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The Sugar Conspiracy

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Replies

  • lemurcat12
    lemurcat12 Posts: 30,886 Member
    Cutting out sugar would have changed nothing at all, because I like eating. I would have just eaten something else instead.

    Yes, this.

    I love food. I love some foods that have added sugar. I don't particularly favor foods with added sugar and if I could never eat those foods again but had no need to restrict calories, my overall calories would not change, as I could so easily find other delicious foods to eat instead. I found this when I cut out added sugar for a while--it was no hardship at all to eat high quality cheese after dinner instead of ice cream. There also was no calorie advantage in doing so. ;-)
  • nvmomketo
    nvmomketo Posts: 12,019 Member
    nvmomketo wrote: »
    nvmomketo wrote: »
    The people who seem to be against the idea that sugar can be a problem for people seem to be those for whom sugar has never been a problem. It didn't happen to me so I don't believe it, and that's where Lustig exaggerated: Sugar is not a problem for everybody, but it is a problem for many. Just because the nutrition powers of yesteryear had fat labelled as the nutritional problem child in the 80s, it does not mean that sugar has been mislabelled as a problem nutrient ( or as the scapegoat) today. It IS a problem for some.

    Looking within myself did not help me lose weight. The minute I dropped sugar and reduced my carbs I lost weight. Easily and lots of it. You bet I was eating too many calories but I was eating too much because of sugar (and partially due to those carbs which are readily converted to sugar). I didn't have to do any soul searching or suddenly develop great will power in order to lose weight; all I had to do was cut sugar out of my diet and I was much less hungry, I lost my cravings, and the slight thermogenic poperties of a very LCHF diet helped a bit too.

    I also love cheese and nuts and overeat those pretty regularly but that's not what made me fat either. Candy, soda, muffins, and unneeded carby plate fillers made me fat. I cut those and replaced them with other macro nutrients (at a slight caloric deficit) and lost weight. Simply cutting calories was not sustainable for more that a week or two for me. Cut sugar too? Suddenly it was easy to lose. It may not be true for all, but it was for me and it is true for many, especially those of us with IR issues (known and undiagnosed). I am not a special snowflake here.

    Sure, many people are fine with eating sugar but many aren't. I was fine with sugar until I approached 40, when suddenly I was not. Stating sugar is a problem for all is wrong, and Lustig should stop it. Staing that sugar is NOT a problem for all is just as wrong - claiming it is a scapegoat is incorrect. A better statement might be that sugar is not a problem for some people, although it may become a problem for some of them later, and that it is indeed a problem for some people right now (somewhere between 1/3 to 1/2 it appears to me based on those affected with IR issues like NAFLD, T2D, PCOS, prediabetes, Alzheimer's, as well as some of those who find weight loss difficult without sugar reduction - not a tiny group).

    ... This thread should probably be moved to the debate section. ;)

    "Readily converted to sugar" is another of those phrases that is used to fear monger against it, as if that makes it bad somehow.

    You're outright denying in your post that things apart from carbs made you fat. "Oh, I've been overeating this and that and X and Y and Z regularly too but that wasn't the problem, no.". I call BS. If you've been overeating you've been overeating them and they were part of the problem.

    I used to eat lots of sugar.
    And lots of fat.
    And probably protein too.
    Like 4+ ham and cheese sandwiches as a single meal? Check.
    Wieners with a bunch of fries? Yeah, did that.
    Pizza and whatnot? Yup. All lots of it and not a single gram of added sugar. Cutting out sugar would have changed nothing at all, because I like eating. I would have just eaten something else instead.

    Yeah no. I can still each 4 oz of cheese in a day and not gain weight. I do it often. Too often, but I can cut other foods from my diet when I do it. I had 4oz of cheese for lunch? Okay, I'll eat less at dinner. No problem. I had a cup of macadamia nuts with coconut for an afternoon "snack". I'll skip dinner. I had a large soda or a bag of jelly bellies? I'm still hungry and I find it harder to regulate my food intake. I can be sure that I'll be hungry for dinner even after a family sized bag of candy.

    I tend to overeat cheese more now since I eat lower carb. I don't eat candy or soda any longer. Even though I overeat in one food it does not mean I overeat my caloric totals for the day. I consider it to be overeating in cheese when it slows my bms for day. LOL

    Pizza? If I eat 4 pieces I am quite full and I stop. Angel food cake? I can eat the whole thing and look for more. We react differently to different foods. Sugar isn't a problem for you. Great. It's egocentric to assume one's experience is true for everyone.

    I'd say if your overeating of cheese and nuts makes you skip a meal later on to still fit IT IS A PROBLEM.

