Never ending hatred towards Carbs in fitness community? China Study
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There are no such things as essential carbohydrates. There are essential proteins and fats, but not carbs. Your body's preferred fuel is fat, or ketones, which are produced when fat is burned. Proteins and fats provide a longer lasting steady stream of energy, unlike carbs, which burn off quickly and leave you hungry sooner. Carbs are not the best fuel source, and only became popular and pushed onto the public when the agricultural revolution came about. We would be wise to dump them and go back to the way the hunter-gatherers lived, on proteins and fats and veggies.
Carbohydrates feel like a pretty awesome fuel source when I'm in the middle of a long run, I can tell you that.
Also, carbohydrates *were* a part of many hunter-gatherer diets. They ate fruit, root vegetables, and acorns.4 -
There are no such things as essential carbohydrates. There are essential proteins and fats, but not carbs. Your body's preferred fuel is fat, or ketones, which are produced when fat is burned. Proteins and fats provide a longer lasting steady stream of energy, unlike carbs, which burn off quickly and leave you hungry sooner. Carbs are not the best fuel source, and only became popular and pushed onto the public when the agricultural revolution came about. We would be wise to dump them and go back to the way the hunter-gatherers lived, on proteins and fats and veggies.
Actually, most of the world has subsided on a high carbohydrate diet since the beginning.
And while ketones can be used for fuel, they aren't the body's preferred fuel...just utter nonsense.7 -
Because carbs are "expensive" calorie wise and that's all there is to it.
It's like carbs = lipstick
protein fat = gas for your car.
If you only have 20 bucks- and you put it only on the lipstick- how you gonna get to work?
You either go into debt using your cc- or you walk and do without. Same with calories- if you eat to many carbs- you're still hungry but used all your calories- you either use "use the cc" and eat up the deficit and or go over- or you do without- and go hungry and stay on track.
It's a matter of balance. Not a matter of "hate" just not practical to eat an all carb diet when you only have 1500 calories to play with all day.4 -
As a woman with PCOS and insulin resistance, carbs, the processed kind have to be in moderation for me, no more than 30-45gr per meal. My doctor put it bluntly for me about 13 years ago. "Do you want that bagel or do you want a baby?" Going low carb I was able to reset my body, lose weight and have 3 healthy kids after a few false starts.
I need to lose more weight but my wicked sweet tooth gets me into trouble ...this is why I. am back here to be accountable for how I plan my meal breakdowns. Sure I can have pancakes or a cupcake, but not all at once and often not on the same days, because even those healthy carbs 30-45g per meal are made up of veggies, fruits and salads.
That is why carbs are not my friends. Plus protein and fats keep me full and level, not on a hunger rollercoaster.1 -
^^I thought it was more complicated than that. I admit I'm not muscle hulk savy, I thought carbs were mainly used for their fuel/energy and yes building too, but not primarily to create the muscle itself.
I have read multiple places it usually comes down to CICO, genetics, etc and you need a surplus to build (not necessarily carbs). I know you can use fat/ protein post workouts for repair/recovery. A lot of non-low carb builders cut carbs when shredding but retain all if not the majority of their mass.
Please explain? I'm honestly curious about this and Bikini season is around the corner.
Carbs stimulate muscle protein synthesis, which helps with muscle building. Fats don't really help with recovery. If anything you want carbs + protein pre or post workout +/- 2 hours (based on some later studies) but your total diet will have a greater impact over the timing of those nutrients. Honestly, there are several other things that should be addressed before timing is concerned.
You can gain muscle in a deficit (especially if you are a noob, returning to training or over-fat) but its not going to be at the same rate as fat oxidation and it's not an ideal situation (since you are in a catabolic state).
If you want to deplete glycogen/water weight storage, you can cut carbs. You can probably see a few lbs of loss just from doing that.
Correction, Insulin stimulates muscle synthesis. Carbs stimulate insulin release.1 -
Because carbs are "expensive" calorie wise and that's all there is to it.
It's like carbs = lipstick
protein fat = gas for your car.
If you only have 20 bucks- and you put it only on the lipstick- how you gonna get to work?
You either go into debt using your cc- or you walk and do without. Same with calories- if you eat to many carbs- you're still hungry but used all your calories- you either use "use the cc" and eat up the deficit and or go over- or you do without- and go hungry and stay on track.
It's a matter of balance. Not a matter of "hate" just not practical to eat an all carb diet when you only have 1500 calories to play with all day.
