USA! USA! (DOMA)

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Replies

  • lcfairbairn74
    lcfairbairn74 Posts: 412 Member
    It's a great day!! :heart: :heart: :drinker: :drinker: :heart: :heart:
  • brookehe
    brookehe Posts: 413 Member
    It was an EPIC 24 hours, from the Texas Senate to the Supreme Court!

    Totally agree! :happy: :drinker: :happy:
  • lithezebra
    lithezebra Posts: 3,670 Member
    I'm lost... someone help me out here?

    The supreme court just eliminated DOMA. DOMA is the defense of marriage act which was an act that defined marriage as being between one man and one women. Since there was no secular justification for the claim it was determined that the act was respecting the rules of an established religion which makes it a violation of the first amendment and therefore unconstitutional. Please bare in mind this is a laymen interpretation of the information that I have read and heard in the general media. I am sure the case was a bit more nuanced then that but in a nutshell that is what I have read so far.

    I believe it was actually found unconstitutional under the 5th amendment as a deprivation of equal liberty.

    The 5th amendment states that you don't have to testify against yourself in court.
    It just occurred to me that you must have meant the 14th amendment. That also sounds like a logical case for its unconstitutionality. It is messed up that an act which violates two constitutional amendments was able to survive as long as it did.

    It is also a little embarrassing that it took me as long as it did to realize what you meant to say but I am a bit distracted with other stuff.

    Speaking of the 5th amendment, everyone should also be paying attention to Salinas v. Texas, the recent SCOTUS decision that affirms that your silence CAN be used against you.
  • srslybritt
    srslybritt Posts: 1,618 Member
    Hmmmm....I just took it to be celebration of equal rights, rather than politics.

    Silly me, what WAS I thinking? :huh:

    ^This.
  • LorinaLynn
    LorinaLynn Posts: 13,247 Member
    Hmmmm....I just took it to be celebration of equal rights, rather than politics.

    Silly me, what WAS I thinking? :huh:

    That's what I was thinking, too. If this is just a political discussion to you, consider yourself lucky that it hasn't been your or your loved ones rights that have been denied for a long time.
  • TeachTheGirl
    TeachTheGirl Posts: 2,091 Member
    There are thousands of political groups. Feel free to join it. My point is, if this were a thread lamenting DOMA being stuck down it would last about 2 minutes before it was removed.

    Then feel free to test that theory instead of raining on our rainbow parade.
  • The_Enginerd
    The_Enginerd Posts: 3,982 Member
    :heart:

    I try to stay out of politics, but this is a landmark day.

    I should go check Facebook to see how many dumb comments people will leave and who I should consider deleting.
  • soldier4242
    soldier4242 Posts: 1,368 Member


    My guess is that you are a fan of country music.

    Hey! I'm a fan of country music - don't lump us in with the bigots

    This for sure.
    I'm a huge fan of alt-country and americana. Lots of us are liberals and care about the poor, and the rights of others.

    I have already explained what I mean in this thread but I will post the same response to you as well to make sure nobody walks away thinking I am generalizing about people that are fans of country music.
    =======================================================================================================
    I like country music too. I was not saying that because he is against gay marriage. I was saying that because he is paraphrasing the lyrics to a country long.

    You've got to stand for something or you'll fall for anything- It is by Aaron Tippin

    When I was a kid it came on the radio every morning so I don't think I will ever forget it.
    =======================================================================================================

    I recognize that there is a stigma that people that like country music are also conservative bible thumpers but trust me that is not at all what was going through my mind when I wrote what I wrote. He just said something that make me think of that Aaron Tippin song I used to hear every morning when I was a kid.
  • GBO323
    GBO323 Posts: 333 Member
    Reposted below with original quotes. Sorry about that!
  • mojohowitz
    mojohowitz Posts: 900 Member
    Does this mean Ted Nugent can marry the love of his life, his own penis?
  • soldier4242
    soldier4242 Posts: 1,368 Member
    I'm lost... someone help me out here?

    The supreme court just eliminated DOMA. DOMA is the defense of marriage act which was an act that defined marriage as being between one man and one women. Since there was no secular justification for the claim it was determined that the act was respecting the rules of an established religion which makes it a violation of the first amendment and therefore unconstitutional. Please bare in mind this is a laymen interpretation of the information that I have read and heard in the general media. I am sure the case was a bit more nuanced then that but in a nutshell that is what I have read so far.

    I believe it was actually found unconstitutional under the 5th amendment as a deprivation of equal liberty.

    The 5th amendment states that you don't have to testify against yourself in court.
    It just occurred to me that you must have meant the 14th amendment. That also sounds like a logical case for its unconstitutionality. It is messed up that an act which violates two constitutional amendments was able to survive as long as it did.

    It is also a little embarrassing that it took me as long as it did to realize what you meant to say but I am a bit distracted with other stuff.

    Speaking of the 5th amendment, everyone should also be paying attention to Salinas v. Texas, the recent SCOTUS decision that affirms that your silence CAN be used against you.

