helpful. Lucky thing the internet allows for both to exist, so we're good.
I agree. I wouldn't be where I am today, if it weren't for the forums and all the people that were helpful and giving correct information.0 -
Yes...thank you OP!!
I get it and think the exact same things. Measuring your food to the hundredths point doesn't matter when the fda approves a 20% margin in accuracy.
It's not easy and crazy weighing is fringing on disordered eating.
I like you.0 -
Maybe MFP should not allow new members to post until they've scrolled through at least 5 pages of newb threads... then, we won't see the same questions asked, and the same answers given. Then maybe people won't make threads about members harping on about CICO.
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MoiAussi93 wrote: »MoiAussi93 wrote: »kimberlyjoy159 wrote: »But sometimes people need to see the second step in order to grasp the first step. Sometimes understanding CICO comes when they get help in that process. There is the truth or fact of CICO and there is how to apply it in my setting.
Agreed. Telling someone just that losing weight is all about CICO is about as helpful as telling someone that the proper way to prepare dinner is to cook the food. It's kind of self-evident, and it's definitely true, but it doesn't help at all in the process to achieve that end result. There are steps to cooking food, and there are steps to achieving CICO.
Agreed. Even if a person has no clue how many calories are in anything, most adults realize that the more you eat the more you will gain, and the way to lose is to eat less. Great. However if it was that simple, nobody would be overweight. What most people are really looking for is help with specific strategies to do that. Instead they get 17 people who will beat them over the head with the "it's all just CICO".
Simple doesn't mean easy. And simple is often overlooked in the multi-million dollar diet and weight loss industry. Simple is hard to make money off.
It is all CICO. Actually doing it is a lot harder. Accurately logging and weighing is not something most are accustomed. Following all these rules and diet plans that guarantee success is something that people are used to. I've fallen victim to that more times than I could count. I failed on most of them. That is why I was overweight, not because I couldn't count but because I was convinced it was more complicated than just counting.
So I will say CICO til the cows come home. If that grates, please feel free to ignore me. I will still say it for those who it might make a difference for...like it did for me.
It doesn't grate, I just don't think it is very helpful.
But we disagree, so that's just how it is.
And I think it is super helpful. Lucky thing the internet allows for both to exist, so we're good.
I agree. I wouldn't be where I am today, if it weren't for the forums and all the people that were helpful and giving correct information.
Me three. I've reached a weight I never thought possible, by learning to accurately count calories with the help of a food scale, and making smarter choices.0 -
It's not real helpful to OPs when they say they're having a hard time and a bunch of people come in to brag, "It's easy for me!"blankiefinder wrote: »danieltsmoke wrote: »strong_curves wrote: »danieltsmoke wrote: »
But you didn't ask any questions in your original post. You claimed CICO doesn't work, too hard and filled with inaccuracies.
I literally didn't claim any of those things..did you read my first post? Literally the entire purpose was to express how pointless the advice of "just eat less calories than you burn" is..like someone else pointed out, it's like telling an alcoholic "hey..just don't drink anymore"...but what it does accomplish is furthering that persons frustration but making something they find very difficult and unknown, seem like a basic math problem.
So we should stop telling people to use CICO? And let them believe it's hard? Because CICO isn't hard, what IS hard is actually making the commitment to maintaining a deficit through the method of your choice, and following through. And it's also hard for people to accept that maybe there are things they are doing wrong, that need to be corrected. It's easier to blame the culprit of your choice (fats, carbs, metabolism, starvation mode, etc) than it is to accept that the difficulty is within.
Who does that help?
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If the threads upset you and you're tired of answering the same questions over and over, don't answer them. That's easy enough, right?ogmomma2012 wrote: »Maybe MFP should not allow new members to post until they've scrolled through at least 5 pages of newb threads... then, we won't see the same questions asked, and the same answers given. Then maybe people won't make threads about members harping on about CICO.
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tannibal_lecter wrote: »Yes...thank you OP!!
I get it and think the exact same things. Measuring your food to the hundredths point doesn't matter when the fda approves a 20% margin in accuracy.
It's not easy and crazy weighing is fringing on disordered eating.
I like you.
I been weighing my food for over 2 years now, have no ED.
ED is when I was eating 900 calories so I could lose weight fast. Yep, I did that about 6 or so years ago, lost the weight and regain it plus some.0 -
It's not real helpful to OPs when they say they're having a hard time and a bunch of people come in to brag, "It's easy for me!"blankiefinder wrote: »danieltsmoke wrote: »strong_curves wrote: »danieltsmoke wrote: »
But you didn't ask any questions in your original post. You claimed CICO doesn't work, too hard and filled with inaccuracies.