This is a great example of different strokes for different folks. I'm losing weight eating 2,500 to 3,000 kCal per day. My favorite snack after a hard workout:
* 18 oz frozen raspberries
* 1 cup protein powder
* I teaspoon honey
* Little bit of tart cherry juice
* Lot of half and half
Mix it in the blender until it's like carb sorbet, then enjoy.
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Yes, it's the common theme. Obviously if you have more calories, everything is easier to fit.0
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There are no such things as essential carbohydrates. There are essential proteins and fats, but not carbs. Your body's preferred fuel is fat, or ketones, which are produced when fat is burned. Proteins and fats provide a longer lasting steady stream of energy, unlike carbs, which burn off quickly and leave you hungry sooner. Carbs are not the best fuel source, and only became popular and pushed onto the public when the agricultural revolution came about. We would be wise to dump them and go back to the way the hunter-gatherers lived, on proteins and fats and veggies.
No native population on the planet has been on a ketogenic diet. Let that sink in.4 -
NorthCascades wrote: »Because carbs are "expensive" calorie wise and that's all there is to it.
It's like carbs = lipstick
protein fat = gas for your car.
If you only have 20 bucks- and you put it only on the lipstick- how you gonna get to work?
You either go into debt using your cc- or you walk and do without. Same with calories- if you eat to many carbs- you're still hungry but used all your calories- you either use "use the cc" and eat up the deficit and or go over- or you do without- and go hungry and stay on track.
It's a matter of balance. Not a matter of "hate" just not practical to eat an all carb diet when you only have 1500 calories to play with all day.
This is a great example of different strokes for different folks. I'm losing weight eating 2,500 to 3,000 kCal per day. My favorite snack after a hard workout:
* 18 oz frozen raspberries
* 1 cup protein powder
* I teaspoon honey
* Little bit of tart cherry juice
* Lot of half and half
Mix it in the blender until it's like carb sorbet, then enjoy.
That raspberry sorbet sounds yummy.2 -
If I cut out carbs I feel weak so I have to eat them but I make sure they are the 'good' carbs like brown rice and wholemeal stuff.
I don't think they are bad for you unless it's in the form of cakes !0 -
janejellyroll wrote: »viren19890 wrote: »janejellyroll wrote: »
I think there's some confusion around low carb diets in this question.viren19890 wrote: »Hello,
I just don't get it- if calories are king -where is there a never ending hatred towards carbs ? I mean I understand about good carbs and bad carbs -but fats have similar categories as well- good and bad yet Carbs get a bad rep?
Even new threads where people don't lose weight for two weeks- some of the posted advice is regarding eat high protein vs carbs.
Didn't China study prove that nothing is wrong with carbs and they don't even affect health in an adverse manner?
What do you guys think about it? another nonsensical broscience or has weight to it?
I'm vegetarian who eats no meat/seafood/eggs- so for me low carb diet is a big no regardless of what the outcome it.
I'm eating a low carb diet but do not agree ALL carbs are bad, I don't think anyone thinks that. Obviously carbs in broccoli and leafy greens are MUCH better than the carbs found in breads and pasta. Most low carbers go by NET carbs not total carbs, meaning if an avocado has 13g of carbs but 10 are fiber, it's only 3 net carbs. So I'll eat the entire avocado. Broccoli is high in fiber too and I eat a ton of broccoli. I hope that makes sense.
Bad carbs certainly affect me in a negative way, I don't know about you. When I eat too many BAD carbs I get headaches hours later (which I am battling with now from a cupcake I had last night) and am very bloated/gassy the next day. Sometimes I decide it's worth it and have a cheat meal, most days I do not.
I don't think it is obvious at all that the carbohydrates in broccoli and leafy greens are "MUCH butter" than the carbohydrates found in bread and pasta. Obviously the foods have different proportions of macro- and micro-nutrients, but the carbohydrates themselves? How are the carbohydrates in broccoli meaningfully different than the carbohydrates in grain?
isn't there different kind of carbs? simple and complex ? to which body responds in different way and one is better other isn't ?
There are different types of carbohydrates (I wouldn't say one is necessarily "better") than the other, but broccoli and bread are both examples of complex carbohydrates. So even if complex carbohydrates are "better," it wouldn't explain how the carbohydrates in broccoli are "MUCH butter" than the carbohydrates in bread.
Wait- I'm still in disbelief that -for example
Potato is same as sweet potato
White rice vs brown rice
Why are the foods on the right called " muscle building" compared to the ones on left ?
