Calling out Lazy is the Lazy answer
Options
Replies
-
sherbear702 wrote: »I don't think I've ever seen someone flat out call an OP lazy. It's been my experience that people get on here, complain about x,y, or z, receive truthful and blunt advice about their "problem" and then get butt hurt because they aren't being coddled and given the responses they want to hear.
This. Basically what I posted above, just phrased differently!
0 -
tincanonastring wrote: »tincanonastring wrote: »tincanonastring wrote: »Like to hear some here on how they address the question "I need motivation or need to be motivated".
A.C.E. Certified Personal and Group Fitness Trainer
IDEA Fitness member
Kickboxing Certified Instructor
Been in fitness for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition
I generally don't address it. If someone is posting that, IMO they don't have the inner-drive yet to make the changes and anything I say about finding it is going to fall on deaf ears. I try to help people who are ready for help.
Maybe most of the time, but not always. A friend started with a very bleak and discouraged attitude, but I encouraged her just to START and see if the motivation didn't follow, and she's had a lot of success. Sort of like a saying I once heard- "Act yourself into the right way of thinking."
Offline, for a friend I know in real life, it's a different story. I was limiting my response to MFP, but I should have made that distinction.
My reference was actually to an MFP "friend".
Even that situation, to me at least, is different than someone in the forums pleading for someone to give them motivation.
That's where I met this friend!
(I'll be quiet now!) 0 -
tincanonastring wrote: »tincanonastring wrote: »tincanonastring wrote: »Like to hear some here on how they address the question "I need motivation or need to be motivated".
A.C.E. Certified Personal and Group Fitness Trainer
IDEA Fitness member
Kickboxing Certified Instructor
Been in fitness for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition
I generally don't address it. If someone is posting that, IMO they don't have the inner-drive yet to make the changes and anything I say about finding it is going to fall on deaf ears. I try to help people who are ready for help.
Maybe most of the time, but not always. A friend started with a very bleak and discouraged attitude, but I encouraged her just to START and see if the motivation didn't follow, and she's had a lot of success. Sort of like a saying I once heard- "Act yourself into the right way of thinking."
Offline, for a friend I know in real life, it's a different story. I was limiting my response to MFP, but I should have made that distinction.
My reference was actually to an MFP "friend".
Even that situation, to me at least, is different than someone in the forums pleading for someone to give them motivation.
That's where I met this friend! (I'll be quiet now!)
That's just a wall I'd rather not bang my head against!0 -
kshama2001 wrote: »tincanonastring wrote: »I don't think that I would call somebody lazy. However, I will at times state that a person is not dedicated or ready to make a change.
I think "Are you sure you're ready to make this type of change?" is the type of pointed question that needs to be asked for someone to have that gut-check moment (pun somewhat intended). I don't think that's dismissive or calling someone lazy.
I this this is a useful question "Are you sure you're ready to make this type of change?"
I think the opinion "You're not ready" is invalidating, and will cut off further dialog if the recipient gets defensive.
I've posted the "you're not ready" thing a few times. And I don't mean it in an invalidating way. It's meant for the reader to see it and think "How am I not ready? What do I need to do to be ready?" It's meant to get the reader to think about the choices they're making and question things further. Perhaps it does cut off dialog. I guess that depends on the OP. But I sure as heck hope that the person reading that statement will begin to question things and search for an answer, whether they truly aren't ready or if they're just pussyfooting around or if they just need to buckledown or whathaveyou.
I think asking "What do you need to do to be ready?" would get someone thinking in the right direction much more easily than "You're not ready".0 -
More about:Like to hear some here on how they address the question "I need motivation or need to be motivated".
This kind of reminds me of joining in a chat discussion, and seeing other posters complain, "I'm bored; entertain me". This isn't television. It's interactive. You get out of the conversation only what you put in to it. I learned early on when I chatted about real life, even if it was about the cat strolling across my keyboard, the discussion would liven up. We're craving genuine interaction and real life....glued to our keyboards. Ironic, isn't it? So I contribute, and be as real as I can be. Then I get back.
How can I get in the skin of another person who is demotivated, stuck, disinterested? I can't glue my motivation in to their head. They have to dig deep and figure out why they don't want to do what they know they must. It might be a problem of mis-perception, thinking they need to sweat like J-Lo in the third hour of her live concert, or eat grapefruit and cottage cheese the rest of their life. Maybe the person is a solid introvert and is trying to love team sports. Redirect them. Maybe they love their toast and jam. Coach them how they can fit toast and jam in to a slimmer life.0 -
I will say, I don't respond to many of the "I don't have any motivation" threads, and often it depends on the attitude of the poster. If a person strikes me as feeling overwhelmed, that's one thing. But a while back there was a guy bemoaning the fact he needed to lose 100 lbs, but going on and on about how great he felt his life was and didn't really want to change it. I think I may have actually used "You're not ready" in that case.0
-
@rainbowbow - is kindness the same as coddling?0
-
tincanonastring wrote: »tincanonastring wrote: »tincanonastring wrote: »Like to hear some here on how they address the question "I need motivation or need to be motivated".