    I know exactly what you are talking about and that is completely wrong. If silence can be used against people in the future then we are all in for a world of hurt. That violates the promise that our courts will treat us all as innocent until we are proven guilty.
  • GBO323
    GBO323 Posts: 333 Member
    Just for the record....the SCOTUS did NOT strike down or invalidate the entire DOMA...mainly the provision that affected Federal benefits to same sex couples and the constitutional rights of the states regarding their definition of marriage.

    While opinions on the matter "may vary", let's keep the facts straight in what the SCOTUS actually did today. DOMA isn't gone, it's been modified.

    While you are correct, the precedent set by this ruling paves the way for same sex marriage. All Federal barriers are now removed as unconstitutional and this precedent should percolate down to the state courts. It will be slow going but the momentum is building.

    I understand what you are saying. Let's make sure we keep the facts and the "hope so/hope not" separate. They are different.
  • ldrosophila
    ldrosophila Posts: 7,512 Member
    Supreme Court strikes down Defense of Marriage Act
    By Pete Williams and Erin McClam, NBC News
    In a landmark ruling for gay rights, the Supreme Court on Wednesday struck down the Defense of Marriage Act, the 1996 law blocking federal recognition of same-sex marriages.
    The decision was 5-4, written by Justice Anthony Kennedy. It said that the law amounted to the “deprivation of the equal liberty of persons that is protected by the Fifth Amendment.”
    In a separate case, the court ruled that it could not take up a challenge to Proposition 8, the California law that banned gay marriage in that state. That decision means that gay marriage will once again be legal in California.
    The ruling on the Defense of Marriage Act means that the federal government must recognize the gay marriages deemed legal by the states — 12 plus the District of Columbia, before the California case was decided. The law helps determine who is covered by more than 1,100 federal laws, programs and benefits, including Social Security survivor benefits, immigration rights and family leave.

    About time maybe my friend can finally make his family whole and his two adopted boys will have married daddies
  • EvanKeel
    EvanKeel Posts: 1,903 Member
    I'm lost... someone help me out here?

    The supreme court just eliminated DOMA. DOMA is the defense of marriage act which was an act that defined marriage as being between one man and one women. Since there was no secular justification for the claim it was determined that the act was respecting the rules of an established religion which makes it a violation of the first amendment and therefore unconstitutional. Please bare in mind this is a laymen interpretation of the information that I have read and heard in the general media. I am sure the case was a bit more nuanced then that but in a nutshell that is what I have read so far.

    I believe it was actually found unconstitutional under the 5th amendment as a deprivation of equal liberty.

    The 5th amendment states that you don't have to testify against yourself in court.
    It just occurred to me that you must have meant the 14th amendment. That also sounds like a logical case for its unconstitutionality. It is messed up that an act which violates two constitutional amendments was able to survive as long as it did.

    It is also a little embarrassing that it took me as long as it did to realize what you meant to say but I am a bit distracted with other stuff.

    No I meant what i said :)

    A ruling under the 14th amendment's equal protection would have been much, much better; Kennedy would have never gone for it, though. I really did mean the 5th amendment. Equal liberty is not the same as equal protection.
  • ahviendha
    ahviendha Posts: 1,291 Member
    i was happy to read that this morning =) but serious fail with voting rights act. but this makes me forgive them a little bit. still want to egg scalia's house. what a turd.
  • juliemouse83
    juliemouse83 Posts: 6,663 Member
    Hmmmm....I just took it to be celebration of equal rights, rather than politics.

    Silly me, what WAS I thinking? :huh:

    That's what I was thinking, too. If this is just a political discussion to you, consider yourself lucky that it hasn't been your or your loved ones rights that have been denied for a long time.

    ^^^This^^^

    Two of my besties are affected by this, and my friends ARE my family, so this is most assuredly a step in the right direction, all politico garbage aside, so that said?

    I think this is the PERFECT forum for a little celebration of equality! :drinker: :laugh: :flowerforyou: :drinker:
  • PrincessYorga
    PrincessYorga Posts: 63
    Wooohooo!!!! What a great day!!! :-)
  • Aello11
    Aello11 Posts: 312 Member
    I actually never thought I would see it in my lifetime. But I am still a betting woman and my money is on my Quaker state (Pennsylvania) to be last. Which will be interesting because my ex-gf has said she is prosposing to me on the day PA joins the enlightened states. :tongue:
  • russbittles
    russbittles Posts: 78
    I got back from my morning walk, and was greeted at the door by my mom, yelling, "We won!" I was still on my endorphin rush, and wasn't sure what she was talking about. My son is gay, and I am so relieved that one day, he may be able to find and be with the love of his life, equally.
  • FunkyGranolaTree
    FunkyGranolaTree Posts: 363 Member
    It is hard to keep back the tears of joy for all of my dear friends! Bye Bye DOMA...You dont live here anymore!
  • Hellbent_Heidi
    Hellbent_Heidi Posts: 3,669 Member
    A "Supreme" waste of taxpayer money in my opinion.....anyone should be able to get married if they want to make the committment. I'm happy it went the way it did, but doesn't the government have bigger things to concern itself with?