    I don't know about that. It's about the equivalent of someone saving room/calories at a healthy meal so they can still have dessert. I highly doubt nuts or cheese is problem alternative. A cup of nuts at 3:00 is not really less healthy than a steak and broccoli with cheese sauce at 5:00.
  • stevencloser
    stevencloser Posts: 8,911 Member
    nvmomketo wrote: »
    nvmomketo wrote: »
    nvmomketo wrote: »
    The people who seem to be against the idea that sugar can be a problem for people seem to be those for whom sugar has never been a problem. It didn't happen to me so I don't believe it, and that's where Lustig exaggerated: Sugar is not a problem for everybody, but it is a problem for many. Just because the nutrition powers of yesteryear had fat labelled as the nutritional problem child in the 80s, it does not mean that sugar has been mislabelled as a problem nutrient ( or as the scapegoat) today. It IS a problem for some.

    Looking within myself did not help me lose weight. The minute I dropped sugar and reduced my carbs I lost weight. Easily and lots of it. You bet I was eating too many calories but I was eating too much because of sugar (and partially due to those carbs which are readily converted to sugar). I didn't have to do any soul searching or suddenly develop great will power in order to lose weight; all I had to do was cut sugar out of my diet and I was much less hungry, I lost my cravings, and the slight thermogenic poperties of a very LCHF diet helped a bit too.

    I also love cheese and nuts and overeat those pretty regularly but that's not what made me fat either. Candy, soda, muffins, and unneeded carby plate fillers made me fat. I cut those and replaced them with other macro nutrients (at a slight caloric deficit) and lost weight. Simply cutting calories was not sustainable for more that a week or two for me. Cut sugar too? Suddenly it was easy to lose. It may not be true for all, but it was for me and it is true for many, especially those of us with IR issues (known and undiagnosed). I am not a special snowflake here.

    Sure, many people are fine with eating sugar but many aren't. I was fine with sugar until I approached 40, when suddenly I was not. Stating sugar is a problem for all is wrong, and Lustig should stop it. Staing that sugar is NOT a problem for all is just as wrong - claiming it is a scapegoat is incorrect. A better statement might be that sugar is not a problem for some people, although it may become a problem for some of them later, and that it is indeed a problem for some people right now (somewhere between 1/3 to 1/2 it appears to me based on those affected with IR issues like NAFLD, T2D, PCOS, prediabetes, Alzheimer's, as well as some of those who find weight loss difficult without sugar reduction - not a tiny group).

    ... This thread should probably be moved to the debate section. ;)

    "Readily converted to sugar" is another of those phrases that is used to fear monger against it, as if that makes it bad somehow.

    You're outright denying in your post that things apart from carbs made you fat. "Oh, I've been overeating this and that and X and Y and Z regularly too but that wasn't the problem, no.". I call BS. If you've been overeating you've been overeating them and they were part of the problem.

    I used to eat lots of sugar.
    And lots of fat.
    And probably protein too.
    Like 4+ ham and cheese sandwiches as a single meal? Check.
    Wieners with a bunch of fries? Yeah, did that.
    Pizza and whatnot? Yup. All lots of it and not a single gram of added sugar. Cutting out sugar would have changed nothing at all, because I like eating. I would have just eaten something else instead.

    Yeah no. I can still each 4 oz of cheese in a day and not gain weight. I do it often. Too often, but I can cut other foods from my diet when I do it. I had 4oz of cheese for lunch? Okay, I'll eat less at dinner. No problem. I had a cup of macadamia nuts with coconut for an afternoon "snack". I'll skip dinner. I had a large soda or a bag of jelly bellies? I'm still hungry and I find it harder to regulate my food intake. I can be sure that I'll be hungry for dinner even after a family sized bag of candy.

    I tend to overeat cheese more now since I eat lower carb. I don't eat candy or soda any longer. Even though I overeat in one food it does not mean I overeat my caloric totals for the day. I consider it to be overeating in cheese when it slows my bms for day. LOL

    Pizza? If I eat 4 pieces I am quite full and I stop. Angel food cake? I can eat the whole thing and look for more. We react differently to different foods. Sugar isn't a problem for you. Great. It's egocentric to assume one's experience is true for everyone.

    I'd say if your overeating of cheese and nuts makes you skip a meal later on to still fit IT IS A PROBLEM.

    I don't know about that. It's about the equivalent of someone saving room/calories at a healthy meal so they can still have dessert. I highly doubt nuts or cheese is problem alternative. A cup of nuts at 3:00 is not really less healthy than a steak and broccoli with cheese sauce at 5:00.