If this is true I mean don't we end up in "IIFYM" terriroty.0 -
dannijordan30 wrote: »If I cut out carbs I feel weak so I have to eat them but I make sure they are the 'good' carbs like brown rice and wholemeal stuff.
I don't think they are bad for you unless it's in the form of cakes !
lol I was also under the assumption that "good" was actually good and "bad" was bad but I'm learning that good is only good under certain circumstances and bad is also good under certain circumstances lol0 -
Bad carbs are the ones that put you over your calorie goals. Same with fats and proteins.6
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viren19890 wrote: »janejellyroll wrote: »viren19890 wrote: »janejellyroll wrote: »
I think there's some confusion around low carb diets in this question.viren19890 wrote: »Hello,
I just don't get it- if calories are king -where is there a never ending hatred towards carbs ? I mean I understand about good carbs and bad carbs -but fats have similar categories as well- good and bad yet Carbs get a bad rep?
Even new threads where people don't lose weight for two weeks- some of the posted advice is regarding eat high protein vs carbs.
Didn't China study prove that nothing is wrong with carbs and they don't even affect health in an adverse manner?
What do you guys think about it? another nonsensical broscience or has weight to it?
I'm vegetarian who eats no meat/seafood/eggs- so for me low carb diet is a big no regardless of what the outcome it.
I'm eating a low carb diet but do not agree ALL carbs are bad, I don't think anyone thinks that. Obviously carbs in broccoli and leafy greens are MUCH better than the carbs found in breads and pasta. Most low carbers go by NET carbs not total carbs, meaning if an avocado has 13g of carbs but 10 are fiber, it's only 3 net carbs. So I'll eat the entire avocado. Broccoli is high in fiber too and I eat a ton of broccoli. I hope that makes sense.
Bad carbs certainly affect me in a negative way, I don't know about you. When I eat too many BAD carbs I get headaches hours later (which I am battling with now from a cupcake I had last night) and am very bloated/gassy the next day. Sometimes I decide it's worth it and have a cheat meal, most days I do not.
I don't think it is obvious at all that the carbohydrates in broccoli and leafy greens are "MUCH butter" than the carbohydrates found in bread and pasta. Obviously the foods have different proportions of macro- and micro-nutrients, but the carbohydrates themselves? How are the carbohydrates in broccoli meaningfully different than the carbohydrates in grain?
isn't there different kind of carbs? simple and complex ? to which body responds in different way and one is better other isn't ?
There are different types of carbohydrates (I wouldn't say one is necessarily "better") than the other, but broccoli and bread are both examples of complex carbohydrates. So even if complex carbohydrates are "better," it wouldn't explain how the carbohydrates in broccoli are "MUCH butter" than the carbohydrates in bread.
Wait- I'm still in disbelief that -for example
Potato is same as sweet potato
White rice vs brown rice
Why are the foods on the right called " muscle building" compared to the ones on left ?
If this is true I mean don't we end up in "IIFYM" terriroty.
The sweet potato has slightly more fiber and a ton of extra vitamin A (that's what makes it orange). Otherwise, they're pretty similar in terms of nutrition.5 -
viren19890 wrote: »janejellyroll wrote: »viren19890 wrote: »janejellyroll wrote: »
I think there's some confusion around low carb diets in this question.viren19890 wrote: »Hello,
I just don't get it- if calories are king -where is there a never ending hatred towards carbs ? I mean I understand about good carbs and bad carbs -but fats have similar categories as well- good and bad yet Carbs get a bad rep?
Even new threads where people don't lose weight for two weeks- some of the posted advice is regarding eat high protein vs carbs.
Didn't China study prove that nothing is wrong with carbs and they don't even affect health in an adverse manner?
What do you guys think about it? another nonsensical broscience or has weight to it?
I'm vegetarian who eats no meat/seafood/eggs- so for me low carb diet is a big no regardless of what the outcome it.
I'm eating a low carb diet but do not agree ALL carbs are bad, I don't think anyone thinks that. Obviously carbs in broccoli and leafy greens are MUCH better than the carbs found in breads and pasta. Most low carbers go by NET carbs not total carbs, meaning if an avocado has 13g of carbs but 10 are fiber, it's only 3 net carbs. So I'll eat the entire avocado. Broccoli is high in fiber too and I eat a ton of broccoli. I hope that makes sense.