I literally didn't claim any of those things..did you read my first post? Literally the entire purpose was to express how pointless the advice of "just eat less calories than you burn" is..like someone else pointed out, it's like telling an alcoholic "hey..just don't drink anymore"...but what it does accomplish is furthering that persons frustration but making something they find very difficult and unknown, seem like a basic math problem.
So we should stop telling people to use CICO? And let them believe it's hard? Because CICO isn't hard, what IS hard is actually making the commitment to maintaining a deficit through the method of your choice, and following through. And it's also hard for people to accept that maybe there are things they are doing wrong, that need to be corrected. It's easier to blame the culprit of your choice (fats, carbs, metabolism, starvation mode, etc) than it is to accept that the difficulty is within.
Who does that help?
I haven't seen anyone brag in the threads I have been in. Even the diet pill ones. Many more people give encouragement than just say "well I have self control so you should too" it's more like "we've been there, keep on going, make sure you're on point with your calories and the weight will drop off again" so that's a pretty big exaggeration.0 -
I can't count how many times I have offered advice on how to log accurately etc etc. I don't go in posts and brag it was easy. I do feel that it does people a disservice to emphasize how hard it is, as to me, it comes down to lifestyle, commitment, and daily choices. No one knows how hard it will be for someone else, as no one knows how those three elements will come into play for that individual.0
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If the threads upset you and you're tired of answering the same questions over and over, don't answer them. That's easy enough, right?ogmomma2012 wrote: »Maybe MFP should not allow new members to post until they've scrolled through at least 5 pages of newb threads... then, we won't see the same questions asked, and the same answers given. Then maybe people won't make threads about members harping on about CICO.
Personally, I'd rather stay and try to help others, but I know there are some who would rather we all just went away.0 -
I have never seen anyone do that.
It's not real helpful to OPs when they say they're having a hard time and a bunch of people come in to brag, "It's easy for me!"blankiefinder wrote: »danieltsmoke wrote: »strong_curves wrote: »danieltsmoke wrote: »
But you didn't ask any questions in your original post. You claimed CICO doesn't work, too hard and filled with inaccuracies.
I literally didn't claim any of those things..did you read my first post? Literally the entire purpose was to express how pointless the advice of "just eat less calories than you burn" is..like someone else pointed out, it's like telling an alcoholic "hey..just don't drink anymore"...but what it does accomplish is furthering that persons frustration but making something they find very difficult and unknown, seem like a basic math problem.
So we should stop telling people to use CICO? And let them believe it's hard? Because CICO isn't hard, what IS hard is actually making the commitment to maintaining a deficit through the method of your choice, and following through. And it's also hard for people to accept that maybe there are things they are doing wrong, that need to be corrected. It's easier to blame the culprit of your choice (fats, carbs, metabolism, starvation mode, etc) than it is to accept that the difficulty is within.
Who does that help?
First question I always ask is "Do you weigh your food?"
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blankiefinder wrote: »
If the threads upset you and you're tired of answering the same questions over and over, don't answer them. That's easy enough, right?ogmomma2012 wrote: »Maybe MFP should not allow new members to post until they've scrolled through at least 5 pages of newb threads... then, we won't see the same questions asked, and the same answers given. Then maybe people won't make threads about members harping on about CICO.
Personally, I'd rather stay and try to help others, but I know there are some who would rather we all just went away.
Agree.0 -
If the threads upset you and you're tired of answering the same questions over and over, don't answer them. That's easy enough, right?ogmomma2012 wrote: »Maybe MFP should not allow new members to post until they've scrolled through at least 5 pages of newb threads... then, we won't see the same questions asked, and the same answers given. Then maybe people won't make threads about members harping on about CICO.
What kind of answer do people want? No one has special snowflake syndrome on MFP. The long-time members make that clear. This isn't JUST for supporting people in whatever they choose to do. People also dispel weight loss myths and diet scams. It wouldn't be logical to expect anything but the scientific truth, and if people were to stop posting, then the forums would be dead a lot of the time. I think that would suck.0 -
I have never seen anyone do that.
It's not real helpful to OPs when they say they're having a hard time and a bunch of people come in to brag, "It's easy for me!"blankiefinder wrote: »danieltsmoke wrote: »strong_curves wrote: »danieltsmoke wrote: »
But you didn't ask any questions in your original post. You claimed CICO doesn't work, too hard and filled with inaccuracies.