    It's gonna have different nutrients.
    But I know for a FACT, that if someone posted they regularly reduce their dinner calories or completely skip it so they can eat more twinkies during the day, people on here would be all up in that.
  • nvmomketo
    nvmomketo Posts: 12,019 Member
    edited May 2016
    nvmomketo wrote: »
    nvmomketo wrote: »
    The people who seem to be against the idea that sugar can be a problem for people seem to be those for whom sugar has never been a problem. It didn't happen to me so I don't believe it, and that's where Lustig exaggerated: Sugar is not a problem for everybody, but it is a problem for many. Just because the nutrition powers of yesteryear had fat labelled as the nutritional problem child in the 80s, it does not mean that sugar has been mislabelled as a problem nutrient ( or as the scapegoat) today. It IS a problem for some.

    Looking within myself did not help me lose weight. The minute I dropped sugar and reduced my carbs I lost weight. Easily and lots of it. You bet I was eating too many calories but I was eating too much because of sugar (and partially due to those carbs which are readily converted to sugar). I didn't have to do any soul searching or suddenly develop great will power in order to lose weight; all I had to do was cut sugar out of my diet and I was much less hungry, I lost my cravings, and the slight thermogenic poperties of a very LCHF diet helped a bit too.

    I also love cheese and nuts and overeat those pretty regularly but that's not what made me fat either. Candy, soda, muffins, and unneeded carby plate fillers made me fat. I cut those and replaced them with other macro nutrients (at a slight caloric deficit) and lost weight. Simply cutting calories was not sustainable for more that a week or two for me. Cut sugar too? Suddenly it was easy to lose. It may not be true for all, but it was for me and it is true for many, especially those of us with IR issues (known and undiagnosed). I am not a special snowflake here.

    Sure, many people are fine with eating sugar but many aren't. I was fine with sugar until I approached 40, when suddenly I was not. Stating sugar is a problem for all is wrong, and Lustig should stop it. Staing that sugar is NOT a problem for all is just as wrong - claiming it is a scapegoat is incorrect. A better statement might be that sugar is not a problem for some people, although it may become a problem for some of them later, and that it is indeed a problem for some people right now (somewhere between 1/3 to 1/2 it appears to me based on those affected with IR issues like NAFLD, T2D, PCOS, prediabetes, Alzheimer's, as well as some of those who find weight loss difficult without sugar reduction - not a tiny group).

    ... This thread should probably be moved to the debate section. ;)

    "Readily converted to sugar" is another of those phrases that is used to fear monger against it, as if that makes it bad somehow.

    You're outright denying in your post that things apart from carbs made you fat. "Oh, I've been overeating this and that and X and Y and Z regularly too but that wasn't the problem, no.". I call BS. If you've been overeating you've been overeating them and they were part of the problem.

    I used to eat lots of sugar.
    And lots of fat.
    And probably protein too.
    Like 4+ ham and cheese sandwiches as a single meal? Check.
    Wieners with a bunch of fries? Yeah, did that.
    Pizza and whatnot? Yup. All lots of it and not a single gram of added sugar. Cutting out sugar would have changed nothing at all, because I like eating. I would have just eaten something else instead.

    Yeah no. I can still each 4 oz of cheese in a day and not gain weight. I do it often. Too often, but I can cut other foods from my diet when I do it. I had 4oz of cheese for lunch? Okay, I'll eat less at dinner. No problem. I had a cup of macadamia nuts with coconut for an afternoon "snack". I'll skip dinner. I had a large soda or a bag of jelly bellies? I'm still hungry and I find it harder to regulate my food intake. I can be sure that I'll be hungry for dinner even after a family sized bag of candy.

    I tend to overeat cheese more now since I eat lower carb. I don't eat candy or soda any longer. Even though I overeat in one food it does not mean I overeat my caloric totals for the day. I consider it to be overeating in cheese when it slows my bms for day. LOL

    Pizza? If I eat 4 pieces I am quite full and I stop. Angel food cake? I can eat the whole thing and look for more. We react differently to different foods. Sugar isn't a problem for you. Great. It's egocentric to assume one's experience is true for everyone.

    I'd say you skipping meals because you overate cheese or nuts IS a problem in itself. And if I were to subscribe to the idea of certain foods being addicting, that would apply more to the idea than sugar that you just cut out no problem.

    I don't completely agree with your edited response either.

    Addiction? Lets not go there right now.

    I said sugar was a problem for me. Nuts and cheese are not. I can, and have cut those from my diet in the past for health reasons and experimentation. Today I choose to eat them and some days I choose to eat a fair amount of them. My health is fine and I am successfully maintaining a 40lb loss for 6+ months now. I don't see those foods as a problem for me.