Bad carbs certainly affect me in a negative way, I don't know about you. When I eat too many BAD carbs I get headaches hours later (which I am battling with now from a cupcake I had last night) and am very bloated/gassy the next day. Sometimes I decide it's worth it and have a cheat meal, most days I do not.
I don't think it is obvious at all that the carbohydrates in broccoli and leafy greens are "MUCH butter" than the carbohydrates found in bread and pasta. Obviously the foods have different proportions of macro- and micro-nutrients, but the carbohydrates themselves? How are the carbohydrates in broccoli meaningfully different than the carbohydrates in grain?
isn't there different kind of carbs? simple and complex ? to which body responds in different way and one is better other isn't ?
There are different types of carbohydrates (I wouldn't say one is necessarily "better") than the other, but broccoli and bread are both examples of complex carbohydrates. So even if complex carbohydrates are "better," it wouldn't explain how the carbohydrates in broccoli are "MUCH butter" than the carbohydrates in bread.
Wait- I'm still in disbelief that -for example
Potato is same as sweet potato
White rice vs brown rice
Why are the foods on the right called " muscle building" compared to the ones on left ?
If this is true I mean don't we end up in "IIFYM" terriroty.
Those foods will have different calorie counts and different amounts of different vitamins and minerals, but the carbohydrates in them . . . they're the same.
Edit: Not saying they have the same *number* of carbohydrates, I don't know how many they have exactly. But the type of carbohydrates in them, they're the same.3 -
viren19890 wrote: »janejellyroll wrote: »viren19890 wrote: »janejellyroll wrote: »
I think there's some confusion around low carb diets in this question.viren19890 wrote: »Hello,
I just don't get it- if calories are king -where is there a never ending hatred towards carbs ? I mean I understand about good carbs and bad carbs -but fats have similar categories as well- good and bad yet Carbs get a bad rep?
Even new threads where people don't lose weight for two weeks- some of the posted advice is regarding eat high protein vs carbs.
Didn't China study prove that nothing is wrong with carbs and they don't even affect health in an adverse manner?
What do you guys think about it? another nonsensical broscience or has weight to it?
I'm vegetarian who eats no meat/seafood/eggs- so for me low carb diet is a big no regardless of what the outcome it.
I'm eating a low carb diet but do not agree ALL carbs are bad, I don't think anyone thinks that. Obviously carbs in broccoli and leafy greens are MUCH better than the carbs found in breads and pasta. Most low carbers go by NET carbs not total carbs, meaning if an avocado has 13g of carbs but 10 are fiber, it's only 3 net carbs. So I'll eat the entire avocado. Broccoli is high in fiber too and I eat a ton of broccoli. I hope that makes sense.
Bad carbs certainly affect me in a negative way, I don't know about you. When I eat too many BAD carbs I get headaches hours later (which I am battling with now from a cupcake I had last night) and am very bloated/gassy the next day. Sometimes I decide it's worth it and have a cheat meal, most days I do not.
I don't think it is obvious at all that the carbohydrates in broccoli and leafy greens are "MUCH butter" than the carbohydrates found in bread and pasta. Obviously the foods have different proportions of macro- and micro-nutrients, but the carbohydrates themselves? How are the carbohydrates in broccoli meaningfully different than the carbohydrates in grain?
isn't there different kind of carbs? simple and complex ? to which body responds in different way and one is better other isn't ?
There are different types of carbohydrates (I wouldn't say one is necessarily "better") than the other, but broccoli and bread are both examples of complex carbohydrates. So even if complex carbohydrates are "better," it wouldn't explain how the carbohydrates in broccoli are "MUCH butter" than the carbohydrates in bread.
Wait- I'm still in disbelief that -for example
Potato is same as sweet potato
White rice vs brown rice
Why are the foods on the right called " muscle building" compared to the ones on left ?
If this is true I mean don't we end up in "IIFYM" terriroty.
Because a lot of bro's believe in bad science.2 -
^^I thought it was more complicated than that. I admit I'm not muscle hulk savy, I thought carbs were mainly used for their fuel/energy and yes building too, but not primarily to create the muscle itself.
I have read multiple places it usually comes down to CICO, genetics, etc and you need a surplus to build (not necessarily carbs). I know you can use fat/ protein post workouts for repair/recovery. A lot of non-low carb builders cut carbs when shredding but retain all if not the majority of their mass.
Please explain? I'm honestly curious about this and Bikini season is around the corner.
Carbs stimulate muscle protein synthesis, which helps with muscle building. Fats don't really help with recovery. If anything you want carbs + protein pre or post workout +/- 2 hours (based on some later studies) but your total diet will have a greater impact over the timing of those nutrients. Honestly, there are several other things that should be addressed before timing is concerned.