A.C.E. Certified Personal and Group Fitness Trainer
IDEA Fitness member
Kickboxing Certified Instructor
Been in fitness for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition
I generally don't address it. If someone is posting that, IMO they don't have the inner-drive yet to make the changes and anything I say about finding it is going to fall on deaf ears. I try to help people who are ready for help.
Maybe most of the time, but not always. A friend started with a very bleak and discouraged attitude, but I encouraged her just to START and see if the motivation didn't follow, and she's had a lot of success. Sort of like a saying I once heard- "Act yourself into the right way of thinking."
Offline, for a friend I know in real life, it's a different story. I was limiting my response to MFP, but I should have made that distinction.
My reference was actually to an MFP "friend".
Even that situation, to me at least, is different than someone in the forums pleading for someone to give them motivation.
I think the difference is this--some people consider others on the MFP forum strangers who they can get advice from, while others see MFP as more of a community where people can form relationships. I fall more into the first category, but we can all use MFP as we like.0 -
@nadler64On one hand I agree, and yet I get really angry with people who ask for help and then proceed to shoot down every helpful response that comes his or her way. They want the easy answer, the magic bullet, and there never is one. I admit I'm not the most sympathetic person, though.
I've seen this too. I saw it yesterday. I think the poster was depressed and frankly could not see the rainbow for the rain. She was poor, shut-in, living off ramen noodles, and didn't see any reason to cook a nice meal just for herself. Again, I try and use Socratic questioning to jolt such people out of their funk. Sometimes it works.
0 -
What no on on this thread realizes is all the times I created fake accounts asking for motivation so people would feel okay to toot their own horn about their successes.
Oh well...0 -
@nadler64On one hand I agree, and yet I get really angry with people who ask for help and then proceed to shoot down every helpful response that comes his or her way. They want the easy answer, the magic bullet, and there never is one. I admit I'm not the most sympathetic person, though.
I've seen this too. I saw it yesterday. I think the poster was depressed and frankly could not see the rainbow for the rain. She was poor, shut-in, living off ramen noodles, and didn't see any reason to cook a nice meal just for herself. Again, I try and use Socratic questioning to jolt such people out of their funk. Sometimes it works.
I will do this, but sometimes it's exhausting to do. Sometimes you really have to be invested in the person. Is that lazy on my part? Maybe, but it also depends on what they give back to you. If they are completely defeatist, and unwilling to budge I normally just drop it and move on.0 -
@lyttlewon, a fine strategy to move on if you don't see any action. One of my favourite quotes:
The true secret of giving advice is, after you have honestly given it, to be perfectly indifferent whether it is taken or not, and never persist in trying to set people right.
Henry Ward Beecher
Your input is rattling around in their head. When they are prepared to work it through, they will.0 -
-
Like to hear some here on how they address the question "I need motivation or need to be motivated".
A.C.E. Certified Personal and Group Fitness Trainer
IDEA Fitness member
Kickboxing Certified Instructor
Been in fitness for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition
I usually tell people to write out a list of whys. Why do you want to lose weight? What do you want to accomplish (physically and mentally) by reaching your goal? Then I tell them to keep the list on them and read it whenever they feel like falling off their plan or skip a workout.
I also think that while motivation is great, determination is the key to succeeding.0 -
kshama2001 wrote: »kshama2001 wrote: »tincanonastring wrote: »I don't think that I would call somebody lazy. However, I will at times state that a person is not dedicated or ready to make a change.
I think "Are you sure you're ready to make this type of change?" is the type of pointed question that needs to be asked for someone to have that gut-check moment (pun somewhat intended). I don't think that's dismissive or calling someone lazy.
I this this is a useful question "Are you sure you're ready to make this type of change?"
I think the opinion "You're not ready" is invalidating, and will cut off further dialog if the recipient gets defensive.
I've posted the "you're not ready" thing a few times. And I don't mean it in an invalidating way. It's meant for the reader to see it and think "How am I not ready? What do I need to do to be ready?" It's meant to get the reader to think about the choices they're making and question things further. Perhaps it does cut off dialog. I guess that depends on the OP. But I sure as heck hope that the person reading that statement will begin to question things and search for an answer, whether they truly aren't ready or if they're just pussyfooting around or if they just need to buckledown or whathaveyou.
I think asking "What do you need to do to be ready?" would get someone thinking in the right direction much more easily than "You're not ready".
I think that's much more helpful. I think "you're not ready" FEELS pretty much like code for "you're lazy" and "you don't really want this." If someone's here and trying to log, they probably want it.