    Now for other who did get fat because they overate nuts and cheese. Sure, that's a problem for them.
  • nvmomketo
    nvmomketo Posts: 12,019 Member
    edited May 2016
    nvmomketo wrote: »
    nvmomketo wrote: »
    nvmomketo wrote: »
    The people who seem to be against the idea that sugar can be a problem for people seem to be those for whom sugar has never been a problem. It didn't happen to me so I don't believe it, and that's where Lustig exaggerated: Sugar is not a problem for everybody, but it is a problem for many. Just because the nutrition powers of yesteryear had fat labelled as the nutritional problem child in the 80s, it does not mean that sugar has been mislabelled as a problem nutrient ( or as the scapegoat) today. It IS a problem for some.

    Looking within myself did not help me lose weight. The minute I dropped sugar and reduced my carbs I lost weight. Easily and lots of it. You bet I was eating too many calories but I was eating too much because of sugar (and partially due to those carbs which are readily converted to sugar). I didn't have to do any soul searching or suddenly develop great will power in order to lose weight; all I had to do was cut sugar out of my diet and I was much less hungry, I lost my cravings, and the slight thermogenic poperties of a very LCHF diet helped a bit too.

    I also love cheese and nuts and overeat those pretty regularly but that's not what made me fat either. Candy, soda, muffins, and unneeded carby plate fillers made me fat. I cut those and replaced them with other macro nutrients (at a slight caloric deficit) and lost weight. Simply cutting calories was not sustainable for more that a week or two for me. Cut sugar too? Suddenly it was easy to lose. It may not be true for all, but it was for me and it is true for many, especially those of us with IR issues (known and undiagnosed). I am not a special snowflake here.

    Sure, many people are fine with eating sugar but many aren't. I was fine with sugar until I approached 40, when suddenly I was not. Stating sugar is a problem for all is wrong, and Lustig should stop it. Staing that sugar is NOT a problem for all is just as wrong - claiming it is a scapegoat is incorrect. A better statement might be that sugar is not a problem for some people, although it may become a problem for some of them later, and that it is indeed a problem for some people right now (somewhere between 1/3 to 1/2 it appears to me based on those affected with IR issues like NAFLD, T2D, PCOS, prediabetes, Alzheimer's, as well as some of those who find weight loss difficult without sugar reduction - not a tiny group).

    ... This thread should probably be moved to the debate section. ;)

    "Readily converted to sugar" is another of those phrases that is used to fear monger against it, as if that makes it bad somehow.

    You're outright denying in your post that things apart from carbs made you fat. "Oh, I've been overeating this and that and X and Y and Z regularly too but that wasn't the problem, no.". I call BS. If you've been overeating you've been overeating them and they were part of the problem.

    I used to eat lots of sugar.
    And lots of fat.
    And probably protein too.
    Like 4+ ham and cheese sandwiches as a single meal? Check.
    Wieners with a bunch of fries? Yeah, did that.
    Pizza and whatnot? Yup. All lots of it and not a single gram of added sugar. Cutting out sugar would have changed nothing at all, because I like eating. I would have just eaten something else instead.

    Yeah no. I can still each 4 oz of cheese in a day and not gain weight. I do it often. Too often, but I can cut other foods from my diet when I do it. I had 4oz of cheese for lunch? Okay, I'll eat less at dinner. No problem. I had a cup of macadamia nuts with coconut for an afternoon "snack". I'll skip dinner. I had a large soda or a bag of jelly bellies? I'm still hungry and I find it harder to regulate my food intake. I can be sure that I'll be hungry for dinner even after a family sized bag of candy.

    I tend to overeat cheese more now since I eat lower carb. I don't eat candy or soda any longer. Even though I overeat in one food it does not mean I overeat my caloric totals for the day. I consider it to be overeating in cheese when it slows my bms for day. LOL

    Pizza? If I eat 4 pieces I am quite full and I stop. Angel food cake? I can eat the whole thing and look for more. We react differently to different foods. Sugar isn't a problem for you. Great. It's egocentric to assume one's experience is true for everyone.

    I'd say if your overeating of cheese and nuts makes you skip a meal later on to still fit IT IS A PROBLEM.

    I don't know about that. It's about the equivalent of someone saving room/calories at a healthy meal so they can still have dessert. I highly doubt nuts or cheese is problem alternative. A cup of nuts at 3:00 is not really less healthy than a steak and broccoli with cheese sauce at 5:00.

    It's gonna have different nutrients.
    But I know for a FACT, that if someone posted they regularly reduce their dinner calories or completely skip it so they can eat more twinkies during the day, people on here would be all up in that.

    Again, Twinkies are different than a bowl of macadamia nuts with coconut... At least in my eyes.