I literally didn't claim any of those things..did you read my first post? Literally the entire purpose was to express how pointless the advice of "just eat less calories than you burn" is..like someone else pointed out, it's like telling an alcoholic "hey..just don't drink anymore"...but what it does accomplish is furthering that persons frustration but making something they find very difficult and unknown, seem like a basic math problem.
So we should stop telling people to use CICO? And let them believe it's hard? Because CICO isn't hard, what IS hard is actually making the commitment to maintaining a deficit through the method of your choice, and following through. And it's also hard for people to accept that maybe there are things they are doing wrong, that need to be corrected. It's easier to blame the culprit of your choice (fats, carbs, metabolism, starvation mode, etc) than it is to accept that the difficulty is within.
Who does that help?
First question I always ask is "Do you weigh your food?"
Yes, and we're being told this is useless. I'll add myself to the list of people waiting to hear what a more useful response might be.
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They do it all the time. I think someone did it in this thread. It's very common.ogmomma2012 wrote: »
It's not real helpful to OPs when they say they're having a hard time and a bunch of people come in to brag, "It's easy for me!"blankiefinder wrote: »danieltsmoke wrote: »strong_curves wrote: »danieltsmoke wrote: »
But you didn't ask any questions in your original post. You claimed CICO doesn't work, too hard and filled with inaccuracies.
I literally didn't claim any of those things..did you read my first post? Literally the entire purpose was to express how pointless the advice of "just eat less calories than you burn" is..like someone else pointed out, it's like telling an alcoholic "hey..just don't drink anymore"...but what it does accomplish is furthering that persons frustration but making something they find very difficult and unknown, seem like a basic math problem.
So we should stop telling people to use CICO? And let them believe it's hard? Because CICO isn't hard, what IS hard is actually making the commitment to maintaining a deficit through the method of your choice, and following through. And it's also hard for people to accept that maybe there are things they are doing wrong, that need to be corrected. It's easier to blame the culprit of your choice (fats, carbs, metabolism, starvation mode, etc) than it is to accept that the difficulty is within.
Who does that help?
I haven't seen anyone brag in the threads I have been in. Even the diet pill ones. Many more people give encouragement than just say "well I have self control so you should too" it's more like "we've been there, keep on going, make sure you're on point with your calories and the weight will drop off again" so that's a pretty big exaggeration.
Diet bragging, food bragging, twisting things around to make them things they aren't, arguing for CICO when nobody argued against it. So very common.
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danieltsmoke wrote: »If I had any advice to offer to people struggling, I'd say it's all about trial and error, which can be frustratingly slow. You gotta try something, whether its working out more, or trying to stay under a certain amount-ish of calories, and see how that goes for a few weeks. If that doesn't work, change it up, and try again. Patience has been my biggest struggle but probably my greatest ally during the last few months, and I know that once you find your groove you're gonna kick your fitness goals right in the somewhat large *kitten*. Rant over..
I 100% agree!!!! There is no special formula. It's not about fitting into a dress in 3 months. It's about making calculated changes, every single day of your life for the rest of your life.
Make "Educated guesses" on how/what/how much you should be eating and how/what/how much you should be exercising, do that for 6 weeks, if the weight is going up, scale down & do the new routine for 6 more weeks, if the weight is going down, keep doing what you're doing until the scale stops... then intensify.0 -
kittywrangler wrote: »Good post. I see it all the time certain posters become parrots and even though their message isn't directed at ME, it bugs the stink out of me to see the same patronizing
"Eat at a caloric deficit, you'll lose weight" message.
Everyones journey is different.
So what would you tell someone who is asking for help on why they are not losing weight??
Its not the message I disagree with, its the delivery. Often times many people are asking for help and its just a blunt delivery of the same message with no insight or advice on how to achieve it. I've seen people post "educate yourself", well I'm fairly certain most people who are asking questions are trying to do just that. Maybe its just me, but there is a definite "tone" in some responses and it makes me sad. @Serah87 @3dogsrunning @Debmal77 The journey is they need more help than a simple" CICO statement.0 -
They do it all the time. I think someone did it in this thread. It's very common.ogmomma2012 wrote: »
It's not real helpful to OPs when they say they're having a hard time and a bunch of people come in to brag, "It's easy for me!"blankiefinder wrote: »danieltsmoke wrote: »strong_curves wrote: »danieltsmoke wrote: »
But you didn't ask any questions in your original post. You claimed CICO doesn't work, too hard and filled with inaccuracies.