I have a tough time losing weight. Even at high weights it comes off super slow. Forget plateaus, every week is a plateau. I also have some emotional/addiction issues with food. I don't post "why am I not losing weight" threads because I know why. I turned to that hamburger for solace one day and that turned into 3 days etc etc. Work hard and stay motivated for a month, lose some weight, gain most or all of it back in a week of bad behavior. Then have to start again, a month lost. When I read threads of people similar to me, people will either offer suggestions "just cook your own meals from home!" duh! Like if I had a grip on this I would be doing that already, right? But I don't post. Because I don't need a bunch of people telling me a week of screwing up means I don't "really want it" or "am not ready". I'll never be ready if that's the case.
0 -
@rainbowbow - is kindness the same as coddling?
kindness is providing people with information and sharing the knowledge they need to succeed.
Coddling is making it my personal mission to MAKE them succeed.0 -
Did you see my suggestions as somehow forcing success on others, @rainbowbow ?0
-
Did you see my suggestions as somehow forcing success on others, @rainbowbow ?
You're suggesting that providing people the information they need is not enough.
We need to coddle them, ask them pointed questions, help them find their internal motivation and hold their hand. As i stated earlier, once someone has the know-how of what needs to be done to succeed it becomes their CHOICE. Nothing you or I say is going to convince them to take the steps they personally need to succeed. The motivation needed to begin will very quickly come down to dedication they need to continue.
We are not personal counselors and i see nothing wrong with providing people with information and knowledge or personal experience for free. If anything, i see that as kindness. What i think is overstepping is trying to act like their own personal therapist.
edit: you also implied that if we aren't acting as such, we are giving them the "lazy" answer.0 -
@sheermomentum , what does it mean when we say someone is "lazy"? Does such a thing even exist?
For instance, I read a seventeenth century French aristocrat call contemporary peasants "lazy" because all they did was lay in their dirty hovels all winter. I strongly suspect the problem was that these peasants were stuck in a social system where initiative got them nothing but trouble. Or they were starving. Or both.0 -
blues4miles wrote: »kshama2001 wrote: »kshama2001 wrote: »tincanonastring wrote: »I don't think that I would call somebody lazy. However, I will at times state that a person is not dedicated or ready to make a change.
I think "Are you sure you're ready to make this type of change?" is the type of pointed question that needs to be asked for someone to have that gut-check moment (pun somewhat intended). I don't think that's dismissive or calling someone lazy.
I this this is a useful question "Are you sure you're ready to make this type of change?"
I think the opinion "You're not ready" is invalidating, and will cut off further dialog if the recipient gets defensive.
I've posted the "you're not ready" thing a few times. And I don't mean it in an invalidating way. It's meant for the reader to see it and think "How am I not ready? What do I need to do to be ready?" It's meant to get the reader to think about the choices they're making and question things further. Perhaps it does cut off dialog. I guess that depends on the OP. But I sure as heck hope that the person reading that statement will begin to question things and search for an answer, whether they truly aren't ready or if they're just pussyfooting around or if they just need to buckledown or whathaveyou.
I think asking "What do you need to do to be ready?" would get someone thinking in the right direction much more easily than "You're not ready".
I think that's much more helpful. I think "you're not ready" FEELS pretty much like code for "you're lazy" and "you don't really want this." If someone's here and trying to log, they probably want it.
I have a tough time losing weight. Even at high weights it comes off super slow. Forget plateaus, every week is a plateau. I also have some emotional/addiction issues with food. I don't post "why am I not losing weight" threads because I know why. I turned to that hamburger for solace one day and that turned into 3 days etc etc. Work hard and stay motivated for a month, lose some weight, gain most or all of it back in a week of bad behavior. Then have to start again, a month lost. When I read threads of people similar to me, people will either offer suggestions "just cook your own meals from home!" duh! Like if I had a grip on this I would be doing that already, right? But I don't post. Because I don't need a bunch of people telling me a week of screwing up means I don't "really want it" or "am not ready". I'll never be ready if that's the case.
This is why it's only used in certain situations. For example, in a thread 5 pages long where the OP refutes any and all advice. Or the OP has 1,001 excuses for not being able to do something. That's when I typically pull out the "you're not ready". Because either they're not ready, or they need to take a deeper look at things and question themselves.0
Categories
- All Categories
- 1.4M Health, Wellness and Goals
- 391.6K Introduce Yourself
- 43.5K Getting Started
- 259.7K Health and Weight Loss
- 175.6K Food and Nutrition
- 47.3K Recipes
- 232.3K Fitness and Exercise
- 393 Sleep, Mindfulness and Overall Wellness
- 6.4K Goal: Maintaining Weight
- 8.5K Goal: Gaining Weight and Body Building
- 152.7K Motivation and Support
- 7.8K Challenges
- 1.3K Debate Club
- 96.3K Chit-Chat
- 2.5K Fun and Games
- 3.3K MyFitnessPal Information
- 23 News and Announcements
- 936 Feature Suggestions and Ideas
- 2.3K MyFitnessPal Tech Support Questions