    ETA that most meals do have different nutrients.
  • nvmomketo
    nvmomketo Posts: 12,019 Member
    nvmomketo wrote: »
    nvmomketo wrote: »
    nvmomketo wrote: »
    nvmomketo wrote: »
    The people who seem to be against the idea that sugar can be a problem for people seem to be those for whom sugar has never been a problem. It didn't happen to me so I don't believe it, and that's where Lustig exaggerated: Sugar is not a problem for everybody, but it is a problem for many. Just because the nutrition powers of yesteryear had fat labelled as the nutritional problem child in the 80s, it does not mean that sugar has been mislabelled as a problem nutrient ( or as the scapegoat) today. It IS a problem for some.

    Looking within myself did not help me lose weight. The minute I dropped sugar and reduced my carbs I lost weight. Easily and lots of it. You bet I was eating too many calories but I was eating too much because of sugar (and partially due to those carbs which are readily converted to sugar). I didn't have to do any soul searching or suddenly develop great will power in order to lose weight; all I had to do was cut sugar out of my diet and I was much less hungry, I lost my cravings, and the slight thermogenic poperties of a very LCHF diet helped a bit too.

    I also love cheese and nuts and overeat those pretty regularly but that's not what made me fat either. Candy, soda, muffins, and unneeded carby plate fillers made me fat. I cut those and replaced them with other macro nutrients (at a slight caloric deficit) and lost weight. Simply cutting calories was not sustainable for more that a week or two for me. Cut sugar too? Suddenly it was easy to lose. It may not be true for all, but it was for me and it is true for many, especially those of us with IR issues (known and undiagnosed). I am not a special snowflake here.

    Sure, many people are fine with eating sugar but many aren't. I was fine with sugar until I approached 40, when suddenly I was not. Stating sugar is a problem for all is wrong, and Lustig should stop it. Staing that sugar is NOT a problem for all is just as wrong - claiming it is a scapegoat is incorrect. A better statement might be that sugar is not a problem for some people, although it may become a problem for some of them later, and that it is indeed a problem for some people right now (somewhere between 1/3 to 1/2 it appears to me based on those affected with IR issues like NAFLD, T2D, PCOS, prediabetes, Alzheimer's, as well as some of those who find weight loss difficult without sugar reduction - not a tiny group).

    ... This thread should probably be moved to the debate section. ;)

    "Readily converted to sugar" is another of those phrases that is used to fear monger against it, as if that makes it bad somehow.

    You're outright denying in your post that things apart from carbs made you fat. "Oh, I've been overeating this and that and X and Y and Z regularly too but that wasn't the problem, no.". I call BS. If you've been overeating you've been overeating them and they were part of the problem.

    I used to eat lots of sugar.
    And lots of fat.
    And probably protein too.
    Like 4+ ham and cheese sandwiches as a single meal? Check.
    Wieners with a bunch of fries? Yeah, did that.
    Pizza and whatnot? Yup. All lots of it and not a single gram of added sugar. Cutting out sugar would have changed nothing at all, because I like eating. I would have just eaten something else instead.

    Yeah no. I can still each 4 oz of cheese in a day and not gain weight. I do it often. Too often, but I can cut other foods from my diet when I do it. I had 4oz of cheese for lunch? Okay, I'll eat less at dinner. No problem. I had a cup of macadamia nuts with coconut for an afternoon "snack". I'll skip dinner. I had a large soda or a bag of jelly bellies? I'm still hungry and I find it harder to regulate my food intake. I can be sure that I'll be hungry for dinner even after a family sized bag of candy.

    I tend to overeat cheese more now since I eat lower carb. I don't eat candy or soda any longer. Even though I overeat in one food it does not mean I overeat my caloric totals for the day. I consider it to be overeating in cheese when it slows my bms for day. LOL

    Pizza? If I eat 4 pieces I am quite full and I stop. Angel food cake? I can eat the whole thing and look for more. We react differently to different foods. Sugar isn't a problem for you. Great. It's egocentric to assume one's experience is true for everyone.

    I'd say if your overeating of cheese and nuts makes you skip a meal later on to still fit IT IS A PROBLEM.

    I don't know about that. It's about the equivalent of someone saving room/calories at a healthy meal so they can still have dessert. I highly doubt nuts or cheese is problem alternative. A cup of nuts at 3:00 is not really less healthy than a steak and broccoli with cheese sauce at 5:00.

    It's gonna have different nutrients.
    But I know for a FACT, that if someone posted they regularly reduce their dinner calories or completely skip it so they can eat more twinkies during the day, people on here would be all up in that.

    Again, Twinkies are different than a bowl of macadamia nuts with coconut... At least in my eyes.

    ETA that most meals do have different nutrients.