You can gain muscle in a deficit (especially if you are a noob, returning to training or over-fat) but its not going to be at the same rate as fat oxidation and it's not an ideal situation (since you are in a catabolic state).
If you want to deplete glycogen/water weight storage, you can cut carbs. You can probably see a few lbs of loss just from doing that.
Correction, Insulin stimulates muscle synthesis. Carbs stimulate insulin release.
Oh semantics.. lol0 -
The only people who have to be careful about carbs is people who have diabetes, PCOS, insulin resistance, or other issues with insulin. I have to be careful about the kind of carbs I have (whole grain carbs have less impact on blood sugar levels than processed "white" carbs), but I can still have carbs. I just use multi-grain bread instead of white. I have smaller portions of potatoes than I otherwise would (this girl loves some mashed potatoes--I could eat an entire plate of them if given the opportunity!), but I still allow myself some. For those that don't have insulin issues, carbs are fine if you stay in your calorie limit. I wouldn't advise eating nothing but carbs because your body also needs fat and protein, but carbs definitely serve a place in our dietary plans.1
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diannethegeek wrote: »viren19890 wrote: »janejellyroll wrote: »viren19890 wrote: »janejellyroll wrote: »
I think there's some confusion around low carb diets in this question.viren19890 wrote: »Hello,
I just don't get it- if calories are king -where is there a never ending hatred towards carbs ? I mean I understand about good carbs and bad carbs -but fats have similar categories as well- good and bad yet Carbs get a bad rep?
Even new threads where people don't lose weight for two weeks- some of the posted advice is regarding eat high protein vs carbs.
Didn't China study prove that nothing is wrong with carbs and they don't even affect health in an adverse manner?
What do you guys think about it? another nonsensical broscience or has weight to it?
I'm vegetarian who eats no meat/seafood/eggs- so for me low carb diet is a big no regardless of what the outcome it.
I'm eating a low carb diet but do not agree ALL carbs are bad, I don't think anyone thinks that. Obviously carbs in broccoli and leafy greens are MUCH better than the carbs found in breads and pasta. Most low carbers go by NET carbs not total carbs, meaning if an avocado has 13g of carbs but 10 are fiber, it's only 3 net carbs. So I'll eat the entire avocado. Broccoli is high in fiber too and I eat a ton of broccoli. I hope that makes sense.
Bad carbs certainly affect me in a negative way, I don't know about you. When I eat too many BAD carbs I get headaches hours later (which I am battling with now from a cupcake I had last night) and am very bloated/gassy the next day. Sometimes I decide it's worth it and have a cheat meal, most days I do not.
I don't think it is obvious at all that the carbohydrates in broccoli and leafy greens are "MUCH butter" than the carbohydrates found in bread and pasta. Obviously the foods have different proportions of macro- and micro-nutrients, but the carbohydrates themselves? How are the carbohydrates in broccoli meaningfully different than the carbohydrates in grain?
isn't there different kind of carbs? simple and complex ? to which body responds in different way and one is better other isn't ?
There are different types of carbohydrates (I wouldn't say one is necessarily "better") than the other, but broccoli and bread are both examples of complex carbohydrates. So even if complex carbohydrates are "better," it wouldn't explain how the carbohydrates in broccoli are "MUCH butter" than the carbohydrates in bread.
Wait- I'm still in disbelief that -for example
Potato is same as sweet potato
White rice vs brown rice
Why are the foods on the right called " muscle building" compared to the ones on left ?
If this is true I mean don't we end up in "IIFYM" terriroty.
The sweet potato has slightly more fiber and a ton of extra vitamin A (that's what makes it orange). Otherwise, they're pretty similar in terms of nutrition.
Kill me now- i've been living my life wrong. What the frikking fudge.
What the heck is true on the internet. I'm so paranoid now- that i'm judging all your responses as well. DAMN
Every video touts about good carbs and bad carbs. Insulin response and muscle and all that blah0 -
amyvanblaricom wrote: »I love carbs. I have put them into more moderation along with Everything else but its not their fault people get fat.
I don't know about anyone but myself, eating too much of everything made me morbidly obese. Too many calories in, not nearly enough calories out.
Eating all things in moderation brought me to a "normal" weight for the first time in my adult life, and has kept me there for over 2-1/2 years.
I don't really understand the condemnation of any food.
0
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