I literally didn't claim any of those things..did you read my first post? Literally the entire purpose was to express how pointless the advice of "just eat less calories than you burn" is..like someone else pointed out, it's like telling an alcoholic "hey..just don't drink anymore"...but what it does accomplish is furthering that persons frustration but making something they find very difficult and unknown, seem like a basic math problem.
So we should stop telling people to use CICO? And let them believe it's hard? Because CICO isn't hard, what IS hard is actually making the commitment to maintaining a deficit through the method of your choice, and following through. And it's also hard for people to accept that maybe there are things they are doing wrong, that need to be corrected. It's easier to blame the culprit of your choice (fats, carbs, metabolism, starvation mode, etc) than it is to accept that the difficulty is within.
Who does that help?
I haven't seen anyone brag in the threads I have been in. Even the diet pill ones. Many more people give encouragement than just say "well I have self control so you should too" it's more like "we've been there, keep on going, make sure you're on point with your calories and the weight will drop off again" so that's a pretty big exaggeration.
Diet bragging, food bragging, twisting things around to make them things they aren't, arguing for CICO when nobody argued against it. So very common.
I think arguing for CICO only happens when someone pops in like "But you can't be healthy if you're eating pizza and twinkies all day so you can't lose weight eating junk food". Only things that I have seen are the humble-brag threads started by someone who wants attention for their personal achievements.0 -
They do it all the time. I think someone did it in this thread. It's very common.ogmomma2012 wrote: »
It's not real helpful to OPs when they say they're having a hard time and a bunch of people come in to brag, "It's easy for me!"blankiefinder wrote: »danieltsmoke wrote: »strong_curves wrote: »danieltsmoke wrote: »
But you didn't ask any questions in your original post. You claimed CICO doesn't work, too hard and filled with inaccuracies.
I literally didn't claim any of those things..did you read my first post? Literally the entire purpose was to express how pointless the advice of "just eat less calories than you burn" is..like someone else pointed out, it's like telling an alcoholic "hey..just don't drink anymore"...but what it does accomplish is furthering that persons frustration but making something they find very difficult and unknown, seem like a basic math problem.
So we should stop telling people to use CICO? And let them believe it's hard? Because CICO isn't hard, what IS hard is actually making the commitment to maintaining a deficit through the method of your choice, and following through. And it's also hard for people to accept that maybe there are things they are doing wrong, that need to be corrected. It's easier to blame the culprit of your choice (fats, carbs, metabolism, starvation mode, etc) than it is to accept that the difficulty is within.
Who does that help?
I haven't seen anyone brag in the threads I have been in. Even the diet pill ones. Many more people give encouragement than just say "well I have self control so you should too" it's more like "we've been there, keep on going, make sure you're on point with your calories and the weight will drop off again" so that's a pretty big exaggeration.
Diet bragging, food bragging, twisting things around to make them things they aren't, arguing for CICO when nobody argued against it. So very common.
Outside of this thread, I have never seen it (eta - the whole easy part). And to be fair, this thread was specifically about it being easy/not easy so to say whether it was easy for you or not is on topic.
I see the other things all the time too from the other side. Diet bragging, food bragging, twisting things aroudn to make them things they aren't, arguing about CICO (commonly the whole eat whatever you want for weight loss vs health thing when no one says eat whatever you want for health). So very common.0 -
"Can anyone give me directions to California? I'm in Georgia."
California? Why do you want to there?
I don't go to California. I vacation in New York.
You, sir, are smart. I'm smart, too, so I know New York is the place to go.
Hahaha! California! Why do you like Earthquakes?
I am outside of California right now!
You could go West, but really, you should go to New York.
You shouldn't like Earthquakes so much.
Really, OP, wanting to be in an earthquake is a bad thing.
Are you flying or driving?
Don't you get it? OP wants to be in an earthquake! That's not smart.
I'm not in California!
We all avoid earthquakes and you should, too.
I never go to California! I'm not there now!!!!
I'm not there either. Ha!
<stupid picture insulting OP>
Haha! Stupid picture is so funny! Ha!
I once wanted to go to California, but I listened to smart people who say New York is best, so now I do that.
We all vacation in New York. If you don't, you'll have a miserable vacation.
I'm not in California!
Why doesn't the OP respond and explain why she wants to go to California? I don't get it.