    It's both a lot of calories for fairly limited nutrition. They're both treats, I don't think anyone sees a handful of macadamia's as equivalent to a meal and apart from the fat content it isn't particularly going to aid your nutrition goals.
    nvmomketo wrote: »
    nvmomketo wrote: »
    The people who seem to be against the idea that sugar can be a problem for people seem to be those for whom sugar has never been a problem. It didn't happen to me so I don't believe it, and that's where Lustig exaggerated: Sugar is not a problem for everybody, but it is a problem for many. Just because the nutrition powers of yesteryear had fat labelled as the nutritional problem child in the 80s, it does not mean that sugar has been mislabelled as a problem nutrient ( or as the scapegoat) today. It IS a problem for some.

    Looking within myself did not help me lose weight. The minute I dropped sugar and reduced my carbs I lost weight. Easily and lots of it. You bet I was eating too many calories but I was eating too much because of sugar (and partially due to those carbs which are readily converted to sugar). I didn't have to do any soul searching or suddenly develop great will power in order to lose weight; all I had to do was cut sugar out of my diet and I was much less hungry, I lost my cravings, and the slight thermogenic poperties of a very LCHF diet helped a bit too.

    I also love cheese and nuts and overeat those pretty regularly but that's not what made me fat either. Candy, soda, muffins, and unneeded carby plate fillers made me fat. I cut those and replaced them with other macro nutrients (at a slight caloric deficit) and lost weight. Simply cutting calories was not sustainable for more that a week or two for me. Cut sugar too? Suddenly it was easy to lose. It may not be true for all, but it was for me and it is true for many, especially those of us with IR issues (known and undiagnosed). I am not a special snowflake here.

    Sure, many people are fine with eating sugar but many aren't. I was fine with sugar until I approached 40, when suddenly I was not. Stating sugar is a problem for all is wrong, and Lustig should stop it. Staing that sugar is NOT a problem for all is just as wrong - claiming it is a scapegoat is incorrect. A better statement might be that sugar is not a problem for some people, although it may become a problem for some of them later, and that it is indeed a problem for some people right now (somewhere between 1/3 to 1/2 it appears to me based on those affected with IR issues like NAFLD, T2D, PCOS, prediabetes, Alzheimer's, as well as some of those who find weight loss difficult without sugar reduction - not a tiny group).

    ... This thread should probably be moved to the debate section. ;)

    "Readily converted to sugar" is another of those phrases that is used to fear monger against it, as if that makes it bad somehow.

    You're outright denying in your post that things apart from carbs made you fat. "Oh, I've been overeating this and that and X and Y and Z regularly too but that wasn't the problem, no.". I call BS. If you've been overeating you've been overeating them and they were part of the problem.

    I used to eat lots of sugar.
    And lots of fat.
    And probably protein too.
    Like 4+ ham and cheese sandwiches as a single meal? Check.
    Wieners with a bunch of fries? Yeah, did that.
    Pizza and whatnot? Yup. All lots of it and not a single gram of added sugar. Cutting out sugar would have changed nothing at all, because I like eating. I would have just eaten something else instead.

    Yeah no. I can still each 4 oz of cheese in a day and not gain weight. I do it often. Too often, but I can cut other foods from my diet when I do it. I had 4oz of cheese for lunch? Okay, I'll eat less at dinner. No problem. I had a cup of macadamia nuts with coconut for an afternoon "snack". I'll skip dinner. I had a large soda or a bag of jelly bellies? I'm still hungry and I find it harder to regulate my food intake. I can be sure that I'll be hungry for dinner even after a family sized bag of candy.

    I tend to overeat cheese more now since I eat lower carb. I don't eat candy or soda any longer. Even though I overeat in one food it does not mean I overeat my caloric totals for the day. I consider it to be overeating in cheese when it slows my bms for day. LOL

    Pizza? If I eat 4 pieces I am quite full and I stop. Angel food cake? I can eat the whole thing and look for more. We react differently to different foods. Sugar isn't a problem for you. Great. It's egocentric to assume one's experience is true for everyone.

    I'd say if your overeating of cheese and nuts makes you skip a meal later on to still fit IT IS A PROBLEM.

    Eating until you are full and satisfied and then not eating again until you're hungry is not a problem. It's a normal appetite and it's working exactly like it should.

    If you're skipping meals to fit in more treats that's not exactly how it should be.
    Okay then... That's more rigid than my usual approach to food, and I'm keto, but it that works for you, great.
  • nvmomketo
    nvmomketo Posts: 12,019 Member
    edited May 2016
    ndj1979 wrote: »
    nvmomketo wrote: »
    nvmomketo wrote: »
    nvmomketo wrote: »
    nvmomketo wrote: »
    The people who seem to be against the idea that sugar can be a problem for people seem to be those for whom sugar has never been a problem. It didn't happen to me so I don't believe it, and that's where Lustig exaggerated: Sugar is not a problem for everybody, but it is a problem for many. Just because the nutrition powers of yesteryear had fat labelled as the nutritional problem child in the 80s, it does not mean that sugar has been mislabelled as a problem nutrient ( or as the scapegoat) today. It IS a problem for some.