    LOL! It just goes to show that you do not understand how huge of an issue this is for millions of people. It's not about the ceremony. It's about legal rights to spousal benefits, immigration, adoption, and a thousand more. There are no "bigger" things than civil rights.
    Maybe I didn't word it right....but my point was that its ridiculous that (in this day and age) such a discriminatory movement actually took up this much time and money being heard by the Supreme Court. I totally get that its a big issue for a whole lot of people (and some those people are friends of mine). What I don't get is why people would go out of their way to support an act like DOMA in the first place. Why should anyone care who anyone else wants to marry?
  • Hexahedra
    Hexahedra Posts: 894 Member
    SCOTUS only struck down part of DOMA, but they struck the most important provision that denies federal benefits to same-sex couples. DOMA is still alive, but it's toothless at the federal level. States, on the other hand, are still free to not recognize other states' same-sex marriage.

    Considering section 3 of DOMA both infringes on states' right to define marriage AND unjustifiably deprive liberty to people not convicted of a crime, it makes perfect sense that they invalidate it. I'm just a little concerned that it was decided with such a narrow margin.
  • soldier4242
    soldier4242 Posts: 1,368 Member
    There are thousands of political groups. Feel free to join it. My point is, if this were a thread lamenting DOMA being stuck down it would last about 2 minutes before it was removed.

    Then feel free to test that theory instead of raining on our rainbow parade.
    First off I want to say I completely disagree with Lone_Wolf. I do think this is something worth celebrating.

    That said I think Lone_Wolf and everyone who agrees with him should be allowed to rain on our parade and that we should just learn to dance in the rain.

    We are having this conversation in an open chat forum on the internet. This means we should expect that not everyone is going to agree with us and that even those that disagree with us should have the right to post the same as we do.

    I say that the best thing to do is to put their comments through logical scrutiny. If they can defend their position with logic then they their position deserves to be heard. If their position does not stand up to logic then it deserves to be publicly destroyed.

    I welcome everyone's input because I certainly don't want mine excluded.

    I also think that they should be allowed to make a thread lamenting the loss of DOMA's power and they should expect people like me to be in there debating with them.
  • MerinneW
    MerinneW Posts: 71 Member
    Great day for the USA - congratulations to all those affected!
  • Lone_Wolf70
    Lone_Wolf70 Posts: 2,820 Member
    There are thousands of political groups. Feel free to join it. My point is, if this were a thread lamenting DOMA being stuck down it would last about 2 minutes before it was removed.

    Then feel free to test that theory instead of raining on our rainbow parade.
    First off I want to say I completely disagree with Lone_Wolf. I do think this is something worth celebrating.

    That said I think Lone_Wolf and everyone who agrees with him should be allowed to rain on our parade and that we should just learn to dance in the rain.

    We are having this conversation in an open chat forum on the internet. This means we should expect that not everyone is going to agree with us and that even those that disagree with us should have the right to post the same as we do.

    I say that the best thing to do is to put their comments through logical scrutiny. If they can defend their position with logic then they their position deserves to be heard. If their position does not stand up to logic then it deserves to be publicly destroyed.

    I welcome everyone's input because I certainly don't want mine excluded.

    I also think that they should be allowed to make a thread lamenting the loss of DOMA's power and they should expect people like me to be in there debating with them.

    Excuse me sir. All I have said is that this topic doesnt belong here. Thats it.
  • LadyElby
    LadyElby Posts: 151 Member
    WWWOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!!! :D
  • _chiaroscuro
    _chiaroscuro Posts: 1,340 Member
    Does this mean Ted Nugent can marry the love of his life, his own penis?

    Came in to express my excitement that we're making progress, stayed to laugh my @ss off at this.

    Edit for typo
  • shaypearl
    shaypearl Posts: 307 Member
    A beautiful song for a wonderful moment in time

    :heart: MACKLEMORE & RYAN LEWIS - SAME LOVE feat. MARY LAMBERT :heart:
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hlVBg7_08n0


    CONGRATS!
  • SDkitty
    SDkitty Posts: 446 Member
    It's a great day for humans :flowerforyou:
  • maab_connor
    maab_connor Posts: 3,927 Member


    My guess is that you are a fan of country music.

    Hey! I'm a fan of country music - don't lump us in with the bigots

    This for sure.
    I'm a huge fan of alt-country and americana. Lots of us are liberals and care about the poor, and the rights of others.

    I have already explained what I mean in this thread but I will post the same response to you as well to make sure nobody walks away thinking I am generalizing about people that are fans of country music.
    =======================================================================================================
    I like country music too. I was not saying that because he is against gay marriage. I was saying that because he is paraphrasing the lyrics to a country long.

    You've got to stand for something or you'll fall for anything- It is by Aaron Tippin

    When I was a kid it came on the radio every morning so I don't think I will ever forget it.
    =======================================================================================================

    I recognize that there is a stigma that people that like country music are also conservative bible thumpers but trust me that is not at all what was going through my mind when I wrote what I wrote. He just said something that make me think of that Aaron Tippin song I used to hear every morning when I was a kid.

    i got what you meant. i'm a liberal and i listen to country music too.
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