OP is dumb. Likes earthquakes. Hasn't learned yet about New York. Eventually, she will figure it out.
I'm not in California! Hahaha! I love not being in California!
Earthquakes are bad!
<stupid picture>
Hahahaha, Liking earthquakes.
Oh, haha. So funny! We are so smart! No earthquakes for us!
I don't like Earthquakes!-2 -
Do you not see all the people agreeing that asking those seeking weight loss help to recheck their CICO is useless?
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85Cardinals wrote: »I agree with the gist of what the original poster is saying. People here are often insufferably smug with their comments and suggestions. It seems like it's politics or religion with them, and good luck arguing about that with true believers.
I know what you mean. I don't post here a whole bunch...but have come across multiple threads that people who are desperate for help and on the verge of giving up started, and all these food and calorie know-it-alls come back with arrogant one liners such as "abs are made in the kitchen!" "Buy a food scale you're obviously logging incorrectly" "cico" and my all time favorite "eat less move more". Lucky for me these things have come very easy to my personal quest, but I feel a more delicate hand can be executed in trying to help these poor people not give up. We're all here fighting our own internal/external wars, and it makes me sad when people are so arrogant and condescending just because someone isn't some fitness/nutrition/calorie god(dess).
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ogmomma2012 wrote: »Maybe MFP should not allow new members to post until they've scrolled through at least 5 pages of newb threads... then, we won't see the same questions asked, and the same answers given. Then maybe people won't make threads about members harping on about CICO.
There is nothing preventing veterans from ignoring what they consider to be repeat topics.
I don't necessarily agree with everything the OP said. However, I do agree with one of his focal points, that often times, new members ask questions, and out come a lot of the one size fits all retorts, or people using phraseology without even giving a thought that the person they are responding to has no clue what all the jargon means.
Shouldn't the focus be to try and help (and motivate) individuals as we can, realizing that while there may be some core truths that apply to one and all, we all have different backgrounds, understanding, goals, weaknesses and strengths. I think a lot of people that are quick to respond, forget that they were new once as well.
Anyone can post in a flippant manner, "read the stickies...CICO.." and all the rest of the forum jargon.
This thread has devolved into nothing more than MFP veterans trying to be fitness macho with one another. Who does that help?
If people will leave their forum egos at the thread door, and read again what the OP has said, they just might find some points of agreement that they quickly overlooked in their attempt to quickly rebuke the OP or some other poster.
I have seen a lot of good posts on this forum in the short time I have been here. I have also seen a lot of adults with huge egos who can't seem to do anything over than post the same kind of cut and paste, arrogant, snotty response to other members, without taking the time to see the person behind the screen name. That is how people get lost. That is how people get frustrated, confused, and the leave the site, because of things like what this thread has become.0 -
kittywrangler wrote: »kittywrangler wrote: »Good post. I see it all the time certain posters become parrots and even though their message isn't directed at ME, it bugs the stink out of me to see the same patronizing
"Eat at a caloric deficit, you'll lose weight" message.
Everyones journey is different.
So what would you tell someone who is asking for help on why they are not losing weight??
Its not the message I disagree with, its the delivery. Often times many people are asking for help and its just a blunt delivery of the same message with no insight or advice on how to achieve it. I've seen people post "educate yourself", well I'm fairly certain most people who are asking questions are trying to do just that. Maybe its just me, but there is a definite "tone" in some responses and it makes me sad. @Serah87
What you think might be "toned" may not be at all. I've seen many, many, many times where people were genuine in trying to help the Op's out, only to have the Op's say they/we were/are being negative, mean, rude, bully's, etc.0 -
kittywrangler wrote: »kittywrangler wrote: »Good post. I see it all the time certain posters become parrots and even though their message isn't directed at ME, it bugs the stink out of me to see the same patronizing
"Eat at a caloric deficit, you'll lose weight" message.
Everyones journey is different.
So what would you tell someone who is asking for help on why they are not losing weight??
Its not the message I disagree with, its the delivery. Often times many people are asking for help and its just a blunt delivery of the same message with no insight or advice on how to achieve it. I've seen people post "educate yourself", well I'm fairly certain most people who are asking questions are trying to do just that. Maybe its just me, but there is a definite "tone" in some responses and it makes me sad. @Serah87
^^ the weight loss veteran tone.."hey just CICO" may not be meant in a patronizing manner, but to someone grasping for real, practicable advice, patronizing is how it comes off.0
This discussion has been closed.
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