    Looking within myself did not help me lose weight. The minute I dropped sugar and reduced my carbs I lost weight. Easily and lots of it. You bet I was eating too many calories but I was eating too much because of sugar (and partially due to those carbs which are readily converted to sugar). I didn't have to do any soul searching or suddenly develop great will power in order to lose weight; all I had to do was cut sugar out of my diet and I was much less hungry, I lost my cravings, and the slight thermogenic poperties of a very LCHF diet helped a bit too.

    I also love cheese and nuts and overeat those pretty regularly but that's not what made me fat either. Candy, soda, muffins, and unneeded carby plate fillers made me fat. I cut those and replaced them with other macro nutrients (at a slight caloric deficit) and lost weight. Simply cutting calories was not sustainable for more that a week or two for me. Cut sugar too? Suddenly it was easy to lose. It may not be true for all, but it was for me and it is true for many, especially those of us with IR issues (known and undiagnosed). I am not a special snowflake here.

    Sure, many people are fine with eating sugar but many aren't. I was fine with sugar until I approached 40, when suddenly I was not. Stating sugar is a problem for all is wrong, and Lustig should stop it. Staing that sugar is NOT a problem for all is just as wrong - claiming it is a scapegoat is incorrect. A better statement might be that sugar is not a problem for some people, although it may become a problem for some of them later, and that it is indeed a problem for some people right now (somewhere between 1/3 to 1/2 it appears to me based on those affected with IR issues like NAFLD, T2D, PCOS, prediabetes, Alzheimer's, as well as some of those who find weight loss difficult without sugar reduction - not a tiny group).

    ... This thread should probably be moved to the debate section. ;)

    "Readily converted to sugar" is another of those phrases that is used to fear monger against it, as if that makes it bad somehow.

    You're outright denying in your post that things apart from carbs made you fat. "Oh, I've been overeating this and that and X and Y and Z regularly too but that wasn't the problem, no.". I call BS. If you've been overeating you've been overeating them and they were part of the problem.

    I used to eat lots of sugar.
    And lots of fat.
    And probably protein too.
    Like 4+ ham and cheese sandwiches as a single meal? Check.
    Wieners with a bunch of fries? Yeah, did that.
    Pizza and whatnot? Yup. All lots of it and not a single gram of added sugar. Cutting out sugar would have changed nothing at all, because I like eating. I would have just eaten something else instead.

    Yeah no. I can still each 4 oz of cheese in a day and not gain weight. I do it often. Too often, but I can cut other foods from my diet when I do it. I had 4oz of cheese for lunch? Okay, I'll eat less at dinner. No problem. I had a cup of macadamia nuts with coconut for an afternoon "snack". I'll skip dinner. I had a large soda or a bag of jelly bellies? I'm still hungry and I find it harder to regulate my food intake. I can be sure that I'll be hungry for dinner even after a family sized bag of candy.

    I tend to overeat cheese more now since I eat lower carb. I don't eat candy or soda any longer. Even though I overeat in one food it does not mean I overeat my caloric totals for the day. I consider it to be overeating in cheese when it slows my bms for day. LOL

    Pizza? If I eat 4 pieces I am quite full and I stop. Angel food cake? I can eat the whole thing and look for more. We react differently to different foods. Sugar isn't a problem for you. Great. It's egocentric to assume one's experience is true for everyone.

    I'd say if your overeating of cheese and nuts makes you skip a meal later on to still fit IT IS A PROBLEM.

    I don't know about that. It's about the equivalent of someone saving room/calories at a healthy meal so they can still have dessert. I highly doubt nuts or cheese is problem alternative. A cup of nuts at 3:00 is not really less healthy than a steak and broccoli with cheese sauce at 5:00.

    It's gonna have different nutrients.
    But I know for a FACT, that if someone posted they regularly reduce their dinner calories or completely skip it so they can eat more twinkies during the day, people on here would be all up in that.

    Again, Twinkies are different than a bowl of macadamia nuts with coconut... At least in my eyes.

    ETA that most meals do have different nutrients.

    Yawn - nutritional make up is different but that is all...

    I see we still can't grasp that concept...

    The concept that people would criticize a meal of twinkies but not an early dinner of nuts with coconut? Please clarify so we get it.
  • ndj1979
    ndj1979 Posts: 29,139 Member
    nvmomketo wrote: »
    ndj1979 wrote: »
    nvmomketo wrote: »
    nvmomketo wrote: »
    nvmomketo wrote: »
    nvmomketo wrote: »
    The people who seem to be against the idea that sugar can be a problem for people seem to be those for whom sugar has never been a problem. It didn't happen to me so I don't believe it, and that's where Lustig exaggerated: Sugar is not a problem for everybody, but it is a problem for many. Just because the nutrition powers of yesteryear had fat labelled as the nutritional problem child in the 80s, it does not mean that sugar has been mislabelled as a problem nutrient ( or as the scapegoat) today. It IS a problem for some.

    Looking within myself did not help me lose weight. The minute I dropped sugar and reduced my carbs I lost weight. Easily and lots of it. You bet I was eating too many calories but I was eating too much because of sugar (and partially due to those carbs which are readily converted to sugar). I didn't have to do any soul searching or suddenly develop great will power in order to lose weight; all I had to do was cut sugar out of my diet and I was much less hungry, I lost my cravings, and the slight thermogenic poperties of a very LCHF diet helped a bit too.

    I also love cheese and nuts and overeat those pretty regularly but that's not what made me fat either. Candy, soda, muffins, and unneeded carby plate fillers made me fat. I cut those and replaced them with other macro nutrients (at a slight caloric deficit) and lost weight. Simply cutting calories was not sustainable for more that a week or two for me. Cut sugar too? Suddenly it was easy to lose. It may not be true for all, but it was for me and it is true for many, especially those of us with IR issues (known and undiagnosed). I am not a special snowflake here.

    Sure, many people are fine with eating sugar but many aren't. I was fine with sugar until I approached 40, when suddenly I was not. Stating sugar is a problem for all is wrong, and Lustig should stop it. Staing that sugar is NOT a problem for all is just as wrong - claiming it is a scapegoat is incorrect. A better statement might be that sugar is not a problem for some people, although it may become a problem for some of them later, and that it is indeed a problem for some people right now (somewhere between 1/3 to 1/2 it appears to me based on those affected with IR issues like NAFLD, T2D, PCOS, prediabetes, Alzheimer's, as well as some of those who find weight loss difficult without sugar reduction - not a tiny group).

    ... This thread should probably be moved to the debate section. ;)

    "Readily converted to sugar" is another of those phrases that is used to fear monger against it, as if that makes it bad somehow.

    You're outright denying in your post that things apart from carbs made you fat. "Oh, I've been overeating this and that and X and Y and Z regularly too but that wasn't the problem, no.". I call BS. If you've been overeating you've been overeating them and they were part of the problem.

    I used to eat lots of sugar.
    And lots of fat.
    And probably protein too.
    Like 4+ ham and cheese sandwiches as a single meal? Check.
    Wieners with a bunch of fries? Yeah, did that.
    Pizza and whatnot? Yup. All lots of it and not a single gram of added sugar. Cutting out sugar would have changed nothing at all, because I like eating. I would have just eaten something else instead.

    Yeah no. I can still each 4 oz of cheese in a day and not gain weight. I do it often. Too often, but I can cut other foods from my diet when I do it. I had 4oz of cheese for lunch? Okay, I'll eat less at dinner. No problem. I had a cup of macadamia nuts with coconut for an afternoon "snack". I'll skip dinner. I had a large soda or a bag of jelly bellies? I'm still hungry and I find it harder to regulate my food intake. I can be sure that I'll be hungry for dinner even after a family sized bag of candy.

    I tend to overeat cheese more now since I eat lower carb. I don't eat candy or soda any longer. Even though I overeat in one food it does not mean I overeat my caloric totals for the day. I consider it to be overeating in cheese when it slows my bms for day. LOL

    Pizza? If I eat 4 pieces I am quite full and I stop. Angel food cake? I can eat the whole thing and look for more. We react differently to different foods. Sugar isn't a problem for you. Great. It's egocentric to assume one's experience is true for everyone.

    I'd say if your overeating of cheese and nuts makes you skip a meal later on to still fit IT IS A PROBLEM.

    I don't know about that. It's about the equivalent of someone saving room/calories at a healthy meal so they can still have dessert. I highly doubt nuts or cheese is problem alternative. A cup of nuts at 3:00 is not really less healthy than a steak and broccoli with cheese sauce at 5:00.

    It's gonna have different nutrients.
    But I know for a FACT, that if someone posted they regularly reduce their dinner calories or completely skip it so they can eat more twinkies during the day, people on here would be all up in that.

    Again, Twinkies are different than a bowl of macadamia nuts with coconut... At least in my eyes.

    ETA that most meals do have different nutrients.

    Yawn - nutritional make up is different but that is all...

    I see we still can't grasp that concept...

    The concept that people would criticize a meal of twinkies but not an early dinner of nuts with coconut? Please clarify so we get it.

    I have many times and I see no need to repeat myself...

    Keep believing sugar is the devil....